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  #16561  
Old Posted Jul 21, 2022, 8:48 PM
wabooba wabooba is offline
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Originally Posted by Calfan12 View Post
Yes & it's not just WestJet Calgary YYC- Nashville BNA flights that draw some connectiing passengers from Vancouver YVR, Western Canada. A lot WS flights at YYC does including even WestJet's new summer seasonal 3x weekly YYC - Boston BOS which started up end of June 2022 draws from YVR too.
IMHO, a fair percentage of Westjet pax, especially for Europe, plus of course US destinations, are drawn from Vancouver.
They probably constitute a large wedge of the pie for many Westjet routes that YYC alone could not support.
     
     
  #16562  
Old Posted Jul 22, 2022, 9:59 PM
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^ agreed and the Westjet effect creating an increasing barrier to entry for other carriers there.

Meanwhile JAL increasing YVR to daily in October

https://aeroroutes.com/eng/220722-jloct22yvr

JL018 NRT1830 – 1140YVR 767 D
JL017 YVR1345 – 1630+1NRT 767 D
     
     
  #16563  
Old Posted Jul 23, 2022, 7:05 AM
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Originally Posted by wabooba View Post
IMHO, a fair percentage of Westjet pax, especially for Europe, plus of course US destinations, are drawn from Vancouver.
They probably constitute a large wedge of the pie for many Westjet routes that YYC alone could not support.
Yep true & WestJet is making it tough on AC/ other Airlines at YYC.

Looks like Air Canada (AC) is adding a 3rd daily flight on the Vancouver YVR - Fort St John YXJ route from August 1 2022, as currently YVR - YXJ is 2x daily.

AC has cut the YYC- YXJ 1x daily flights from July 31, after operating it for few months since May 1.

But Calgary YYC - Fort St John YXJ will still be operated by WestJet 2x daily which they have a stronghold on that route at YYC & 1 of the reasons why AC cut it.

Last edited by Calfan12; Jul 25, 2022 at 6:33 AM.
     
     
  #16564  
Old Posted Jul 23, 2022, 2:12 PM
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AC's regional network at YYC was on borrowed time the minute WS launched Encore and Link. When WS only had 737s, AC could use Jazz all over small routes. But WS has been pushing AC further and further from their peak, and I predict more Jazz routes will be either cut or reduced frequency. Not that there's much left to cut; within AB, it's just YEG, YMM, and YQU. I could see YQU being surrendered to WS eventually. I think YMM will stay because AC wants the connecting pax.

I wonder if there's been any customer backlash to AC cutting frequencies but upgauging the former DH1 and DH3 routes to DH4 (a big capacity increase). But it has definitely meant frequency reductions (ie. from 3x daily to 2x daily, from 8x daily to 5x daily), even if overall capacity has grown or stayed the same. Those lost departure times were pretty significant to connecting pax. We're seeing the early morning and late evening departures stay, and the middle flights getting axed. I know those midday ones were popular with connecting pax, so AC assumably saw a huge reduction in connecting pax using these, otherise they would have kept them and axed a late night flight. Certainly no route is more victim of the move to all DH4 than YYJ-YVR. Used to be like 18x daily, but on DH1 and some DH3. Now it's like under 10 always. But larger planes. So maybe its a wash? But I liked the frequency you could get with DH1s, but now airlines are going more towards larger RJs and 70+ seat props. And WS can only do better with Link, but those are even smaller than the DH1 that AC used to fly. Surprised to see the 50-seat market collapse, those are getting turfed by tons of North American carriers in favour of the CR-900 and the like.
     
     
  #16565  
Old Posted Jul 23, 2022, 3:20 PM
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Grateful for AC twice daily service from YCG to YVR and 4 weekly to YYC on q400s.
And you're right we have morning and evening service and lost our mid day flight.
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  #16566  
Old Posted Jul 23, 2022, 6:45 PM
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Originally Posted by Denscity View Post
Grateful for AC twice daily service from YCG to YVR and 4 weekly to YYC on q400s.
And you're right we have morning and evening service and lost our mid day flight.
The morning flight connect with morning arrivals bank into YVR from Australia/HK, and connect with mid-day international departure bank. The evening flight connect with mid-day arrival bank and late night departure bank, as well as the second-daily flight to LHR.

