Calgary International Airport II - Page 294

Tobuz · #**5861** Posted **Dec 21, 2016, 12:29 AM**

On the Calgary Herald website, Tues Dec 20...

WestJet CEO blasts new terminal at YYC

Link to the article is here: http://calgaryherald.com/business/local-...ort-authority-hasnt-listened-to-concerns

Holy **#%. Lots of folks here have said the building is pretty but doesn't work so well. That "doesn't work so well" thing is a pretty big deal, though, when you're an airline with your principal hub here. It's bad enough that WestJet has now had to build longer connection times for YYC into its scheduling and ticketing. That must be costing WS passengers and profits. Ouch.

WestJet's Saretsky: "I think this terminal risks actually forcing traffic to other airports."

YYC's response: "Familiarity with the new systems and processes will take some time, but we are providing information in the terminal, online and through our social media channels to reassure passengers". Wow. Scathing criticism from WestJet's CEO just garners the usual "everything's fine, no matter what our customers and airline partners think" and "we'll fix it with YouTube and Twitter" responses from YYC.

casper · #**5862** Posted **Dec 21, 2016, 12:45 AM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tobuz

On the Calgary Herald website, Tues Dec 20...

WestJet CEO blasts new terminal at YYC

Link to the article is here: http://calgaryherald.com/business/local-...ort-authority-hasnt-listened-to-concerns

Holy **#%. Lots of folks here have said the building is pretty but doesn't work so well. That "doesn't work so well" thing is a pretty big deal, though, when you're an airline with your principal hub here. It's bad enough that WestJet has now had to build longer connection times for YYC into its scheduling and ticketing. That must be costing WS passengers and profits. Ouch.

WestJet's Saretsky: "I think this terminal risks actually forcing traffic to other airports."

YYC's response: "Familiarity with the new systems and processes will take some time, but we are providing information in the terminal, online and through our social media channels to reassure passengers". Wow. Scathing criticism from WestJet's CEO just garners the usual "everything's fine, no matter what our customers and airline partners think" and "we'll fix it with YouTube and Twitter" responses from YYC.

The CEO of WestJet gets it. - Good.

The soon to be former CEO of YYC does not. - Good. Soon will not be relevant.

sammyd · #**5863** Posted **Dec 21, 2016, 12:51 AM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tobuz

On the Calgary Herald website, Tues Dec 20...

WestJet CEO blasts new terminal at YYC

Link to the article is here: http://calgaryherald.com/business/local-...ort-authority-hasnt-listened-to-concerns

Holy **#%. Lots of folks here have said the building is pretty but doesn't work so well. That "doesn't work so well" thing is a pretty big deal, though, when you're an airline with your principal hub here. It's bad enough that WestJet has now had to build longer connection times for YYC into its scheduling and ticketing. That must be costing WS passengers and profits. Ouch.

WestJet's Saretsky: "I think this terminal risks actually forcing traffic to other airports."

YYC's response: "Familiarity with the new systems and processes will take some time, but we are providing information in the terminal, online and through our social media channels to reassure passengers". Wow. Scathing criticism from WestJet's CEO just garners the usual "everything's fine, no matter what our customers and airline partners think" and "we'll fix it with YouTube and Twitter" responses from YYC.

Bitching on this forum about it for 55 of your 56 posts won't help.

CorporateWhore · #**5864** Posted **Dec 21, 2016, 1:25 AM**

Bit late to the game, but I had the chance to travel through the new terminal last week, and wanted to share some thoughts.

In general, I found the process fairly smooth...although there just seem to be more steps now, which if/when things fail may make it more miserable (ie. half the bag drop off machines seemed to be out of service, which did cause some delays). Allowing multiple people at once to put their stuff into boxes for the security check was smart. After security though, I wasn't quite as convinced. A layout that has everyone crowd around the check-in area with passengers for 4-5 flights is definitely not something that adds to a relaxing experience.

I did find the design of the airport nice, but somewhat vanilla. It looked like "modern generic airport" you'd see in a commercial. Nothing was ugly, but I was hoping for a bit more of a statement architecturally.

Denscity · #**5865** Posted **Dec 21, 2016, 1:38 AM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bigtime

Air Canada 77W arriving on runway 29 thanks to the Chinook winds yesterday, operating YYZ-YYC. Photo credit to Andrew Ganong.

https://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set=oa.1052936104818108&type=1

Great shot!

Denscity · #**5866** Posted **Dec 21, 2016, 1:40 AM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tobuz

On the Calgary Herald website, Tues Dec 20...

WestJet CEO blasts new terminal at YYC

Link to the article is here: http://calgaryherald.com/business/local-...ort-authority-hasnt-listened-to-concerns

Holy **#%. Lots of folks here have said the building is pretty but doesn't work so well. That "doesn't work so well" thing is a pretty big deal, though, when you're an airline with your principal hub here. It's bad enough that WestJet has now had to build longer connection times for YYC into its scheduling and ticketing. That must be costing WS passengers and profits. Ouch.

