Robson Square Renovations

[Yume-sama]

Who knows what could be under that road, it would cost a lot of money to do, and take a long time to accomplish. I don't see anybody being a proponent of closing traffic on Robson Street long enough to accomplish this goal. Where would all the tricked out Porsche 911's cruise? Think of the rich folk for once! :P

[officedweller]

I think you'd be running through what is currently UBC Downtown if you put a tunnel in (Mind you, if the sunken plaza is roofed over, there would be space created in those areas for the campus).
A tunnel ramp would also have to cut across/through the existing Howe Street underpass/tunnel - but there may be just enough height in that tunnel there to insert a second level (although it is used for overheight trucks to load and unload into both the Robson Square complex and the Law Courts).

[deasine]

On CTV Canada AM this morning, Premier Gordon Campbell gave very few details regarding the clamshell.

Apparently, Arthur Erikson is involved in this project, but he said he has "minimal involvement."

[mr.x]

What should be done with Robson Square?
Vancouver/CKNW(AM980)

4/23/2008

The provincial government has announced it will consult the public on the future development of Robson Square in downtown Vancouver.

The ministry of economic development plans to hire a consulting company in the next few weeks to begin the process.

It's not clear at this point if the consultations will include Premier Gordon Campbell’s proposal for a giant wooden "clamshell" to cover Robson Square.





Posted by jlousa

GE Ice plaza drawings.
Have to admit they are not impressive.

http://www.fileden.com/files/2008/4/11/1862053/A2.0%5B1%5D.pdf
http://www.fileden.com/files/2008/4/11/1862053/A2.0%5B1%5D.pdf
http://www.fileden.com/files/2008/4/11/1862053/A2.0%5B1%5D.pdf
http://www.fileden.com/files/2008/4/11/1862053/A2.0%5B1%5D.pdf (http://www.fileden.com/files/2008/4/11/1862053/A2.1%5B1%5D.pdf)
http://www.fileden.com/files/2008/4/11/1862053/A2.0%5B1%5D.pdf (http://www.fileden.com/files/2008/4/11/1862053/A2.2%5B1%5D.pdf)
http://www.fileden.com/files/2008/4/11/1862053/A2.0%5B1%5D.pdf (http://www.fileden.com/files/2008/4/11/1862053/A2.3%5B1%5D.pdf)
http://www.fileden.com/files/2008/4/11/1862053/A2.0%5B1%5D.pdf (http://www.fileden.com/files/2008/4/11/1862053/A2.4%5B1%5D.pdf)
http://www.fileden.com/files/2008/4/11/1862053/A2.0%5B1%5D.pdf (http://www.fileden.com/files/2008/4/11/1862053/A2.5%5B1%5D.pdf)
http://www.fileden.com/files/2008/4/11/1862053/A2.0%5B1%5D.pdf (http://www.fileden.com/files/2008/4/11/1862053/A2.6%5B1%5D.pdf)
http://www.fileden.com/files/2008/4/11/1862053/A2.0%5B1%5D.pdf (http://www.fileden.com/files/2008/4/11/1862053/A2.7%5B1%5D.pdf)






posted by leftcoaster
http://i75.photobucket.com/albums/i305/mattcav/Overview.jpg

http://i75.photobucket.com/albums/i305/mattcav/North.jpg







If they're going to have public consultations, it's going to be pretty pointless. Lots of hippy kids going "hey man, you can't chop that tree...it's a living thing, just like you" or senile seniors saying "the provincial government plans to build a roof that will cast a dark shadow over Robson Square, turning it into a safe haven for junkees, the homeless, and addicts. Will somebody think of the children?!!!! FOR GOD'S SAKE THINK OF THE MOTHER F@C!K!N@ CHILDREN!"

.....as with the aquarium consultations, observation tower consultations, Waterfront Stadium consultations, and the knoll.

[Jacques]

QUOTE "If they're going to have public consultations, it's going to be pretty pointless. Lots of hippy kids going "hey man, you can't chop that tree...it's a living thing, just like you" or senile seniors saying "the provincial government plans to build a roof that will cast a dark shadow over Robson Square, turning it into a safe haven for junkees, the homeless, and addicts. Will somebody think of the children?!!!! FOR GOD'S SAKE THINK OF THE MOTHER F@C!K!N@ CHILDREN!"

.....as with the aquarium consultations, observation tower consultations, Waterfront Stadium consultations, and the knoll."
I agree with you, that being said they wouldn't be any druggies or homelessness if the frigging government Municipal and Provincial would get their act together and start building those Affordable housing as promises and relocate the bunch of Crakcheads to Mayencourt "second Hope in prince Georges, they are offered a chance to be there for 3 to 5 years that would be a good fix and they could take up to 500 of these would be lost causes.
But eh who's listening when there is a solution, no one as usual, I would close insight and move all of them out of town, end of storey.
As for the three hugger well send them back to KITS and mothers with children and Old lady scared with their anting and ranting can stay in Yaletown because they are too good to be in the Downtown core any way.
they may as well be safer with Urban fare and their lattes on sunny day not rain on their precious poodles and Chiwawa. WT

[deasine]

But then again, when the Provincial Government does public consultations, things start to change a little. Their method of public consultations is literally to consult the public with their proposal, ask feedback from them [ignore the back ones], and continue on the project. It's just a stepping stone.