So as far as international travel concern, those 2 flights will connect to almost everything. This is probably all AC need to make YVR connection on international routes:

Arrival: 12pm, 9pm
Departure: 9am, 2pm
     
     
  #16567  
Old Posted Jul 26, 2022, 12:28 PM
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EVA’s turn to increase flights on a mix of 787-9s and 787-10s

https://aeroroutes.com/eng/220726-braug22ca

Taipei Taoyuan – Vancouver 20AUG22 – 10SEP22 Increase from 4 to 5 weekly
BR010 TPE2355 – 2000YVR 789 357
BR010 TPE2355 – 2000YVR 781 16

BR009 YVR0200 – 0440+1TPE 789 146
BR009 YVR0200 – 0440+1TPE 781 27
     
     
  #16568  
Old Posted Jul 26, 2022, 12:49 PM
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Originally Posted by Johnny Aussie View Post
EVA’s turn to increase flights on a mix of 787-9s and 787-10s

https://aeroroutes.com/eng/220726-braug22ca

Taipei Taoyuan – Vancouver 20AUG22 – 10SEP22 Increase from 4 to 5 weekly
BR010 TPE2355 – 2000YVR 789 357
BR010 TPE2355 – 2000YVR 781 16

BR009 YVR0200 – 0440+1TPE 789 146
BR009 YVR0200 – 0440+1TPE 781 27
Great for Vancouver & EVA is increasing Taipei TPE - Toronto YYZ from 2 to 3x weekly from Late August- Early September 2022 also too.
     
     
  #16569  
Old Posted Jul 26, 2022, 1:32 PM
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Vancouver YVR will be busy to end July 2022.

Nearly 70,000 daily passengers expected this week at Vancouver International Airport.This week’s daily passenger volumes at Vancouver International Airport (YVR) will be the busiest since the pandemic began, closing in on normal volumes.

In a bulletin today advising travellers to arrive early as a precaution, YVR says it will see an average of about 67,000 passengers per day between July 25 and August 31 for a total of 467,500 passengers this week alone.

There were 69,560 passengers yesterday (Sunday), and the forecast calls for 66,198 passengers today (Monday), 65,860 passengers tomorrow (Tuesday), 66,162 passengers Wednesday, 67,544 passengers Thursday, 66,586 passengers Friday, and 65,590 passengers Saturday.

https://dailyhive.com/vancouver/vancouver-international-airport-yvr-july-2022-statistics
     
     
  #16570  
Old Posted Jul 26, 2022, 8:13 PM
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Originally Posted by zahav View Post
AC's regional network at YYC was on borrowed time the minute WS launched Encore and Link. When WS only had 737s, AC could use Jazz all over small routes. But WS has been pushing AC further and further from their peak, and I predict more Jazz routes will be either cut or reduced frequency. Not that there's much left to cut; within AB, it's just YEG, YMM, and YQU. I could see YQU being surrendered to WS eventually. I think YMM will stay because AC wants the connecting pax.

I wonder if there's been any customer backlash to AC cutting frequencies but upgauging the former DH1 and DH3 routes to DH4 (a big capacity increase). But it has definitely meant frequency reductions (ie. from 3x daily to 2x daily, from 8x daily to 5x daily), even if overall capacity has grown or stayed the same. Those lost departure times were pretty significant to connecting pax. We're seeing the early morning and late evening departures stay, and the middle flights getting axed. I know those midday ones were popular with connecting pax, so AC assumably saw a huge reduction in connecting pax using these, otherise they would have kept them and axed a late night flight. Certainly no route is more victim of the move to all DH4 than YYJ-YVR. Used to be like 18x daily, but on DH1 and some DH3. Now it's like under 10 always. But larger planes. So maybe its a wash? But I liked the frequency you could get with DH1s, but now airlines are going more towards larger RJs and 70+ seat props. And WS can only do better with Link, but those are even smaller than the DH1 that AC used to fly. Surprised to see the 50-seat market collapse, those are getting turfed by tons of North American carriers in favour of the CR-900 and the like.
In no rational world does YVR-YYJ need 18 flights a day. Any civil servant/businss person would take Helijet or Harbour Air if they really wanted to be in either place at such a specific time. The bulk are likely connecting to an AC mainline flight and won't really care if they have to be at the airport at 13:00 or 14:00.
     
