Calgary Roads

[freeweed]

Maybe wasn't any "safer" but those guys had insurance for their 4x4's, and if they were to hit something, they would be covered. Did your neighbour with the bob cat have that kind of coverage?

I'd assume so, as it's a commercial vehicle used for the usual things Bobcats are used for (landscaping, earth moving, etc). May not apply on actual roads as it's not a road-rated vehicle, although you'd have to think so as these guys tend to at least load and unload from their trailers on the road, and parked cars...

However, nothing says those 4X4s had coverage. Maybe they were uninsured. Pretty sure the city doesn't have a rule saying "insured vehicles are fine", regardless. If they did I know of many happy contractors who would gladly purchase coverage if they could make a few bucks clearing residential roads.

[freeweed]

As far as hand-shoveling goes, you'd be surprised how much you can do by hand. I used to clear a 75ft. driveway by myself - no more than three hours after the worst snow. If I did that much on the street, and every 2nd neighbor did the same, there would be a one lane passable road at least. People are too afraid of manual labor, yet they run to the gym to stay fit. Go figure.

And you'd be surprised how many people don't go to the gym that's kept at -20C. ;)

It's not that anyone's afraid of manual labour, it's that it's entirely silly. What if we had a flood like in 2006, and people tried using electric pumps to clear their basements, and the city said "sorry, you can bail by hand, it's no more than a few hours work, people are too afraid of manual labour"? What do you think would happen if you walked up to a farmer that uses machinery (ie: all of them) and said that kind of thing?

We have labour-saving technology for a reason. It's lunacy that we cannot use it as appropriate.

People aren't afraid of manual labour. Our government is afraid of the slightest possibility of anything going wrong, so we over-regulate even the tiniest of things. Seriously, my good old days in the 'Peg and northern ON, it was pretty much legal to ride your snowmobile down the street if that was what it took to get things done after a big storm(food, emergency transport, etc). These days? I bet you'd lose your license for a year because "OMG some kid could get hurt or a car might get dented!!!".

[Medicineline]

Forgive me if this has been mentioned... but is there an actual example of plows being added to city vehicles that would not normally have them?? The idea makes for a great talking point, but on my travels I can't think of a single time I've seen a city bus whip by with a plow stuck on its front... If it hasn't been tried elsewhere, why not? There are plenty of other cities in North America who receive a lot more snow than Calgary. If none of them are using this idea, I'm guessing there's a good reason for it....

Not sure about the Denver bus plow, but how about a Philly garbage truck plow?

Photo by Swinefeld

http://i43.photobucket.com/albums/e388/Swinefeld/Blizz%20Pix/Blizzpix_07.jpg (http://forum.skyscraperpage.com/showthread.php?t=176834)

[mwalker_mw]

Garbage truck plows actually seem like a fairly well thought out solution. They are already driving many of the minor routes on a daily basis, they are out early, and there are no passengers. Once morning garbage runs are done, the vehicles are free for use for the rest of the day.

What I am wondering is: why is this such an issue now? We aren't getting any more snow than in the past. Has the level of service provided by the city actually decreased significantly in recent years?

[Ferreth]

And you'd be surprised how many people don't go to the gym that's kept at -20C. ;)

It's not that anyone's afraid of manual labour, it's that it's entirely silly. What if we had a flood like in 2006, and people tried using electric pumps to clear their basements, and the city said "sorry, you can bail by hand, it's no more than a few hours work, people are too afraid of manual labour"? What do you think would happen if you walked up to a farmer that uses machinery (ie: all of them) and said that kind of thing?

We have labour-saving technology for a reason. It's lunacy that we cannot use it as appropriate.

People aren't afraid of manual labour. Our government is afraid of the slightest possibility of anything going wrong, so we over-regulate even the tiniest of things. Seriously, my good old days in the 'Peg and northern ON, it was pretty much legal to ride your snowmobile down the street if that was what it took to get things done after a big storm(food, emergency transport, etc). These days? I bet you'd lose your license for a year because "OMG some kid could get hurt or a car might get dented!!!".

Perhaps "afraid" was a bad choice of words. I'm pretty much with you on the "if the machinery is available let's use it" philosophy. I was thinking of that picture of the NE street being impassable, if it was me and no other option was available, I'd be out there with a snow shovel. If I can't get to work, I'm digging my way to work. Come to think of it, I bet if everyone had spontaneously decided to start cleaning their own streets, the city would discourage that too. Can't have people dropping dead from heart attacks 'ya know. :rolleyes:

I did a little weather digging to illustrate how unusual this winter to date is in Calgary. The average snow depth in Calgary for December is 4cm. Maxes out at 6cm for January. Record snowfall in a day is 22cm for December. So, we really are on the extreme end of what we get in this city.

[MichaelS]

I'd assume so, as it's a commercial vehicle used for the usual things Bobcats are used for (landscaping, earth moving, etc). May not apply on actual roads as it's not a road-rated vehicle, although you'd have to think so as these guys tend to at least load and unload from their trailers on the road, and parked cars...

However, nothing says those 4X4s had coverage. Maybe they were uninsured. Pretty sure the city doesn't have a rule saying "insured vehicles are fine", regardless. If they did I know of many happy contractors who would gladly purchase coverage if they could make a few bucks clearing residential roads.

He would probably have insurance for his commercial operations, but if I was a claims adjuster and he came to me saying he needed to make a claim for damaging parked cars on the road he was attempting to clear, and he didn't have a contract with the City (the owner of the road) his claim would probably be rejected. I am assuming this, but I don't work for an insurance company so could be wrong.

And yes, your neighbours with 4x4's are required by law to have Public Liability and Public Damage on their vehicles, so if they are registered and on the road they have the coverage to repair any damage they cause.

[freeweed]

He would probably have insurance for his commercial operations, but if I was a claims adjuster and he came to me saying he needed to make a claim for damaging parked cars on the road he was attempting to clear, and he didn't have a contract with the City (the owner of the road) his claim would probably be rejected. I am assuming this, but I don't work for an insurance company so could be wrong.

And yes, your neighbours with 4x4's are required by law to have Public Liability and Public Damage on their vehicles, so if they are registered and on the road they have the coverage to repair any damage they cause.

Basically, you're assuming a lot and you're still not addressing the fundamental issue. This really has nothing to do with insurance at the end of the day and all to do with the city disallowing the practice.

If it IS about insurance, here's how this particular catch-22 works:

1. The insurance company would only have a problem with the "no contract" situation if the city specifically will not play ball with independents - ie: bans the practice.

2. You're claiming the city will not let people do this work because of a lack of liability coverage.

See how circular this is?

A Bobcat damaging a car would normally be covered, even though the operator has no specific contract with the city (or the vehicle owner) to be on the roads, if it's due to his normal, allowed course of work. If I get a guy to load some dirt onto my yard, and he bumps my neighbour's car, my contractor has neither a contract with the city nor with my neighbour, and yet his insurance pays. No different than if I pay him to clear the road in front of my house, except that in this case he's violating the law (or at least a city ordinance or by-law or whatever we have here) and like almost all situations like this, the insurance company will deny coverage.

Regardless, the reason contractors won't plow roads on their own isn't about insurance. Until these guys get bit in a large liability claim they never think about it and pretty much play cowboy. They won't, however, allow the city to go after them for "illegal" activities and therefore won't risk their business license etc for violating city law.

It's all about what the city allows.

