SAN DIEGO | Boom Rundown, Vol. 2

[SDfan]

Its great to see this new development in SD. I stayed at the Doubletree in Mission Valley around Christmas and took a walk through Downtown. Its a great sign seeing those cranes! Also, the new Holiday Inn Bayside tower looks great. Hadn't been past it since July.

Btw, this new Architecture blog will have a ton of information about architecture in San Diego. Its brand new and only has 4 posts as of yet but it will cover projects and developments all across the west coast :cool:

http://westcoastarch.blogspot.com/

Daniel, I like your blog. Keep at it.

[tyleraf]

Here is an interesting article about the downtown condo market. Let's get these projects going! http://www.sddt.com/News/article.cfm?SourceCode=20140131cza&_t=New+condos+sold+out+in+downtown+San+Diego#.UuysVn-9KK0

[tyleraf]

Here is the January NEVP construction update. http://www.portofsandiego.org/north-embarcadero/3459-nevp-phase-i-construction-update-january-2014.html

[tyleraf]

Here are some photos of 15th and island that I took last week. Glass is starting to go up. http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7313/12310434743_e7ec7e631f.jpg
http://farm4.staticflickr.com/3743/12310719464_f6e1370b35.jpg
http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7289/12310867656_2cd391ffa3.jpg
1 Columbia Place seems to be having some renovations done.
http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7399/12310393375_453f4f598a.jpg
Bonus: Some shots from Emerald Plaza
http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7447/12310283755_e695a9c6ab.jpg
http://farm4.staticflickr.com/3797/12310871616_eb99bb6048.jpg
http://farm6.staticflickr.com/5544/12310447113_803630a1dc.jpg

[Streamliner]

Here are some photos of 15th and island that I took last week. Glass is starting to go up.

Bonus: Some shots from Emerald Plaza


Great to see 15th and Island moving quickly. Not a huge fan of its design, but nice to see some height in this area.

Also, you reminded me of how sad it is that Emerald Plaza is so hidden in the skyline these days. That and One America Plaza used to be the two most distinctive towers in our city (when viewed from the north side of the bay at least). Such a unique looking building.

[Erip]

Does anyone have info on the building in Hillcrest that used to be the San Diego Blood Bank? It looks like it's being converted into lofts, which could be pretty rad. Can't find any info. They have a banner up that says standardlofts.com, but there's no functional webpage at that URL.

Also, finally an explanation on what's taking so long with Horton Plaza Park. Yeesh, what an embarrassment: http://www.kpbs.org/news/2014/feb/04/san-diego-city-council-consider-horton-plaza-park-/

[Yackemflaber69]

i love san diego

[tyleraf]

Horton Plaza Park and the two new Portland Loos got city council approval today! http://www.nbcsandiego.com/news/local/Horton-Park-Portland-Loos-Get-Green-Light-from-City-243620921.html

[mello]

July 2015 for Horton Plaza??? :koko: I have to say that is an utter embarrassment! As a life long San Diegan that is a punch to the gut, so nothing done to Balboa park for the centennial and taking 2 years to build a small plaza? Wow :hell:

[tyleraf]

India and beech site is for sale. http://www.loopnet.com/xNet/MainSite/Listing/Profile/Profile.aspx?LID=17594226&SRID=4111058533&StepID=101

[eburress]

July 2015 for Horton Plaza??? :koko: I have to say that is an utter embarrassment! As a life long San Diegan that is a punch to the gut, so nothing done to Balboa park for the centennial and taking 2 years to build a small plaza? Wow :hell:

That's how things roll here. Nobody should ever confuse San Diego for being a "can do" city.

[SDfan]

Anyone else notice that the rendering in the pbs article is nothing like the renderings on the fences surrounding the plaza now?

Downgrade.

So San Diego.

[tyleraf]

SDFan: It looks the same to me. What do you think looks different.

[HurricaneHugo]

A week to go, Faulconer or Alvarez?

[tyleraf]

Faulconer, he will be better for development.

[Nerv]

The Horton Plaza park seems to be more of a victim of the redevelopment agencies going bye-bye in California. Everyone knew there'd be some fallout there. It's not the only project in the state that got jacked. I'm just glad it's getting done at all. Thanks Jerry for stealing more money from the cities to support the states habits....:titanic:

[Leo the Dog]

Faulconer, he will be better for development.

+1

Alvarez appears to be too young.

[SDfan]

SDFan: It looks the same to me. What do you think looks different.


tyleraf,

Here is the article on the approved design back in Nov 2012:
http://www.nbcsandiego.com/news/local/Council-Approves-Plans-for-Horton-Plaza-179378851.html

Notice the rounded amphitheater with the light sculptures surrounding it. Also the different levels differentiating each area of the expanded plaza.

Then here is the PBS article from a few days ago:
http://www.kpbs.org/news/2014/feb/04/san-diego-city-council-consider-horton-plaza-park-/

No rounded space. No light sculptures. Flat. Just a boxed, square space.

