[St. John's] The Official Project Thread

[Jstaleness]

Originally Posted by AllBlack

I saw this on Ryan Snodden's blog today. Pretty cool 360 panoramic from the top of the Atlantic Place parking garage following yesterday's storm.

I've never been to the top level of the garage. Wouldn't want to have to find my way down in a blizzard.

http://360.io/HEFDL4

If a picture is worth 1000 words than this one has a clear message. It was COLD! Can almost feel the windchill.

[PoscStudent]

Originally Posted by Architype

Three to four years to build the Convention Centre expansion is actually a very long time period for construction, it seems like it should take about 2 years. The Vancouver Centre took less than two years and it was a much larger and more complex design.

I guess keeping the building open during constructions is affecting how long it takes, it still seems like a ridiculous time frame.

[YYCguys]

Originally Posted by Jstaleness

If a picture is worth 1000 words than this one has a clear message. It was COLD! Can almost feel the windchill.

BRRR!!! I imagine that those WS non stop flights to sunny south destinations can't come soon enough for the folks out there! Stay warm in the meantime folks!

[statbass]

From VOCM news (Feb 6 - 2012).

Two New New Developments in Capital City

It looks like a couple of new developments will get the green light from the capital city. Councillor Frank Galgay says city staff is recommending the go ahead for a 10-story class A office building on Job Street at Hamilton Avenue and a six story suite of condominiums on Henry Street at the old Star of the Sea property.

Reports from public meetings on those projects will be tabled at tonight's council meeting, but a third development, a 12 story hotel, has been deferred.

Galgay says they want to discuss the project further to see if it can be reduced in height for a larger footprint after complaints from area residents about the obstruction of their viewplane.

I'm very disappointed that the 12 storey hotel didn't get the green light; although, I'm not surprised. I guess I shouldn't dwell on the negative, the Deacon Properties building and Star of the Sea condo were approved - for which I'm very happy!

[Marty_Mcfly]

More on the Hilton project: there are currently residents of the area at the council meeting with a petition against the project. Go figure.

UPDATE: Council rejected the proposal, bye bye.

[ConundrumNL]

Originally Posted by statbass

From VOCM news (Feb 6 - 2012).



I'm very disappointed that the 12 storey hotel didn't get the green light; although, I'm not surprised. I guess I shouldn't dwell on the negative, the Deacon Properties building and Star of the Sea condo were approved - for which I'm very happy!

I'm disappointed to, but I just watched Shannie's statement about the building on Here and Now, and I agree with a lot she said. This building was pretty much a drop-in standard design and not really that inspired. Had the building been something unique like the Hamliton/Job design it may have been better received.

[upnotout]

I think what we can learn from council's rejection of the Hilton proposal is that if you want to build a highrise in St. John's, it's got to have class and be unique. Look at how Fortis' initial proposal was rejected, only for the much nicer new Fortis proposal to be greenlit. Same goes for the Job Street proposal. It is a very nice proposal and was accepted with very little opposition, whereas the cookie-cutter Hilton proposal got rejected flat-out. I think if they come back with a more appealing design and reduce the height by two stories, it should go through. On the other hand, Garden Inn is a pretty vanilla brand. Maybe I regular Hilton might work better. Even Shannie said that the likelihood is that a hotel will eventually end up on the site.

[statbass]

Some more information on the development front from yesterday's council meeting:

VOCM News - Feb 7, 2012

The capital city will spend over $21-million on capital works this year. The projects range from, recreation infrastructure, to street upgrades, and new water mains. Finance Chair Danny Breen calls the funding significant, but says there's many more projects that need to get done. Led by St. John's, municipalities have been calling on government to create a new fiscal funding arrangement between both levels of government. Breen says the capital 'to-do list' is far greater than the budget.


Breen says if the city did not have to pay the provincial portion of the HST, for example, there would be an extra $10-million to work with.

I also read yesterday about proposals to build a new Colemans supermarket, an NLC outlet, and a few more commercial developments in the Southlands area.

[Architype]

Originally Posted by ConundrumNL

I'm disappointed to, but I just watched Shannie's statement about the building on Here and Now, and I agree with a lot she said. This building was pretty much a drop-in standard design and not really that inspired. Had the building been something unique like the Hamliton/Job design it may have been better received.

It is a bit of a disappointment when a major development is turned down, a luxury which the city cannot really afford. The logic of it being rejected because of cookie cutter design which could go anywhere does not really hold water either, the design was just an efficient modern one with clean lines and acceptable proportions. The most likely reason for the deferral is because of its proximity to the houses on Pleasant Street, but this will still be the case with whatever goes there, and a small height reduction won't make much difference. A larger footprint will just eat up the view and use more land which is already scarce.

The Deacon office proposal which was approved is actually planned to be 3 meters taller than the Hilton. The design is more unique, but I would question the likelhood of its ever being built in that form because of cost. Approval is no guarantee of construction; there are plenty of precedents for this happening.

