Lansdowne Park Redevelopment Phase 1 | Completed

[lrt's friend]

Originally Posted by originalmuffins

I think the difference is that the appetite and view restrictions make it so Richmond is viable to incorporate those towers. Bank is more central and it would be harder to implement those especially without LRT (which Richmond also will have access to 3 stations - which is where a lot of the height is proposed). Richmond has to increase the density and incorporate ground retail near the station. That's the best way to improve Richmond at it's current state (and Carling too for that matter - which will also need either BRT or a tramway via QED like many of us talked about).


Although I do agree with the current proposal with Lansdowne 2.0. That density is much needed for that area which can help push through better transit options for that area.

The problem with Richmond Road is that the Confederation Line is close but still does not effectively serve the traditional retail strip in Westboro. It is just far enough away to dissuade most pedestrians.

We cannot make the same mistake on Bank Street. QED is residential and park and just intersects Bank Street. We need frequent transit that serves our retail streets without significant walks. We have to stop saying that a 500 m walk is close enough for a transit rider while most are used to a 50 m walk when using a car.

We also have to understand that for transit to succeed, we need to attract people to those retail streets from elsewhere, not to expect a few hundred locals in towers to meet the requirements of higher order transit. Yes, it helps but our overall transit network needs improvement to allow more people to choose transit for more trips. I don't see anybody making bold proposals to allow this to happen.

[Uhuniau]

Originally Posted by J.OT13

As an aside, walking down Bank felt more like a downtown than downtown itself. So many local retailers and restaurants, people on the street, a good mix of heritage and modern architecture. Minto's Fifth and Bank is a fantastic. They really nailed adding density while preserving the human-scale feel and it should serve as an example for the rest of the city.

Overhead WIRES?!?!! (Faints in Ancient Glebish)

[Uhuniau]

Originally Posted by OTSkyline

I think they're referring to massing and step backs vs. lot line to lot line buildings.

In this example, I think Bank Street is doing it much better than Richmond Road in terms of style & design. Richmond seems but more imposing and like a dark canyon than Bank.

The single best thing that the built environment can do to contribute to a street being a People Street vs. a Car Street is for the buildings to be "lot line to lot line", regardless of mass or height.

[Uhuniau]

Originally Posted by lrt's friend

At some point we need to find a better Bank Street transit solution. Absolutely, we cannot close it to regular traffic. That will destroy what we are currently building on Bank Street as well as the surrounding neighbourhoods.

The city has already very clearly decided what the transit "solution" is for Bank (and also for Rideau-Montreal):

Nothing.

We can't even get a steady supply of articulated buses to keep the 7 from being the hell bus. Those buses are "needed" elsewhere.

The answer to the transit problems is Nothing.

[Uhuniau]

Originally Posted by lrt's friend

We have to stop saying that a 500 m walk is close enough for a transit rider while most are used to a 50 m walk when using a car.

It's not just the walk distances or stop placements. We also have to stop thinking that circuitous and indirect transit service that somewhat, but not entirely, reflects natural desire lines, is good enough.

This mentality is especially prevalent when it comes to "opening" streets like Bank in the summer with zero regard for transit service, or when a construction detour that results in five or six stops being taken out of service has only one replacement stop on the diversion route. (If that.)

The topology of the transit system matters. Transit users understand that intuitively. Transit authorities, oh lord, how they do not.

[ponyboycurtis]

I'm really going to miss when they tear down these walkups on the north side. Spacing and practicality aside these things kick the ass out of the steps on the south. Perhaps most importantly I have so many childhood memories of these walkups with the Roughriders.

The steel beams and roof overhang and ground floor mezzanine are pretty awesome as well. Upper tier and all the washrooms are pretty bad.





Some of the other areas of the north side are pretty interesting as well if you are into weird concretey structures.




Anyhow, point of the matter here. I really like the small shops that are attached to the north side redo/renovation.







