ATLANTA | Development Thread V

[Nanosolar]

[QUOTE=simms3_redux;6014146]In looking at the video interview of Loudermilk, Jr with the rendering of the 8-floor midrise in the background...the midrise is shorter than Viewpoint's garage!!

If there is any proof as to how fucking ridiculous parking requirements are in Atlanta, that rendering is it. I just threw together a use map of that block. The vast land area of the block is taken up by parking structures. Very small portion actually taken up by "buildings", and retail just thrown in for good measure. See below the best cast scenario for development/use on that block if the midrise goes up. Blue=block. Yellow=retail. Red=garage. Green lines outline the buildings essentially. If blue is showing, that's potentially dead space, as on 6th St.
/QUOTE]

Is it because 1) it's extremely expensive to put parking underground 2) There is already stuff underground that can't be moved or 3) ???

It's true though, now would be the time to impose some kind of guidelines, the boom is happening/about to happen with residential and office again. At this rate it seems like half the land in Midtown will be parking decks

[RudyJK]

Originally Posted by simms3_redux

In looking at the video interview of Loudermilk, Jr with the rendering of the 8-floor midrise in the background...the midrise is shorter than Viewpoint's garage!!

If there is any proof as to how fucking ridiculous parking requirements are in Atlanta, that rendering is it. I just threw together a use map of that block. The vast land area of the block is taken up by parking structures. Very small portion actually taken up by "buildings", and retail just thrown in for good measure. See below the best cast scenario for development/use on that block if the midrise goes up. Blue=block. Yellow=retail. Red=garage. Green lines outline the buildings essentially. If blue is showing, that's potentially dead space, as on 6th St.

The way i understood Loudermilk is:

• Starbucks and the lot on Peachtree come down and a new tower with retail on bottom connects with Viewpoint on Peachtree. Starbucks comes back on site in some capacity, he pointed to the southern Peachtree front section of the current Viewpoint.
• The lot on 6th St. gets new infill retail that connects Sprint with Borders new apt tower.
• The whole shebang gets new treatments, but not necessarily consistent treatments (the way that SOME retailers like it so their image stands out among their neighbors.)

There was no mention of surface parking lots being redeveloped so perhaps that is not part of the plan? - crossed fingers.

[Orlando]

Originally Posted by shivtim

Why is it inappropriate to have student housing next to a strip club? I live across the street from the Cheetah, and they're actually a very good neighbor. The only problem is the surface parking and lack of street interaction.

I thought the answer was obvious. But, it's because of it's seedy nature, and the kind of activity it is associated with. The Cheetah was there when that part of Midtown was a bunch of surface parking lots and hookers hanging out on street corners. Now, it's much different. It's getting better, and that part of the city would be even better if they forced the Cheetah to shut down or move. I used to park around there as a grad student at Georgia Tech before they built Tech Square, and I remember walking to my car at night, and there would be drug needles and used condoms in the gutter. And, on top of that, there would be an occasional male prostitute hanging out on the street corner.

Cities, can be much safer and better without them. For example, Times Square in Manhattan cleaned up a lot during the reign of Mayor Jiuliani. It was known for all of its adult shops, etc., and was very seedy. But, now, it's a huge tourist attraction and family friendly, too. Manhattan, in general, was a lot rougher and more seedy before they started to make it safer and clean it up more. Now, it's a very desirable place to live in.

[cokezero]

Originally Posted by Orlando

I thought the answer was obvious. But, it's because of it's seedy nature, and the kind of activity it is associated with. The Cheetah was there when that part of Midtown was a bunch of surface parking lots and hookers hanging out on street corners. Now, it's much different. It's getting better, and that part of the city would be even better if they forced the Cheetah to shut down or move. I used to park around there as a grad student at Georgia Tech before they built Tech Square, and I remember walking to my car at night, and there would be drug needles and used condoms in the gutter. And, on top of that, there would be an occasional male prostitute hanging out on the street corner.

Cities, can be much safer and better without them. For example, Times Square in Manhattan cleaned up a lot during the reign of Mayor Jiuliani. It was known for all of its adult shops, etc., and was very seedy. But, now, it's a huge tourist attraction and family friendly, too. Manhattan, in general, was a lot rougher and more seedy before they started to make it safer and clean it up more. Now, it's a very desirable place to live in.

