The Official Saint John, NB Project Thread

[adamuptownsj]

Originally Posted by bingun

Relevant section of the North End Plan below.

(image)

A) Lansdowne seems like it will resolve itself in conjunction with a willing and able PlazaREIT.

B) Clearly needed as I said.

C) I don't get the Chesley bike lane need. Main/Simonds and Douglas/Bentley already get you to points south and west respectively. We don't need to squeeze this particular corridor. What's the benefit here? Very duplicative.

D) much better than C and helps with B.

E) I want to know how. If this was Japan we would just follow the old Rockland Road then hack stairs into the hillside at the top, but no way that passes muster with grade/accessibility/winter needs.

[ell]

Originally Posted by adamuptownsj

C) I don't get the Chesley bike lane need. Main/Simonds and Douglas/Bentley already get you to points south and west respectively. We don't need to squeeze this particular corridor. What's the benefit here? Very duplicative.

I'm guessing the city does not intend to extend the Douglas bike lane (or Harbour Passage) from Bentley to Main and wants an obvious West-North bike route.

I agree that the existing Harbour Passage connection is preferable (although switching sides on Simonds St is sketchy and should be addressed), that is the way I travel from the Brunswicker to Lansdowne. It's not an obvious route for everyone though.

[adamuptownsj]

Intersection improvements at Hilyard and Simonds would be very easy to do. It's very silly to not extend the bike lane on Douglas from Bentley to Main. If we're going to have a west/north/harbour passage bike interface, a flat residential street with a school and a museum is the right place to do it. Not up a steep hill past a pair of highway ramps to and from a bridge. I can't imagine it would be very complicated to extend the Main bike lanes past St Luke's half a block.

[ell]

Originally Posted by adamuptownsj

Intersection improvements at Hilyard and Simonds would be very easy to do. It's very silly to not extend the bike lane on Douglas from Bentley to Main. If we're going to have a west/north/harbour passage bike interface, a flat residential street with a school and a museum is the right place to do it. Not up a steep hill past a pair of highway ramps to and from a bridge. I can't imagine it would be very complicated to extend the Main bike lanes past St Luke's half a block.

I think you're right:
It would be easy to improve the Hilyard/Simonds intersection
It would be sensible to extend the Douglas bike lane
It would be uncomplicated to extend the Main St bike lanes

I don't know why none of these have been done!

[bingun]

There is a $1.17M building permit that has been applied for this week for 10 Broadview Avenue -

INTERIOR RENOVATION AND CHANGE OF USE FOR SNB

For those unfamiliar, this is the office/warehouse building south of Broad Street, close to Tin Can Beach, currently occupied by CGI (an IT company). Also close to the rumoured Lafford development. Could this be the new location that was speculated about a while back? Lots of parking down there and still 'central' rather than going out East.

[Ire Narissis]

Originally Posted by bingun

There is a $1.17M building permit that has been applied for this week for 10 Broadview Avenue -



For those unfamiliar, this is the office/warehouse building south of Broad Street, close to Tin Can Beach, currently occupied by CGI (an IT company). Also close to the rumoured Lafford development. Could this be the new location that was speculated about a while back? Lots of parking down there and still 'central' rather than going out East.

Minor nitpick: CGS, not CGI. It stands for Computer Generated Solutions.

[bingun]

Originally Posted by Ire Narissis

Minor nitpick: CGS, not CGI. It stands for Computer Generated Solutions.

My bad, I get them mixed up.


1750 Sandy Point Road



New North End School

[bingun]

The construction at Saint John Toyota is finally moving faster than a snail's pace, and structural steel is up for the showroom expansion.

[adamuptownsj]

Rehabitat (part of Housing Alternatives) acquired the Lorne School on Newman Street from the province for $1. Presumably will convert to housing. Per AllNB.

[darkharbour]

Originally Posted by adamuptownsj

Rehabitat (part of Housing Alternatives) acquired the Lorne School on Newman Street from the province for $1. Presumably will convert to housing. Per AllNB.

Great news! So glad to hear that it will be not only maintained but [likely] turned into much needed housing.

The North End is quietly getting a lot of good infill or redevelopment, I think in 10 years the neighbourhood will feel lightyears beyond what it was in the 2010s.