It is very possible, and I pray, that PBS just pulled a stock photo from when they were deciding on which of the three designs would move forward. Hopefully that's the case, and the city isn't cheapening the original design but hacking critical elements from the approved plan.

[tyleraf]

The NBC article that I posted has the original design. I think the other article shows one of the other two designs that were proposed. Also San Diego might end up hosting America's Cup in 2017. http://www.utsandiego.com/news/2014/feb/05/san-diego-port-officials-to-discuss-americas-cup/

[SDfan]

San Diego Metro posted the better design in their article. I hope this is what ends up being constructed:

(4th article down)

http://www.sandiegometro.com/2014/02/daily-business-report-feb-4-2014/

[tyleraf]

Of all the articles I've read on the park there hasn't been any indication the design never changed so were probably good.

[tyleraf]

1 Columbia Place (formerly Columbia Center) is undergoing a multimillion dollar renovation.
http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7378/12354519403_6e81d01e3e.jpg
http://farm4.staticflickr.com/3750/12354344365_ba8643fa8e.jpg
Here is a photo of the work.
http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7399/12310393375_453f4f598a.jpg

[spoonman]

+1

Alvarez appears to be too young.

+2. Bad for urban development. I especially did not like Alvarez's stance on Barrio Logan.

[mello]

Did you guys know that a Hanson's organic market is going in the bottom of Ariel Suites? This now makes Little Italy possibly the most complete urban neighborhood in Southern California! It has it all from schools to home furnishing, maybe a bit lacking on retail but wow LI is going to be a very impressive place especially once the gorgeous park on the South side of the County building is complete.

-- For those who don't know Hanson's has a store in San Clemente I have been there and it is pretty cool, a bit pricey however.

[tyleraf]

East Village is getting a gateway sign. http://eastvillagesandiego.com/category/vices/

[Leo the Dog]

East Village is getting a gateway sign. http://eastvillagesandiego.com/category/vices/

That's great! Where is it...Market street?

[tyleraf]

They haven't decided yet. They are just collecting donations right now.

[Bertrice]

I'm sure it might get done before Horton plaza park and the convention center

[SDfan]

What ever happened to the Asian gateway sign in the Marina District, or the Asian Thematic District? I can't remember which area is which, or where one begins or the other ends... whatever. What happened to the sign?

[Erip]

tyleraf,

Here is the article on the approved design back in Nov 2012:
http://www.nbcsandiego.com/news/local/Council-Approves-Plans-for-Horton-Plaza-179378851.html

Notice the rounded amphitheater with the light sculptures surrounding it. Also the different levels differentiating each area of the expanded plaza.

Then here is the PBS article from a few days ago:
http://www.kpbs.org/news/2014/feb/04/san-diego-city-council-consider-horton-plaza-park-/

No rounded space. No light sculptures. Flat. Just a boxed, square space.

It is very possible, and I pray, that PBS just pulled a stock photo from when they were deciding on which of the three designs would move forward. Hopefully that's the case, and the city isn't cheapening the original design but hacking critical elements from the approved plan.

It looks like the original, more complex plans stand, at least according to this:
http://sandiegodowntownnews.com/reviving-horton-plaza/

[HurricaneHugo]

Anybody know of any good low cost apartments in downtown San Diego?

Friend is looking into them

He didn't make much last year so he might qualify for low-income housing

[SDfan]

It looks like the original, more complex plans stand, at least according to this:
http://sandiegodowntownnews.com/reviving-horton-plaza/

Thank you so much for clarifying! :cool:

[SDCAL]

A week to go, Faulconer or Alvarez?

I'm voting for Mr. Alvarez.

I think it's a bit simplistic to say that Faulconer is pro development and Alvarez in anti development.

Faulconer's core constituents are NIMBYs, people who tend to be older, wealthier, white males who live above the 8 and who don't want to see SD grow anymore. Sure Faulconer is friends with people like Manchester, but Faulconer can't overturn court decisions as mayor to get things like NBC going.

Faulconer seems to me to represent old San Diego - the San Diego where downtown and the rest of the city are kept very separate. Alvarez seems to represent the future - younger, and with a vision that SD can be a dynamic city throughout all the neighborhoods inclusive of downtown with more cohesion.

Anyway, I don't mean to go on a political rant here, but I'm surprised that people on a forum who often seem frustrated with SD's status quo would be for the status quo candidate. ;)

[spoonman]

I'm voting for Mr. Alvarez.

I think it's a bit simplistic to say that Faulconer is pro development and Alvarez in anti development.

Faulconer's core constituents are NIMBYs, people who tend to be older, wealthier, white males who live above the 8 and who don't want to see SD grow anymore. Sure Faulconer is friends with people like Manchester, but Faulconer can't overturn court decisions as mayor to get things like NBC going.