PS: many people own 4X4s (and other private vehicles) and operate them on the road without insurance coverage. Plus, an insurance company could just as easily deny a claim if someone was found to be illegally "clearing snow" with a 4X4 as they could with a Bobcat. There's no magic clause that says a 4X4 is OK but a Bobcat is not, it's the activity itself that is the root issue here. In fact, just stick a blade on the front of your 4X4 and see what happens. Perfectly legal to drive on city roads with one attached, no commercial insurance required. But try plowing the street in front of your house...

[MichaelS]

I'm not saying it is right or the system needs to change, but I am saying that that is how it is. Yes, if your friend with the bob cat hit a car while doing work on your yard, his insurance would cover it. He was hired to do a job and while performing that job caused damage. But, if he hit it while you told him to plow your street, it wouldn't because unfortunately you do not have the authority to legally authorize that work.

The city might not "play ball" with these guys, simply because it is not normal practice to hire private contractors to clear residential streets. From the sounds of things, this is being looked at and could change. But until there is an official contract (even for sum of zero dollars) ensuring that the volunteer has the legal right to clear the road, and he has proven to have all proper coverage, the city won't allow anyone playing "cowboy" to go out and start clearing roads. Not saying it is right or wrong, just saying it is that way.

[mooky]

What about a provincial Good Samaritan law exempting volunteers clearing snow in the interest of public safety after a declaration of a "snow emergency" or something by the provincial government or a local designate in municipal areas? Law stays in effect until "snow emergency" is lifted by government. Just a thought.

[bookermorgan]

Drove up to Mallzac this eve all the way up Metis Trail (and whatever roads it turns onto on the way. So it is now open.

The signs in the mall showing the alternate route call the portion of Metis Trail north of Stoney "Dwight Mclellan Trail". I don't know who Dwight Mclellan is.

Maybe a Past President of United Horsemen of Alberta?
Google was vague, but i didnt try all that hard :)
good to hear no more little range road to get away from the mall

[You Need A Thneed]

Google was vague, but i didnt try all that hard :)
I didn't try at all, as I didn't really care about who he was, was just pointing out the name.

[Aegis]

I know McIvor isn't the most popular alderman on this board, but I really don't see what's wrong with most of his ideas.

Citizens clearing snow with their own equipment? That's not a good idea, liability issues are a legitimate concern. Hiring contractors? The union will have something to say about that.

Adding ploughs to vehicles? Would be a great idea if there are a lot of surplus garbage trucks sitting around, but somehow I think they are necessary for garbage removal. Maybe I'm mistaken though.

Scheduling clearing with odd/even days parking requirements on streets? Smart idea, don't know why we aren't doing that now.

The biggest problem I see with this debate is there isn't consensus that anything needs to change. I'm willing to bet there is heavy resistance from City departments on changing the way they do business..

The current policy doesn't work, it needs to change!

[DizzyEdge]

I know McIvor isn't the most popular alderman on this board, but I really don't see what's wrong with most of his ideas.

Citizens clearing snow with their own equipment? That's not a good idea, liability issues are a legitimate concern. Hiring contractors? The union will have something to say about that.

Adding ploughs to vehicles? Would be a great idea if there are a lot of surplus garbage trucks sitting around, but somehow I think they are necessary for garbage removal. Maybe I'm mistaken though.

Scheduling clearing with odd/even days parking requirements on streets? Smart idea, don't know why we aren't doing that now.

The biggest problem I see with this debate is there isn't consensus that anything needs to change. I'm willing to bet there is heavy resistance from City departments on changing the way they do business..

The current policy doesn't work, it needs to change!

I've been curious about this one. Anyone know if those trucks are on the road 8+ hours a day 5 days a week to get all of the residential garbage picked up or if there's downtime?

[Bigtime]

It's McIver, not McIvor.

The more you know... :tup:

[freeweed]

Citizens clearing snow with their own equipment? That's not a good idea, liability issues are a legitimate concern.

Oftentimes, liability is found for NOT doing anything. Except when you're dealing with government. You think the hundreds of people involved in accidents after a storm can successfully sue the city for not clearing the roads? How about the bottom of my car being scraped to hell because I have no legal way to properly and safely exit my driveway right now? Why do we as a society often only assume liability on the part of private citizens?

I'd also like to know why we let unions trump common sense. Sorry, but if work needs to be done, hire private contractors and let the unions suck eggs. We're in a recession and I know plenty of trained people who could quite safely do some road clearing, cheap. They're certainly trained and insured for it, they do it all the time on private parking lots all winter long.

I do miss parking bans though. In Winnipeg, you can't park on major roads ANYTIME during the winter, which allows them to always be properly plowed. And after a major storm, ALL on-street parking is banned so that the city can do its job. It's ridiculous that we let people park unmoving vehicles on public roads all winter long.

Although, as should always be kept in our minds, this winter and last are the exception lately. The past 5 years before that I don't think I even saw snow on the road more than a couple of days in a row. :shrug:

[Mazrim]

I always wondered where residents can park in Winnipeg if so much on-street parking is banned during snowstorms. I was there one winter during and had to park like 10 blocks from where I was staying. If I had to do that on a regular basis I would be pissed.

[Aegis]

Oftentimes, liability is found for NOT doing anything. Except when you're dealing with government. You think the hundreds of people involved in accidents after a storm can successfully sue the city for not clearing the roads? How about the bottom of my car being scraped to hell because I have no legal way to properly and safely exit my driveway right now? Why do we as a society often only assume liability on the part of private citizens?:

The difference is that government has "unlimited" ability to take risk. They could be sued and found to be grossly negligent in some situations if it was found that they didn't take any reasonable care to ensure safety. Ie: If a contractor reported a sink hole in a public road and the city didn't do anything about it, and someone else suffered a loss of some kind as a result of the lack of action. The same could be said for streets, but the burden would be quite high. Ie: The City can't be reasonably expected to bring all roads to bare pavement instantaneously.

Mack's Snow Removal will simply declare bankruptcy if they were successfully sued and insurance doesn't cover their liability. Imagine the liability that could result if Mack's Snow Removal actually caused an injury vehicle accident during ploughing? It would be a mess that is completely unnecessary given that we have an entire city department that deals with this issue.

We just need to better utilize resources and agree that something needs to be done!


I'd also like to know why we let unions trump common sense. Sorry, but if work needs to be done, hire private contractors and let the unions suck eggs. We're in a recession and I know plenty of trained people who could quite safely do some road clearing, cheap. They're certainly trained and insured for it, they do it all the time on private parking lots all winter long.

Most unions have exclusive right to the work - its just the way it is. So, we have to work within the constraints of the system..

I seriously think that some aldermen don't even agree that something needs to change. It's like Alderman King is back in office all over again.

[freeweed]

I always wondered where residents can park in Winnipeg if so much on-street parking is banned during snowstorms. I was there one winter during and had to park like 10 blocks from where I was staying. If I had to do that on a regular basis I would be pissed.

Most if not all people have an actual parking spot. It makes visiting friends a bit tricky during the winter but the City only declares an all-out parking ban a handful of nights a year, so you manage.

I always wonder how people manage to own a vehicle without having a dedicated parking spot for it, whether it's on their driveway/garage, a surface lot, or underground. I can't even conceive of buying a car without a place to park it. You can tell where I grew up I guess. :haha:

[mersar]

I always wonder how people manage to own a vehicle without having a dedicated parking spot for it, whether it's on their driveway/garage, a surface lot, or underground. I can't even conceive of buying a car without a place to park it. You can tell where I grew up I guess. :haha:

I'm currently one of those people, and I'll say it can be fun (my landlord has a stall for the unit where I live, but he and a number of others rented out their stalls to a company on the other side of the park so I don't get to use it, though my rent is cheaper as a result). Theres 6 stalls on-street in front of my place that are reserved as resident parking, and theres been a few occasions that we've played a game of musical parking stalls some evenings as people come and go. I'm actually a bit worried about the construction for the 13th ave greenway as its likely these stalls will be removed temporarily during.