[jlousa]

Wish I wasn't right, but looks like there won't be a clamshell.

http://www.canada.com/theprovince/news/story.html?id=0bbd38d9-0c6f-4045-a9fa-822efa72e193&k=18145

An idea to build a wooden "clam-shell" roof over Robson Square has been shucked and thrown out with the garbage.
Economic Development Minister Colin Hansen said yesterday the idea for a wooden roof over the square, linked to Premier Gordon Campbell, is now officially dead.
"We had never adopted that concept," he said. "That concept for a so-called clam-shell roof is not on."

The B.C. government has announced a public-consultation process over what to do with Robson Square, designed by architect Arthur Erickson.
Les Bazso, The Province

The idea was floated last year, but received almost universal derision, including a plea from the prestigious Royal Architectural Institute of Canada to drop the concept.
Hansen said the province wants public input into the future of the downtown Vancouver plaza, which is getting an $87-million facelift.
Much of the site is currently under tarps, to plug leaks in the 30-year-old structure.
Hansen wants Robson Square to become a cultural space that could be used for public events.
"We're open to ideas," Hansen told The Province. "I hope
people will look at how Robson Square can become a meeting-place, and a place where Asia-Pacific cultures can be celebra-ted."
Part of the plan is to build a new $23-million Asia-Pacific Centre.
Robson Square is to be one of the celebration spaces around the city during the 2010 Olympics and the outdoor skating rink is being refurbished in time for the Games.
The square's architect, Arthur Erickson, has been giving advice on the project, Hansen said,and will be part of any design changes.
NDP Olympic critic Harry Bains wanted to know if this is another Olympic cost.
"The taxpayer has every right to know if this is another hidden cost," said Bains. "The public should make the decision. There should be real input by [the] public, then act upon those suggestions."
Fred Kent, president of the New York-based Project for Public Spaces, said the square's sunken plaza rarely works because people don't like to go below ground.
Kent said Robson Square should remain open 18 hours a day, with cafes, restaurants and activities.
"It has to work all the time. It can't just work when there are festivals," he said, adding that it should also link up with the lawn of the Vancouver Art Gallery.
"You really don't have any great gathering place in downtown and that's really a fatal flaw," he said. "It may be the last attempt to make it work."

[mr.x]

^ that's quite dissapointing.....a public consultation????? yea, Robson Square probably won't be changing anytime soon.

[flight_from_kamakura]

you know, when erickson is standing before st. peter, and the balance of his life is under scrutiny, robson square will figure in the judgment. unfortunately, that doesn't help those of us concerned with vital public spaces.

this quote says it all:


Fred Kent, president of the New York-based Project for Public Spaces, said the square's sunken plaza rarely works because people don't like to go below ground.
Kent said Robson Square should remain open 18 hours a day, with cafes, restaurants and activities.
"It has to work all the time. It can't just work when there are festivals," he said, adding that it should also link up with the lawn of the Vancouver Art Gallery.
"You really don't have any great gathering place in downtown and that's really a fatal flaw," he said. "It may be the last attempt to make it work."

i just don't get how moronic some people can be - the foolish urbanists and architects who want to protect this idiotic "square" were formed during an era when precisely this form of development seemed clever and progressive, and as such, they, among all others, should be precisely who we are ignoring! despite the fact that it came from the mind of a confirmed philistine (gordo), the "clam-shell" arch was actually a great idea, and it would undoubtedly have given the "square" (more of) a sense of place. i just can't believe that he wouldn't ram it through! gordo, you know you're right! you're willing to lay off thousands of government workers, privatize medical services, and eliminate the ministry of environment BUT it's too much to impose a fairly well-considered project upon this failure of a public space?? come on pal.

oy, anyway. personally, i think that when the olympics are done, we ought to raze the courthouse block between smythe and robson, and build a grand public plaza.

[officedweller]

The main thing they need to do is remove the hedge and the domes to improve visibility down into the sunken plaza.

[TwoFace]

Taking advantage of cheap Tuesday at the Gallery the other day, there was a Ball Hockey game going on downstairs.
Little dark down there, needs more light for sure.

[deasine]

Forgot about this last night: CTV reports that this project is scrapped but public consulations about how to improve the square will come soon. i think we need to change the thread name to "Robson Square Renovation | proposed"

[agrant]

personally, i think that when the olympics are done, we ought to raze the courthouse block between smythe and robson, and build a grand public plaza.Yea. That part of the courthouse and area under Robson doesn't work for the public. I'd even go further and block car traffic between Hornby and Howe. I'd like to see everything open up, be more accessable and noticeable. You see hundreds of people walking by along Robson at any given time, then almost nobody in the law courts area or down below. It was a nice idea at the time, but it needs to change.

[ckkelley]

Too bad about the roof. Oh well, life goes on.

As for the upcoming discussions I think I'm gonna propose a landmark marble fountain, lavish in design and tricked out with lighting for night viewing. Something to the tune of $50 Mil. or so.

