Calgary Public Transit II

[para transit fellow]

The Vancouver trolley's have a battery pack that has got a 10 km max range. The challenge is that if you do a max range more than a few times you ruin the battery pack ( 109 cells costing $40,000) and have to replace them. The battery pack is useful for short moves of a couple of hunfred metres.

One other aspect of the cost of trolleys is that you need extra facilities for servicing. The vancouver trolley service bays have catwalks at bus roof height ---so the electonics tech can service the power supply ( located on top of the bus).

[jeffwhit]

Originally Posted by Riise

TfL is actually looking to push these in order to lower the production costs. Although the model pictured is tailored for London, a model without the rear platform and staircase could work well in Calgary.

If we get electronic fare payment in place, a black platform would be great here.

[Koolfire]

Originally Posted by para transit fellow

The Vancouver trolley's have a battery pack that has got a 10 km max range. The challenge is that if you do a max range more than a few times you ruin the battery pack ( 109 cells costing $40,000) and have to replace them. The battery pack is useful for short moves of a couple of hunfred metres.

That's crazy. I wonder what type of battery that is, NiMH, Li-ion or something else. But draining a rechargable battery a few times should not ruin it. Maybe the max charge is only 99% after the first couple times but that's far from ruined.

We're things can get interesting is if more hybrid buses get built/used. You should be able to add a pole system so that it can draw and return power (when braking if battery/capacitor is at 100%) from overhead lines and run as a hybrid the rest of the time.

[that_twisted_cm]

Originally Posted by jeffwhit

If we get electronic fare payment in place, a black platform would be great here.

Question is, how high are they? Do they have the clearance to clear some of the underpasses (Brisebois/Crowchild, CP tracks, etc.)?

[jeffwhit]

Originally Posted by that_twisted_cm

Question is, how high are they? Do they have the clearance to clear some of the underpasses (Brisebois/Crowchild, CP tracks, etc.)?

I can't find the heights on the new Routemaster prototypes, but the originals were 14', 4 1/2" tall, across all generations.

Clearance on Crowchild/Brisebois is over 17.5 feet, but the CPR underpasses are under 14'.

Those CPR tracks are a huge pain in the ass. I wonder what the clearance on the new 4th Street underpass will be.

[mersar]

4th Street is supposed to be a lot higher clearance, thats part of the reason why they had to drop 9th Ave on the north side and why there will not be any access to 10th Ave on the south side as the slopes are longer.

[frinkprof]

Originally Posted by CorporateWhore

Would be nice to have these beauties driving around Calgary...

http://www.autoblog.com/2010/11/12/londons-new-double-decker-bus-unveiled-w-video/

No thanks, even with Riise's proposed modifications.

Capacity of the London-spec double-decker: 87 with 2 doors

Capacity of the D60LFR (articulated buses Calgary runs): 108 with 3 doors.

Cost comparison: Not sure, but any savings on the double-decker likely can't make up for the loss of capacity and onloading/offloading problems.

[Riise]

Originally Posted by jeffwhit

If we get electronic fare payment in place, a black platform would be great here.

The main purpose of the rear platform is so passengers can hop on and off during stop and go traffic in Central London and on busy high streets. In Calgary, I don't think there are many routes that feature this environment. Also, when you consider the cost of staffing the rear platform with a conductor and the fact that you can place a card reader near the middle door the rear platform doesn't make much sense.

However, if rapid alighting is a high priority then you could make a case in a debate over double deckers and bendy busses.

Originally Posted by frinkprof

No thanks, even with Riise's proposed modifications.

Capacity of the London-spec double-decker: 87 with 2 doors

Capacity of the D60LFR (articulated buses Calgary runs): 108 with 3 doors.

Cost comparison: Not sure, but any savings on the double-decker likely can't make up for the loss of capacity and onloading/offloading problems.

If the new Routemasters are run in a three door configuration then the capacity would increase due to the removal of a staircase and doorway. In addition, a three door configuration would provide alighting times closer to those of a bendy bus but would also reduce transfer times, necessary size of bus docks/zones, and road space being occupied.

Nonetheless, even if bendy busses have better specs they provide a God awful riding experience in comparison to double deckers. Add in the slick design of the new Routemasters and you start to give public transport a fun factor.

[UofC.engineer]

Originally Posted by You Need A Thneed

The tender for Southland Station's 4 car extension is now out.

The project is supposed to be done by the end of June 2011.

Includes:
Extended platform
New south end platform access, much bigger than the current one
Partial replacement of the existing platform.
I think some renos inside the station head.
Concrete repairs to existing grade beams and deck.

Where can I find the documents for the plan? I checked CT website but only the Whitehorn plans were there

[You Need A Thneed]

Originally Posted by UofC.engineer

Where can I find the documents for the plan? I checked CT website but only the Whitehorn plans were there

On Coolnet (Internet), or at the construction association. If you don't know what Coolnet is, you won't be able to log on to see it there.

[frinkprof]

There's some information/feedback sessions coming up for the possible (i.e. no timeline or exact routing set) SW BRT service.

Here's a map of the probable route with probable major stops.