Faulconer seems to me to represent old San Diego - the San Diego where downtown and the rest of the city are kept very separate. Alvarez seems to represent the future - younger, and with a vision that SD can be a dynamic city throughout all the neighborhoods inclusive of downtown with more cohesion.

Anyway, I don't mean to go on a political rant here, but I'm surprised that people on a forum who often seem frustrated with SD's status quo would be for the status quo candidate. ;)

I agree with many of your arguments. Faulconer's large NIMBY constituency is probably terrifying to many on this board. That said, my opinion is that when the day is done, Alvarez's anti business stance will make him even more hostile to development than Faulconer. Faulconer will likely just look the other way as much as is politically possible when development concerns arise.

[Bertrice]

the embcarcadero is really starting to get going

http://www.cbs8.com/story/24694937/fat-city-neon-sign-removed

http://kfmb.images.worldnow.com/images/24694937_BG1.jpg

[Prahaboheme]

Thanks for posting this. I'm excited to see this sign preserved and hopefully restored to another part of the city. Additionally, great to see this block developed into a higher density building. A win-win.

I believe this is still the current rendering:

http://sandiego.urbdezine.com/files/2012/05/FatCityLofts2.jpg

http://sandiego.urbdezine.com/files/2012/05/FatCityLofts4.jpg

[SDfan]

I'm voting for Mr. Alvarez.

I think it's a bit simplistic to say that Faulconer is pro development and Alvarez in anti development.

Faulconer's core constituents are NIMBYs, people who tend to be older, wealthier, white males who live above the 8 and who don't want to see SD grow anymore. Sure Faulconer is friends with people like Manchester, but Faulconer can't overturn court decisions as mayor to get things like NBC going.

Faulconer seems to me to represent old San Diego - the San Diego where downtown and the rest of the city are kept very separate. Alvarez seems to represent the future - younger, and with a vision that SD can be a dynamic city throughout all the neighborhoods inclusive of downtown with more cohesion.

Anyway, I don't mean to go on a political rant here, but I'm surprised that people on a forum who often seem frustrated with SD's status quo would be for the status quo candidate. ;)

I voted for Faulconer because I don't like obstructionists. Alverez was pretty much Filner-light. Filners actions in Kearny Mesa, College Area, and Carmel Valley towards progressive development absolutely terrified me. Alverez demonized developers, businessmen, and "downtown interests" throughout his campaign. I'm a Democrat, but I'm not easily swayed by populist rhetoric, nor was I comfortable with the amount of money funneling in from outside groups -even if it was from unions I support, I don't like it when any entity or special interest tries to manipulate my community.

Needless to say, I woke up relieved this morning. Now we can move on.

[SDfan]

Sad day.

Downsized hotel OKd for downtown
Developers blame tight financing conditions for Ash Street project
http://www.utsandiego.com/news/2014/feb/12/hotel-ash-downtown-design/

[spoonman]

Sad day.

Kind of a bummer, but from street level, 14 floors and 24 aren't that different. That Ash street corridor is one of the last places with a lot of surface parking, and I will be happy to see it go.

I'd like to think though that the 200 rooms that are not going to be added to this hotel will appear in another development that will occur due to the convention center expansion.

[Erip]

Some good analysis on the plaza station project: http://sandiego.urbdezine.com/2014/02/12/when-is-a-smart-growth-project-a-trojan-horse-park-station-as-a-case-study/
:runaway:

[SDfan]

Some good analysis on the plaza station project: http://sandiego.urbdezine.com/2014/02/12/when-is-a-smart-growth-project-a-trojan-horse-park-station-as-a-case-study/
:runaway:

Good article.

[tyleraf]

It's unfortunate that 401 W Ash was scaled back that said I still am glad to see that parking lot eliminated.

[tyleraf]

I'm excited to see fat city get going. It's going to be great for little Italy and I'm glad they are preserving the building.

[tyleraf]

I hope we get America's Cup! http://www.reuters.com/article/2014/02/14/us-amaericascup-venue-idUSBREA1D00K20140214

[tyleraf]

The New State Courthouse is about to get started! http://www.utsandiego.com/news/2014/feb/10/courthouse-state-downtown-SOM/

[tyleraf]

Kaiser Permanente broke ground on their new San Diego Central Hospital in Kearny Mesa. It looks decent and at least it replaces a warehouse and a huge parking lot.
http://farm3.staticflickr.com/2865/12591023845_b2963c8774.jpg

[tyleraf]

Downtown Update
9th & Broadway
Webcam shot
http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7434/12591365735_855c282e4b.jpg
Starting to make an impact.
http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7315/12591889125_a169f422fe.jpg
Sempra
http://farm6.staticflickr.com/5527/12591974593_ef06fa1f9e.jpg
Urbana
http://farm4.staticflickr.com/3768/12591856565_736521c26c.jpg
Park & G
http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7297/12591981553_95f859c565.jpg
15th & Island
http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7440/12591994633_c7f9dfd980.jpg
https://s3.yimg.com/so/7418/12591875475_e0e04bbcf9.jpg
https://s1.yimg.com/sj/2854/12591895805_688c4c347b.jpg
Also, here are some new renders of Ballpark Village.
http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7294/12591138863_054a22b44c.jpg
http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7294/12591134013_094b9eec16.jpg
http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7459/12591136293_f5da80ff4e.jpg

[Leo the Dog]

I know some of you guys don't care for it, but I like ballpark village.

