Canada's 'housing bubble' deemed close to bursting

[Wigs]

Originally Posted by urbandreamer

I'm paying $1300 including parking for a 1 bedroom in Toronto, steps from High Park.

I'm expecting to get renovicted, unless I vacate next year.

This is the most I've paid for rent. In KW I paid $650 for a large 2 bedroom 17 years ago; $600 for 1200 sqft loft in Montreal in 2002-03; in the Annex my rooming house was $300/month c.96-'00. I refuse to pay more than $1500/month to rent.

My cousin pays $1,500 for a basement apartment in St. Catharines. I'd say by 2022 standards you got yourself a deal

[yaletown_fella]

I have a bad feeling the government will pressure the BOC to ease or conjure some kind of interest free loan bailout for these speculators (most bought out of the greed that theyd see 15% appreciation every year and then could sell without paying capital gains)

I hope this spells the end of the teardown McMansion era. In my opinion, McMansions in urban zones should be required to have multiple secondary rental units.

Theres a really ugly McMansion built during the Covid bubble that left a scar on the historic streetscape of Lowther just west of Bedford in Yorkville. Half the first floor is a garish suburban garage done in black glass. It's the perfect symbol of this greed.

[whatnext]

Originally Posted by Truenorth00

That's why some of them are out protesting, conflating "home owners" with investors and demanding the government bail them out. It's fucking gross how they think they are victims.

https://twitter.com/RE_MarketWatch/status/1579325374408056832?t=6JchtyvEpsrjWxQIsNLYhQ&s=19

That group is getting lambasted on Twitter as just a shill group for realtors. Looks like some of their ate their own about how you can't go wrong buying real estate.


Justice_Queen
@RE_MarketWatch

1/ I wonder if @bcrea is prepared to do anything about the realtor pretending to be a tenant fighting rent controls. This protest is backed by the RE industry pretending to be homeowners and renters.
@YVRTenantsUnion
@bc_acorn

https://twitter.com/RE_MarketWatch/status/1581460602148380673

[swimmer_spe]

Originally Posted by Truenorth00

I get where the phrase comes from. Kinda sad that instead of seeing many of these immigrants as victims of unscrupulous realtors and mortgage brokers, people are using it as an opportunity to portray all this, as only a problem in certain ethnic communities. It's clearly more widespread than that. Immigrants are just the easiest prey.

It's gross how every regulator and authority failed in these stories. Sadly, I don't think the majority of these people will lose their jobs, or that the majority of fraudsters will see any sort of sanction. I do hope to see lots of foreclosures. Only way to restore some moral hazard.

The problem is they are taking advantage of immigrants that many would want to just leave Canada all together. Now, if it was a regular, white, Christian, heterosexual family, the CPC would be up in arms over it.

Add this to the long list of Canada ignoring the plight of immigrants.

Originally Posted by yaletown_fella

I have a bad idea the government will pressure the BOC to ease or conjure some kind of interest free loan bailout for these speculators (most bought out of the greed that theyd see 15% appreciation every year and then could sell without paying capital gains)

I hope this spells the end of the teardown McMansion era. In my opinion, McMansions in urban zones should be required to have multiple secondary rental units.

Theres a really ugly McMansion built during the Covid bubble that left a scar on the historic streetscape of Lowther just west of Bedford in Yorkville. Half the first floor is a garish suburban garage done in black glass. It's the perfect symbol of this greed.

I don't feel that there will be a bail out of those that bought unless there is some sort of stipulation on rental or resale value. If the CPC were in, I would agree with your concern.

As far as McMansions taking over, I don't see that ending anytime soon. I do feel we may see less new builds in new subdivisions being so large, but one offs, I feel it is here to stay.

[Luisito]

• Video Link

[Architype]

We all know these characteristics, but some of the differences can be startling. This is about housing types, not ownership. Apartment rates don't drop below 35%, except in NL, where it is 4%, and singles don't rise above 42%, except in NL, where it is 80%.

The Most Popular Home Type In Each Canadian Province

Ontario
#1. Apartments: 53%
#2. Singles: 27%
#3. Rows: 17%
#4. Semis: 3%

Quebec
#1. Apartments: 73%
#2. Singles: 15%
#3. Semis: 7%
#4. Rows: 5%

British Columbia
#1. Apartments: 65%
#2. Singles: 19%
#3. Rows: 13%
#4. Semis: 3%

Alberta
#1. Singles: 40%
#2. Apartments: 35%
#3. Rows: 13%
#4. Semis: 11%

Manitoba
#1. Apartments: 54%
#2. Singles: 32%
#3. Rows: 10%
#4. Semis: 4%

Nova Scotia
#1. Apartments: 56%
#2. Singles: 35%
#3. Semis: 6%
#4. Rows: 3%

Saskatchewan
#1. Singles: 42%
#2. Apartments: 40%
#3. Rows: 14%
#4. Semis: 5%

New Brunswick
#1. Apartments: 41%
#2. Singles: 40%
#3. Semis: 13%
#4. Rows: 6%

Prince Edward Island
#1. Apartments: 40%
#2. Singles: 40%
#3. Semis: 12%
#4. Rows: 8%

Newfoundland and Labrador
#1. Singles: 80%
#2. Semis: 9%
#3. Rows: 7%
#4. Apartments: 4%

source

[Innsertnamehere]

That does not seem correct at all. 54% of dwellings in Ontario are detached dwellings according to 2021 census data, not 27%. Apartments are 31%.