[adamuptownsj]

Originally Posted by darkharbour

Great news! So glad to hear that it will be not only maintained but [likely] turned into much needed housing.

The North End is quietly getting a lot of good infill or redevelopment, I think in 10 years the neighbourhood will feel lightyears beyond what it was in the 2010s.

16,000 sf building footprint. East half of it seems it could make 7-10 average-sized apartments on each of 3 floors, but they would be pretty short on windows, unless they cut in new ones. I assume the west half is a gym?

[bingun]

Good news, that place has been vacant for a decade now? Isn't some of it used as a community center, or is that separate from the old school?

Several more schools will be vacant soon once the two new ones finish.

[adamuptownsj]

Originally Posted by bingun

Good news, that place has been vacant for a decade now? Isn't some of it used as a community center, or is that separate from the old school?

Several more schools will be vacant soon once the two new ones finish.

Community centre is next door (Nick Nicolle Community Centre). IIRC they sometimes make use of parts of the old school... perhaps the gym?

I know the city has plans for redevelopment of the Hazen-White-St. Francis site (see the North End Community Plan). Maybe it would be converted to apartments but I think demolition is in the cards. There's serious drainage issues there due to a buried stream. No clue about Centennial.

Prince Charles has one weird layout. Maybe it could work for supportive housing of some kind. I'd like to see the whole block bounded by Union, Prince Edward, and Crown redeveloped (extensions of Brunswick to Pitt and Richmond to Wentworth, and so on) but that kind of megaproject is wishful thinking. AFAIK there's no plan for it.

St. John the Baptist-King Edward is more interesting. Huge site. Maybe convert the upper floors to apartments St Pat's style (classroom=unit), and leave the half-basement/gym to Golden Gloves and the after-school programs that operate out of it? 35-ish units maybe? Then do something with the giant parking lot area and wasted Pitt Street frontage.

[bingun]

If anyone wants to have a good laugh at the write-in comments on this year's budget survey, you can check out the link below.

https://pub-saintjohn.escribemeetings.com/filestream.ashx?DocumentId=26935

Also, a render of the Aquatic Center, post-renovation.



EDIT - Here is what AI thinks of the comments -

What stands out

Safety and disorder is the top theme, even though nothing asked about it. About 23% of comments are about open drug use, crime, encampments and not seeing police around. Most are about Uptown and Waterloo St. People compare Saint John with KV and Rothesay, and with the crackdowns in Fredericton and Moncton. Only about six comments want police spending cut. About a dozen people say they have moved, or are thinking of moving, to the suburbs because of it. This lines up with police being #2 in Q1 at 49.8%.

The most common revenue idea is taxing industry, not residents. About 17% name Irving or heavy industry, the 2013 tax break, industrial assessment levels or provincial tax reform. A few also raise industry's water pricing. This matches the top pick in Q5, regional cost-sharing and tax reform at 53.4%. People plainly see this as the missing third choice between raising taxes and cutting services.

Anger about traffic calming is mostly about speed cushions. About 14% want speed cushions or bike lanes stopped, and speed cushions come up slightly more often than bike lanes. Several people suggest ticketing instead, and some want the City to lobby the Province for a share of fine revenue. About 28 comments support transit or active transportation, which is roughly 2.5 against for every one in favour. That's almost the same ratio as the checkbox questions: 43.9% spend less on active transportation vs 18.5% spend more. The supportive comments are mostly about transit frequency and hours, not bike lanes, and transit comes out positive in the checkbox results too.

People think suburbs should pay their share. About 26 comments call for amalgamation, tolls, a "poll tax", recreation fees for non-residents, or requiring City staff to live in the city. One says Council dropped a planned non-resident recreation fee in 2020 in exchange for a $60K payment.

People think the City has too many managers and not enough frontline workers. About 24 comments say "fewer managers, more boots on the ground." Some give specifics: HR's budget went from $1.4M in 2020 to $2.8M in 2025, and management and admin positions went from 92 to 102 while total permanent positions fell. Others complain about the new CAO's salary postings and the 4-day work week.

Opposition to the data centre shows up even though the survey didn't ask. About 19 comments oppose the Lorneville/VoltaGrid data centre and 3 support it. The concerns are the power grid, water, few permanent jobs, and the fact that industrial assessment means it won't pay much tax.