Thanks for the update. I noticed last weekend that the Sempra site crane was about to go up...appears it is up now.

[Prahaboheme]

What is the status for Ballpark Village?

I don't mind it. In fact, I think it does a decent job of incapsulating the library and the ballpark, and extending out this section of east village into those hideious surface parking lots. I do, however, wish it was more of a "flat iron" style buidling, taking advantage of the corner a bit more.

[SDfan]

I bitched about BPV not being diverse enough in height, but I noticed with this rendering the project preserves a view corridor for the new library, which I appreciate.

[aerogt3]

What they've proposed for ballpark village is way better than the parking lots it replaces.

[spoonman]

^ Yes. This project will also help bridge the gap between the Imperial Transit Center and the southeastern part of EV. Walking from the ballpark area to places like Mission Brewery and the transit center will seem more appealing, and safer.

[Streamliner]

Sorry if this is a bit off topic, but I found some cool concept art and construction shots of my favorite skyscraper in San Diego, One America Plaza. Thought it'd be interesting. From the early 90s:

Art:
http://www.bricehouse.com/subpages/images/big/One-America-5.jpg

http://www.bricehouse.com/subpages/images/big/One-America-6.jpg

Construction:
http://www.bricehouse.com/subpages/images/big/One-America-2.jpg

http://www.bricehouse.com/subpages/images/big/One-America-3.jpg

http://www.bricehouse.com/subpages/images/big/One-America-4.jpg

Source (http://www.bricehouse.com/subpages/past_projects2.html#)

[tyleraf]

The New Courthouse breaks Ground next month. I can't wait to see this rise! The article also mentions that the old courthouse site fronting Broadway will most likely be sold to a developer to build a high rise. http://www.utsandiego.com/news/2014/feb/21/courthouse-state-downtown/
Also, excavation is in full swing at One La Jolla Centre unfortunately I couldn't get a photo though.

[spoonman]

The New Courthouse breaks Ground next month. I can't wait to see this rise! The article also mentions that the old courthouse site fronting Broadway will most likely be sold to a developer to build a high rise. http://www.utsandiego.com/news/2014/feb/21/courthouse-state-downtown/
Also, excavation is in full swing at One La Jolla Centre unfortunately I couldn't get a photo though.

Good stuff. Lots of exciting major developments in starting or in progress. 9th & B-way, 15th & Island, the courthouse, and soon ballpark village and PCH & B-way.

Broadway & PCH is supposed to break ground in 'early 2014'. Has anyone been by there recently?

[tyleraf]

I drove by the other day and it is still an active parking lot. I believe Bosa plans to break ground in July.

[spoonman]

I drove by the other day and it is still an active parking lot. I believe Bosa plans to break ground in July.

Too bad. I was hoping for fences.

Anything on Lane Field? I've pretty much given up on the project.

[mello]

Very excited to see the courthouse rise, between this and Kettner and Ash it will make up for that hotel being chopped by 10 floors because it will get swallowed up by the two larger towers anyway.

Also can't wait for new high rises to be built on Broadway once the old CH is torn down. The UT article mentioned they won't build on almost one whole block to to a "fault line" what gives :cheers: There is only a fault for one block?? This doesn't prevent towers in Tokyo, Mexico City or SF does it? Why do we have to leave a whole block for some lame "civic plaza" because of a rinky dink fault?

[spoonman]

Very excited to see the courthouse rise, between this and Kettner and Ash it will make up for that hotel being chopped by 10 floors because it will get swallowed up by the two larger towers anyway.

Also can't wait for new high rises to be built on Broadway once the old CH is torn down. The UT article mentioned they won't build on almost one whole block to to a "fault line" what gives :cheers: There is only a fault for one block?? This doesn't prevent towers in Tokyo, Mexico City or SF does it? Why do we have to leave a whole block for some lame "civic plaza" because of a rinky dink fault?

I haven't been down to the Kettner area recently, but I imagine that Ariel Suites has also had a positive impact there too.

I can't comment on the fault, but at least the city has the good sense to build parking below the park.

[SDCAL]

I'm very excited about the courthouse - I actually like the design. It looks very "government-chic" and something reminiscent of a U.N. Building in NYC.