[freeweed]

Most unions have exclusive right to the work - its just the way it is. So, we have to work within the constraints of the system..

I seriously think that some aldermen don't even agree that something needs to change. It's like Alderman King is back in office all over again.

Or we look at changing the system. Which leads into your second point there; there's just never the political will to challenge the almighty unions. :koko:

Ah well, it's +10 outside and I bet at this rate my street will be clear by March. :haha:

I will say this though - this winter has finally made me realize why so many people drive SUVs and trucks here. Which is really a pointless waste 95% of the year.

[Full Mountain]

Most if not all people have an actual parking spot. It makes visiting friends a bit tricky during the winter but the City only declares an all-out parking ban a handful of nights a year, so you manage.

I always wonder how people manage to own a vehicle without having a dedicated parking spot for it, whether it's on their driveway/garage, a surface lot, or underground. I can't even conceive of buying a car without a place to park it. You can tell where I grew up I guess. :haha:

I'm not sure how you figure that everyone has a dedicated parking stall....the majority of the city that was built before the last bust has at most capacity for 2 cars, the parts that were built prior to that (1940's and prior) are lucky to have a garage more likely a back drive (capacity 1 vehicle)....I currently live in a house that was built around 1925 and while there is a garage (a later addition) but, I am not allowed to use it as my landlord has rented it out, so neither I nor the folks upstairs who have 2 vehicles have dedicated spots, it makes it a challenge sometimes but not a challenge that I would trade for a 200-300 dollar increase in my rent

[freeweed]

I'm not sure how you figure that everyone has a dedicated parking stall....the majority of the city that was built before the last bust has at most capacity for 2 cars, the parts that were built prior to that (1940's and prior) are lucky to have a garage more likely a back drive (capacity 1 vehicle)....I currently live in a house that was built around 1925 and while there is a garage (a later addition) but, I am not allowed to use it as my landlord has rented it out, so neither I nor the folks upstairs who have 2 vehicles have dedicated spots, it makes it a challenge sometimes but not a challenge that I would trade for a 200-300 dollar increase in my rent

I figure it because the city has an overnight parking ban several times per year, that covers all roads, and for the past several decades (as long as I've been alive I've seen parking bans) the city hasn't towed everyone's car.

From what I recall about vehicle ownership numbers, there are fewer cars than residences in Winnipeg, and much of the city has room for 2, 3, even 4 cars if you include a garage. It's only a select handful that have 3 cars in a house with zero parking spots. Hell, most people in houses with only one spot in the back can't afford multiple cars (that's why they're in tiny older houses in the first place).

You're an outlier, but you're certainly not the typical average case - again, cars aren't being towed by the thousands when the parking ban comes into effect. I know a few friends who park "illegally" in commercial lots (shopping malls, etc) but I never saw those getting full during a parking ban.

If you want to be cheap on parking/rent, that's your prerogative (like mersar above) but then you have to deal with the lack of on-street parking during the parking bans. Everyone I know in the city who owns a car has to contend with this - either live in a place with parking, pay for parking, or do the mad car shuffle a few times during the winter.

And of course, every winter I got the panic call from a buddy who didn't realize reality, asking if he could park on my driveway that night. :haha:

[Full Mountain]

I figure it because the city has an overnight parking ban several times per year, that covers all roads, and for the past several decades (as long as I've been alive I've seen parking bans) the city hasn't towed everyone's car.

From what I recall about vehicle ownership numbers, there are fewer cars than residences in Winnipeg, and much of the city has room for 2, 3, even 4 cars if you include a garage. It's only a select handful that have 3 cars in a house with zero parking spots. Hell, most people in houses with only one spot in the back can't afford multiple cars (that's why they're in tiny older houses in the first place).

You're an outlier, but you're certainly not the typical average case - again, cars aren't being towed by the thousands when the parking ban comes into effect. I know a few friends who park "illegally" in commercial lots (shopping malls, etc) but I never saw those getting full during a parking ban.

If you want to be cheap on parking/rent, that's your prerogative (like mersar above) but then you have to deal with the lack of on-street parking during the parking bans. Everyone I know in the city who owns a car has to contend with this - either live in a place with parking, pay for parking, or do the mad car shuffle a few times during the winter.

And of course, every winter I got the panic call from a buddy who didn't realize reality, asking if he could park on my driveway that night. :haha:

I see that you were referring to Winnipeg and I to Calgary...given that I cannot speak to the housing conditions in Winnipeg

But given the choice between unplowed streets and having to constantly move my car to avoid parking restrictions I'll take the unplowed streets (BTW I have yet to push a vehicle because it got stuck relating to me or someone that I know) this includes years (18+) in a cul-de-sac that isn't plowed and my father had a rear wheel drive truck

[freeweed]

I see that you were referring to Winnipeg and I to Calgary...given that I cannot speak to the housing conditions in Winnipeg

But given the choice between unplowed streets and having to constantly move my car to avoid parking restrictions I'll take the unplowed streets (BTW I have yet to push a vehicle because it got stuck relating to me or someone that I know) this includes years (18+) in a cul-de-sac that isn't plowed and my father had a rear wheel drive truck

I wondered (Winnipeg never has "busts"). There are some in Winnipeg who go it without a parking spot, but it's a real hassle. You get used to it, it's the price of being able to go anywhere. Take what Calgary had last week, double it, and double it some more. That's the first big snowfall in the 'peg. And it almost never melts until March.

Heh. I do hear ya. I've had to push a couple of times here but that's just because up in the deep NW, we're almost in the foothills so we get MUCH more snow than average sometimes. Most people in Calgary don't routinely have to push cars, tho.

A RWD truck is much better in deep snow than your average car, incidentally. It's all about clearance when it comes to deep snow. FWD helps get you going straight but I'll take that truck over a low car any day in the snow.

I dunno though, I must admit I'm a little surprised. On a forum where people typically bemoan the government subsidizing other people's lifestyle/transportation choices, I'm a bit shocked at how many expect the taxpayer to provide y'all with a free parking space. ;)

[freeweed]

Random question:

If I'm not allowed to hire someone to clear a road in front of my house as it's city property and whomever I hire would have no contract with the city... how does that relate to sidewalks?

I've always just done my own but as I get older I can see the day when I want someone to do it for me. Is this also banned? It's city property so I don't see why the rules would be any different. And I'd think anyone offering this sort of service would want to use powered machinery (a snowblower at the very least) which could easily cause damage.

Anyone ever look into this?

[Mazrim]

I wondered (Winnipeg never has "busts"). There are some in Winnipeg who go it without a parking spot, but it's a real hassle. You get used to it, it's the price of being able to go anywhere. Take what Calgary had last week, double it, and double it some more. That's the first big snowfall in the 'peg. And it almost never melts until March.

The instance I was referring to earlier in Winnipeg was the night of a 50cm dump of snow around New Years 2006 I believe. It was chaos and I was extremely impressed with the snow clearing efforts there. Sure, the bus stops were completely buried on most roads, but at least you could drive almost anywhere 12 hours after the storm. I did get stuck twice the day after on small side streets though.