I love the low covered ceilings and perpendicular signs.



Compared to this.

I love Lansdowne regardless. Pretty much every aspect of it. But I would love to have seen more of it developed like the first set of photos. That is also the part slated for redevelopment. Perhaps I just don't understand anything about our current world.

[originalmuffins]

Originally Posted by lrt's friend

The problem with Richmond Road is that the Confederation Line is close but still does not effectively serve the traditional retail strip in Westboro. It is just far enough away to dissuade most pedestrians.

We cannot make the same mistake on Bank Street. QED is residential and park and just intersects Bank Street. We need frequent transit that serves our retail streets without significant walks. We have to stop saying that a 500 m walk is close enough for a transit rider while most are used to a 50 m walk when using a car.

We also have to understand that for transit to succeed, we need to attract people to those retail streets from elsewhere, not to expect a few hundred locals in towers to meet the requirements of higher order transit. Yes, it helps but our overall transit network needs improvement to allow more people to choose transit for more trips. I don't see anybody making bold proposals to allow this to happen.

But I didn't say we don't need to have transit improvements. The taller towers being implemented on Richmond are very close to the stations lol. I didn't mention the Westboro portion but as the area is built up on the other side, more routes can be circulated from those stations.

[OTSkyline]

The distance between the LRT stations on Scott and the Retail strip on Richmond is 350m or a short 5min walk. Building LRT underground under Richmond would have been extremely expensive.

People in this city need to adjust their expectations to the new reality that Ottawa is becoming a larger city (and the commuting patterns that come with it). Long gone are the days where a bus would pick you up in front of your home at Pleasantdrive Ave in Avalon Orleans and drop you off at your destination downtown on the same ride.

As someone who has used subways/metros all around Canada and the world, it's totally normal to have to walk a few hundred meters to the nearest metro station from you, sometimes even transfer between lines, and then walk a few hundred meters to your final destination. As long as the metro/LRT is frequent and reliable, that should not be a problem. But saying the LRT won't serve Westboro/Richmond retail is pretty laughable.

[originalmuffins]

Originally Posted by OTSkyline

The distance between the LRT stations on Scott and the Retail strip on Richmond is 350m or a short 5min walk. Building LRT underground under Richmond would have been extremely expensive.

People in this city need to adjust their expectations to the new reality that Ottawa is becoming a larger city (and the commuting patterns that come with it). Long gone are the days where a bus would pick you up in front of your home at Pleasantdrive Ave in Avalon Orleans and drop you off at your destination downtown on the same ride.

As someone who has used subways/metros all around Canada and the world, it's totally normal to have to walk a few hundred meters to the nearest metro station from you, sometimes even transfer between lines, and then walk a few hundred meters to your final destination. As long as the metro/LRT is frequent and reliable, that should not be a problem. But saying the LRT won't serve Westboro/Richmond retail is pretty laughable.

Exactly. I've lived abroad and it was fairly normal to have no transfers after the metro stop, which required having a bike or walking. Granted we do have to deal with winters here so as long as there is decent bus transfers from the importand and LAST stops in each line, then that there alleviates that issue. As for stations along the route, walking 5-8 mins from the station to get somewhere isn't too bad either.

[lrt's friend]

The primary problem is that we do not offer decent bus transfers.

Maybe we can no longer offer one seat rides, but do we offer an adequate replacement? The public is voting NO by not using transit anymore.

Waiting 30 minutes or longer at a LRT station for a bus is unacceptable.

European cities offer a much more comprehensive transit network with minimal waits for transfers.

[J.OT13]

Originally Posted by SL123

What Bank street in the glebe need is to stop allowing cars owners to park on the street. this alone would clear so much of the traffic mess in that area.

If we disallow street parking, I'd prefer using those lanes for buses or cycle tracks than regular car traffic lanes.