I just can't get on board with ballpark village though. I keep looking at the renderings and I want to like it, but I just don't. Yes, it will be better than a parking lot of course, but the design seems to be something that will be dated very quickly. It's like they tried to squish several high rises together to form one but the look is not cohesive and to me seems like a building that did not have a lot of thought put into the aesthetics. Quite a shame being that close to what I consider one of our most iconic buildings - the new library.

[Prahaboheme]

I actually think Ballpark Village will be one of the more iconic designs over the past several years to rise. So many of the new residential highrises subscribe to the "glass and balcony" look without much effort placed in the aesthetic look of the building.

[Chapelo]

La Jolla Centre III (Irvine Company) progress, Feb 19.

http://i.imgur.com/8oPGNqjl.jpg?1 (http://imgur.com/8oPGNqj)

[spoonman]

^ Nice, Chapelo.

[Bertrice]

Belmont park is adding a new rest/bar and rooftop bar.
and zip lines! finally zip lines!

https://scontent-b-sjc.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash3/t1/1497610_485333294921337_193766701_n.jpg

http://media.sdreader.com/img/photos/2014/01/17/3zi_t658.JPG?ff95ca2b4c25d2d6ff3bfb257febf11d604414e5

http://www.sandiegoreader.com/news/2014/jan/17/stringers-zip-line-mission-beachs-belmont-park/

[tyleraf]

Thanks for the photo Chapelo. Chargers are proposing a Downtown Stadium Spanos/NFL 400 million City sells Sports Arena and Qualcomm sites. http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/10498748/san-diego-chargers-pitch-plan-new-stadium-remaining-protective-la-market

[Derek]

Thanks for the photo Chapelo. Chargers are proposing a Downtown Stadium Spanos/NFL 400 million City sells Sports Arena and Qualcomm sites. http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/10498748/san-diego-chargers-pitch-plan-new-stadium-remaining-protective-la-market


Why on earth does every single thing have to go to the voters?

[Northparkwizard]

Why on earth does every single thing have to go to the voters?

Agreed, if that ESPN article holds water the Chargers have a serious international player involved now that wants to get a deal done soon. Also, the Q and Sports Arena property sales would dwarf the 400M private equity investment on a new city owned stadium.

Who's to say AEG or someone else doesn't buy the Sports Arena site and build a better venue.

Let the free market figure this one out.

[Leo the Dog]

Thanks for the photo Chapelo. Chargers are proposing a Downtown Stadium Spanos/NFL 400 million City sells Sports Arena and Qualcomm sites. http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/10498748/san-diego-chargers-pitch-plan-new-stadium-remaining-protective-la-market

If it comes to a vote, I vote NO.

While keeping tabs on things in Los Angeles, in San Diego the Chargers proposed a plan to build a $800 to $900 million, football-only facility downtown east of Petco Park -- home of the San Diego Padres -- that could seat as many as 70,000 for Super Bowls.

Football only in the East village will create a massive dead zone, further isolating and walling off potential growth in what's probably the most booming neighborhood in SD right now.

[Chapelo]

It really should be placed where the Murph is today. It's been said before, but there is already the infrastructure and the roads to support the stadium there. I'm not sure why downtown keeps coming up, traffic is already bad going downtown, and placing a stadium there is just going to make things worse.

Not to mention not being able to tailgate, plus all the other events the parking lot is used for, like the Big Three Swap Meet this weekend, the RaceLegal events, etc. Those sort of revenue generating events would be able to continue.

[PadreHomer]

Because a downtown stadium would look BEAUTIFUL and the views would be PHENOMINAL.

It has to go to the voters to have legitimacy. The area where the bus yard and tailgate park is would be perfect.

[Bertrice]

I thought the redevelopment money attached to that parcel was gone.
My guess is the property around EV will help developers but more so at sports arena and Q site. Cha Ching . just make sure the taxpayers fork over the majority percentage plus infrastructure costs.

[SDCAL]

If it comes to a vote, I vote NO.



Football only in the East village will create a massive dead zone, further isolating and walling off potential growth in what's probably the most booming neighborhood in SD right now.

Agree. I would rather Qualcomm was redeveloped into a mixed-use inclusive of a new stadium. As someone who lives in EV, I will vote no on any move to bring the stadium downtown for the reasons you mention.

[Derek]

By booming, do you mean dozens of storefronts that have been vacant for 5+ years?

[Northparkwizard]

By booming, do you mean dozens of storefronts that have been vacant for 5+ years?

Yeah, and the booming parking lot and bus depot which a new Stadium would replace. Look the fact is that if the Q site was still on the table it would've been discussed, it's not. I tend to agree that the Mission Valley site is the best place for the stadium but there's nothing you or I can do about it. They've chosen another site, so we can just forget about that. The City will eventually sell the Mission Valley site when the Chargers move into a new facility here or somewhere else. The Spanos' and their partners haven't even given any fine details of the deal and many people have already made up they're minds.