Cheetah isn't going anywhere. As far as I know, new strip clubs aren't allowed in the SPI-16 district. Thus, as a grandfathered strip club in a district where no others exist or are allowed to exist, the actual Cheetah business is likely worth much more in the free market as an operating strip club than its real estate. The current owner is a really rich old man that owns multiple Cheetah clubs throughout the U.S. I'm sure that place isn't going anywhere in his lifetime and, whenever he dies, his estate will likely realize more value to its beneficiaries by selling to another strip club owner than to a real estate developer.

Rather than trying to fight the Cheetah's existence, we're probably better off accepting that they're going no where and collaborating with them to improve whatever it is we think is wrong with their business (if anything)...be it their building's relation to the street, their large unsightly surface lot, or the manner in which their patrons interact with the surrounding community.

[shivtim]

Originally Posted by Orlando

I thought the answer was obvious. But, it's because of it's seedy nature, and the kind of activity it is associated with. The Cheetah was there when that part of Midtown was a bunch of surface parking lots and hookers hanging out on street corners. Now, it's much different.

Please describe what "seedy nature" means, and also describe what type of activity you're referring to that is "associated" with the Cheetah. Do you have data on the Cheetah increasing crime or prostitution in the area? Or are you just assuming all strip clubs increase crime? Please share. I'll even give you the website to look up crime: http://www.atlantapd.org/zone5.aspx.

The Cheetah was there before, and there were hookers. Now the Cheetah is still there, and there aren't hookers and by your own admission the area is much better than it used to be. I guess the Cheetah isn't the problem, is it? You are undermining your own argument. Your line of reasoning is the same argument people use to try to force out gay bars or ban Sunday alcohol sales.

Now please stop coming into the Atlanta forums and starting off-topic rants. This is the construction thread, for talk about new construction, not righteous condemnation of things you think are "seedy."

[jddar]

Well said shivtim.

Also, Atlanta's convention and trade industries are somewhat dependent on the area's high caliber strip clubs. They're considered a desired attraction by many attendees. I think the City would be wise to permit a few more to proven owner/operators. Admittedly, how that could be done might prove problematic.

Further, do we really want a "City" sterilized to the point of absolute boredom?

Getting back on topic, could someone please post update pics of the Twelfth and Midtown rental tower. I've been out of town for quite sometime and would enjoy seeing its progress.

[ATLaffinity]

Originally Posted by Orlando

I thought the answer was obvious. But, it's because of it's seedy nature, and the kind of activity it is associated with. The Cheetah was there when that part of Midtown was a bunch of surface parking lots and hookers hanging out on street corners. Now, it's much different. It's getting better, and that part of the city would be even better if they forced the Cheetah to shut down or move. I used to park around there as a grad student at Georgia Tech before they built Tech Square, and I remember walking to my car at night, and there would be drug needles and used condoms in the gutter. And, on top of that, there would be an occasional male prostitute hanging out on the street corner.

Cities, can be much safer and better without them. For example, Times Square in Manhattan cleaned up a lot during the reign of Mayor Jiuliani. It was known for all of its adult shops, etc., and was very seedy. But, now, it's a huge tourist attraction and family friendly, too. Manhattan, in general, was a lot rougher and more seedy before they started to make it safer and clean it up more. Now, it's a very desirable place to live in.

You are making stuff up. Stop.

[AtlantaMustang]

Originally Posted by jddar

Getting back on topic, could someone please post update pics of the Twelfth and Midtown rental tower. I've been out of town for quite sometime and would enjoy seeing its progress.

Here's the Oxblue Cam, although it would be nice to see some pics too.

http://oxblue.com/open/brasfieldgorrie/7712thstreet

[AtlantaMustang]

Also here's a quote by smArTaLlone in the Atlanta subforum:

Originally Posted by smArTaLlone

Here's a screenshot of 867 Peachtree and the Viewpoint retail facade from the Midtown Patch video. Loudermilk's statement, "what we need is to really add some street presence and architectural detail" is music to my ears.



http://midtown.patch.com/articles/prelim...chtree-and-spring-streets#video-13352980

[Sketching]

Originally Posted by shivtim

Please describe what "seedy nature" means, and also describe what type of activity you're referring to that is "associated" with the Cheetah. Do you have data on the Cheetah increasing crime or prostitution in the area? Or are you just assuming all strip clubs increase crime? Please share. I'll even give you the website to look up crime: http://www.atlantapd.org/zone5.aspx.

The Cheetah was there before, and there were hookers. Now the Cheetah is still there, and there aren't hookers and by your own admission the area is much better than it used to be. I guess the Cheetah isn't the problem, is it? You are undermining your own argument. Your line of reasoning is the same argument people use to try to force out gay bars or ban Sunday alcohol sales.

