Winnipeg Construction IX

[trueviking]

Sherbrook is a great example. It has become what it is because we didn't knock down all the small old buildings that have become the fertile soil of its redevelopment. The physical environment was there to create a walkable street. Once the ball got rolling it continued. You could have made the same argument about it ten years ago. Had we allowed all the buildings to be set back with parking lots it never would have happened.

It's also disgusting what been allowed at Portage.

[buzzg]

Originally Posted by trueviking

Such a hilarious argument. I can't believe people still think it's good to accept things like this out of a fear of a single retailer moving to the suburbs. How can anyone honestly look at that street and not see how all these small decisions have added up to what we have today. There's no way a parking lot being located front or back would have been a deal breaker. But even if it was who cares. It's one retailer. We can't live in fear of vacant lots. We need to rise above that attitude and do what is right for the bigger picture. It's more likely a business that supports the neighbourhood would move in. I can't imagine IJ serves or employs much of the surrounding community. It's good to have them there but they are hardly irreplaceable.

The big picture is indeed made up of smaller pictures. This is why small things like this are important. When we give in on them they add up to what we have today. A street that has become nothing but a traffic funnel where we worry about buildings getting hit by cars.

You fear an empty building saved in the hopes of a walkable street. By allowing this you have ensured the street will not be walkable, ever. Which is worse. A street that is forever lost or waiting to fill a building that will make it walkable. If ever we are going to enforce the rules major intersections on streets like this are where we need to do it. Walk down the street. There are lots of little neighbourhood focussed small businesses. They need help. That means bringing people who are going to walk along their street.

So sad that people inwinnipeg still have such little confidence in our city. Those days are over. We need to start repairing the damage done by decades of this attitude or nothing will ever improve.

Blows my mind we are having this debate. The area looks like that precicely because we have allowed this kind of thing to happen.

Yup!

[biguc]

Originally Posted by pacman

Planning ahead and being proactive absolutely is needed. It involves doing more than producing a fancy document with guidelines for a perfect future. That foresight and that vision needs to be acted upon or it becomes forgotten. Reserving space and planning is absolutely necessary, but it's even more important to follow through on those plans. No doubt West Broadway is doing great recently. You portray it as doing this in spite of the McDonald's and Rexall and "Nyquil", but isn't it more likely that those blights are helping and gave a big push for the rejuvenation? What would that shining example of an area be today if those businesses weren't allowed? You use West Broadway as an example of how things have gone wrong because the City bent the rules, but I can easily argue the opposite and use West Broadway as an area that was helped and spurred on by spineless councillors who allowed those mistakes. Not saying I'm right and you're wrong, just saying that there are times when things need to be looked at on a case by case basis instead of ignoring anything that doesn't follow the plan.

West Broadway's rejuvenation happened around the pedestrian oriented strip on south Sherbrook. Sherbrook closer to Broadway has actually declined since Nygard's parking lot opened, with not only the businesses that Nygard displaced going, but Gooch's cycle and the Melting pot closing. It's going to be hard to rebuild the critical mass in that area to support pedestrian oriented business. That's a huge thing you guys are missing: a bad development or two will totally drive away future developments, never mind the opportunity cost they impose on their specific site. I would love to see Sherbrook push north to meet up with the hub of activity on Portage near Sherbrook. That will never happen because nobody can make street front retail work in a place that's carved up for cars to drive through.

You pose the question, what would exist at Portage and Sherbrook if not drive-thru businesses. I don't know. Neither do you. But I do know that present land values can support more intense uses than we got when they were developed at the city's nadir.

[buzzg]

^Exactly. If even it was still one storey Tims/Palatal/MCDonalds, but they lined the street (or even better were the base of a multi-use building), that would start to push south and
drive values up, and make land owners like the offices close to Sherbrook and Broadway consider redevelopment. If there's opportunity to make money, people will try. But who's going to want to live in a condo that overlooks that current fast food mecca.

Look at The Pal, there's a million other places you could put a condo building, but the owner saw enough value to buy out the business and land to redevelop it. And IMO it's not that desirable, Sherbrook has more potential, but with the way that block has been developed - it's all dead.