The free market is playing out right now and if it didn't need to come to a vote the deal would be all but done. It would be easily the largest project ever downtown, which I think we can all appreciate. The positive economic impact would also be gigantic.I haven't seen any other developer try and take a stab at the site and they won't because they know better than to get in the way of the biggest fish in the pond.

I was against Petco when it was introduced and I have to admit that my worst fears were never realized. I think with the right architects and engineers, the East Village site could be monumentally awesome.

[Bertrice]

New clairemont shopping center. but NIMBY's stopped the in-n-out. lmfao

http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-ikcrk7tJggM/UwTq2vLoaYI/AAAAAAAAU8o/ewvUcKmOCNk/s280/PrtScr+capture_2.jpg


http://blog.clairemont.com/2014/02/balboa-mesa-unveils-new-look-new-stores.html?m=1

[Puzzlecraft]

As of February 23, 2014 looking southeast from 4th & Thorn.

http://www.custompuzzlecraft.com/SanDiego/5th_thorn_20140223.jpg

[eburress]

New clairemont shopping center. but NIMBY's stopped the in-n-out. lmfao

http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-ikcrk7tJggM/UwTq2vLoaYI/AAAAAAAAU8o/ewvUcKmOCNk/s280/PrtScr+capture_2.jpg


http://blog.clairemont.com/2014/02/balboa-mesa-unveils-new-look-new-stores.html?m=1

San Diegans really are the worst! Who cares if there was going to be an In-n-Out? It's not like that part of town is Beverly Hills or something.

[Leo the Dog]

By booming, do you mean dozens of storefronts that have been vacant for 5+ years?

No, I was referring to just the tower cranes erecting the massive buildings in the neighborhood.

[aerogt3]

Football only in the East village will create a massive dead zone, further isolating and walling off potential growth in what's probably the most booming neighborhood in SD right now.

Yeah, I prefer the stadium not be built, so we can enjoy the lively urban core provided by the empty parking lots and bus yard.

If the stadium would be a "dead zone," I'm curious what you call the space it would occupy right now.

[tyleraf]

I just received an email back from Lankford and associates concerning Lane Field. They plan to break ground in early April.
http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7372/12749792045_75f7e9f4a2.jpg

[Leo the Dog]

Yeah, I prefer the stadium not be built, so we can enjoy the lively urban core provided by the empty parking lots and bus yard.

If the stadium would be a "dead zone," I'm curious what you call the space it would occupy right now.

I agree that what's there currently isn't a lively area, but I don't think that area will be parking lots til the end of time. It should be developed, just not for football.

Football stadiums are suburban structures. The article says it is "football only", meaning it'll be used 10 times/year, with a Super Bowl maybe every decade. The other 355 days it will just be a behemoth of a structure, occupying precious East Village real estate aka the final frontier for DT expansion.

MLB is an inner-city/DT sport. So comparing PetCo Park success to potential Chargers stadium is Apple to Oranges. The Patriots don't play in Back Bay, the Jets don't play in Manhattan, 49ers are in suburbia. SD isn't a run-down rust belt city like Detroit or Cleveland where an inner city massive demo/redevelopment stadium in the core is needed. It is a successful inner-city that is growing with a high demand for housing.

This would be a monumental mistake. Just my opinion though.

[Derek]

It would be a monumental mistake to the lose the Chargers because they want to take over some blocks in the heavily underused/industrial area that's there now.


I agree that Mission Valley is where they should build a new stadium, but if building a stadium downtown allows them to stay then I'm all for it.

[spoonman]

^ Lots of good arguments, but I agree with this at the end of the day.

[tyleraf]

Yea same with me.

[SDfan]

I'd rather lose the Chargers than take valuable urban land off the market. San Diego doesn't have a lot of room for growth, especially for high density development. I've been for the Chargers getting a new stadium, but if it's going to be downtown, I'm voting no. I'm willing to see them pack up and head north, east, or wherever they can sucker some poor community into paying for their new home.

[SDfan]

PS, hilarious that an Innout is controversial. So San Diego.

[Bertrice]

If the chargers want a new stadium paid 50-75% by taxes/bond then they don't have the right to say where. The buyers should have a choice. 70k people taking the trolley LMFAO. what happens when they overlap on a sunday with the padres? BTW I used to work Charger games at the Q. It can't be done. I'm not a hater just a realist w/the logistics. The Chargers don't want to go to LA and LA besides being a shitty sports town doesn't want them.

[Northparkwizard]

If the chargers want a new stadium paid 50-75% by taxes/bond then they don't have the right to say where. The buyers should have a choice. 70k people taking the trolley LMFAO. what happens when they overlap on a sunday with the padres? BTW I used to work Charger games at the Q. It can't be done. I'm not a hater just a realist w/the logistics. The Chargers don't want to go to LA and LA besides being a shitty sports town doesn't want them.