[greg_a]

When does work start on the "all-turns" intersection at 14th and 10th? I think that's supposed to happen as part of the west line c-train project.

http://www.westlrt.ca/files/Sunalta%20ARP%20Amendment%20Phase%201%20June-09.pdf

[MichaelS]

Random question:

If I'm not allowed to hire someone to clear a road in front of my house as it's city property and whomever I hire would have no contract with the city... how does that relate to sidewalks?

I've always just done my own but as I get older I can see the day when I want someone to do it for me. Is this also banned? It's city property so I don't see why the rules would be any different. And I'd think anyone offering this sort of service would want to use powered machinery (a snowblower at the very least) which could easily cause damage.

Anyone ever look into this?

See this bylaw, #67 in it specifically (page 26)
http://www.calgary.ca/DocGallery/BU/cityclerks/20m88.pdf

[frinkprof]

Nevermind.

[freeweed]

See this bylaw, #67 in it specifically (page 26)
http://www.calgary.ca/DocGallery/BU/cityclerks/20m88.pdf

Awesome, thanks! Nice to have the direct page # and everything!

So here's how we solve the dilemma: take this bylaw, replace "sidewalk" with "your residential street". Wow, problem solved.

(For those too lazy to click):


A person may, in such a way as not to cause injury or unduly interfere with any person lawfully using the Sidewalk or Pathway, use a power driven device that is sufficiently light and of such construction that it will not damage the surface of the Sidewalk or Pathway to move ice, snow, or other materials from any portion of a Sidewalk or Pathway.

I do find the adjoining grass section disturbing, however (next point in the PDF). It claims that I'm responsible for the weeds that have grown up in the grass next to my sidewalk. However, there is literally no way to get rid of them other than to re-sod the section. The developer did a piss-poor job there and weed-and-feed is now illegal here, so all I can do is mow it and hope for the best. Clover is virtually impossible to eradicate once it gets a hold in this climate. Ah well, no one's reported me to Big Brother yet.

[lubicon]

Awesome, thanks! Nice to have the direct page # and everything!

So here's how we solve the dilemma: take this bylaw, replace "sidewalk" with "your residential street". Wow, problem solved.

(For those too lazy to click):



I do find the adjoining grass section disturbing, however (next point in the PDF). It claims that I'm responsible for the weeds that have grown up in the grass next to my sidewalk. However, there is literally no way to get rid of them other than to re-sod the section. The developer did a piss-poor job there and weed-and-feed is now illegal here, so all I can do is mow it and hope for the best. Clover is virtually impossible to eradicate once it gets a hold in this climate. Ah well, no one's reported me to Big Brother yet.

Really?? I thought they were still debating that bylaw. And even at that I thought it was only going to be on the sale of herbicides? Either way it doesn't matter to me. I will continue to use them on my weeds and buy from out of town suppliers if I have to.

[mersar]

Really?? I thought they were still debating that bylaw. And even at that I thought it was only going to be on the sale of herbicides? Either way it doesn't matter to me. I will continue to use them on my weeds and buy from out of town suppliers if I have to.

Out of province suppliers actually. The ban on the one chemical in weed and feed is a provincial ban. The city scrapped the cosmetic pesticide bylaw though which is what you were thinking of.

[freeweed]

Good to see the city and province doing such an excellent job communicating that everyone understands what's legal. I don't really know what's changed but I've never been a lawn chemicals fan myself anyway. I just parrot what I think I've heard - and had a nice gift of double concentration roundup sent to me "just in case", even though I don't think I've ever bothered with the stuff. :haha:

[kw5150]

Really?? I thought they were still debating that bylaw. And even at that I thought it was only going to be on the sale of herbicides? Either way it doesn't matter to me. I will continue to use them on my weeds and buy from out of town suppliers if I have to.

Good for you champ...... I despise pesticides and herbicides.

[kw5150]

How can the city possibly force people to clear their sidewalks when the plow ice and snow all over the sidewalks along 10th street nw (and others)? It doesn't make sense.

The city also plows snow right in front of wheelchair ramps which is really disgusting. Is that how lazy and "finger pointy" and extra-costs-obsessed we have all become?

Also, how come the city is allowed to plow huge banks of snow around peoples' cars? They do not post any warning signs and then you wake up and your car is literally trapped with a wall of hard packed snow around it. This has personally never happened to me but it happens on 20th ave nw all the time. I will take a picture of the Nissan "cube" in question and post it.

In Winnipeg they warn people before they plow (went there for uni). If your car is not moved the tow it (at no expense) to the next street over.

Im sure calgary could come up with an urgent snow removal plan if they needed to. The could have enought money set aside every year to clear 2 major snow events. If it doesn't snow, tough luck for the plows!

Another disgusting fact: Some cities actually pay the plow companies for the amount of salt they put on the roads. Then the plow companies dump as much salt as possible on the roads to meet their quotas. Say goodbye to that nice paint job on your older cars!!

RANT COMPLETE.......

[mooky]

Another disgusting fact: Some cities actually pay the plow companies for the amount of salt they put on the roads. Then the plow companies dump as much salt as possible on the roads to meet their quotas. Say goodbye to that nice paint job on your older cars!!

RANT COMPLETE.......

Cost plus x% .. its how the US does a lot of contracts in Iraq too; its come under scrutiny for being an easy way for contractors to pad contracts, which without oversight sure as heck can be. These types of contracts are moronic from the get-go.

[kw5150]

Cost plus x% .. its how the US does a lot of contracts in Iraq too; its come under scrutiny for being an easy way for contractors to pad contracts, which without oversight sure as heck can be. These types of contracts are moronic from the get-go.

Yes, we dont want to end up with that as a contract for sure. All I know is that we seem to "get by" with have next to no plowing so 1 or 2 good street clearings would probably be just perfect.

[greg_a]

I'm not sure of the timeline, or even if there is a definitive one. However, it should be mentioned that this interesection and most of the improvements outlined in the document you posted are not being done as part of the West LRT project. The Sunalta ARP (and amendments) is only a project that is related to the West LRT work. That is, it is an external undertaking.

Thanks for the info.

[kap384]

WOW! 9:41 pm and there is a sanding truck on my street / cul-de-sac right now in Royal Oak! Surprising!

[freeweed]

WOW! 9:41 pm and there is a sanding truck on my street / cul-de-sac right now in Royal Oak! Surprising!

More like perplexing. Why now of all times (middle of a chinook, no forecast snow for over a week)?

[Stang]

More like perplexing. Why now of all times (middle of a chinook, no forecast snow for over a week)?

Maybe trying to spread it around a bit so it melts better in the warmth?

The city must be feeling kind of like a kid who doesn't want to finish dinner. Just spread it around the plate instead of making it disappear. :)

[kap384]

More like perplexing. Why now of all times (middle of a chinook, no forecast snow for over a week)?


Good point. I agree.

[Corndogger]

I noticed the Province has posted the executive summary for Phase 3 of the Deerfoot Trail Safety Audit. The recommendations are more specific this time and everything is costed out, assigned to either the Province or the City, and a Benefit to Cost Ratio (BCR) is provided. The costs seem very reasonable to me and the BCRs are great, if they pan out. One of the recommendations is to test and then implement ramp metering at the Southland Drive and at 11 St. exits southbound. It was determined this area would benefit most from ramp metering.

One of the recommendations that I'm trying to wrap my head around is to implement a bus only shoulder through the Anderson Road interchange area northbound. Anyone who has ever driven through that area knows they need to add lanes to get rid of the bottleneck and that it should have been done a few years back when they were doing all of the other expansion work.

There's also recommendations to add about a dozen cameras over the next three years. Again, this should have been done years ago and they need a lot more.

