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  #7661  
Old Posted Apr 9, 2010, 9:45 PM
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I know, I was mostly making a point on Morogolus's behalf. hah
I guess it's just quite a shock for most of us to see the cost of that land explode so much.

Edit: Didn't notice that last part before. Pretty sure we are still the 17th largest city in the country.

Last edited by dsim249; Apr 9, 2010 at 10:39 PM.
     
     
  #7662  
Old Posted Apr 9, 2010, 10:16 PM
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Originally Posted by Country View Post
The Sheraton Four Points is going up in Stonebridge, by the big-box mall. And the Best Western is going up on the west end of 22nd Street, out near the Shaw Centre and the new Wal-Mart.

I don't think there are any renderings online, but both buildings are now standing in the structural sense. Exterior/interior work continues... they are both uninspiringly suburban.
And both look remarkably similar. I actually thought they were the same hotel design as they were/are going up .
     
     
  #7663  
Old Posted Apr 9, 2010, 10:32 PM
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Originally Posted by jrm857 View Post
and one of the major cities in Canada.
     
     
  #7664  
Old Posted Apr 10, 2010, 12:04 AM
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Originally Posted by circle33 View Post

Architect: "I know, if we put this sail thing on top, nobody will notice how ugly the bottom is".


There has got to be a better way to hide the parking or ventilation or whatever that is. I guess the "greenery" helps a bit, but keep in mind, it will be "brownery" for most of the year. It is really a shame to put this opposite the auditorium, which is actually a pretty nice design.
     
     
  #7665  
Old Posted Apr 10, 2010, 12:17 AM
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not really, saskatoon is an expensive city to live in, and people need to realize that, we are no longer the cheap small city we used to be. we are now expensive and one of the major cities in Canada.
while the bold is true, the underlined is a bit (or maybe a lot of) a stretch

Holiday Inn is fugly At least it bumps us up to 31st in the your city's tallest under construction! The sign of a major city.
     
     
  #7666  
Old Posted Apr 10, 2010, 12:48 AM
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Originally Posted by Morogolus View Post
11 frickin million dollars? I wish the real estate companies and developers would quit pretending this is Vancouver or Toronto. I'd like to know what their justification is for nearly tripling the price. It makes no sense..

-There have been no significant projects in the area with the exception of completing the west side of the river landing and readjustment of 19th st which was already in the books when the original price was negotiated.

-Real estate prices have not gone up not that much at all and for high price dwellings has actually dropped.

-To everyone's knowledge not one other developer has shown interest in the site.

They're taking a huge risk here and this could essentially kill the project. Meanwhile River Landing sits empty bringing in no revenue on an 82 million dollar sidewalk. Hopefully since this was done through a 3rd party then the city could come back with a more reasonable price.

Morogolus,

Commercial property/land values do not follow residential price trends. Residential and Commercial property trade for very different reasons and with very different purchasers. In many cases these two property types may even be moving in opposite directions; ie. an over supply of residential properties would cause a decline in price, while a low vacancy level in the office market would cause an upward movement in the office market at the same time.

Do not compare residential real estate to commercial they are very different animals.
     
     
  #7667  
Old Posted Apr 10, 2010, 2:10 AM
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Well I guess I got told by several people

Still doesn't change the fact it's expensive and by doing this that lot could sit empty for another 20 years. They should just take what they can get.
     
     
  #7668  
Old Posted Apr 10, 2010, 2:14 AM
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I'm curious as to why all the ventilation is out the front side of the building, I can understand parking, but ventilation? At least be creative and do exposed duct work etc, that could make the building very unique. I understand the 11 million dollar appraisal for the land and know that 2 separate private firms assessed the land, but I would almost expect the city to absorb some of that cost, after all it is city land they aren't really losing money b/c of it.
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  #7669  
Old Posted Apr 10, 2010, 2:45 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by socialisthorde View Post
Architect: "I know, if we put this sail thing on top, nobody will notice how ugly the bottom is".


There has got to be a better way to hide the parking or ventilation or whatever that is. I guess the "greenery" helps a bit, but keep in mind, it will be "brownery" for most of the year. It is really a shame to put this opposite the auditorium, which is actually a pretty nice design.
I noticed that ugly bottom right away but that sail thing on the top doesn't take away from the fact. Total redesign in my mind.
     