That argument is so tired. Over 75,000 people a day work downtown, so it happens everyday. 2 freeways are even closer, countless bus lines, Multiple Trolley lines(not just 1), Amtrak, Coaster, and vehicles all intersect there. Not to mention the Enormous advantage of being in a area that is walkable and bike-able, unlike the Mission Valley site. Downtown seems to be the best location if we're talking about transit, it works in New Orleans.

[112597jorge]

If the chargers want a new stadium paid 50-75% by taxes/bond then they don't have the right to say where. The buyers should have a choice. 70k people taking the trolley LMFAO. what happens when they overlap on a sunday with the padres? BTW I used to work Charger games at the Q. It can't be done. I'm not a hater just a realist w/the logistics. The Chargers don't want to go to LA and LA besides being a shitty sports town doesn't want them.

LA a shitty sports town :koko:, who are we kidding :haha:, hopefully chargers stay in SD, LA might get Rams anyway (im neutral)

[Leo the Dog]

It would be a monumental mistake to the lose the Chargers because they want to take over some blocks in the heavily underused/industrial area that's there now.


I agree that Mission Valley is where they should build a new stadium, but if building a stadium downtown allows them to stay then I'm all for it.

I don't think anybody wants to lose the Chargers. It would be a HUGE loss to lose an NFL team. MV is perfect IMO. I'd like to bring the NBA back to SD, personally and MLS too.

Another worry of mine is the parking situation. By building a DT stadium, additional surface lots could start to appear in surrounding 'hoods. We might develop a few East Village surface lots with the new stadium, but we might create many more in adjacent neighborhoods.

[Leo the Dog]

PS, hilarious that an Innout is controversial. So San Diego.

I agree...so strange. :koko:

[SDCAL]

If the chargers want a new stadium paid 50-75% by taxes/bond then they don't have the right to say where. The buyers should have a choice. 70k people taking the trolley LMFAO. what happens when they overlap on a sunday with the padres? BTW I used to work Charger games at the Q. It can't be done. I'm not a hater just a realist w/the logistics. The Chargers don't want to go to LA and LA besides being a shitty sports town doesn't want them.

Your first sentence hits the nail on the head.

This is what I found so strange about the article that was posted, it sounds like the Chargers are making all the calls.

This is a result of poor leadership by the city.

Why is the location entirely up to the Chargers, why is it their call to take redeveloping the MV site off the table?

We need better leadership in local government to steer this.

And I agree with those saying they would rather the chargers leave than ruin (in my opinion) east village.

Even some who support a downtown stadium are saying MV would be better, so why settle?

I think it's doing a great disservice to one of the most promising neighborhoods in our city to say, "well it's better than nothing so I'm for it."

Trust me, as a resident down here I hate the vacant store fronts and parking lots with a passion. But, I also realize we have been in the worst economic downturn since the Great Depression over the past 5 years, and I think that more than anything is the cause for stalled development in EV. With the economy picking up, I'm confident development would progress in EV even without the stadium being erected there.

[SDCAL]

I just received an email back from Lankford and associates concerning Lane Field. They plan to break ground in early April.
http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7372/12749792045_75f7e9f4a2.jpg

Great news, thanks for investigating and sharing :). Are the hotels that will occupy expected to be the same ones that were announced previously (I think it was a Homewood Suites and something else)?

[aerogt3]

I agree that what's there currently isn't a lively area, but I don't think that area will be parking lots til the end of time. It should be developed, just not for football.

Realstically, that land will sit for a VERY long time before it's ever developed. If someone wants to build a tower or whatever, there are already dozens of empty lots in much better locations for them to build on.

DT is way more constrained by demand for buildings than space for them.

Football stadiums are suburban structures. The article says it is "football only", meaning it'll be used 10 times/year, with a Super Bowl maybe every decade. The other 355 days it will just be a behemoth of a structure, occupying precious East Village real estate aka the final frontier for DT expansion.

There are lots of non-baseball events held at petco. Considering baseball has a lot more games and occupies the prime seasons for out door events, it's likely a chargers stadium would host a lot more.

MLB is an inner-city/DT sport. So comparing PetCo Park success to potential Chargers stadium is Apple to Oranges. The Patriots don't play in Back Bay, the Jets don't play in Manhattan, 49ers are in suburbia. SD isn't a run-down rust belt city like Detroit or Cleveland where an inner city massive demo/redevelopment stadium in the core is needed. It is a successful inner-city that is growing with a high demand for housing

The 49ers move there next season. Demand for housing is so high that depite probably a hunderd empty lots in DT, there are what, 3 or 4 towers going up?

I'd rather lose the Chargers than take valuable urban land off the market. San Diego doesn't have a lot of room for growth, especially for high density development.

Look at google maps and see just how much of downtown SD is empty lots and surface parking. That there's not a lot of room for growth or that high rises will be built at the bus depot if the stadium is defeated is nonsense. There is at least 20-30 years worth of vacant lots to build on that are in a much better location before the stadium would even begin to compete for space.