[jlousa]

The plans for Robson Square look really good, at least in my opinion, I've sent a copy of what's being proposed to SFUVancouver so that he could look over it and post what he thinks. I'll post a link to the document at that time. I can confirm the roof is off the table, which is unfortunate because it looked terrific, but the rest of the plans are pretty great. :tup:

[deasine]

The plans for Robson Square look really good, at least in my opinion, I've sent a copy of what's being proposed to SFUVancouver so that he could look over it and post what he thinks. I'll post a link to the document at that time. I can confirm the roof is off the table, which is unfortunate because it looked terrific, but the rest of the plans are pretty great. :tup:

That's great news... don't disappoint us jlousa... jkjk :P

[jlousa]

Sorry SFUVancouver, was hoping to see what you thought before I let the wild dogs at the bones. :tup:

Anyways heres a link to where I'm hosting it, my bandwidth there is going to get killed so maybe someone can host it elsewhere. It's over 5mb so don't even think of opening it directly, just save it onto your computers first. Enjoy.

http://www.fileden.com/files/2008/4/11/1862053/Robsonsq.pdf

[mr.x]

it's alright, it's just not the same without the roof.

I like the location and the design of the Asia Pacific Centre, it matches with Erickson's courthouse, and the new water jet plaza for the Art Gallery.

[flight_from_kamakura]

hmm, yeah, no mention of the arch, that's really really disappointing. well, maybe it's a timetable thing and gordo will pull the trigger on it after the olympics. one can hope.

all in all, however, i see this as a big improvement. better integration of the sunken area with the street will do a lot to improve the square, and the asia pacific building is a great addition (and i especially like how the design has steps up and off the street AND street-level windows etc - clearly erickson had nothing to do with it *wink).

on the less positive side, i have mixed feelings about the granite/led plan on the georgia street side. my immediate question is why not expand the grassed area and plant a bunch of trees and things instead? oy. that said, it'll be useful for the olympics, and it does fill a sort of need for festival use. it could be a great spot for another farmer's market too.

hey and thanks for the document jlousa

[mr.x]

I wouldn't be surprised if the APC and the UBC Knollers moved in and started complaining about the grass being removed.

[deasine]

LOL!

Are they still doing the Georgia Street Plaza, that fountain thingy? That would be so cool to have in Vancouver. Let's surround the olympic clock with that =D

[officedweller]

The fountains on the plaza may end up being a bit stark. Looks like they get rid of all the trees except new street trees.
Think Yonge Dundas Square in Toronto which has the same water features and suffers if there is no pedestrian activity. i.e. think rainy day.

I think what we have now is better than a relatively barren plaza. i.e. Toronto is trying to soften the look of Nathan Philips Square - why are we going in the opposite direction?

BTW - the fountain on the plaza is the BC Centennial Fountain - erected on BC's 100th anniversary (of being founded) in 1958. This year is BC's 150th anniversary.

[vanlaw]

The fountains on the plaza may end up being a bit stark. Looks like they get rid of all the trees except new street trees.
Think Yonge Dundas Square in Toronto which has the same water features and suffers if there is no pedestrian activity. i.e. think rainy day.

I think what we have now is better than a relatively barren plaza. i.e. Toronto is trying to soften the look of Nathan Philips Square - why are we going in the opposite direction?

Agreed - they shouldnt pave it over simply to say they "changed" the area - NPS in TO is brutal, and YDS, with the newly completed "Toronto Life Square", has turned out to be a big POS, in my opinion - no idea why they would want to turn the whole block into a water feature that would only really be utilized 2-3 months of the year.

[SFUVancouver]

Sorry SFUVancouver, was hoping to see what you thought before I let the wild dogs at the bones. :tup:

Anyways heres a link to where I'm hosting it, my bandwidth there is going to get killed so maybe someone can host it elsewhere. It's over 5mb so don't even think of opening it directly, just save it onto your computers first. Enjoy.

http://www.fileden.com/files/2008/4/11/1862053/Robsonsq.pdf

No worries. I was off line for a weekend for an extended family gathering.

Interesting reading, jlousa, thanks for the file.

Here are some highlights:

1. SUMMARY OF THE PROJECT
The scope of this project is to provide the necessary consulting services to develop, implement and manage the delivery of a public consultation process to gather feedback and input on the revitalization of Robson Square, including:

• The proposed Asia Pacific Trade and Cultural Centre Pavilion building; and

• The proposed Georgia Street Plaza


In addition the public consultation process is to seek input on revitalization ideas that would help achieve the following objectives for the Ice Rink Plaza, the Art Gallery Plaza and the areas around the corner of Robson Street and Howe Street, including:

• Enhanced public use of the Ice Rink Plaza for year round gatherings, functions and celebrations;

• Enhanced visibility, connectedness and accessibility of the lower Ice Rink Plaza from Robson Street;

• Significant weather protection for the ice rink and lower plaza area to encourage year round use of the
space; and

• Providing increased street level presence for UBC Robson Square on Robson, Howe and Hornby.


[It mentions the plan for renovations and then continues]

In 2007 planning commenced for the next phases of the remediation program. The remediation planning included:

• Areas previously identified as requiring envelope remediation but assigned a lower priority and not included in the previous phases of the work

• New areas with failed envelope components discovered as the previous work progressed.


