Canada Line | Completed - Page 511

mr.x · #**10201** Posted **Oct 24, 2009, 8:10 AM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zassk

The M-line is ridiculously gold-plated. Everything about it screams reckless NDP spending. We will never get another line like that again. If you think the Evergreen or UBC stations will live up to the existing M-line stations, then I think you are living in a dream land.

As I said before, I would happily accept getting 3 stations at C-line quality rather than 2 stations at M-line quality for the same price.

The M-Line stations cost around $25-million each....which happens also to be the approximate cost for each Canada Line elevated station at half the length, after 5 years of inflation.

Hardly gold-plated. At best, the more aesthetically pleasing designs would have increased overall project costs marginally. The bulk of the project's cost is in rail infrastructure.

nname · #**10202** Posted **Oct 24, 2009, 8:39 AM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by mr.x

The M-Line stations cost around $25-million each....which happens also to be the approximate cost for each Canada Line elevated station at half the length, after 5 years of inflation.

Hardly gold-plated. At best, the more aesthetically pleasing designs would have increased overall project costs marginally. The bulk of the project's cost is in rail infrastructure.

The Olympic Village station cost about 29 millions to build, so an elevated station cost about the same as an underground station? But then, the recent rebuild of C-Train downtown station costs about 11-13 millions per platform, and they're at-grade too...

deasine · #**10203** Posted **Oct 24, 2009, 2:20 PM**

Post on the previous page has updated with photos. Click below to see.

Quote:

Originally Posted by deasine

Post Updated

mr.x · #**10204** Posted **Oct 24, 2009, 5:42 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by nname

The Olympic Village station cost about 29 millions to build, so an elevated station cost about the same as an underground station? But then, the recent rebuild of C-Train downtown station costs about 11-13 millions per platform, and they're at-grade too...

I'd imagine Olympic Village cost a lot less since it was the tunnel boring pit.

vansky · #**10205** Posted **Oct 24, 2009, 8:12 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Metro-One

Very true, just like how the city of Vancouver will be looking at adding public art in the time to come. So even though it is up and running, the C-Line is still not quite 100% complete.

I hope once #3 road is complete we will see those lighting effects and LED signs Richmond was mentioning putting on the guideways.

it's interesting that you dont really see many billboards along that road, eventhough it's busy. Richmond got the most store signs per capita in the region I think...

Metro-One · #**10206** Posted **Oct 24, 2009, 8:21 PM**

With such a large Chinese, Korean, Japanese and other north east Asian population in Metro Vancouver I have always found it strange that they have not brought more of their advertising and light culture with them. I guess it is slowly becoming more prevalent each year (The Korean Mall at Lougheed Town Center has some of the brightest signs in our region and some really nice lighting effects for example) but it takes time to chip away the old conservative values.

LeftCoaster · #**10207** Posted **Oct 24, 2009, 8:23 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by whatnext

Really oh wise one?

Then I'd find it hard to believe you've ever ridden the C-Line out from Richmond during rush hour when its capacity limitations are painfully obvious. And all this before the Olympics, the alleged justification for building it before the Evergreen Line.

And perhaps you've never taken this "airport line" with luggage, where the drawbacks of a cost cutting "one escalator" policy becomes painfully obvious as you wait for the elevator.

I asked you to educate yourself further before commenting... you did not listen.

Instead you decided to make a fool of yourself for a second time.

Let me reiterate, the capacity of the line has ABSOLUTELY nothing to do with the P3 model.

Please go do some research on the Canada line and P3s and then perhaps we can have a proper discussion about the actual flaws of the P3 model.

vansky · #**10208** Posted **Oct 24, 2009, 8:29 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Metro-One

With such a large Chinese, Korean, Japanese and other north east Asian population in Metro Vancouver I have always found it strange that they have not brought more of their advertising and light culture with them. I guess it is slowly becoming more prevalent each year (The Korean Mall at Lougheed Town Center has some of the brightest signs in our region and some really nice lighting effects for example) but it takes time to chip away the old conservative values.

we dont even have lcds on buses, that's like a billion lost in advertising revenue, just looking at how many ride the bus everyday. as the city grows, we could use more billboards and public advertising...the bus station ads could use a rolling mechanism instead of a static one...

Metro-One · #**10209** Posted **Oct 24, 2009, 8:35 PM**

I am surprised there are not LED screens in some of the underground skytrain stations. People stand and stare at the wall while waiting for the train all day!

In Japan it is crazy, they even place ads on the stairs! (literally on the rising portion of each step)

deasine · #**10210** Posted **Oct 24, 2009, 9:24 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Metro-One

I am surprised there are not LED screens in some of the underground skytrain stations. People stand and stare at the wall while waiting for the train all day!

In Japan it is crazy, they even place ads on the stairs! (literally on the rising portion of each step)

I really wouldn't want to go all out on advertisements... I mean maybe a few more around, but not to Japan's state. Though I have to say, Asian metros have some really cool ways of advertising. Take MTR for instance:

Quoted from Skybean of SSC

There are LCD screens now at most stations for advertising, though the ad itself doesn't take up too much space. Initially, there were plans of installing a huge screen at Burrard but I guess that didn't happen.