Sensible ideas that came up more than once:

• escalating taxes on vacant land and derelict buildings
• coordinating road and sidewalk plows so the road plow doesn't bury the cleared sidewalk
• holding paving contractors to warranties, and better asphalt
• sending a smaller vehicle instead of a fire truck to medical calls
• partnering with Saint John Energy on renewable energy revenue
• bringing back weekly garbage pickup

[adamuptownsj]

Quite a few genuinely good, thoughtful and sensible comments.

Half the Lorneville ones come across as totally nuts, cursing and freaking out.

Some real gems in there. 'Tax billionaires', lottery to serve on city council, lower taxi prices, cancel pensions for city employees, raise property taxes to 'feed the people', nightly sidewalk washing uptown, roadside fruit trees, invest in 'our Francophone legacy', extra tax for suburbs within city limits, abolish paid parking/the parking commission in general, interest free loans for small businesses, no property tax on homes without mortgages, make 1-way streets 2-way, city owned farm-to-table grocery store, tidal power in reversing falls, ban pot, and more besides.

I do agree with the anti-speedbump comments. They're enraging, partly because they're so massive. The speedbumps on Sand Cove by Sheldon's Point actually keep traffic moving at about the speed limit instead of crashing it to like 10 kph. Do we not have the technology to duplicate that?

The real frustrating thing is there's a ton of stuff one person, let alone a group of people, could easily do themselves for their own neighbourhood. Like, you don't need to go Ogden mode but do people know they can prune street trees or throw some cold mix in a pothole? Is that too complicated?

Looking at the social stats for respondents down on page 104, you can kind of guess who was disproportionally likely to complete the survey. Surprised at the senior participation rate.

[bingun]

The comprehensive parking study for the peninsula is being presented on Monday, and I don't know if it's just me, but it feels like this has taken years. Reading through it, there is honestly nothing revolutionary in here, looks like tinkering around the edges for the most part.

https://pub-saintjohn.escribemeetings.com/filestream.ashx?DocumentId=26998

https://pub-saintjohn.escribemeetings.com/filestream.ashx?DocumentId=26999

I found this page fascinating, not because it's revealing some super secret developments we didn't know about, but because it's horrifically out of date. Half the 'future developments' listed have already been built or are in progress. The only interesting one to see listed here again is Vulcan Street, which is the Lafford property; it shows 400 units and 200 parking spots. I think that lines up with past rumours.

Another diagram shows how soon they might come online, and apparently the building on Crown Street is 5-10 years out; St Vincent redevelopment is 10-15 years out??? Glad to see our taxpayer dollars going to this.

[DyAm00394]

CCD Canada database has a project listing for a new hotel at 4180 Loch Lomond Road, (Saint John Airport). Valued at $13,780,000.

[bingun]

Originally Posted by DyAm00394

CCD Canada database has a project listing for a new hotel at 4180 Loch Lomond Road, (Saint John Airport). Valued at $13,780,000.

I'm not complaining about the recent development at the airport, but I do feel like they are putting the cart before the horse. The airport has yet to make much progress on increasing flights or passenger numbers. They must have some confidence that it will happen to justify all this.

[sailor734]

Originally Posted by bingun

I'm not complaining about the recent development at the airport, but I do feel like they are putting the cart before the horse. The airport has yet to make much progress on increasing flights or passenger numbers. They must have some confidence that it will happen to justify all this.

Yeah, having a hotel at an airport that only has 3-4 flights a day total seems very odd to me.

[dhottawa729]

Originally Posted by sailor734

Yeah, having a hotel at an airport that only has 3-4 flights a day total seems very odd to me.

Yes it seems odd at first glance but theres no other accommodation anywhere close by. A hotel would be more for business travellers who stay a couple of days at a time, for driving tourists who want to use this as a gateway to St Martins / Fundy Trail, for flight crew on that midnight/5am flight, or for families that don’t want to brave the elements before a flight to a future sun destination. It’s not all airport related but the airport could certainly benefit from it. The airport has loads of land to lease and this is one service that doesn’t exist nearby. Key is not designing it to be reliant on only the airport so it can sustain itself independently. Ideally, such a hotel could take advantage of the beautiful lake views and maybe be a spa destination or retreat in its own right. A basic hotel that is intended to serve only the airport will not likely be successful. It’s got to be framed as a regional destination hotel with airport access and not an airport hotel.