[St. John's] The Official Project Thread

[Architype]

Originally Posted by PoscStudent

That's a big increase that I wasn't really expecting. The city, as well as many, was in decline and growth was in the burbs.

I guess it can be attributed to new development in Southlands, East end, Kenmount etc. as well as some densification.

Paradise, CBS, Torbay, St Philliips-PC, and smaller places like Bay Bulls & Flatrock make up most of the increase in the CMA.

Mt. Pearl is the only part of the CMA showing a decrease.

[niccanning]

Is there any news on when the other buildings for the Tiffany Village Seniors Complex are set to be constructed?

[Architype]

Originally Posted by niccanning

Is there any news on when the other buildings for the Tiffany Village Seniors Complex are set to be constructed?

The documents may have originally said 2014, and here in the following govt. link (Inventory of Major Capital Projects) from March 2011 it says 2015. It would have to start soon in order to complete it even by 2015, although I would expect it to be in phases. There hasn't been any mention more recently. It was approved Feb 2, 2009.

http://www.economics.gov.nl.ca/E2011/InventoryOfMajorCapitalProjects.pdf

[PoscStudent]

Wonder what the demand for them is?

[niccanning]

Originally Posted by PoscStudent

Wonder what the demand for them is?

I was wondering the same thing.

The Inventory of Major Capital Projects link is great. Thanks!

[Architype]

Not sure if this was posted before, but here is an article on 351 Water Street.

http://www.joconl.com/article/id48361

Also in the news is the City Hall exterior clean up, scheduled for this spring. As noted in the city link, it will cost $440,000, but should be worth it.

http://www.stjohns.ca/csj/NewsDetails?id=709

[MrChills]

Originally Posted by Architype

Not sure if this was posted before, but here is an article on 351 Water Street.

http://www.joconl.com/article/id48361

Also in the news is the City Hall exterior clean up, scheduled for this spring. As noted in the city link, it will cost $440,000, but should be worth it.

http://www.stjohns.ca/csj/NewsDetails?id=709

A good exterior cleanup for City Hall would be to demolish it and start over What an ugly building, it looks like a prison.

[statbass]

I know there's been much talk about the Statistics Canada Census population counts, so please excuse me for posting yet another one. It's interesting to note that most posts have focused exclusively on population counts. I was looking through the data tables on the Stats Canada website and noticed some interesting statistics on another, yet equally important, population measure: population density.

Below is a list of the population density (persons per square kilometer) for the NL CMA and CAs:

St. John's (CMA): 244.8
Corner Brook (CA): 101.8
Grand Falls-Windsor (CA): 251.1
Bay Roberts (CA): 104.8

So it appears that GFW has the highest population density in the province... good on them!

It's also interesting to note that St. John's and GFW have higher densities than HRM (71.0), Ottawa-Gatineau (196.6), Calgary (237.9), and Edmonton (123.0).

This is by no way a disclaimer stating that St. John's has urban sprawl under control... we all know that SJ continues to engulf more and more of the Avalon Peninsula each year; just an interesting tidbit of information.

[PoscStudent]

Looking at the population densities on Statistics Canada's website can be a bit misleading though. Ottawa for example has a large greenbelt where you are not allowed to build, all this land is included in the size of their CMA but they're not sprawling out onto it. HRM is a huge area that takes in lots of rural areas as well as areas that are not built up. The metro area of Calgary I believe is the largest in all of Canada at over 5000 km2, while their city limits are roughly the same size of the St. John's CMA at just over 800 km2. According to the census only about 120,000 people live outside the city, so about 1.1 million Calgarians are living with the same area as the St. John's CMA

[statbass]

Originally Posted by PoscStudent

Looking at the population densities on Statistics Canada's website can be a bit misleading though. Ottawa for example has a large greenbelt where you are not allowed to build, all this land is included in the size of their CMA but they're not sprawling out onto it. HRM is a huge area that takes in lots of rural areas as well as areas that are not built up. The metro area of Calgary I believe is the largest in all of Canada at over 5000 km2, while their city limits are roughly the same size of the St. John's CMA at just over 800 km2. According to the census only about 120,000 people live outside the city, so about 1.1 million Calgarians are living with the same area as the St. John's CMA

Very interesting and fair points. However, after living in Ottawa for a couple of years (and yes, there are reserved greenbelts where development cannot occur), the city does have urban sprawl issues. It used to take me about an hour to travel 15 kilometers home from work in the evening by car; although, an efficient public transit system counterbalanced the congestion. As for Halifax, I can't comment too much on, but I'd think it's rural commutershed population must create havoc from time to time.