Unless we improve transit, those parking spots will still be needed. With a Civic Centre show with an attendance of about 7k (estimated concert set-up capacity), both the Lansdowne and 3rd Avenue parking garages are full, and so is Bank, cars then spill over to residential streets. Can't imagine how bad it gets when the Red Blacks play in front of 24k.

[J.OT13]

Originally Posted by originalmuffins

I think the difference is that the appetite and view restrictions make it so Richmond is viable to incorporate those towers. Bank is more central and it would be harder to implement those especially without LRT (which Richmond also will have access to 3 stations - which is where a lot of the height is proposed). Richmond has to increase the density and incorporate ground retail near the station. That's the best way to improve Richmond at it's current state (and Carling too for that matter - which will also need either BRT or a tramway via QED like many of us talked about).


Although I do agree with the current proposal with Lansdowne 2.0. That density is much needed for that area which can help push through better transit options for that area.

They could build density along Richmond while preserving the human-scale main street character by proposing mid-rises similar to what Minto built in the Glebe. They can be taller (12 floor range) based on the transit justification while keeping a 2 to 4 floor retail front that's 10-20 meters deep.

Carling has nothing worth preserving, so I don't mind it developers go nuts.

Originally Posted by lrt's friend

The problem with Richmond Road is that the Confederation Line is close but still does not effectively serve the traditional retail strip in Westboro. It is just far enough away to dissuade most pedestrians.

We cannot make the same mistake on Bank Street. QED is residential and park and just intersects Bank Street. We need frequent transit that serves our retail streets without significant walks. We have to stop saying that a 500 m walk is close enough for a transit rider while most are used to a 50 m walk when using a car.

We also have to understand that for transit to succeed, we need to attract people to those retail streets from elsewhere, not to expect a few hundred locals in towers to meet the requirements of higher order transit. Yes, it helps but our overall transit network needs improvement to allow more people to choose transit for more trips. I don't see anybody making bold proposals to allow this to happen.

I was of a similar opinion before however, the beauty of having the line a few blocks north along Scott is that Scott can be redeveloped into a high-rise corridor along the O-Train while preserving the traditional streetcar suburb feel of Wellington West and Richmond (though I don't think the City's going for that with block-busters going up all along those streets, unfortunately).

Originally Posted by Uhuniau

Overhead WIRES?!?!! (Faints in Ancient Glebish)

Too bad the street was rebuilt about a decade before the City realized that burying hydro wires is the logical thing to do for added space and increment weather protection.

Originally Posted by ponyboycurtis

I'm really going to miss when they tear down these walkups on the north side. Spacing and practicality aside these things kick the ass out of the steps on the south. Perhaps most importantly I have so many childhood memories of these walkups with the Roughriders.

The steel beams and roof overhang and ground floor mezzanine are pretty awesome as well. Upper tier and all the washrooms are pretty bad.

Some of the other areas of the north side are pretty interesting as well if you are into weird concretey structures.

Anyhow, point of the matter here. I really like the small shops that are attached to the north side redo/renovation.

I love the low covered ceilings and perpendicular signs.

Compared to this.

I love Lansdowne regardless. Pretty much every aspect of it. But I would love to have seen more of it developed like the first set of photos. That is also the part slated for redevelopment. Perhaps I just don't understand anything about our current world.

Losing the Civic Centre for me is the saddest part. So much history, from Pierre Trudeau's rise to Party Leader (and PM), to the return of the Sens, SOS Montfort and so much more. Such a unique structure. Alas, I can understand why this needs to be done. The bowl is quite awkward with the low-ceiling on one side. The roof can no longer hold a jumbotron (from what I understand) and the miss-matched North and South stands seem strange.

That said, I have serious questions about Lansdowne 2.0 and the proposed layouts of the new facilities. I don't think we should blindly give OSEG a cheque for $300 million+.

[lrt's friend]

Originally Posted by J.OT13

Too bad the street was rebuilt about a decade before the City realized that burying hydro wires is the logical thing to do for added space and increment weather protection.