Metro-One · #**10211** Posted **Oct 24, 2009, 9:33 PM**

Well I also don't want to go to the extremes of Japan, but I would love to find a happy middle between Vancouver and Japan. Too bad about Broadway! that is the exact station I had in mind for a nice large screen! That or somewhere along the walls of City Center.

trofirhen · #**10212** Posted **Oct 25, 2009, 2:40 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by lightrail

Actually, I recently travelled between Vancouver and Toronto and used the Toronto subway and Vancouver Canada Line. The Canada line feels a lot like the Toronto subway, but quieter. Both were clean, though Canada line was cleaner. No graffiti on either system.

One difference - the station stops on the Toronto subway were shorter - at some stations the doors opened for as little as 5 seconds - one advantage of having drivers on the trains. Canada Line has a preprogrammed dwell time based on the expected loads at the stations. I think the shortest is 10 seconds.

I lived in Toronto for a year, and I agree with everything you say.
You also mention the similarities between the Toronto subway and Canada Line.

Good post: just one slight difference . . . . the Toronto subway operates full-length trains of 6 cars or upwards.

The Canada Line trains have 2 cars. What an expensive toy

Zassk · #**10213** Posted **Oct 25, 2009, 3:40 PM**

^ What is the frequency and ridership of those 6 car trains? I am guessing that both have a similar number of passengers per car...

nname · #**10214** Posted **Oct 25, 2009, 4:36 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zassk

^ What is the frequency and ridership of those 6 car trains? I am guessing that both have a similar number of passengers per car...

2-3min at peak and 4-5min off-peak.

Zassk · #**10215** Posted **Oct 25, 2009, 5:34 PM**

^ So that answers the unspoken question about our "toy train" Canada Line. The Rotem cars are huge cars. We are not Toronto. We only have the ridership for 2-3 car trains. A 4-6 car train on the Canada Line would be a waste of money.

The Expo/Millennium lines' trains have an average capacity somewhere around 400 passengers per train (i.e. some are bigger, some are smaller), which is the same capacity as a 2-car Canada Line train. After 2010 fleet expansion the E/M lines will still have a capacity of barely 500 per train on average.

I am not sure why some people continue to belittle the Canada Line trains. You guys need to come to terms with the fact that none of our lines are high-capacity like Toronto or Paris. The Canada Line is a pretty close match for our other lines.

SFUVancouver · #**10216** Posted **Oct 25, 2009, 5:48 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zassk

I am not sure why some people continue to belittle the Canada Line trains. You guys need to come to terms with the fact that none of our lines are high-capacity like Toronto or Paris. The Canada Line is a pretty close match for our other lines.

Plus it is brand new. As development shapes up along the line and general demand builds the system capacity will increase. We've all been over this again and again. If the C-Line had been built out with three or four times the capacity, which would bring it in line with the Athens Metro, it would have been monumentally over-built and far inexcess of the $2 billion dollar price tag.

There is more to system capacity than platform and train length. Frequency, train capacity, number of trains; these are all options to increase the C-Line's level of service.

And when the C-Line is totally, utterly at capacity we will simply bulk up parallel transit services. Streetcar on Arbutus, B-Lines on Main and Granville, premium commuter bus service into the core, and frequent all-articulated service on the balance of north-south streets will go a long way towards addressing the level of service ceiling of the C-Line, and at the fraction of the price of over-building it in the first place.

SpongeG · #**10217** Posted **Oct 25, 2009, 6:00 PM**

do they have advertising in the stations yet?

WarrenC12 · #**10218** Posted **Oct 25, 2009, 6:19 PM**

Amen my brothers! Enough Canada Line bashing. I'm all about more frequency. The train size/capacity is fine. The clogged bus routes (99, 20 and others) are a much bigger problem right now than the Canada line will EVER be.

deasine · #**10219** Posted **Oct 25, 2009, 6:24 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by SFUVancouver

And when the C-Line is totally, utterly at capacity we will simply bulk up parallel transit services. Streetcar on Arbutus, B-Lines on Main and Granville, premium commuter bus service into the core, and frequent all-articulated service on the balance of north-south streets will go a long way towards addressing the level of service ceiling of the C-Line, and at the fraction of the price of over-building it in the first place.

Not to mention, as you introduce new rapid transit solutions that are parallel to that of the Canada Line, the number of users decreases: not significantly, but enough.

But by the time the Canada Line is really capacity, we might be discussing about extending it to increase the capacity =P

Yume-sama · #**10220** Posted **Oct 26, 2009, 3:57 AM**

I took the Canada Line to the airport tonight instead of taking a taxi. It was quite painless, and not very busy so I was able to get a seat for the first time ever. The ride was quick, just a little bit of a delay due to something being on the track... though I'm not sure what, as the alarm didn't go off until the trains at both platforms were stopped. And ever the experience, next to me was someone dressed as a Glade Plugin, and his friend, a lamp.