WestJet's Saretsky: "I think this terminal risks actually forcing traffic to other airports."
YYC's response: "Familiarity with the new systems and processes will take some time, but we are providing information in the terminal, online and through our social media channels to reassure passengers". Wow. Scathing criticism from WestJet's CEO just garners the usual "everything's fine, no matter what our customers and airline partners think" and "we'll fix it with YouTube and Twitter" responses from YYC.

Wow that's crazy serious!! And the fact that WestJet is basically "Air Calgary" makes it even crazier!

Suburgatory · #**5867** Posted **Dec 21, 2016, 4:00 AM**

Longer connection times can actually be more preferable by some. I always avoid a tight connection in an airport I don't know so I am sure to have time to switch terminals if needed, clear security again, find a washroom, get something to eat, stretch before getting back into a long flight and possibly walk a long distance to the next gate.

casper · #**5868** Posted **Dec 21, 2016, 4:04 AM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Denscity

Wow that's crazy serious!! And the fact that WestJet is basically "Air Calgary" makes it even crazier!

Gregg Saretsky in addition to being the CEO of WestJet was the former CEO of Alaska and before that Canadian Airlines.

All three are very "customer experience" oriented airlines. I would expect "customer experience" is embedded in his DNA by this point.

On another note, in the photos of the AC 777 landing in the background there are a series of parked aircraft. I think a number of those have been there for years. Wonder what the story is behind them. Perhaps similar to the old Canadian Folkers jets at YXE. They just sit there collecting dust.

suburbia · #**5869** Posted **Dec 21, 2016, 4:41 AM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Suburgatory

Longer connection times can actually be more preferable by some. I always avoid a tight connection in an airport I don't know so I am sure to have time to switch terminals if needed, clear security again, find a washroom, get something to eat, stretch before getting back into a long flight and possibly walk a long distance to the next gate.

I think you missed the point. They are not going to 75 minute connection times so people can go wank in the bathrooms, rather, it is because the actual process of walking and transferring is taking longer.

Cage · #**5870** Posted **Dec 21, 2016, 6:30 AM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by casper

Gregg Saretsky in addition to being the CEO of WestJet was the former CEO of Alaska and before that Canadian Airlines.

All three are very "customer experience" oriented airlines. I would expect "customer experience" is embedded in his DNA by this point.

On another note, in the photos of the AC 777 landing in the background there are a series of parked aircraft. I think a number of those have been there for years. Wonder what the story is behind them. Perhaps similar to the old Canadian Folkers jets at YXE. They just sit there collecting dust.

Saretsky was a VP at Canadian (Airports, technical functions, and operations) and EVP at Alaska (airports, and marketing). He lost the CEO contest to Yilden and left Alaska short before Tilden took the helm. When took over VP Vacations at WS, he was always part of the succession plan should the board require and Durfy need an ouster. To be clear, Saretsky has never had customer experience as a core skill.

MalcolmTucker · #**5871** Posted **Dec 21, 2016, 6:41 AM**

It may be a bit of a strong public message as part of a behind the scenes negotiation to get WestJet into the old A hammer head over the next five years of legacy terminal renos and swaps.

To be frank, WestJet should have never said the cart transfer system was going to be good enough - especially when it was added at their behest late in the game it sounds like. Assuming the connection time holdup is on the passenger side not on the luggage side.

Cage · #**5872** Posted **Dec 21, 2016, 7:01 AM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by CorporateWhore

Allowing multiple people at once to put their stuff into boxes for the security check was smart.

The CATSA plus system is one of the many technological fails of the new terminal. The designers did not account for the efficiency reduction tpcaused by some pax taking longer at the divest station. In the classic divest station approach, there is an invisible hand moving people along to quickly divest of their belonging lest people farther back in line get angry. Instead of taking 20 seconds at he divest station, some people are ore than twice as long. This is having a material impact on screening efficiency.

Example of a not so invisible hand. I am at YYz T1 nexus lane and there is a young inexperienced couple in front of me, I divest of carry-on in bin one, backpack in bin two and laptop in bin three. All bins divested in 15seconds. Female two pax infront of me had yet to fully divest despite having 45 seconds to get her things sorted. I had pushed her bins forward onto the conveyor belt and they were starting to go through the X-ray machine. The female yelps out, be more respectful of first time flyers (they were randomly included into the nexus lane) who need more time. I retort," this is the nexus lane for experienced flyers only, if you need more time the family lane is two lanes over and huge line of other people needing extra time". Boyfriend and me get into an argument, bins are tossed back in my direction, boyfriend gets to have a chat with security about being an unruly passenger while I walk into the Amex lounge.

Under the CATSA plus system, I still divest in 15 seconds but the couple now takes their desired 90 seconds to divest (twice as long as scenario 1). The couples additinal time causes the overall lane efficiency to be cut in half.