[biguc]

Originally Posted by Urban recluse

If we were talking about Downtown, best believe I would be the first on scene ready to kick —, but these two locations are not worth getting your — in a knot over. It's not as if they are gravel lots. There is plenty of room for proper developments, which would draw attention away from these minor infractions. I'm a Hell of a lot more angrier over the city allowing the demolition of the Weir building on Main for that ugly as f@ck building that replaced it. As one of the two principle streets people (especially tourists) see, it is atrocious.

Having neighbourhoods is a big asset for Winnipeg. Especially for a city this size in this part of the continent. I know you're enamoured with smaller American cities with a picturesque main street and not a lot else going on, but Winnipeg is old enough it has a lot more going for it. And that's impressive. Every neighbourhood is an asset. Every neighbourhood high street is a picturesque main street in the making. The space between Isabelle and the Exchange would be prime real estate in any city that hadn't spent decades on the decline. Now that Winnipeg is booming again, it's time we take stock of our neighbourhood assets and leverage them in order to draw and keep talented people.

[Urban recluse]

Originally Posted by trueviking

Such a hilarious argument. I can't believe people still think it's good to accept things like this out of a fear of a single retailer moving to the suburbs. How can anyone honestly look at that street and not see how all these small decisions have added up to what we have today. There's no way a parking lot being located front or back would have been a deal breaker. But even if it was who cares. It's one retailer. We can't live in fear of vacant lots. We need to rise above that attitude and do what is right for the bigger picture. It's more likely a business that supports the neighbourhood would move in. I can't imagine IJ serves or employs much of the surrounding community. It's good to have them there but they are hardly irreplaceable.

The big picture is indeed made up of smaller pictures. This is why small things like this are important. When we give in on them they add up to what we have today. A street that has become nothing but a traffic funnel where we worry about buildings getting hit by cars.

You fear an empty building saved in the hopes of a walkable street. By allowing this you have ensured the street will not be walkable, ever. Which is worse. A street that is forever lost or waiting to fill a building that will make it walkable. If ever we are going to enforce the rules major intersections on streets like this are where we need to do it. Walk down the street. There are lots of little neighbourhood focussed small businesses. They need help. That means bringing people who are going to walk along their street.

So sad that people inwinnipeg still have such little confidence in our city. Those days are over. We need to start repairing the damage done by decades of this attitude or nothing will ever improve.

Blows my mind we are having this debate. The area looks like that precicely because we have allowed this kind of thing to happen.

The problem is no investment. The entire neighborhood from the Exchange to the HSC should be prime real estate, but it is as far from it as you can get. Why don't any of you live in the neighborhood since you are championing it so much?

[Urban recluse]

Originally Posted by biguc

Having neighbourhoods is a big asset for Winnipeg. Especially for a city this size in this part of the continent. I know you're enamoured with smaller American cities with a picturesque main street and not a lot else going on, but Winnipeg is old enough it has a lot more going for it. And that's impressive. Every neighbourhood is an asset. Every neighbourhood high street is a picturesque main street in the making. The space between Isabelle and the Exchange would be prime real estate in any city that hadn't spent decades on the decline. Now that Winnipeg is booming again, it's time we take stock of our neighbourhood assets and leverage them in order to draw and keep talented people.

Now you are being a twit. Winnipeg is not booming. A lot more going for it? Yeah, anyway...open your f@ckin eyes. Nobody wants to be in those neighborhoods. And in terms of the American cities I have visited, they are about the same size as Winnipeg metro wise. They have renewed downtowns thanks to TIF being used for decades. Since you say Winnipeg is booming, I guess we can stop the subsidies?

[jmt18325]

Originally Posted by Urban recluse

Now you are being a twit. Winnipeg is not booming.

It's not? The economy and population are growing faster than they have in decades. It's passed another Canadian city in population for the first time in decades, and will soon pass another. It's booming.

Edit: It actually did pass Quebec City now, so it's passed two cities in population that had in earlier times passed it. Over 15000 people a year are added to the population.

[Tacheguy]

I think anyone who lived here during the eighties and nineties would agree that Winnipeg is experiencing a renaissance.

[Urban recluse]

Originally Posted by jmt18325

It's not? The economy and population are growing faster than they have in decades. It's passed another Canadian city in population for the first time in decades, and will soon pass another. It's booming.

Edit: It actually did pass Quebec City now, so it's passed two cities in population that had in earlier times passed it. Over 15000 people a year are added to the population.