Of course the recommendations that are bound to be implemented without any thought are lowering the threshold for issuing speeding tickets (what is threshold on Deerfoot anyway--if they make it too low Ed can definitely kiss the Calgary vote goodbye) and concentrating on the next three biggest problems.

The last two pages provide some a nice graphical summary of what is recommended, costs, etc.

http://www.transportation.alberta.ca/Content/docType490/Production/DeerfootTrailSafetyReview-Phase3FinalReport-ExecutiveSummary.pdf

[MalcolmTucker]

^ Well, given the cost of adding a lane, a transit only lane would really help for the feeder buses to Anderson from the deep SE and the BRT. Once the SE LRT is built I would think it would change to normal traffic.

Fixing the bottle neck for normal traffic is all well and good, but it would just move it somewhere else, if not Glenmore and Deerfoot (before it is fixed) , further north?

A little early to have read the study, shall do so later today

[Mazrim]

I know the province wants to do the absolute minimum until the SE Ring Road is open, but some of those recommendations for the long term could be done now regardless of what happens with the SE. Traffic jams will still happen on Deerfoot a few years from now, and people will still commute on it daily. Things like updating the Guide Signage are something that are desperately needed no matter what happens, as some of it is in such bad shape these days. Thankfully some of the changes suggested essentially force brand new signage because "moving an arrow to the right place" on a sign is impossible when they literally squish so much crap into as small as a sign as possible.

Ramp Metering would be a welcome change and I hope they install that sooner than later.

[MichaelS]

Does anyone have a listing and schedule of all the road closures happening today for the Olympic Torch relay?

Thanks.

[mersar]

Does anyone have a listing and schedule of all the road closures happening today for the Olympic Torch relay?

Thanks.

See the city news release (http://newsroom.calgary.ca/pr/calgary/safety-along-the-olympic-torch-151537.aspx?link_page_rss=151537)

[mersar]

Well finally some significant progress on the XRT related interchange work that needs to be done by April. They've got all the bases for the lights at Rockyvalley Drive in place with the wire sticking up through them, the missing northbound left turn signal at Crowchild and 12 Mile also has the base in, and they were thawing the ground at Rocky Ridge Road and Country Hills Blvd for the signals there. Didn't cut through Rockyridge itself so I'm not sure the progress on things within the community or in Royal Oak, may take a detour through there next time I head out to Cochrane

[Ferreth]

I noticed the Province has posted the executive summary for Phase 3 of the Deerfoot Trail Safety Audit. The recommendations are more specific this time and everything is costed out, assigned to either the Province or the City, and a Benefit to Cost Ratio (BCR) is provided. The costs seem very reasonable to me and the BCRs are great, if they pan out. One of the recommendations is to test and then implement ramp metering at the Southland Drive and at 11 St. exits southbound. It was determined this area would benefit most from ramp metering.

One of the recommendations that I'm trying to wrap my head around is to implement a bus only shoulder through the Anderson Road interchange area northbound. Anyone who has ever driven through that area knows they need to add lanes to get rid of the bottleneck and that it should have been done a few years back when they were doing all of the other expansion work.

There's also recommendations to add about a dozen cameras over the next three years. Again, this should have been done years ago and they need a lot more.

Of course the recommendations that are bound to be implemented without any thought are lowering the threshold for issuing speeding tickets (what is threshold on Deerfoot anyway--if they make it too low Ed can definitely kiss the Calgary vote goodbye) and concentrating on the next three biggest problems.

The last two pages provide some a nice graphical summary of what is recommended, costs, etc.

http://www.transportation.alberta.ca/Content/docType490/Production/DeerfootTrailSafetyReview-Phase3FinalReport-ExecutiveSummary.pdf

On the summary page (2nd last page) with the improvements by interchange listed, can anyone make sense of the 3 year plans for Memorial and 17th Ave? They talk about "[closing] access from 19 Street using gates and signs during [the] afternoon peak" on Memorial (which affects me). The 17th Ave action items refer to a 19th Street as well, which makes no sense as there is no 19th Street anywhere near that intersection.

[mersar]

On the summary page (2nd last page) with the improvements by interchange listed, can anyone make sense of the 3 year plans for Memorial and 17th Ave? They talk about "[closing] access from 19 Street using gates and signs during [the] afternoon peak" on Memorial (which affects me). The 17th Ave action items refer to a 19th Street as well, which makes no sense as there is no 19th Street anywhere near that intersection.

19th Street does intersect with 17th Ave, its just on the west side of the Bow river (across from Riverside Quays, by the truck stop) and is the nearest intersection to Deerfoot. Its also currently the 'preferred' route for heading from 9th ave to east bound 17th ave (rather then trying to make a left turn across Blackfoot at 15th Street)

[You Need A Thneed]

19th Street does intersect with 17th Ave, its just on the west side of the Bow river (across from Riverside Quays, by the truck stop) and is the nearest intersection to Deerfoot. Its also currently the 'preferred' route for heading from 9th ave to east bound 17th ave (rather then trying to make a left turn across Blackfoot at 15th Street)
Speaking of that intersection, the city is complete the work on the North side (17A Street). You have a go around a little traffic circle to get from 17th Ave/Blackfoot Trail (going westbound) unto 17th Ave. You also cannot turn from 17th Ave going eastbound onto 17th Ave/Blackfoot via 17A street. You can only turn right onto Blackfoot Trail or go straight onto 19th Street.

[Ferreth]

19th Street does intersect with 17th Ave, its just on the west side of the Bow river (across from Riverside Quays, by the truck stop) and is the nearest intersection to Deerfoot. Its also currently the 'preferred' route for heading from 9th ave to east bound 17th ave (rather then trying to make a left turn across Blackfoot at 15th Street)

Thanks mersar. I never realized until now that that intersection is one of the weird ones in Calgary where 4 different named roads come together in one intersection. I'd think if they do the right turns only from 19th that the light might be able to be kept green longer for Blackfoot/17th - it backs up horribly right now during both morning and evening rush.

I like the new traffic circle - it separates the movements of 17th Ave (west) and 17A Street better. That new development needs it too to allow traffic to come out of 17A St better.

[Corndogger]

Depending on the weather, there is supposed to be some lane closures between 11 PM tonight and 5 AM tomorrow between Hwy 566 and the Yankee Blvd interchange going NB.

January 22, 2010
Lanes close on Queen Elizabeth II Highway north of Balzac

Airdrie... Motorists can expect night time lane closures and speed reductions on the Queen Elizabeth II Highway between Balzac and Airdrie.

The closure affects the highway’s northbound lanes between Balzac (Highway 566) and the Yankee Valley Boulevard interchange in Airdrie. Northbound traffic will be reduced to one lane and the speed limit will be reduced to 50 km/h from 11 p.m. on Jan. 25 to 5 a.m. on Jan. 26, weather permitting. There will be a 15-minute period during these times when all northbound traffic will be stopped.
The proposed lane closures and speed reduction are required to accommodate the installation of an overhead sign structure.

Motorists should use caution in the area and obey all signs, message boards, and flag people. Motorists are reminded that fines for speeding are doubled through construction zones when workers are present.

Source: http://alberta.ca/acn/201001/27703583E012D-EF51-DA70-1F4B01030BC95DF1.html

[bookermorgan]

OSM is showing Airport Trail from Barlow to Stoney. Is this wrong?

[You Need A Thneed]

OSM is showing Airport Trail from Barlow to Stoney. Is this wrong?

Yup, definately wrong. However, it doesn't even show Metis Trail open north of 144th Ave yet.