In conjunction with planning the next phases of remediation, it became evident, in part through feedback from the tenants, that the public spaces required revitalization. In addition, The Province’s Asia Pacific Initiatives were investigating Robson Square a central location to facilitate the operation of their programs.

Accommodation and Real Estate Services (ARES) together with the Ministry of Economic Development commissioned Clive Grout Architect in collaboration with Arthur Erickson and Nick Milkovich Architects to develop concepts for the revitalization and enhancement of the public spaces located in Block 51 and Block 61. Specifically, the objectives of the revitalization concepts were focused on achieving:

• enhanced visibility and accessibility of the lower Ice Rink Plaza from Robson Street;

• providing significant rain protection to the ice rink and lower plaza area;

• providing new opportunities on the Robson Street level for public gathering and formal and informal performance/entertainment;

• revitalizing the corner of Robson Street and Hornby to support Asia Pacific Trade and Cultural initiatives;

• establishing a formal civic gathering space on the existing Centennial Plaza on Georgia Street, thereby providing a setting for a wide range of formal and informal activities;

• Strengthening the connection between the public spaces located at the Georgia Street plaza and the plaza spaces around the ice rink and the southern face of the Art Gallery; and

• Providing increased street level presence for UBC Robson Square on Robson / Howe and Hornby.


Coincident with development of the revitalization concepts, General Electric (GE) and the Province of BC announced a sponsorship donation from GE for the operation of the ice rink. Re-opening of the ice rink will contribute to the vitality of the space by providing a focus for public gathering and activity especially in the winter months and the sponsorship agreement with GE will help that be realized.

The concept plans developed by Clive Grout for the revitalization of Robson Square are enclosed as Appendix 3. The main Revitalization concepts include:

• A new entry “Pavilion” for the Asia Pacific Trade and Cultural Centre constructed with frontage on the Robson-Hornby corner and a landscaped terrace level access on the revitalized mound. The entry pavilion will be connected to the Asia Pacific area currently being planned for the former ICBC space. It also includes a new section of stairs along the sidewalk frontage that would mimic the stairs to the Art Gallery Annex across the street. This will create an “amphitheatre” setting for public uses and further enliven this corner of Robson.

• A simple formal granite-paved plaza in the heart of the urban core for use by all. This will serve as a forecourt to the heritage law courts building (no matter who is the long-term lessee) and a large public gathering place. A water and light feature would be incorporated into the new plaza.

The original concept plans also included a large roof structure covering the entire ice rink plaza and spanning over Robson Street. That component has not been accepted.

[Hed Kandi]

When is this supposed to be completed?

[SpongeG]

Clamshell over Robson Square: Is it really dead?

Remember that idea for a clamshell roof over Robson Square that was being blamed as a dreamchild of Premier Gordon Campbell? The one that caused such a ruckus when my colleague Miro Cernetig wrote about it that the government quickly folded the tent (pun intended) and said the $40 million "elegant signature iconic glass and timber roof" was being cancelled? (See another of his stories here.)
The one that was such an embarrassment for the government that it insisted that any plans for revitalization of the Robson Square centre needed to go through a consultation process

Economic Development Minister Colin Hansen even told the media on April 24 that the roof idea was dead, thanks largely to a campaign by Cernetiq and The Vancouver Sun's editorial board.
Well, for a brief moment this week we thought the project had come back to life like a vampire whose heart had been missed by the stake.
On May 1 the government, true to its promise, issued a request for proposals for consulting services for the public consultation process. It even included a handy-dandy attachment of the RFP for potential bidders to download.
But when one looks at the 50-page document there is a bit of a surprise lurking in the back. From page 38 onwards there is an interesting series of plans and timelines that show the supposedly-dead roof resurrected again. Along with an expectation that construction will be finished by the end of 2009.
Naturally, I called Hansen for comment. I don't normally catch Hansen unprepared, but this time he was literally speechless. He said he didn't know about the newest proposal and immediately disconnected so as to go check out the story.
Within 10 minutes he'd called back, both embarrassed and perturbed. No, he said, the roof was not part of the project. It really is dead as a Dodo. Someone inadvertently included an early architectural report to the RFP so as to illustrate the concept, but no, no, no, the clam has been shucked, he said.
"It was clearly a non-starter," he said. "I made it quite clear that the clamshell roof is quite dead."
Hansen also says the revitalization won't be finished before the 2010 Winter Games.
"There is absolutely no way that this can be finished before the Games," he said.
Hansen says the province is refurbishing and expanding the existing skating rink in time for the Games. It will have a roof to protect it from rain, but that won't be a clamshell or span the road. Robson Square will also be used as a public celebration site during the Games, where the province will have an unaccredited media centre, the BC Showcase pavilion, and the 2010 Commerce Centre.
As of Wednesday afternoon the province hadn't fixed the faulty RFP attachment. It didn't really want the public to see the schematics for the roof, but for the record I've posted a copy of the RFP document here.
http://communities.canada.com/vancouversun/photos/insideolympics/images/201691/500x366.aspx



http://communities.canada.com/vancouversun/blogs/insideolympics/archive/2008/05/07/clamshell-over-robson-square-is-it-really-dead.aspx

[flight_from_kamakura]

^ uh, yeah, maybe next time the reporter might want to read the request for tenders. yeesh.