[travis3000]

Originally Posted by Wigs

How long ago did you buy your place?
Kind of disturbing that your mortgage is less than what basement apartments in a huge chunk of southern Ontario rent for!

Bought in 2017 during the spring peak. But I also sold during the same time so it was relevant.

[lio45]

Originally Posted by Wigs

How long ago did you buy your place?
Kind of disturbing that your mortgage is less than what basement apartments in a huge chunk of southern Ontario rent for!

Mine is $420 per month on my personal residence. And it’s getting close to paid off.

I’d love to refinance some of my buildings, but since everyone else in this country is apparently doing mortgage fraud, my cashflow numbers likely don’t look inflated enough to the banks

[WarrenC12]

Originally Posted by Wigs

How long ago did you buy your place?
Kind of disturbing that your mortgage is less than what basement apartments in a huge chunk of southern Ontario rent for!

Well I think he locked in at low interest rates and has a low balance on his mortgage.

$1350 at today's fixed rates doesn't get you much in terms of a loan.

[Wigs]

Originally Posted by travis3000

Bought in 2017 during the spring peak. But I also sold during the same time so it was relevant.

smart move in hindsight!


looks like Barrie increased even more dramatically and fell quicker than a lot of other areas (pretty big jump from Jan 2020 to just before 2022)

[Wigs]

Originally Posted by Truenorth00

I get where the phrase comes from. Kinda sad that instead of seeing many of these immigrants as victims of unscrupulous realtors and mortgage brokers, people are using it as an opportunity to portray all this, as only a problem in certain ethnic communities. It's clearly more widespread than that. Immigrants are just the easiest prey.

It's gross how every regulator and authority failed in these stories. Sadly, I don't think the majority of these people will lose their jobs, or that the majority of fraudsters will see any sort of sanction. I do hope to see lots of foreclosures. Only way to restore some moral hazard.

As if White, Asian or other ethnic GTA/Greater Vancouver/other RE market area mortgage brokers and realtors weren't complicit in this. That CBC story makes it seem like South Asians are the only ones that were unscrupulous.

It almost looks like the regulators looked the other way as the housing market was booming

[Luisito]

Originally Posted by Wigs

As if White, Asian or other ethnic GTA/Greater Vancouver/other RE market area mortgage brokers and realtors weren't complicit in this. That CBC story makes it seem like South Asians are the only ones that were unscrupulous.

No they arent the only ones but I would say they have higher rates of scams in their community.

I and the people I work for have gone to court several times in the past 6 years for unpaid work and people trying to rip us off, and everytime it has been south asians. I hate to say it but it's true.

People look the other way because they're afraid to be accused of racism.

[urbandreamer]

Found: affordable housing - Babys Point, Ontario

[Architype]

Originally Posted by Innsertnamehere

That does not seem correct at all. 54% of dwellings in Ontario are detached dwellings according to 2021 census data, not 27%. Apartments are 31%.

I wonder why the numbers would be divergent? It seems simple enough to get stats from the proper source, unless they used different criteria or methodology.

Originally Posted by urbandreamer

Found: affordable housing - Babys Point, Ontario
https://i.imgur.com/Dkiy0vU.jpg

Seems barely hobbitable, basically ground level entry.

[flar]

Originally Posted by urbandreamer

Found: affordable housing - Babys Point, Ontario

Brander Park?

FYI I've never heard anyone actually call it Babys Point, but if you insist, make sure you pronounce it as Babby Point.

[urbandreamer]

^Yes. I was thinking about Baby Point in Toronto, which is pronounced "Babby" after the somewhat controversial family. I stopped here for a stretch and pee break before heading up to Mooretown and Corunna. This entire area, from Komoka to Sarnia, Essex to Wallaceburg, Chatham to Lucan reminds me of rural Manitoba and Saskatchewan. The 402 is about as flat, empty and boring as the Yellowhead Highway. Chatham could be Yorkton or Selkirk.

[flar]

Actually, I think it might be more like Bobby's Point. I do know it's not pronounced how it looks.

[urbandreamer]

^In Toronto, it rhymes with Abby, not maybe.

[Hali87]

Originally Posted by Drybrain

Yet if you click through and look at the comparison of individual cities, Halifax is only the 20th most expensive, with average rents hundreds of dollars cheaper than the provincial average. What to make of that?

The individual cities list is only looking at vacant 1 and 2BR apartments while the provincial average includes larger units as well (I think).

It's the 20th most expensive on that list but notably it's the most expensive outside of BC and Ontario and is the ~7th or 8th most expensive urban area on that list (Ottawa is more expensive but Gatineau and Nepean are less so I'm not really sure how that works out at a broader level).

Part of this is due to the current rent controls in NS which tend to keep rents relatively low in occupied units and relatively high in vacant ones. The list of individual cities is measuring the vacant ones. Another factor is that a large proportion of these vacant units are in brand-new buildings that generally are not cheap. And another factor is just the overall scarcity - the vacancy rate is back at 1%.