[mersar]

Yup, definately wrong. However, it doesn't even show Metis Trail open north of 144th Ave yet.

Well Airport Trail has been fixed to be just a proposed road in the database, someone needs to go get the GPS tracks for Metis though.

[lubicon]

Was it just me or did anyone elso notice all the speed traps over the weekend? I know it was near the end of the month (quotas?) but holy shit, it seemed like everywhere I went on the weekend CPS had a trap set up. Off the top of my head they were at: NB Crowchild @ Shaganappi, EB Crowchild at the Crowfoot LRT station, NB Stoney @ Crowchild, SB Stoney just north of the Tuscany interchange.

Probably some more that I have forgot about. I don't recall ever seeing so many different locations over such a short time frame.

[freeweed]

Was it just me or did anyone elso notice all the speed traps over the weekend? I know it was near the end of the month (quotas?) but holy shit, it seemed like everywhere I went on the weekend CPS had a trap set up. Off the top of my head they were at: NB Crowchild @ Shaganappi, EB Crowchild at the Crowfoot LRT station, NB Stoney @ Crowchild, SB Stoney just north of the Tuscany interchange.

Probably some more that I have forgot about. I don't recall ever seeing so many different locations over such a short time frame.

I've noticed a lot of traps on Stoney and Crowchild, especially close to their intersection, on recent weekends. I think the 6(?) year long construction zone and drivers getting fed up is finally making CPS realize how much money there is to be had.

[lubicon]

I've noticed a lot of traps on Stoney and Crowchild, especially close to their intersection, on recent weekends. I think the 6(?) year long construction zone and drivers getting fed up is finally making CPS realize how much money there is to be had.

I'm thinking the same thing.

One thing that irks me was the one on EB Crowchild @ the Crowfoot LRT. There is a temporary sign there where the limit increases from 60 to 80. However it has been knocked over for several days now and there is no signage to indicate when you can speed up to 80. This is right where they sere set up on the weekend and were nailing people left and right who sped up from 60 to 80 a little early.

[freeweed]

I'm thinking the same thing.

One thing that irks me was the one on EB Crowchild @ the Crowfoot LRT. There is a temporary sign there where the limit increases from 60 to 80. However it has been knocked over for several days now and there is no signage to indicate when you can speed up to 80. This is right where they sere set up on the weekend and were nailing people left and right who sped up from 60 to 80 a little early.

Yeah, that one's been like that for a while now and I've been wondering if they'd try to nail people (thanks for the warning!). I have no idea what it's for as it's been a speed up to 80 immediately at the station for months now - but the sign is down for absolutely no reason. No construction and no indication of anything to come, just the usual arbitrary messing with speed limits.

Technically the way it's signed, you cannot speed up to 80 until past Nose Hill now. Completely different from what it's been since the summer.

[Corndogger]

Yeah, that one's been like that for a while now and I've been wondering if they'd try to nail people (thanks for the warning!). I have no idea what it's for as it's been a speed up to 80 immediately at the station for months now - but the sign is down for absolutely no reason. No construction and no indication of anything to come, just the usual arbitrary messing with speed limits.

Technically the way it's signed, you cannot speed up to 80 until past Nose Hill now. Completely different from what it's been since the summer.

The City and the police department should be ashamed for pulling these stunts and then trying to tell people it's for safety reasons. I'd like to see some people run for office this fall that would make this an issue. In other words, if safety is really an issue then address road design, poor signage, etc. but quit blaming speed for every problem. Idiots who drive half the speed limit and/or talk/text on the their cell phones are a much bigger problem and I'm positive their are stats to back that up. Bullshit construction zones that go on for a mile past where the construction ends also need to be dealt with.

[Bigtime]

The City and the police department should be ashamed for pulling these stunts and then trying to tell people it's for safety reasons. I'd like to see some people run for office this fall that would make this an issue. In other words, if safety is really an issue then address road design, poor signage, etc. but quit blaming speed for every problem. Idiots who drive half the speed limit and/or talk/text on the their cell phones are a much bigger problem and I'm positive their are stats to back that up. Bullshit construction zones that go on for a mile past where the construction ends also need to be dealt with.

I agree about these bullshit construction zones. I deal with that one on Crowchild by the LRT station every Sunday when coming back from Sunday dinner with the family, it drives me nuts.

[YYCguys]

I wonder when those 80 km signs will come down on the Deerfoot in the Stoney Trail N. area. I just got a speeding ticket somewhere else, so I'm not taking any chances in that zone. I think that if there is NO activity, the contracters should be forced to remove the signs. Who the heck could I address this issue with and how?

[freeweed]

I wonder when those 80 km signs will come down on the Deerfoot in the Stoney Trail N. area. I just got a speeding ticket somewhere else, so I'm not taking any chances in that zone. I think that if there is NO activity, the contracters should be forced to remove the signs. Who the heck could I address this issue with and how?

Those at least sort of make sense, as the intersection isn't totally done and there are legitimate safety issues in the area that warrant slowing traffic down. The very short merge lane that you take from EB Stoney to NB Deerfoot is insanely dangerous right now, as is the off-ramp to CrossIron Mills.

At least I assume more work is being done on these before it goes back to 110...

[You Need A Thneed]

Those at least sort of make sense, as the intersection isn't totally done and there are legitimate safety issues in the area that warrant slowing traffic down. The very short merge lane that you take from EB Stoney to NB Deerfoot is insanely dangerous right now, as is the off-ramp to CrossIron Mills.

At least I assume more work is being done on these before it goes back to 110...

It's definately not done, the "must exit" lanes on the overhead signs are pointing down to lanes that aren't even there right now.

I'm assuming they have to wait until spring to do the required earthwork.

And, yes, that merge lane (as it is now) requires an 80 speed limit. It's dangeroud even at that speed.

The ring road (and definately that interchange) isn't totally completed, merely substantially completed (being used for its intended purpose) - to use construction terminology.

The exit lane to go from southbound Deerfoot onto Stoney Trail is also not built, but isn't quite as much a safety issue, you just have to be in the right lane at just the right time to exit at exactly the right time.

You can see from how the signage is posted that there is intended to be a continuous extra lane between Stoney and the Crossiron Drive interchange in both directions.

[lubicon]

The biggest issue I have with the 80 speed limit on the QE2, north of Stoney is the lack of signage indicating the speed limit is in fact 80. When you are coming off Stoney (EB Stoney for sure, I can't be sure of WB Stoney as I have not taken that ramp yet) you are coming from a road that has a speed limit of 100 but you don't see the 80 speed limts on the QE2 until quite a distance after you enter the highway. Yes there are yellow caution signs (recommended speeds) on the off ramps but you assume the speed limit goes back up to 100/110 as soon as you get onto the QE2 when in fact it is 80. How are people supposed to know the speed limit is 80 when it is not signed?? :hell:

[para transit fellow]

I understand that final completion of the interchange is expected in fall 2010.

I've had three close calls on NB QEII at the merge.

[Mazrim]

I understand that final completion of the interchange is expected in fall 2010.

I've had three close calls on NB QEII at the merge.
I'm sure it could change to spring 2010 if there's a bad enough accident there... *sigh*

[mersar]

Noticed that they've got the dedicated left turn signals installed for both SB and NB 12 Mile at Crowchild when I came back this afternoon, and they've also got the signals on 12 mile by the Co-op installed as well, all of them are still covered in plastic and not working yet though.

[freeweed]

Positive I've asked this before, but... is parking downtown free on Family Day?