The only way that empty space will realistically be developed is if there's a stadium there to make it desirable.

[dales5050]

I'd rather lose the Chargers than take valuable urban land off the market. San Diego doesn't have a lot of room for growth, especially for high density development. I've been for the Chargers getting a new stadium, but if it's going to be downtown, I'm voting no. I'm willing to see them pack up and head north, east, or wherever they can sucker some poor community into paying for their new home.

This has been a common theme here that downtown is running out of room for high density development. As someone who lives downtown, I just don't see it.

What I see are several parcels that are IMHO under developed. Most are mixed blocks where there are a couple of 1-3 story structures and some parking lots.

A great example is the cluster of blocks around Smart Corner (South/West/North/East):

Broadway/10th/C/11th
Broadway/Park/C/12th
E/9th/Broadway/10th
E/10th/Broadway/11th
E/11th/Broadway/Park

I see all of these as developed now but in the long run, these blocks are all ready for dense development. Another example are the two side by side blocks between Broadway/6th/C/8th that has some historically signifiant but not 'AMAZING' buildings currently.

In 25 years, if and when the need for real estate is there downtown, I feel that a good majority of the existing structures downtown will be valued in such a way that they would be likely for demolition if the land is needed for a high rise.

Long story short, I don't see a good portion of the development downtown being 'developed' if that makes sense.

[dales5050]

70k people taking the trolley LMFAO. what happens when they overlap on a sunday with the padres? BTW I used to work Charger games at the Q. It can't be done. I'm not a hater just a realist w/the logistics.


1 - I think a lot of people would take the Coaster DT when they drive now. The Coaster is a much different/better/faster experience than the trolley.

2 - I think it would be AWESOME for both the Chargers and Padres to have games overlap. It would be ideal if it was on a Sunday not a Monday night but even still...

Having 70K-100k sports fans downtown all at the same time would be huge. It would be like having a ComicCon for just a single day but with people who want to drink and eat more.

Every corner of downtown would be packed from morning till night and cash would flow. There would be an energy downtown that is only seen just a couple times a year.

As someone who lives downtown, I don't mind the mess of ComicCon. I know just what it means to the businesses where I live. Sure it would suck for parking and getting in and out but it would only be 1-2 times a year. Instead of being upset about it..I would work with it and enjoy it. Go out and people watch.

[Erip]

1 - I think a lot of people would take the Coaster DT when they drive now. The Coaster is a much different/better/faster experience than the trolley.

2 - I think it would be AWESOME for both the Chargers and Padres to have games overlap. It would be ideal if it was on a Sunday not a Monday night but even still...

Having 70K-100k sports fans downtown all at the same time would be huge. It would be like having a ComicCon for just a single day but with people who want to drink and eat more.

Every corner of downtown would be packed from morning till night and cash would flow. There would be an energy downtown that is only seen just a couple times a year.

As someone who lives downtown, I don't mind the mess of ComicCon. I know just what it means to the businesses where I live. Sure it would suck for parking and getting in and out but it would only be 1-2 times a year. Instead of being upset about it..I would work with it and enjoy it. Go out and people watch.

Most of the merchants and people working at restaurants downtown that I've heard from all say that business suffers on game days. I don't really think the people going to the games spend all that much money elsewhere, and with all those spectators taking up parking and adding to traffic, everyone else tends to stay away on those days. Adding a second stadium event would probably only increase this effect of game day sales losses for downtown businesses.

[Erip]

PS, hilarious that an Innout is controversial. So San Diego.

From what I read on the issue, it was the drive through that was controversial/problematic, not the restaurant per se. Kind of like how residents in North Park were opposed to the Jack N the Box drivethru, this instance had many of the same arguments.

Residents a mere 173 feet away didn't want to listen to the drive thru squack box until 1:30 a.m., or the car stereos, etc. The area for the proposed In n Out was zoned for community neighborhood land use only, and local residents, like most people want a more liveable, walkable, bikeable neighborhood, and a late night drive thru was not that. I think some of the opponents in the area would have been ok if In n Out had been willing to forego the drive thru.

[tyleraf]

So it looks like the old Spreckels building Downtown is going to become residential. http://www.hughesmarino.com/hughes-marino-blog/625-broadway-turning-residential-ags-office-nearing-6-floor-deal-at-one-america-plaza/

[tyleraf]

Here are three new hotels proposed in East Village by the company that developed the Residence Inn in the Gaslamp.
Courtyard: 2015 Completion. Already Approved
http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7325/12780436463_b0b4021ea1.jpg
Fairfield Inn: 2016 Completion. Just filed with CivicSD
http://farm4.staticflickr.com/3696/12780435893_ac52e1f2f5.jpg
Hampton Inn: 2017 Completion. This one I just found on their website.
http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7377/12780749054_b694d1ffdf.jpg
Here is a link to their website. http://www.jstreethospitality.com