Now please stop coming into the Atlanta forums and starting off-topic rants. This is the construction thread, for talk about new construction, not righteous condemnation of things you think are "seedy."

Well said.

[clexmond]

Originally Posted by AtlantaMustang

Also here's a quote by smArTaLlone in the Atlanta subforum:

Also, here's a screenshot of the elevation from 6th Street. Does anyone know what the area under the red line is? It looks like maybe it's built out retail towards 100 6th Street, but I really can't tell with it so blurry.

[photoLith]

Hey guys I'm going to be in Atlanta this evening. I'm in Birmingham right now. Wanted to see if anyone wanted to meet up for photos and if its not too much trouble to be able to couch surf.

[AtlantaMustang]

Originally Posted by photoLith

Hey guys I'm going to be in Atlanta this evening. I'm in Birmingham right now. Wanted to see if anyone wanted to meet up for photos and if its not too much trouble to be able to couch surf.

I would love to if I wasn't working tonight after class, but I can't wait to see your photos, I'm sure they'll be amazing. Have fun!

[scania]

Originally Posted by shivtim

Please describe what "seedy nature" means, and also describe what type of activity you're referring to that is "associated" with the Cheetah. Do you have data on the Cheetah increasing crime or prostitution in the area? Or are you just assuming all strip clubs increase crime? Please share. I'll even give you the website to look up crime: http://www.atlantapd.org/zone5.aspx.

The Cheetah was there before, and there were hookers. Now the Cheetah is still there, and there aren't hookers and by your own admission the area is much better than it used to be. I guess the Cheetah isn't the problem, is it? You are undermining your own argument. Your line of reasoning is the same argument people use to try to force out gay bars or ban Sunday alcohol sales.

Now please stop coming into the Atlanta forums and starting off-topic rants. This is the construction thread, for talk about new construction, not righteous condemnation of things you think are "seedy."

It is very clear that some of you live in a fantasy world...I wonder do any of you really live in Midtown. The fact of the matter is that there are [B]PLENTY OF MALE PROSTITUTES AND DRAG PROSTITUTES IN THIS AREA! It's like you never see the police raids to try and catch them in action every 3 or 4 months. The male prostitutes are mainly buy my building (Plaza Midtown), and the drags are typically between 3rd and 5th.

[shivtim]

^What does any of that have to do with the Cheetah? So your argument is that the straight strip club featuring female dancers is somehow attracting male prostitutes in search of gay clientele? That doesn't make any sense.
For the record, I have never seen any prostitutes near the Cheetah or Plaza Midtown, only over to the east on Cypress, 8th street, etc... it has absolutely no connection to the Cheetah. And with that, I'm done... this discussion doesn't belong in this thread.

[ATLaffinity]

Originally Posted by scania

It is very clear that some of you live in a fantasy world...I wonder do any of you really live in Midtown. The fact of the matter is that there are [B]PLENTY OF MALE PROSTITUTES AND DRAG PROSTITUTES IN THIS AREA! It's like you never see the police raids to try and catch them in action every 3 or 4 months. The male prostitutes are mainly buy my building (Plaza Midtown), and the drags are typically between 3rd and 5th.

[The Lurker]

There's got to be something more exciting than prostitution going on in Atlanta. Any construction photos?

[jnihiser]

They cleared an old warehouse right next to Braxton Auto in the West side...roughly Howell Mill and Chattahoochee (on the Chat side), and appear to be leveling and getting ready to pour...any word?

[shivtim]

Construction is set to begin on the National Center for Civil and Human Rights the week of March 4th, with a May 2014 opening.

[forj]

Originally Posted by jnihiser

They cleared an old warehouse right next to Braxton Auto in the West side...roughly Howell Mill and Chattahoochee (on the Chat side), and appear to be leveling and getting ready to pour...any word?

i have been wondering about this too - finally dug it up looking through the Berkely Park Neighborhood website and the NPU-D meeting notes.. unfortunately - i dont have exciting news to report

http://us1.campaign-archive1.com/?u=904eebdeee0788f5f4c64132e&id=2a3085d4ed&e=4ffd0e4625

Several people have asked about the ongoing construction behind Braxton Automotive (the first lot fronting the south side of Chattahoochee to the west of Howell Mill). This is a self-storage facility that we granted a parking exception for in March 2008. I am not sure why it has taken them so long to begin construction. The project that was originally proposed is described in the February and March 2008 BPNA newsletters. The construction would need to conform pretty closely to that description as a new SAP would be required if it did not and none has been applied for.

a self storage place? boooooooooo