It's from this brochure: http://www.calgarytransit.com/pdf/SW_BRT_Calgary_Brochure_sPg1.pdf

Looks like they could go a step further with this BRT route and introduce more robust stations and busways (separated bus-only lanes) along some of the route.

Info sessions:

Public Meetings:

November 23 from 11:30am - 2:00pm
Rockyview General Hospital: 7007, 14 Street SW

November 23 from 3:30pm - 8:00pm
Southland Leisure Centre: 2000 Southland Drive SW

November 24 from 11:30am - 2:00pm
Mount Royal University: 4825 Mount Royal Gate SW

November 24 from 3:30pm - 7:00pm
Braeside Community Association: 11024 Braeside Drive SW

More info: http://www.calgarytransit.com/html/sw_brt_2010.html

--------------------

Thoughts on a possible SW BRT?

[frinkprof]

Originally Posted by UofC.engineer

Where can I find the documents for the plan? I checked CT website but only the Whitehorn plans were there

Welcome to the forum.

[MalcolmTucker]

On SW BRT, I would be reluctant to support it without detailed studies that showed it improved full trip travel times vs cheaper alternatives like reinforcing the existing feeder bus network or implementing an arterial quasi BRT feeding LRT going along the following routes

24th --> Southland --> Southland Station
90th --> 14th --> Heritage --> Heritage Station

I get that the plan is likely in reaction to the south LRT being full, lowering the effectiveness of the feeder network in the area, but capital dollars should not be spent to ameliorate a temporary problem that will be solved by 2014.

Now, that being said in the long term there will be BRT running connecting the south LRT to Mount Royal College, and on to the West LRT likely at Westbrook. So using one of the lanes to perhaps become a HOW lane between norther 14th St, along Glenmore, and along southern Crowchild might help. But again, I would want a study to make sure that the trade off in road capacity was actually a net benefit to people as a whole.

I think in general we have to remind decision makers about the high operational cost of BRT and the need for higher constant subsidy the more of our core transit network includes lower capacity diesel buses to make sure they don't binge on cheap incremental BRT improvements that leave our transit system unsustainable financially.

[fusili]

Originally Posted by Sir.Humphrey.Appleby

Now, that being said in the long term there will be BRT running connecting the south LRT to Mount Royal College, and on to the West LRT likely at Westbrook.

This, IMHO, is absolutely necessary. Mount Royal should be connected to a circle route BRT that could connect to the West LRT, the South and SE LRT and even the North LRT. This would eliminate a lot of transfers and really reduce trip times, especially for those coming from the South and SE lines.

[srperrycgy]

A Circle Route BRT would be a excellent idea. The current Circle Route is ok, except for the f-ing long and largely unnecessary layovers. In my current commute from Killarney to 58th Ave @ Blackfoot: Chinook Station and Crowchild @ 54th Ave SW.

[fusili]

Originally Posted by srperrycgy

A Circle Route BRT would be a excellent idea. The current Circle Route is ok, except for the f-ing long and largely unnecessary layovers. In my current commute from Killarney to 58th Ave @ Blackfoot: Chinook Station and Crowchild @ 54th Ave SW.

Don't get me started with how bad stop spacing and route timing is in Calgary. I took the 7 (or was it the 6) back from Marda Loop once. It stopped 3 times in four blocks. Has this city ever heard of rapid transit?

[srperrycgy]

Originally Posted by fusili

Don't get me started with how bad stop spacing and route timing is in Calgary. I took the 7 (or was it the 6) back from Marda Loop once. It stopped 3 times in four blocks. Has this city ever heard of rapid transit?

That would have been the #7.

CT did modify a couple of WB stops on the #6 on 26th Ave between 29th and 34th Streets a couple of years ago. The stupid thing is that CT re-signed the stops that were closed with the "Future Bus Zone" signs.

[kw5150]

Originally Posted by fusili

This, IMHO, is absolutely necessary. Mount Royal should be connected to a circle route BRT that could connect to the West LRT, the South and SE LRT and even the North LRT. This would eliminate a lot of transfers and really reduce trip times, especially for those coming from the South and SE lines.

Yes, and this more fuctional circle route for buses (and increased frequency and some good marketing) could take a whole bunch of students off Crowchild during rush hour!

It would also help it the circle was going in both directions.....every 5 mins. How many buses would that take? 60 or so?

[kw5150]

Originally Posted by fusili

Don't get me started with how bad stop spacing and route timing is in Calgary. I took the 7 (or was it the 6) back from Marda Loop once. It stopped 3 times in four blocks. Has this city ever heard of rapid transit?

I guess they feel liek they can be lax on the bus routes because of the LRT...... which is unfortunate. Winnipeg has a very good rapid bus system. We could have one like that which cloud parellel our LRT not just feed it...

[freeweed]

Originally Posted by fusili

Don't get me started with how bad stop spacing and route timing is in Calgary. I took the 7 (or was it the 6) back from Marda Loop once. It stopped 3 times in four blocks. Has this city ever heard of rapid transit?

My bus route in Royal Oak has 3 stops in a single block. I'm not kidding. 2 on one road, and a 3rd once you round the corner. And these aren't huge downtown blocks either.

I realize it's not intended to be a rapid transit route, but get serious. CT has some mind-bogglingly stupid stop arrangements.