[vanlaw]

^ uh, yeah, maybe next time the reporter might want to read the request for tenders. yeesh.

That would require Canwest reporters to have the ability to actually read and properly research stories. Come on! What are you going to ask for next! ;)

[mr.x]

I honestly hope Canwest goes bankrupt.....it's basically becoming the News Corporation/Fox of Canada.

[MistyMountainHop]

I honestly hope Canwest goes bankrupt.....it's basically becoming the News Corporation/Fox of Canada.

Aw, come on! It's bad, but not that bad. :rolleyes:

[mr.x]

Aw, come on! It's bad, but not that bad. :rolleyes:

It's like a virus....it grows and grows and grows. Fox News wasn't bad, but not that bad, a decade ago. Canwest is traveling on a slippery slope. It has gotten worse over the past few years.

[deasine]

Nah Fox is just down there. CanWest is getting worse but not that far yet. Global BC should just become BCTV again... much better then.

[mr.x]

Nah Fox is just down there. CanWest is getting worse but not that far yet. Global BC should just become BCTV again... much better then.

http://www.coxandforkum.com/archives/05.12.20.ExtraExtra.COL.-X.gif



I would even go as far as saying that Global BC was responsible for that "outrage" over the RCMP taser incident at YVR. While horrible and deserving of coverage, they took it way way out of context. They were spinning it in every way they could....and you can also tell by the Sun and Province headlines.

CTV is also heading down the same path, and CBC has started following their lead too....those online polls/comment questions are just ridiculous.

[vanlaw]

I honestly hope Canwest goes bankrupt.....it's basically becoming the News Corporation/Fox of Canada.

Agreed - I'm a big news fiend and have always preferred BCTV - buts its just turned to crap. The story's the lead off with tonight at 5, will still be lead tomorrow at noon - they cycle the same shit through for 5 newscasts (5, 6, 11, morning and noon)....and all it covers is the same crap in the Sun and Province, word for word - get rid of the Province jokers - Dana Gee and Stuart Derdyn - that stuff is not news. It all went downhill when all three became part of same org.

BBC World is a decent news service. Great world newscast, and good programming in between (world business report, click, fast track, reporters etc) as well.

[jlousa]

I hate Global probably more then the next guy but there was a mistake in the RFP.
If anyone read the whole thing instead of just skimming it, then it's clear there is no roof, but if they only looked at the timeline then the roof is still there. The RFP has even been recalled and they are adjusting it to remove the roof completely. So it still boils down to sloppy journalism.

[jlousa]

Figured I'd revive this as it's now in progess, and there some more info.

The new clear domes will be 3ft lower then the existing ones to improve visibilty to the lower level, as we talked about here the new greenery will be much lower as well. The lighting will be via leds and will include colour shifting to entice people to come see what's going on. They have decided against the new stairwells as they plan on using the money saved to make the existing stairs better and more inviting. They figured if people won't come down the exisiting 4 stairwells, then they still wouldn't with 6. They are also considering buying out some of the leasees to bring in something that draws people, they have considered restaurants but they have failed there in the past, so they are still hashing out ideas.

We can probably change the title from proposed to u/c.

[officedweller]

Thanks for the info

[Phazed]

this project had so much potential initially; now it's a bit of a disappointment

[deasine]

We can probably change the title from proposed to u/c.

Will do.

this project had so much potential initially; now it's a bit of a disappointment

Well we did loose a nice roof but I don't think we should just say this project has no potential.

[LeftCoaster]

The construction schedule for the project was released this morning at a site meeting. The project will be starting as close to October 1st as possible with a scheduled completion date of February 9th, to be ready for the one year countdown to the games on February 12th.

The start date of October 1st is going to be somewhat tight, as the tendering of the project does not even close until September 25th, barring any extensions. With at least a week of mobilization that should be a difficult target to hit, but at least it lights the fires to get the contractors moving on this project ASAP.

[clooless]

this project had so much potential initially; now it's a bit of a disappointment

Are you kidding? Robson Square is losing those hideous brown domes, which will be replaced with something contemporary.

That's worth it right there.

[mr.x]

Are you kidding? Robson Square is losing those hideous brown domes, which will be replaced with something contemporary.

That's worth it right there.

He means the original plans for a wood/glass roof over the entire plaza, and a much larger ice rink.

[jlousa]

There were never plans for a much larger ice rink, the ice rink is being expanded to the original proposal, as for the clamshell roof that was always just a vision and was never seriously considered.

[deasine]

There were never plans for a much larger ice rink, the ice rink is being expanded to the original proposal, as for the clamshell roof that was always just a vision and was never seriously considered.

They should make the new oval domes shape like a clam then =)

[Delirium]

not much to see but here's some pictures from this morning

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y101/oct2gon/Picture111-1.jpg

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y101/oct2gon/Picture110-1.jpg

[clooless]

He means the original plans for a wood/glass roof over the entire plaza, and a much larger ice rink.

True, the clamshell roof isn't in the renovation plans, but we've known for months that wasn't going to happen. Replacing the brown domes of atrocity with something that will let more light in (I presume) will brighten the lower space enormously.