[YYCguys]

Free parking? Calgary downtown? Are you crazy? :) The two phrases just don't seem to make sense in the same sentence!

But it sure would be nice! :)

[freeweed]

Free parking? Calgary downtown? Are you crazy? :) The two phrases just don't seem to make sense in the same sentence!

They do if that sentence ends in the word "Sunday"... ;)

Ah, Google to the rescue. (http://http://www.calgaryparking.com/web/guest/parkplus/parkingrates)

All Areas

Saturday: ALL on street parking rates in Calgary are $1.50 per hour

Sunday & Holidays: No charge

Operating Hours: 0900 to 1800 Mon to Sat. After 1800 and Sundays are free.

List of Holidays

New Year's Day, Alberta Family Day, Good Friday, Easter Monday, Victoria Day, Canada Day, Civic Holiday, Labour Day, Thanksgiving Day, Remembrance Day, Christmas Day, December 26 (if December 26 falls on a Sunday or Monday, then December 27). With the exception of the special provision for December 26, no other day is substituted for holidays falling on a Saturday or Sunday.

[YYCguys]

Well I'll be jiggered! Isn't that interesting! Who woulda thunk it? :)

[mersar]

Couple things to note from Mondays council meeting agenda:

37th Street interchange project is being proposed to also include redesigning the intersection at Richardson Way
Recommendation to scale Metis Trail down from expressway to aerterial, including building only 2 lanes between 80th ave and 96th ave (the missing section) with intersections at 80th, 96th, CHB and 128th Ave, but also looks like provisions for future building of interchanges at all those locations.

[O-tacular]

So here's a list of what I think are the worst stretches of road in this city vitality-wise and pedestrian-wise in no particular order:

1) Crowchild Tr.

2) Anderson Rd.

3) 16th Ave N.E.

4) Bow Tr. between Sarcee and 85th St.

5) 14th St. S.W.

6) Glenmore Tr.

I do alot of driving for my job and driving these is absolutely soul-crushing. You could drive in the country and see more people and buildings than you do trapped between two berms and concrete sound barriers.

[frinkprof]

Nevermind.

[bigcanuck]

4) Bow Bottom Tr. between Sarcee and 85th St.



Corrected

[Stang]

While I don't disagree with the vitality part - those roads are pretty bland to be sure - but what makes them soul-crushing for drivers probably makes them a whole lot more livable for the people who live nearby.

As for the pedestrian part - there's a good reason that those roads don't have sidewalks. ;)

[O-tacular]

Yeah, I meant Bow Tr. But Bow Bottom could also be added to that list.
Driving Glenmore and 14th everyday has really highlighted the awefullness of the 60's model of segregated roads, homes, and work for me.It's no wonder Calgary has such a bad image. People driving the Trans Canada would hardly know that they're within the city until about Barlow Tr. Crowchild is equally bad.

[Mazrim]

Who would actually want to walk alongside Glenmore or Crowchild? I'm glad they're pretty much separate from everything around them, otherwise we'd be constantly hearing people complain that they're dangerous to kids and whatnot.

[craner]

So here's a list of what I think are the worst stretches of road in this city vitality-wise and pedestrian-wise in no particular order:

1) Crowchild Tr.

2) Anderson Rd.

3) 16th Ave N.E.

4) Bow Tr. between Sarcee and 85th St.

5) 14th St. S.W.

6) Glenmore Tr.

I do alot of driving for my job and driving these is absolutely soul-crushing. You could drive in the country and see more people and buildings than you do trapped between two berms and concrete sound barriers.

I don't imagine "pedestrian friendly" was a priority for these roads (with good reason).:hmmm:

[Stang]

Yeah, I meant Bow Tr. But Bow Bottom could also be added to that list.
Driving Glenmore and 14th everyday has really highlighted the awefullness of the 60's model of segregated roads, homes, and work for me.It's no wonder Calgary has such a bad image. People driving the Trans Canada would hardly know that they're within the city until about Barlow Tr. Crowchild is equally bad.

I don't think that Calgary has a particularly bad image because of this. I don't judge London by a trip around the M-25, because that road is busy, polluted, and the view is terrible. Walls, overpasses, barriers, etc.

I don't doubt that someone travelling through Calgary using mostly those types of roads wouldn't have much to write home about. But I also think that most people would realize that there's a lot more to the city.

Last summer I drove from the Peace Arch crossing and around Vancouver (but through the lower mainland cities) to get to Horseshoe Bay. Boring as f***. Ugly. Nothing to see. All highways, pavement, walls, etc.

I don't think that there are any cities that don't have a few bland, boring roads. They have their function, even if they don't look good doing it.

[freeweed]

I don't think that there are any cities that don't have a few bland, boring roads. They have their function, even if they don't look good doing it.

Yes, and they're usually called expressways or freeways. Can't say as I've been in a city of any size that doesn't have them in one fashion or another.

Short of removing the option for high-speed vehicular traffic (which I'm sure some here wouldn't argue against), they're a necessary evil.

[YYCguys]

I got lost at CIM the other day trying to find my way out of the darn place. I was trying to go south to get on Stoney Trail but avoid the QE2/Deerfoot. Signage to Dwight McLellan Trail southbound was not very good at all, and I ended up on a gravel road that went past the auction mart and eventually I hooked up with Dwight McLellan Trail/Metis Trail by luck! Hope signage and roadwork gets better once better weather arrives!

[mersar]

So its sounding like the province is wanting to hand Deerfoot back to the city, under the guise that Stoney will be the "main" highway through the city so its no longer needed to be part of the province's responsibility to maintain Deerfoot. On the upside nothing is likely to happen until after Stoney is complete (so 2015 or later). Of course city council are against it, especially due to the costs that they'd have to absorb

[crooked rain]

So here's a list of what I think are the worst stretches of road in this city vitality-wise and pedestrian-wise in no particular order:

4) Bow Tr. between Sarcee and 85th St.
.

Tell that to the joggers that seem to think it is a suitable route for running despite the lack of a sidewalk or pathway, even in the recent fog.

[korzym]

So its sounding like the province is wanting to hand Deerfoot back to the city, under the guise that Stoney will be the "main" highway through the city so its no longer needed to be part of the province's responsibility to maintain Deerfoot. On the upside nothing is likely to happen until after Stoney is complete (so 2015 or later). Of course city council are against it, especially due to the costs that they'd have to absorb

you make it sound like their conservative to begin with..

[You Need A Thneed]

I got lost at CIM the other day trying to find my way out of the darn place. I was trying to go south to get on Stoney Trail but avoid the QE2/Deerfoot. Signage to Dwight McLellan Trail southbound was not very good at all, and I ended up on a gravel road that went past the auction mart and eventually I hooked up with Dwight McLellan Trail/Metis Trail by luck! Hope signage and roadwork gets better once better weather arrives!

The first light south of the Mall, you turn left (to go east), then you just follow that road to Dwight McLellan Trail, you have to turn, as there is no other option.

[craner]

So its sounding like the province is wanting to hand Deerfoot back to the city, under the guise that Stoney will be the "main" highway through the city so its no longer needed to be part of the province's responsibility to maintain Deerfoot. On the upside nothing is likely to happen until after Stoney is complete (so 2015 or later). Of course city council are against it, especially due to the costs that they'd have to absorb

The don't see (and I don't buy) that the City didn't know this was coming with the completion of Stoney.

[mersar]

Still no more progress in the NW on the XRT related road upgrades... the one new set of lights on 12 Mile Coulee is still turned off, and nothing visible has happened at Country Hills & Rocky Ridge since I was last through there.