     
  #7670  
Old Posted Apr 10, 2010, 3:37 AM
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It's not particularly attractive, but then again it's a Holiday Inn. Search around the net and you'll come to the conclusion that Holiday Inn hotels are almost always unremarkable in every possible way. The real problem is the City can't refuse a development permit because of unremarkable architecture

This sort of development will continue until the City Centre Plan and accompanying bylaws are formulated and enacted.

Surface parking or this...well, we don't have much choice.

Last edited by Ruckus; Apr 10, 2010 at 9:43 AM. Reason: word choice
     
     
  #7671  
Old Posted Apr 10, 2010, 3:56 AM
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Originally Posted by Ruckus View Post
It's not particularly attractive, but then again it's a Holiday Inn. Search around the net and you'll come to the conclusion that Holiday Inn hotels are almost always unremarkable in every possible way. The real problem is the City can't reject a development permit because of unremarkable architecture

This sort of development will continue until the City Centre Plan and accompanying bylaws are formulated and enacted.

Surface parking or this...well, we don't have much choice.
I am totally aware of that. To turn down a positive development based on architecture not liked by some would be a kick in the ass and a possible loss on progress. As far as surface parking lot terms I would agree to take a built in parkade rather then a surface parking lot. In terms of cost including a parkade might make or break some projects and allow the surface parking lot to remain as the need for parking.

Conclusion can't complain with progress, but doesn't help with eye sores.

Last edited by JayM; Apr 10, 2010 at 4:18 AM.
     
     
  #7672  
Old Posted Apr 10, 2010, 9:28 AM
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^ We get what we deserve, nothing more, nothing less

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ruckus View Post
The above ground parking is not surprising. At least it's softened with a strip of greenery running the length. I don't mind the venting. Those slits help to break up what would otherwise be a blank wall.

What will make or break this hotel is how well the street level interacts with the pedestrian. The Pacific Ave side offers views into the lobby, and perhaps restaurant. It's not obvious in this rendering, but I suspect they have a guest drop-off/pick-up loop similar to the Hilton/Sheraton. I'm curious about the corner of Wall and 22nd, and more importantly whether there is an entrance or view into the hotel from Wall St.

Other than those concerns, it's a great use of that site and will have a positive impact on the surrounding businesses (Chianti, Caffe Sola, maybe Saigon Rose (a little bit further)...Arby's ).

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On the reappraised land: Holy shit!
lol, my bad. There's a medical office building on the corner of Wall and 22nd.

Blank wall for sure
     
     
  #7673  
Old Posted Apr 10, 2010, 7:06 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by socialisthorde View Post
Architect: "I know, if we put this sail thing on top, nobody will notice how ugly the bottom is".


There has got to be a better way to hide the parking or ventilation or whatever that is. I guess the "greenery" helps a bit, but keep in mind, it will be "brownery" for most of the year. It is really a shame to put this opposite the auditorium, which is actually a pretty nice design.
The parking should go in the back, out of sight. I wish the would consider something like this instead.
     
     
  #7674  
Old Posted Apr 10, 2010, 10:00 PM
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RE: Parcel 'y' value

Murray Totland with City planning department was quoted in an article in today's paper as saying, "It's only worth what people are willing to pay for it at the end of the day".

Given this property's sorry past in terms of interest from developers or buyers, I certainly hope that council keeps Mr. Totlands observation in mind! You can have the land assessed at whatever amount, but if no one is interested, then it obviously is overpriced for market.

Monday will be an interesting day at council.
     
     
  #7675  
Old Posted Apr 10, 2010, 10:36 PM
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Originally Posted by dsim249 View Post
I know, I was mostly making a point on Morogolus's behalf. hah
I guess it's just quite a shock for most of us to see the cost of that land explode so much.

Edit: Didn't notice that last part before. Pretty sure we are still the 17th largest city in the country.
Yea by population we are 17th, but economically we compete with in the big city list. if you look at a lot of those cities above us most are suburbs of somewhere bigger, last time I checked kitchner, victoria, st catherines were not considered as real stron economic cities. Just sayin . . .
     