[jlousa]

Just received this from the city today, not much new info but worth the read.

http://www.fileden.com/files/2008/4/11/1862053/RobsonSq2.pdf

[deasine]

It says "file isn't there"

[jlousa]

Try again, for some reason it doesn't like filename with spaces, I had to change it.

[ravman]

oh its there

[Delirium]

YAY those damn pagoda things are history!

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y101/oct2gon/Image1-9.jpg

[deasine]

some interesting stuff... =)

[fever]

just got this.. feedback from the open house

http://www.robsonsquarerenewal.gov.bc.ca/down/consultation_summary_report.pdf

[officedweller]

Pics of the canopies for the renovation work taken by me today.

http://img410.imageshack.us/img410/3333/pa210866ee1.jpg

[officedweller]

Pic of the construction canopies taken by me today. Note how the peaked form matches the copper peaked roof of the old courthouse building:

http://img354.imageshack.us/img354/6931/pb080867fg5.jpg

[officedweller]

Pic taken by me today:

http://img102.imageshack.us/img102/739/p4291006.jpg

[SpongeG]

neat - it should make people on the street aware that there is something down there - most people are oblvious to the whole thing

[LeftCoaster]

FYI the remaining scaffolding canopy should be coming down some time in June.

[flight_from_kamakura]

Heritage advocate targets Robson Square
Arthur Erickson creation subjected to 'incremental intrusions'

Lisa Smedman
Vancouver Courier

Friday, June 05, 2009

On May 25, Cooper received a City of Vancouver Heritage Award for her campaign to save the Evergreen, a 10-storey commercial building at 1285 West Pender St. that was built in 1980. That building--which came close to being demolished--received heritage designation as a result of Cooper's campaign.

As a designated building, it now would require a heritage alternation permit, issued by the city, before it could be altered or demolished.

At the awards ceremony, Cooper noted that two city councils had voted unanimously for "measures that saved the Evergreen Building from demolition--and in Arthur Erickson's lifetime. And it will not be the last," she vowed. She then formally nominated another of Erickson's works, Robson Square, for inclusion on the Vancouver Heritage Register, a first step in getting heritage designation.

"It's one of the few complexes in North America that so melds landscape, public space, purpose, building--everything from the law courts to the art gallery," she said in a subsequent interview with the Courier.

Cooper, an art consultant who founded the Arthur Erickson Conservancy in 2003, said Robson Square needs protection from the "incremental intrusions" that are cumulatively eroding Erickson's original design. She cited the loss of its outdoor restaurants, large auditorium and cinema--as well as little things like the more recent installation of glass barriers that prevent people from getting close to the waterfall and from sitting on the edges of planter boxes. "These glass barriers are so contrary to the design and the spirit of Robson Square," said Cooper. "[They] break every Erickson design rule. They make the space less accessible, less public."

She'd like to see these intrusions generate the same protests as the "clamshell," a proposal to erect a wooden roof over Robson Square for the 2010 Olympics.

"That never actually made it to a formal proposal stage, and one of the reasons it didn't was because of the outcry against it from the architectural community [and] from the citizens of Vancouver," Cooper said.

She noted that Robson Square, built between 1973 and 1979, made Heritage Vancouver's "top 10" endangered historic sites list earlier this year.

Cooper first met Erickson in 1998 in his garden. She was struck by its design, a "microcosm" of the architect's philosophies on the use of scale and proportion. The cedar deck, the hedge, a platform leading into the pond formed a series of horizontal planes that, she recalled, lead "your eye to infinity, to a distance you cannot see. This is something that Arthur does in all his domestic work, and also in his public work."

She said the time is ripe to preserve that legacy. "There's only a handful of Erickson buildings in Vancouver, and I really believe that the generations after us will look to us to say, 'What happened to them? Why weren't they preserved?'" Cooper said. "And now is the time."

Cooper is especially interested in preserving "modernist" buildings--those built in the 1950s and later. "We're a young city. So when we look at buildings from the '50s and '60s that's a really important part of our history."

Erickson, a Vancouver architect famous for his work on Simon Fraser University and UBC's Museum of Anthropology--as well as for buildings around the world--died May 20. A memorial service will be held June 14--a date that would have been his 85th birthday--at 2:30 p.m. in SFU's Convocation Mall.

this strikes me as almost comically misguided. it's a pretty simple and uncontroversial proposition that failed public squares ought to be made to work.

[Kodii]

She said the time is ripe to preserve that legacy. "There's only a handful of Erickson buildings in Vancouver, and I really believe that the generations after us will look to us to say, 'What happened to them? Why weren't they preserved?'" Cooper said. "And now is the time."

Want an Erickson legacy? Build the RC!

[Locked In]

Not much to see here, but this thread hasn't had an update in a while. My pictures, taken this evening:

http://lh6.ggpht.com/_9FW9P3-u1EI/SkG25LSUEeI/AAAAAAAAAvc/9OsV8Duu_PE/s800/IMG_9508.JPG

http://lh6.ggpht.com/_9FW9P3-u1EI/SkG260BhwUI/AAAAAAAAAvg/l62apmW7UlA/s800/IMG_9509.JPG

[Spork]

When oh when will they be taking down those foul pagoda things? My favourite part of the project!