All statistics are misleading if we only focus on a few. I guess another take home point is that it's important to look at the whole picture (counts, density, etc) to get a clearer picture.

Thanks for those comments PoscStudent, very informative

[Marty_Mcfly]

Originally Posted by statbass

As for Halifax, I can't comment too much on, but I'd think it's rural commutershed population must create havoc from time to time.

The actual city of Halifax, as well as the city of Dartmouth are actually quite dense, especially the Halifax Peninsula. The issue is that the HRM consists of a lot of small towns, some of which are quite a far away from the central population (like North Preston). Though I believe a sprawl problem has taken over in parts of the HRM outside of the Halifax Peninsula.

[Architype]

Originally Posted by statbass

I know there's been much talk about the Statistics Canada Census population counts, so please excuse me for posting yet another one. It's interesting to note that most posts have focused exclusively on population counts. I was looking through the data tables on the Stats Canada website and noticed some interesting statistics on another, yet equally important, population measure: population density.

Below is a list of the population density (persons per square kilometer) for the NL CMA and CAs:

St. John's (CMA): 244.8
Corner Brook (CA): 101.8
Grand Falls-Windsor (CA): 251.1
Bay Roberts (CA): 104.8

So it appears that GFW has the highest population density in the province... good on them!

It's also interesting to note that St. John's and GFW have higher densities than HRM (71.0), Ottawa-Gatineau (196.6), Calgary (237.9), and Edmonton (123.0).

This is by no way a disclaimer stating that St. John's has urban sprawl under control... we all know that SJ continues to engulf more and more of the Avalon Peninsula each year; just an interesting tidbit of information.

It's more accurate to use the population centre data (formerly called "urban area") (see link). Because some municipalities take in large uninhabitaed areas like St.John's and some don't, it really changes the figures. In the population centre data, only the continuous built up areas are included - but this includes the contiguous suburban areas like Paradise as well.

http://www12.statcan.gc.ca/census-recens...pd-pl/Tables-Tableaux.cfm?LANG=Eng&T=800

Population, Area, Persons per sq km.

St. John's - population centre = 165,346 / 185.55 sq km = 891.1 persons per sq km.

Halifax - population centre = 297,943 / 269.27 sq km = 1106.5 persons per sq km.

[statbass]

Originally Posted by Architype

It's more accurate to use the population centre data (formerly called "urban area") (see link). Because some municipalities take in large uninhabitaed areas like St.John's and some don't, it really changes the figures. In the population centre data, only the continuous built up areas are included - but this includes the contiguous suburban areas like Paradise as well.

http://www12.statcan.gc.ca/census-recens...pd-pl/Tables-Tableaux.cfm?LANG=Eng&T=800

Population, Area, Persons per sq km.

St. John's - population centre = 165,346 / 185.55 sq km = 891.1 persons per sq km.

Halifax - population centre = 297,943 / 269.27 sq km = 1106.5 persons per sq km.

I guess another appropriate measure would be to calculate the urban density, followed by metropolitan and regional densities, thereby creating a gradient or 'degree of dispersion' of density.

On another note, I read on twitter that the old NL telephone was approved in principle by the heritage committee.

[Architype]

Originally Posted by statbass

I guess another appropriate measure would be to calculate the urban density, followed by metropolitan and regional densities, thereby creating a gradient or 'degree of dispersion' of density.

On another note, I read on twitter that the old NL telephone was approved in principle by the heritage committee.