     
  #7676  
Old Posted Apr 10, 2010, 11:18 PM
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Parcel Y

Parcel Y now $11M

Property downtown sees value double

By David Hutton, The StarPhoenixApril 10, 2010



The prime riverfront land slated to become the anchor for River Landing has more than doubled in price in the last four years, says a report going to city council Monday.

Known as Parcel Y, the value of the contentious 2.43-acre site across from the Remai Arts Centre has gone from $4.8 million in 2006 to $11 million this year, say two new appraisals done for the city.

The appraisals, done by Suncorp Valuations and Beatty Appraisal and Consulting, value the land at $11.6 million and $10.4 million, respectively. Those valuations appraise the land at $110 and $98 per square foot.

The city's administration is asking council to decide Monday whether to enter into negotiations with Lake Placid Developments, in a joint bid with Karim Nasser's Victory Majors Investment Corp., to build a $200-million hotel-office-condo megaproject, or to move forward with a process to open the land up for other developers to bid on.

"We need to clearly know if council has an interest in pursuing the development Lake Placid has proposed or not," said city manager Murray Totland. "If not, they need to give us direction to pursue a request for proposals because we can't do much on either and it's not fair to be trying to do both."

The new land prices were a surprise to city administration, Totland said. The price of land in the downtown has increased dramatically and the city's real estate market has boomed since 2006. But he expected the values would be dampened somewhat by the restrictions on the site, which call for a hotel, street-level retail, residential use, a public gathering place and parking.

"I've always thought any time you place significant restriction you end up reducing value so I was surprised to see valuations that high," he said.

Local philanthropist Ellen Remai purchased the land for $1.6 million in 2005 when a hotel and spa was eyed.

The prices aren't binding but give city administration and council more information on the property, Totland said. Council could agree to sell the land to a developer for any price, Totland said, and may want to hear from the appraisers to get more information on how the values were arrived at.

"It's only worth what people are willing to pay for it at the end of day," he said.

In the report, the city's administration lays out what it would be looking for from Lake Placid if council wants to enter into negotiations. The agreement the city is looking for would, generally, be the same as a previous one from two years ago, including construction timelines that, if not met, would mean the land would be repurchased by the city.

This time, though, the city is also asking for stronger financial due diligence with an outside audit brought in to investigate the financial viability of the project.

That measure would ensure for the public the development is viable, Totland said.

Nasser and Lake Placid CEO Michael Lobsinger have been clear they are looking to revive the agreement exactly as it was prior it being voided last year when payment deadlines on the land weren't met. They have also said they won't bid if the city opens up the land for other developers.

On Friday, Nasser said he felt the new appraisals were "too high" at $11 million and suggested the previous land price, $4.8 million plus interest, was a fairer price.

"We are prepared for everything," Nasser said.

"We want to talk with them and co-operate to proceed."

If negotiations fail, the city could reopen the request for proposals, Totland said, which was being readied for next week.

"It would be nice to move forward on this," Totland said. "The need for a decision is clear."

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  #7677  
Old Posted Apr 11, 2010, 12:13 AM
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Karim (Kay) Nasser

A good read on Karim (Kay) Nasser from the business section of The Star Phoenix.

A modest entrepreneur

     
     
  #7678  
Old Posted Apr 11, 2010, 3:47 AM
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^ Great read.

He's modest, yet so sure of this project. And he's not even interested in profits, just getting this done for the good of Saskatoon. This guy impresses me a bit more every time I hear about him. If he gets this built, I have a feeling this city's going to be naming A LOT of things in his honour. Maybe starting with the new bridge???

Now we wait for Monday night.
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  #7679  
Old Posted Apr 11, 2010, 3:49 AM
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  #7680  
Old Posted Apr 11, 2010, 6:59 AM
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^ Great read.

He's modest, yet so sure of this project. And he's not even interested in profits, just getting this done for the good of Saskatoon. This guy impresses me a bit more every time I hear about him. If he gets this built, I have a feeling this city's going to be naming A LOT of things in his honour. Maybe starting with the new bridge???

Now we wait for Monday night.
The bridge? C'mon, that's a little premature...maybe a cul-de-sac.
     
     
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