Also went up by CIM and have to comment that wow, theres a lot of new roads up there since last summer. Quite a few are blockaded off still, but the County is at least seeming to be preparing for the development thats happening

[lubicon]

This is more of a "Calgary Area Roads' post but I was just looking at the 3 year construction plan for the Alberta Gov't. There are a few highlights for roads in the Calgary. Two projects that seem significant (to me anyway) are:

1. making the QE2 into 6 lanes from Airdrie to Carstairs.
2. completion of twinning 1A between Calgary and Cochrane.

Both projects make me :)

[Corndogger]

This is more of a "Calgary Area Roads' post but I was just looking at the 3 year construction plan for the Alberta Gov't. There are a few highlights for roads in the Calgary. Two projects that seem significant (to me anyway) are:

1. making the QE2 into 6 lanes from Airdrie to Carstairs.
2. completion of twinning 1A between Calgary and Cochrane.

Both projects make me :)

I looked at that document and completely missed Highway 2 being made into 6 lanes to Carstairs. The entire highway from here to Edmonton needs to freewayized and made a minimum of 6 lanes. Take the $2 billion from the unproven and unneeded carbon capture program and another $2 billion from the equally ridiculous regional transit program and you could easily do it. It would be a huge boost to our economy now and in the future.

[MichaelS]

This is more of a "Calgary Area Roads' post but I was just looking at the 3 year construction plan for the Alberta Gov't. There are a few highlights for roads in the Calgary. Two projects that seem significant (to me anyway) are:

1. making the QE2 into 6 lanes from Airdrie to Carstairs.
2. completion of twinning 1A between Calgary and Cochrane.

Both projects make me :)

Does the twinning inlude going down the hill?

[frinkprof]

Nevermind.

[mersar]

Does the twinning inlude going down the hill?

Not according to what I've heard. Just to Gleneagles Drive, which according to some old rumors will get traffic lights installed as well. Theres also supposedly some funding coming up for some improvements to the Highway 1A @ Highway 22 intersection, at a minimum adding some more exit lanes, possibly to going as far as adding new lanes on the bridge over the CPR. Theres also $1.8M for upgrades to Highway 22 south of Cochrane, including yet another new intersection at River Heights Drive (this time roughly 500m south of the current, or 2nd intersection those two roads have had)

[Corndogger]

Could you expand on what you mean by this? I presume you are speaking of the Green TRIP program, which has seen cuts in the last couple budgets.

I'm talking about the $2 billion Ed said the Province would spend on regional transit initiatives which could involve having trains run between places like Airdrie and Cochrane. I realize there have been cuts in the funding delivered but the entire project needs to be shelved. The area to be served is way too spread out and there simply are not enough people to make it viable. I'd rather see the money spent on highways because this will help the economy much more than such a transit project ever would. Hopefully know that the Global Warming/Climate Change data has been proven to be a bunch of lies and politically driven our governments can get back to reality and spend our money on programs that will be useful. If Ed wants to spend some money on reducing pollution, keeping our water sources clean, etc. I'm all for it. I'd even be in favor of building HOT lanes on Hwy 2 to Airdrie to help reduce congestion and provide a *reasonable* alternative to those who don't want to drive.

[Corndogger]

Not according to what I've heard. Just to Gleneagles Drive, which according to some old rumors will get traffic lights installed as well. Theres also supposedly some funding coming up for some improvements to the Highway 1A @ Highway 22 intersection, at a minimum adding some more exit lanes, possibly to going as far as adding new lanes on the bridge over the CPR. Theres also $1.8M for upgrades to Highway 22 south of Cochrane, including yet another new intersection at River Heights Drive (this time roughly 500m south of the current, or 2nd intersection those two roads have had)

Traffic lights?! Hopefully people will threaten to riot if those are the plans.

[Bassic Lab]

I'm talking about the $2 billion Ed said the Province would spend on regional transit initiatives which could involve having trains run between places like Airdrie and Cochrane. I realize there have been cuts in the funding delivered but the entire project needs to be shelved. The area to be served is way too spread out and there simply are not enough people to make it viable. I'd rather see the money spent on highways because this will help the economy much more than such a transit project ever would. Hopefully know that the Global Warming/Climate Change data has been proven to be a bunch of lies and politically driven our governments can get back to reality and spend our money on programs that will be useful. If Ed wants to spend some money on reducing pollution, keeping our water sources clean, etc. I'm all for it. I'd even be in favor of building HOT lanes on Hwy 2 to Airdrie to help reduce congestion and provide a *reasonable* alternative to those who don't want to drive.

The two billion Green Trip program wasn't simply for regional transit, it covers all transit. So Calgary Transit, the Edmonton Transit System, L.A. Transit, and other established systems will likely benefit heavily from the funding.

That said the way some of the talk was headed it did look like new regional systems might really benefit for political reasons but I'd wait until the money is actually awarded before declaring the whole thing a bust.

[mooky]

I'm talking about the $2 billion Ed said the Province would spend on regional transit initiatives which could involve having trains run between places like Airdrie and Cochrane. I realize there have been cuts in the funding delivered but the entire project needs to be shelved. The area to be served is way too spread out and there simply are not enough people to make it viable. I'd rather see the money spent on highways because this will help the economy much more than such a transit project ever would. Hopefully know that the Global Warming/Climate Change data has been proven to be a bunch of lies and politically driven our governments can get back to reality and spend our money on programs that will be useful. If Ed wants to spend some money on reducing pollution, keeping our water sources clean, etc. I'm all for it. I'd even be in favor of building HOT lanes on Hwy 2 to Airdrie to help reduce congestion and provide a *reasonable* alternative to those who don't want to drive.

I don't want to drag this off topic, but I have to respond.

If you are referring to the hacked emails, I'll straighten you out that there was no smoking gun found in those emails. At worst, the talk of fixing the data has to do with the variability of trying to deal with a lot of variables over hundreds of thousands of years. It wasn't an evil scientist plot to cook the books, it was a bunch of eggheads trying to figure out scientific methods of correct comparison and analysis.

If you are referring to the recent snow-storms in the north east of the US, those, though not conclusive evidence, fit the pattern of global climate change models precisely as predicted, they don't in fact refute it.

The overwhelming evidence is still that climate change exists, and that we have to deal with it.

Now whether it is man made(anthropogenic) or natural, that you can argue, but sea levels are rising causing potential displacement of hundreds of millions of people in civilized and developing regions, ice is melting in arctic and antarctic regions at an alarming rate, oceans are acidifying (causing reefs to be bleached and screwing with the biggest environment on our planet that recycles it back into oxygen), and the idea we cannot effect our oh-so-thin atmosphere is naive and stupid.

I'm not necessarily for carbon capture or carbon credit trading, and I don't want to get on that debate here, but please leave your FUD out of the discussion.




Now, back to roads... did anyone else see on Global last night that the Science Center on St. Georges is not going to lead to the road being fully upgraded?

According to the report only a small portion in front of the new building will be redone, so main access will still be off Memorial, and if anyone wants to use 8th avenue, they will at best be using a road that looks like a bomb hit it. No plans to upgrade it according to Ald Joe Ceci as the biggest problems are only 500 cars a day use it (there estimates) and the poor drainage in the area would require a storm sewer which currently isn't there. I have to figure personally though that the amount of cars coming off 8th avenue will in deed increase once the science center is open. How many though, I don't know.

Right now the road is closed north of the construction site to soccer field due to flooding/icing which has mangled the road, though drivers were still detouring around the barricade.

[freeweed]

Anthropogenic. ;)