Bigtime · #**5873** Posted **Dec 21, 2016, 2:32 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by casper

On another note, in the photos of the AC 777 landing in the background there are a series of parked aircraft. I think a number of those have been there for years. Wonder what the story is behind them. Perhaps similar to the old Canadian Folkers jets at YXE. They just sit there collecting dust.

I think Avmax and Field park them over there, they may take stuff for parts and eventually a bunch of them will be scrapped. Not enough room on their ramps/hangars for them, so I assume the airport rents them that space to store them.

casper · #**5874** Posted **Dec 21, 2016, 7:25 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cage

Saretsky was a VP at Canadian (Airports, technical functions, and operations) and EVP at Alaska (airports, and marketing). He lost the CEO contest to Yilden and left Alaska short before Tilden took the helm. When took over VP Vacations at WS, he was always part of the succession plan should the board require and Durfy need an ouster. To be clear, Saretsky has never had customer experience as a core skill.

I thought he was in a CEO role before. Interesting, he is more of an operations guy. He appears to be publicly pushing the customer experience issue with the airport authority.

hoboman27 · #**5875** Posted **Dec 21, 2016, 7:25 PM**

so let's hypothesize how the Calgary Airport Authority will respond to this.

Some random crazy ideas to get the conversation started:

Install seating in the new terminal
Set up nexus lanes in their connection area
Point fingers at WestJet for approving all the designs, and play hardball
Double up those little shuttle buses to appease WestJet
Have horse carriage rides to connect the two terminals to add to that "Disney Experience"
Declare bankruptcy and let WestJet operate the terminal

casper · #**5876** Posted **Dec 21, 2016, 7:28 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by MalcolmTucker

It may be a bit of a strong public message as part of a behind the scenes negotiation to get WestJet into the old A hammer head over the next five years of legacy terminal renos and swaps.

To be frank, WestJet should have never said the cart transfer system was going to be good enough - especially when it was added at their behest late in the game it sounds like. Assuming the connection time holdup is on the passenger side not on the luggage side.

Is there another airport doing that cart thing with its private race track?

The carts are cute. When I see them it puts a smile on my face.

Suburgatory · #**5877** Posted **Dec 21, 2016, 7:58 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by suburbia

I think you missed the point. They are not going to 75 minute connection times so people can go wank in the bathrooms, rather, it is because the actual process of walking and transferring is taking longer.

Dreaming about that Firepark handy from Innersoul1?

You missed the point. I doubt Westjet is going to lose a lot of trans-border and international connections over 40 mins like the article claims Westjet is worried about.

You don't choose a connection through ORD, DEN, LAX or IAH that's 35mins if you're not an experienced traveler and/or been through that airport before. Not to mention any delay on your first flight and you are guaranteed to be missing your connection.

Now, the negative affects that has on the rest of Westjet's back end operations, sure it obviously causes them a ton of other issues.

Cage · #**5878** Posted **Dec 21, 2016, 8:08 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by MalcolmTucker

It may be a bit of a strong public message as part of a behind the scenes negotiation to get WestJet into the old A hammer head over the next five years of legacy terminal renos and swaps.

To be frank, WestJet should have never said the cart transfer system was going to be good enough - especially when it was added at their behest late in the game it sounds like. Assuming the connection time holdup is on the passenger side not on the luggage side.

The fight is now fully public.

Danielle Smith 11am today had a conversation with Robert Palmer. Palmer made the case the WestJet should move over to C concourse and swap gates with AC moving to A concourse. The primary reason is that WS connects twice as many passengers as AC. Which is true to a point. While WS connects more pax, based on domestic to international connections AC and WS are about equal, Especially since AC codeshares and interlines with UA.

What WS needs to contemplate is a complete redesign of the YYC hub to a departure bank system. Bring everyone into YYC from domestic destinations and then 30 minutes later have departure bank to USA and South. Also they should split the aircraft between international (including transborder) and domestic. In the middle at peak times, WestJet should create a bus system to take pax directly from the A1 Encore area to about where D 70/71 are located. Pax then connect to international (stay in same concourse) or go to transborder connections. This would alleviate YYC link capacity issues during peak periods.

Second thing that WS should do is adjust schedule so that all aircraft dwell for an extended time at YYC but make up the difference at the out stations. Take YYC-YXE-YYC as an example. make a short connection in YXE but allow fro the aircraft to remain longer in YYC. Most major airlines have switched to this hub format (in the USA its called rebanking the hub).

MalcolmTucker · #**5879** Posted **Dec 21, 2016, 8:31 PM**

• Video Link

suburbia · #**5880** Posted **Dec 21, 2016, 9:41 PM**

Possibly dumb question (because I don't know much about airports) ...

Other than for trans-border where the US customs are housed in Calgary, is there really any major reason why international flights are segregated from domestic travel?

Also, would it not make sense to have international/trans-border in the middle of the airport, instead of on one end? Obviously not easy to change, but just a thought. This is basically how it was, and I think there were benefits that some may not have registered ("you don't realize what you got till it's gone" scenario).