[officedweller]

Dome installed yesterday (July 11th)
Pic by me today.

http://img9.imageshack.us/img9/7369/p7121080.jpg (http://img9.imageshack.us/i/p7121080.jpg/)

[David]

noooooooooo! I thought those godawful domes were gone forever :(

[Login650]

I believe the domes are necessary to protect the ice rink surface from all our winter rain.

[LeftCoaster]

noooooooooo! I thought those godawful domes were gone forever :(

No the domes are back, and will be staying as they were ludicrously expensive.

The good thing is they will be staying the same brushed aluminum finish and will have clear glass instead of the crap that was in there before. They will look much better than the domes that were in there before, but unfortunately there will still be domes.

[SpongeG]

yah and please don't plant back the hedges - those really cut it off from the street - most people walking by never even stopped to look down cause there was no idea that there was something down there

[twoNeurons]

Shoulda been a clamshell.

[officedweller]

Look what turned up over the weekend!
Pic by me today.

http://img132.imageshack.us/img132/632/p7211090.jpg (http://img132.imageshack.us/i/p7211090.jpg/)http://img132.imageshack.us/img132/p7211090.jpg/1/w586.png (http://g.imageshack.us/img132/p7211090.jpg/1/)

[LeftCoaster]

Thanks for the pic.

Yeah that is the last of the road closures on Robson to get these beasts installed... now the glass will be coming. Due to the unique design of the SS domes, each piece of glass but two will have to be custom made.

[clooless]

Please tell me those god awful pagodas will be removed shortly. Is that still the plan?

The new domes look nice.

[deasine]

Please tell me those god awful pagodas will be removed shortly. Is that still the plan?

The new domes look nice.

Especially now since they don't match the new domes at all. Something round and streamlined to replace the pagodas that match the new domes would look nice...

[cjohnny4]

And let's pray that those God-awful street lights nearby are toast as well!

[clooless]

Good point. They look so...70s.

Thanks for the pic, officedweller.

Regarding the domes, I find it kind of strange that the curve of the new domes does not seem to match that of the existing concrete. It appears that there might be a small gap between the dome and the concrete wall.

[LeftCoaster]

Good eye clooless, the gap will be filled in by stainless steel flashing to match the domes though, so nothing to worry about.

Regarding the pagodas, they will not be demolished under this current contract, so I have no idea when they will be coming down.

The city might just do it on its own, or do it under a separate contract... or god forbid just leave them up there.

[Delirium]

that sucks. did something change because the pagoda's were supposed to be removed as per the development permit report;

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y101/oct2gon/Image1-9.jpg?t=1248310869

[trofirhen]

I don't like the pagodas either; they're hokey looking - as well as ugly.

However . . . . what I'd really like to know is; will Robson Square have an underground pedestrian connection to the Canada Line? (I rather imagine not, but hope so nevertheless)

Now that Robson Square is part of the UBC downtown campus, and is still a major focal point downtown for better or for worse, it might be good if there was access to City Centre Station.

Does anyone know anything about this?
(Excuse me; I'm an ex-Vancouverite living overseas, and keep up on the city's progress through these forums. Thank you for your understanding)
:)

(I never appreciated Vancouver, growing up there, but it beats Sverdlovsk any day) :haha:

[trofirhen]

I believe the domes are necessary to protect the ice rink surface from all our winter rain.

I read somewhere recently that the ice rink was going to be shut down permanently. . . . .
Is this true or not?
Once again, excuse me, but I get most of my civic information through the forums here.

Thank you. :shrug:

[Spork]

City Centre station is quite far away (~1 block). Additionally, correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't believe that UBC Robson Square gets that busy - I believe that the student population there is very small (<500?).

[mr.x]

^ there is no direct connection to Robson Square. City Centre Station has three entrances: street level (West Georgia and Granville), Pacific Centre Mall, and Vancouver Centre Mall.

The closest we'll ever get to having a station at Robson Square is the potential future station entrance on Robson and Granville.

[mr.x]

I read somewhere recently that the ice rink was going to be shut down permanently. . . . .
Is this true or not?
Once again, excuse me, but I get most of my civic information through the forums here.

Thank you. :shrug:

The ice rink at Robson Square was shut down a few years ago, but over the last year there have been renovations to fix the refrigeration system and expand the ice rink surface in time for the Olympics. The money for the ice rink fix ups and expansion is coming from a $3-million sponsorship from General Electric....Robson Square will be known as GE Plaza during the Games, and it'll also be the unaccredited media centre for 5,000 media personnel.

The new domes and accessibility upgrades are being paid by the province.

[metroXpress]

Pics by me...on Saturday July 25th

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2593/3761540241_05e3fc44cb.jpg?v=0

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2581/3761551299_8b7400eec0.jpg


hosted on Flickr

[officedweller]

Pic by me today.
More work on the pond on the roof - that pond hasn't had water in years!

http://img200.imageshack.us/img200/7237/p8061117.jpg (http://img200.imageshack.us/i/p8061117.jpg/)

[itinerant]

The domes are not bad, but not great either. Problem with making modifications to a complex like Robson Square with 'upgrades' is that many people simply want something that is currently fashionable to be tacked onto it. It is from another time. Even at thirty odd years old, the lighting, original domes, and even the pagodas were appropriate to the structure. It must have been difficult for the designers of the upgrades to make choices that would be complementary to the vision and yet make actual improvements. Already a few changes are not welcome, such as the barred fencing, glass railings and stone capstones which work against the purity of the building's form. I only hope the bulky appearance of the new domes once fully installed with glazing do not simply become gaudy gems that draw too much attention to themselves in a well-crafted setting.