And how many people leave? I think some of you are very naive. I will say things have improved since the nasty 90s, but booming is inaccurate.

[EndoftheBeginning]

139 Tuxedo has started, piles are being driven.

Render from the web page. It's a Karma Development project.



Quick drive by shot from the dash cam

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Another crappy dash cam shot, this time of the Old Grace Housing Co-operative project on Arlington. It's pretty big, takes up a good 1/2 block.

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And a couple from earlier this week of the progress at the old Pal site.

Heading west


Heading east

[jmt18325]

Originally Posted by Urban recluse

And how many people leave?

The net figures are far more important. I spend a great deal more time in Winnipeg than you do. The difference from even a decade ago is very stark (at that point, there was only the glimmer of something better). It's pretty hard to be negative about the direction overall. It's been a long time since 15,000 people a year have been added to the population. That puts Winnipeg about a decade from a million people.

[Urban recluse]

Contradicting statements (that the city is "booming") is not negative, but realistic. You can live in your fantasy. In terms of what is being built there, the majority of the developments are rinky dink, made of the cheapest materials, resembling drywall. Oh yes, scream from the hills!

[esquire]

At the risk of being a negative nellie, I'll just say that population growth on its own isn't the whole story. As a province, Manitoba is still losing thousands of people a year to interprovincial migration. There are a lot of educated young people leaving Winnipeg each year... it's not all rosy out there. As recluse says, the situation is improving but to say it's anything resembling a boom is a dramatic overstatement.

And thanks for the construction pics, End!

[jmt18325]

Originally Posted by esquire

At the risk of being a negative nellie, I'll just say that population growth on its own isn't the whole story. As a province, Manitoba is still losing thousands of people a year to interprovincial migration. There are a lot of educated young people leaving Winnipeg each year... it's not all rosy out there. As recluse says, the situation is improving but to say it's anything resembling a boom is a dramatic overstatement.

And thanks for the construction pics, End!

Maybe boom is an overstatement, but I wouldn't call it dramatic. To go from 0 growth to growth in population over over 2% a year and economic growth over 2.5% is nothing small.

Even the airport, which spent a decade in a holding pattern, is experiencing massive growth of over 5%.

There was literally nothing going on here a decade ago. Now progress, some of it major, is on (almost) every corner.

[Bluenote]

Originally Posted by esquire

At the risk of being a negative nellie, I'll just say that population growth on its own isn't the whole story. As a province, Manitoba is still losing thousands of people a year to interprovincial migration. There are a lot of educated young people leaving Winnipeg each year... it's not all rosy out there. As recluse says, the situation is improving but to say it's anything resembling a boom is a dramatic overstatement.

And thanks for the construction pics, End!

Ok let's see the household income now vs the 1990s
Let's see the value of land vs the 1990s
Let's the how much a home cost then to now.
You can correct inflation in those figures.

What was the population of Winnipeg in 1990 and what is it in 2017

What is the population of the province in 1990 and what is it in 2017.


What was the unemployment rate in 1990 and what is it today.



We have towns which are no cities which are BOOMING. Morden -Winkler - Steinbach etc etc etc.

[Urban recluse]

Originally Posted by esquire

At the risk of being a negative nellie, I'll just say that population growth on its own isn't the whole story. As a province, Manitoba is still losing thousands of people a year to interprovincial migration. There are a lot of educated young people leaving Winnipeg each year... it's not all rosy out there. As recluse says, the situation is improving but to say it's anything resembling a boom is a dramatic overstatement.

And thanks for the construction pics, End!

Thanks Esq, you always make sense

[Tacheguy]

Originally Posted by esquire

At the risk of being a negative nellie, I'll just say that population growth on its own isn't the whole story. As a province, Manitoba is still losing thousands of people a year to interprovincial migration. There are a lot of educated young people leaving Winnipeg each year... it's not all rosy out there. As recluse says, the situation is improving but to say it's anything resembling a boom is a dramatic overstatement.

And thanks for the construction pics, End!

about the young people leaving. That used to be true during the oil boom but doesn't really hold today. some leave of course, but others are coming the other way. our net outmigration is caused by baby boomers cashing out and saying goodbye to winter. they are going to bc largely. not necessarily Vancouver but the Okanogan and Vancouver island.