You could do that, but city and town boundaries are pretty arbitrary, and metropolitan areas (CMAs) are based largely on commuter levels rather than density. There is no sense in including large undeveloped areas where no one lives in urban population densities. In the case of St. John's, isolated areas like Pouch Cove, as well as rural areas, etc. would be the ones not included in the population centre. BTW, Goulds is large enough to form it's own population centre.

NL telephone building - good.

[statbass]

Originally Posted by Architype

You could do that, but city and town boundaries are pretty arbitrary, and metropolitan areas (CMAs) are based largely on commuter levels rather than density. There is no sense in including large undeveloped areas where no one-on-one lives in urban population densities. In the case of St. John's, isolated areas like Pouch Cove, as well as rural areas, etc. would be the ones not included in the population centre. BTW, Goulds is large enough to form it's own population centre.

NL telephone building - good.

Thanks for the insight Archetype, much appreciated! :-)

[Architype]

You're welcome.

This link tells more about the definition of population centres (formerly urban areas).

http://www.statcan.gc.ca/subjects-sujets/standard-norme/sgc-cgt/urban-urbain-eng.htm

First, the term population centre will replace the term urban area. A population centre will be defined as an area with a population of at least 1,000 and a density of 400 or more people per square kilometre. All areas outside population centres will continue to be defined as rural area.

I am not clear on all the details of how the actual boundaires of population centres are achieved, but it probably is based on dissemination areas:

http://www12.statcan.ca/census-recensement/2006/ref/dict/geo021-eng.cfm

[AllBlack]

More Development the Focus of Meeting
Wednesday , February 15 2012


The business community supports lifting a ban that's stopping any development above the 190 metre contour, but it appears some residents still need convincing. The City of St. John's has asked the province to make amendments to the municipal plan that would open up sections on either side of Kenmount Road and an area near Southlands.



Sam Bromley says he's not anti-development, he just doesn't want the city to lose all of its green space. Bromley lives in Kenmount Terrace and is one of about thirty people who have come together signing a petition against development above the 190m. In contrast, those in favour talked prime locations, economic benefits, and curbing urban sprawl.



From construction companies, to neighbouring municipalities, to the average joe, all had a chance to have their say on what allowing development would mean. There were about 70 people in attendance. That's in addition to the 13 written submissions received prior to the hearing. If the amendment is made, the city says both areas would need new pumping stations, but those costs would fall to developers. Engineers say the capacity for these projects would only be available after 2013 when the new water treatment plant in Petty Harbour-Long Pond comes online. Commissioner Chris Sharpe now has 30 days to compile a report that would include a list of recommendations for the province and the city.

http://www.vocm.com/newsarticle.asp?mn=2&ID=20831

[Architype]

^ Thanks for posting, there's some more info in this CBC article.

The new development area west of Southlands is called Glencrest in this article.

St. John's expansion plans meet with approval
CBC News Posted: Feb 15, 2012

Little opposition was voiced at a St. John's public hearing Tuesday night on opening up two massive blocks of land to development.

The city would like to rezone two areas of the city: one, near Southlands, is owned by former Newfoundland and Labrador premier Danny Williams, while the other is off Kenmount Road, near the Kelsey Drive commercial district. . .

The St. John's Board of Trade strongly endorses the proposed rezoning.

Full article here:
http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/newfoundla...nl-stjohns-expansion-southlands-215.html


Also, links to the city's maps showing the areas to be rezoned above 190m:

Kenmount -
http://www.stjohns.ca/pdfs/Aerial%20Map%20-%20KENMOUNT%20ABOVE%20190.pdf

Southlands-Glencrest -
http://www.stjohns.ca/pdfs/Aerial%20Map%20-%20SOUTHLANDS%20ABOVE%20190.pdf

City page -
http://www.stjohns.ca/csj/EventDetails?id=2972&loc=null&date=14-2-2012

[jeddy1989]

Hey I've always wondered why we don't have a city zoo? in other places who runs the zoos? is it the city or the province or private? I would think that many MUN programs would benefit from having a zoo (biology and animal behavior etc)

[Marty_Mcfly]

I wanted to say it was because St. John's doesn't have the population base for a zoo, but upon further research I see that Moncton has a zoo. So I have no idea, I wouldn't mind having a zoo to visit every once in a while