[osirisboy]

a well crafted setting? that's a matter of opinion.

[duener]

The domes are not bad, but not great either. Problem with making modifications to a complex like Robson Square with 'upgrades' is that many people simply want something that is currently fashionable to be tacked onto it. It is from another time. Even at thirty odd years old, the lighting, original domes, and even the pagodas were appropriate to the structure. It must have been difficult for the designers of the upgrades to make choices that would be complementary to the vision and yet make actual improvements. Already a few changes are not welcome, such as the barred fencing, glass railings and stone capstones which work against the purity of the building's form. I only hope the bulky appearance of the new domes once fully installed with glazing do not simply become gaudy gems that draw too much attention to themselves in a well-crafted setting.

I agree with you in terms of architecture; the new additions may not entirely fit with the original design.

But the problem is that the original design was deeply flawed and this is a failed public space. It's almost hard to believe that such a life-less area could exist along one of the busiest pedestrian streets in North America. So I think anything that makes it work as public space is desirable, regardless of architectural purity.

[mezzanine]

what I'd really like to know is; will Robson Square have an underground pedestrian connection to the Canada Line? (I rather imagine not, but hope so nevertheless)


of note, it was Erickson's intention to have a mass transit entrance under robson street by the skating rink. His idea was that robson square would offer a ped-only north-south thru-way and much activity would come from the trnasit station entrance.

considering how big the pedestrian scale is by the skating rink, and how desolate the place is now, it fits in.


IMO, ideally, I would remove the rink and have robson tunnel under the surface between howe and hornby. the surface at robson would be a very large ped sqaure. impossible now, but one can dream....

[David]

yeah i only heard about that lost piece of Vancouver history this year; that would have been amazing if Robson Square functioned that way

[mr.x]

of note, it was Erickson's intention to have a mass transit entrance under robson street by the skating rink. His idea was that robson square would offer a ped-only north-south thru-way and much activity would come from the trnasit station entrance.

considering how big the pedestrian scale is by the skating rink, and how desolate the place is now, it fits in.


IMO, ideally, I would remove the rink and have robson tunnel under the surface between howe and hornby. the surface at robson would be a very large ped sqaure. impossible now, but one can dream....

wow, i didn't know that. So that's the missing piece of the puzzle, of why Erickson built it that way.

[Overground]

I thought I read something a here a few years ago....officedweller maybe...about there already being space underground(sealed off) that connects from Pacific Centre parking to the Law Courts/Robson Square. Perhaps I've lost the plot, lol.

[officedweller]

There's the Howe street tunnel - which starts near Dunsmuir and provides an undergound roadway to Smithe - the Robson Square loading bays are off of it - as well as Pacific Centre's loading bays. Theoretically, you can access Robson Square from that tunnel from Pacific Centre - wouldn't be pleasant though.

[Overground]

ahh...thanks. I remember that now.

[itinerant]

Strange that Robson Square is considered desolate and under utilized now, but when it was built and for over a decade afterwards it was always busy and full of life. The ice rink was well used, the media centre now overtaken by UBC was popular, and the restaurant on the lower plaza was full. On any given sunny day, the steps leading down from the art gallery and all the way down to the rink would be full of people enjoying the crowd or perhaps a quiet moment to themselves in the sun. So what happened? Probably a number of things in the general area. I don't think UBC moving in was one of the best decisions... or the conversion of many of the public and conference space into a school. I'd like to see that reversed at some time... perhaps the Art gallery would be better suited to expand in that direction, and maybe a reversal of some of the current tenant directions that have sucked the life out of the place. IMHO.

[nova9]

Those restaurants could have only existed in the previous decade. The restaurant scene in Vancouver has just changed so much since the 90s and I fear the establishments in Robson Square never changed or adapted. Certainly, the removal of the rink (not the removal but the lack of ice) certainly contributed to the lack of ambience there but the restaurants ceased being draws and now they sit there with empty patios on a sunny weekend. It's just sad.

[osirisboy]

what restaurants with patios are there now? besides the one attached to the art gallery which seems busy.

[officedweller]

Pic taken by me - Saturday August 8th, 2009 1:30 pm
Glass being installed on the south dome:

http://img90.imageshack.us/img90/7820/p8081119.jpg (http://img90.imageshack.us/i/p8081119.jpg/)

[Hed Kandi]

Pic taken by me - Saturday August 8th, 2009 1:30 pm
Glass being installed on the south dome:

http://img90.imageshack.us/img90/7820/p8081119.jpg (http://img90.imageshack.us/i/p8081119.jpg/)

Looking Good! And a vast improvement over the former.

[mr.x]

Unfortunately, it looks like the hedges are coming back.

[Vancity]

the glass on the dome is looking pretty fine ^^

thanks for the pic!

[nova9]

what restaurants with patios are there now? besides the one attached to the art gallery which seems busy.
I don't know the name of it and to be honest, I haven;t checked down there since the renovations started but it was right across the rink.