A symptom of Ottawa being a 'Tim Bits' city. They have flip-flopped over the years concerning burying wires. The buried the wires on Bank Street in Old Ottawa South before they rebuilt Bank Street in the Glebe. They simply cheaped out on a project that will likely last 50 years. A lost opportunity to properly improve an already successful retail street that would be so much better without the visual pollution of wires and poles blocking critical sidewalk space. Bank Street in the Glebe is too busy looking because the hydro poles were left in place.

[ponyboycurtis]

Originally Posted by lrt's friend

A symptom of Ottawa being a 'Tim Bits' city. They have flip-flopped over the years concerning burying wires. The buried the wires on Bank Street in Old Ottawa South before they rebuilt Bank Street in the Glebe. They simply cheaped out on a project that will likely last 50 years. A lost opportunity to properly improve an already successful retail street that would be so much better without the visual pollution of wires and poles blocking critical sidewalk space. Bank Street in the Glebe is too busy looking because the hydro poles were left in place.

Poles blocking critical sidewalk space. Boy oh boy tell me about it. I enjoy walking the length of Bank st. but the Glebe portion sidewalks are narrow to begin with and once you toss in all the poles, garbage cans and bike lockups two people walking by each other takes a certain amount of care and attention.

[J.OT13]

Sorry if I've asked this before, but what's the bike parking situation at Lansdowne?

[phil235]

Originally Posted by J.OT13

Sorry if I've asked this before, but what's the bike parking situation at Lansdowne?

Lots of small racks scattered around, but no large bike parking area, except during events.

[J.OT13]

Originally Posted by phil235

Lots of small racks scattered around, but no large bike parking area, except during events.

Considering the robust bike network around Lansdowne, you would think they would have provide far better bike infrastructure at the site. Very disappointing. Sounds almost as bad as Dow's Lake.

[phil235]

Originally Posted by J.OT13

Considering the robust bike network around Lansdowne, you would think they would have provide far better bike infrastructure at the site. Very disappointing. Sounds almost as bad as Dow's Lake.

Same. I don’t generally have a lot of trouble finding a spot most of the time, but the racks tend to fill up during busy times. Secure parking would be an easy way to increase modal share.

[J.OT13]

Cross-post.

Due to the World Curling Championships to be held at the Civic Centre at Lansdowne, the 67s may play their first round of the playoffs at Slush Puppie. Only missing piece is the OHL's approval.

This is said to be an interesting opportunity for the team and fans to experience a new, right-sized CHL rink as they look to the future replacement of the Civic Centre.

Les 67’s commenceront leurs séries à... Gatineau

JEAN-FRANÇOIS PLANTE
Le Droit, 16 janvier, 2023

Il y aura du hockey des séries éliminatoires de la Ligue de l’Ontario (OHL) à Gatineau ce printemps si tout se passe comme prévu.

La tenue du Championnat mondial de curling au 1er au 9 avril prochain va forcer les 67’s d’Ottawa à sortir de la Place TD entre le 30 mars et le 11 avril alors qu’ils devraient normalement y disputer leur première ronde éliminatoire.

Les meilleures nations du curling devaient s’arrêter à Ottawa en 2021, mais en raison de la COVID, le championnat a été repoussé de deux ans.


Pour l’équipe de tête de la OHL, l’option numéro un est le Centre Slush Puppie (CSP) de Gatineau depuis le début. Toutes les ententes de location ont déjà été ficelées avec la Ville de Gatineau et le club des Olympiques.

Il ne reste que la OHL à donner son aval à ce transfert temporaire. Il s’agirait d’une formalité.

Sans domicile fixe, les 67’s pourraient toujours se tourner vers le Centre Canadian Tire (CCT) de Kanata, mais l’amphithéâtre n’est pas facile à louer en raison de l’incertitude des dates de spectacles qui y sont prévus. Le CCT a notamment bloqué certaines dates en fonction d’imprévus.