The Star of the Sea condo building will make a far greater impact on its neighbours than the Hilton would have since it is wedged into a small residential street with a much higher FAR; its design is still basically a box with a few doodads added on.

[PoscStudent]

If the city didn't like the look of the Hilton they could have easily went back to the company and say they want a different design for that location. It has everything to do with height and nothing with design.

[statbass]

hmm, interesting....

VOCM News - Feb 7, 2012

New statistics show that office and industrial space vacancy rates have declined to their lowest level in five years in the capital city.

Turner Drake & Partners have just released their December 2011 statistics. St. John's total office vacancy rate is the lowest in Atlantic Canada, sitting at 3.53 per cent. Class A space is at 0 per cent, with Class B space following closely behind at 2.78 per cent. Industrial space is also hard to come by in the city, with a total vacancy of 3.32 per cent. Construction permit values nearly doubled from 2009-2010, indicating St. John's has recognized the need for additional space in the market.

While these results seem positive for the capital city, the survey also says lack of available space and increasing net rents are discouraging for tenants looking space. Twelve rental surveys were recently conducted throughout the six major city centres in Atlantic Canada.

Need I say more?

[Marty_Mcfly]

I think some form of compromise could have been met for the Hilton development. I completely understand that the hotel was too close to some of the homes in the area, but the lot is quite big, a re-positioning of the hotel could have solved that issue. Decreasing height by increasing footprint wouldn't be wise, could end up a lot like Atlantic Place. Shannie made a lot of good points (I may never say that again), the biggest one being "a hotel will probably end up on this site eventually". Local residents may have a lot more to worry about if a 15-20 storey hotel gets proposed for there.

Well, two outta three isn't bad? Trying to stay positive about all of this.

[Architype]

The city allows up to 48 meters for height under certain conditions, the hotel proposal was only 35 meters. I don't see it as being very different than the Hamilton Ave development which is 38m, and with houses across the street etc., except for the public opposition.

[Marty_Mcfly]

It may have all come down to the differences in design between the two buildings. But as someone stated above, the Garden Inn really isn't a high-end hotel, so I'm sure there wasn't any thought into a high-end design. None the less, the proposed design, while nothing special, wasn't anything horrible either. It's certainly of better design than the Delta hotels, which in my opinion, doesn't do much for me. Just concrete and glass.

[PoscStudent]

Newfoundland and Labrador's population was 514,536 (1.8)
St. John's population was 196,966 (8.8%)

Newfoundland and Labrador's population has increased since the 1980's!

Paradise increased 40.6% after recording an increase of 31% in 2006.

[statbass]

Originally Posted by PoscStudent

Newfoundland and Labrador's population was 514,536 (1.8)
St. John's population was 196,966 (8.8%)

Newfoundland and Labrador's population has increased since the 1980's!

Paradise increased 40.6% after recording an increase of 31% in 2006.

This is the first population increase since the start of our decline in 1986.... 25 years... wow!

[Marty_Mcfly]

Nice to see St. John's doing well! Looks like we may crack the 200,000 next year. Also, I believe the St. John's CMA may be the 9th fastest growing Metro area in Canada

[statbass]

From Global Calgary - Feb 8, 2012

P.E.I. attracted more than 2,500 new immigrants in 2010, up from fewer than 500 in 2005. Both Nova Scotia and New Brunswick attracted more than 2,000 immigrants in 2010. Newfoundland and Labrador was fourth at about 700 — a figure that hasn't changed much in the past 20 years.

Read it on Global News: Population turnaroud in Atlantic Canada, all provinces see growth: latest census figures

In 2005, all four Atlantic provinces initiated an immigration strategy aimed at attracting and retaining immigrants. It seems that these policies have worked very well in NS, NB, and especially PEI (500% increase in 5 years), whereas NL has only seen marginal growth at best.

It begs to question: why we are not seeing growth like the other Atlantic provinces? NL has been the economic giant of the region over the past 5 years or so, and there are still more projects coming down the pipe (Hebron, Muskrat Falls, numerous mining projects, etc). I'm assuming you will see bigger increases in immigration in NS due to the big boost from the ship building contracts.

With our aging population and decline birth rates, immigration is becoming the key to population growth in this region. I think NL needs to sit down with the other Atlantic provinces and see what changes are needed to improve these rates. NL needs to get up to par with the other provinces or we won't have a workforce in 20 years time.

[Architype]

The City of St.John's now has a population of 106,172, an increase of 5.5%.

http://www12.statcan.gc.ca/census-recens...ng&T=301&SR=26&S=3&O=D&RPP=25&PR=0&CMA=0

[PoscStudent]

Originally Posted by Architype

The City of St.John's now has a population of 106,172, an increase of 5.5%.

http://www12.statcan.gc.ca/census-recens...ng&T=301&SR=26&S=3&O=D&RPP=25&PR=0&CMA=0

That's a big increase that I wasn't really expecting. The city, as well as many, was in decline and growth was in the burbs.