«Notre option préférée est le Centre Slush Puppie, signale le directeur général des 67’s, James Boyd. L’amphithéâtre est neuf. Il est de taille parfaite. Nous avons déjà agencé nos dates des séries avec l’horaire des Olympiques. Il devrait y avoir du hockey chaque jour à Gatineau pendant le premier tour des séries de la OHL et de la LHJMQ.»

James Boyd aime aussi le fait que le CSP possède trois patinoires communautaires pour permettre à son club de s’installer confortablement pendant une dizaine de jours pour y tenir ses entraînements au même endroit.

Afin de rester en Ontario, l’option d’aller jouer à l’Académie canadienne internationale de hockey à Rockland n’a jamais été considérée pour la simple raison que des matches peuvent être joués uniquement dans des amphithéâtres de la Ligue canadienne de hockey ou de la LNH.

Les détenteurs d’abonnements saisonniers ont été avertis par correspondance de la non disponibilité de la Place TD durant la première ronde des séries de la OHL. Ils vont bientôt apprendre qu’ils devront traverser un pont pour aller voir deux à quatre matches (si nécessaire) de leur équipe préférée durant cette première ronde.

Les 67’s pourront reprendre leur domicile au deuxième tour des séries.

«Nous attendons l’approbation de la OHL depuis un bon bout de temps déjà. Nos officiels mineurs sont au courant du déplacement à Gatineau puisqu’ils doivent s’assurer de maîtriser les équipements nécessaires comme les différents systèmes de révision vidéo», a ajouté James Boyd.

Un avant-goût de l’avenir

Pour le directeur général des 67’s, les partisans pourraient profiter de cette «éviction» forcée pour aller visiter le Centre Slush Puppie, un édifice flambant neuf.

«C’est un amphithéâtre facile d’accès pour nos partisans. Notre plan est d’avoir un édifice similaire dans les prochaines années. Je ne sais pas combien de nos partisans ont vu le Centre Slush Puppie, mais je suis convaincu qu’ils seront impressionnés de voir ce qui les attend prochainement. Ça va aussi renforcer notre partenariat avec les Olympiques. Louis Robitaille a été d’une grande aide pour faciliter notre déménagement temporaire. Peut-être que nous gagnerons quelques partisans qui voudront suivre le reste de nos propres séries 2023 si nous gagnons cette première ronde. On n’est jamais trop prudent», explique celui qui se trouve à la tête d’une équipe qui a gagné 30 de ses 39 premiers matches de la saison.

Les 67’s pourront terminer leur saison régulière à la Place TD. Leurs deux derniers matches à domicile sont prévus pour les 24 et 25 mars contre Peterborough et Barrie.

Chanceux dans leur malchance, les 67’s ont évité le pire. Le Championnat mondial de curling aurait pu être présenté durant la deuxième ronde, la demi-finale ou même la finale de la OHL.

«Traditionnellement, dans les marchés la OHL, les partisans ne se bousculent pas aux portes des amphithéâtres durant la première ronde des séries. C’est à partir de la deuxième ronde qu’il commence à y avoir de bonnes affluences aux matches», raconte James Boyd.

Propriétaire des 67’s, le Ottawa Sports and Entertainment Group (OSEG) aura de la difficulté à faire ses frais durant cette première ronde éliminatoire à Gatineau, mais la location de la Place TD pour le Championnat mondial de curling va lui permettre de largement récupérer sa mise avec cet événement d’envergure.

https://www.ledroit.com/2023/01/16/les-6...atineau-652335b5856bb22ead6de67134c5423a

[Ottawacurious]

There will be a discussion organized by 'parkways for people' about the future of Lansdowne (phase II). Sean Menard is promoting the event. They are more-or-less saying since the city hasn't done the consultations yet, they will kick-start it.

https://www.eventbrite.ca/e/the-future-o...to-share-your-views-tickets-505725387247

Bring popcorn. Might be entertaining.