     
  #16571  
Old Posted Jul 26, 2022, 10:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Calfan12 View Post
Great for Vancouver & EVA is increasing Taipei TPE - Toronto YYZ from 2 to 3x weekly from Late August- Early September 2022 also too.
So?

The YYZ part is included in the link I posted. No need to highlight the YYZ part in the YVR thread.
     
     
  #16572  
Old Posted Jul 26, 2022, 10:15 PM
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Originally Posted by whatnext View Post
In no rational world does YVR-YYJ need 18 flights a day. Any civil servant/businss person would take Helijet or Harbour Air if they really wanted to be in either place at such a specific time. The bulk are likely connecting to an AC mainline flight and won't really care if they have to be at the airport at 13:00 or 14:00.
That's assuming you coming from Vancouver. If someone from Penticton, Castlegar, Smithers, or even Kamloops, then connecting to the YYJ flight at YVR with AC (or WS) would be your only choice regardless of what type of traveler you are.
     
     
  #16573  
Old Posted Jul 27, 2022, 12:08 AM
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That's assuming you coming from Vancouver. If someone from Penticton, Castlegar, Smithers, or even Kamloops, then connecting to the YYJ flight at YVR with AC (or WS) would be your only choice regardless of what type of traveler you are.
With 8 daily flights they are spread out quite well for decent connections to/from YVR’s AC network.
Looking at AC’s updated schedules in the region what’s even more remarkable is YYC-YEG down to only 6 daily flights.

Noticed one of AC’s daily flights to YOW now a 789. Wow
With the August changes AC will still have 10 daily widebodies on the YVR transcons (7 YYZ / 2 YUL / 1 YOW)
     
     
  #16574  
Old Posted Jul 27, 2022, 4:05 AM
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Air Canada upgauging YVR-ORD to a 321 for a limited period

https://aeroroutes.com/eng/220727-acsep22ord

Vancouver – Chicago O’Hare 14SEP22 – 29OCT22 A321 replaces A320, 1 daily (YVR departure with A321 from 15SEP22, ORD departure from 14SEP22)

AC1048 YVR0915 – 1521ORD 321 D
AC1049 ORD1820 – 2044YVR 321 D
     
     
  #16575  
Old Posted Jul 28, 2022, 10:59 PM
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Flair-BUR to LAX by freerealms454, on Flickr

Flair changing Los Angeles service from BUR to LAX starting October 31; 4x weekly.
Flair upping frequency to Puerto Vallarta to 4x weekly
Flair upping frequency to Los Cabos to 3x weekly
     
     
  #16576  
Old Posted Jul 29, 2022, 12:03 AM
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Looks like BUR will be losing all their international service. Wonder if they will actively pursuing AC or WS to get their international service back
     
     
  #16577  
Old Posted Jul 29, 2022, 10:41 PM
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Do your transborder redeyes have preclearance now or still no?

Quote:
Originally Posted by zahav View Post
but now airlines are going more towards larger RJs and 70+ seat props.
AC made a massive shift at YYC this summer on May 1, the biggest single day equipment change we've ever seen from them with YQR, YLW, and YXE all swapping to all-RJ from all-Q. I know a few business fliers in both YQR and YLW that regularly connect in YYC and have switched back to AC for jet service.

This was simply a shift of the RJ out west and the Q to the east as opposed to them actually acquiring more RJ, but we're not quite sure why the shift in RJ strategy to focus them in the west.
     
     
  #16578  
Old Posted Jul 30, 2022, 5:28 AM
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China Airlines Taipei Taoyuan – Vancouver eff 01OCT22 Increase from 3 to 4 weekly, A350-900XWB
https://aeroroutes.com/eng/220729-ci4q22na

Also it looks like Air India Delhi to Vancouver YVR route is increasing frequencies from 3 to 7 weekly September 1-October 30.
     
     
  #16579  
Old Posted Jul 30, 2022, 6:58 AM
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Do your transborder redeyes have preclearance now or still no?
US customs is 4:30 AM to 8:30 PM. Outside of those times flights to the US go out of the international terminal.
     
     
  #16580  
Old Posted Jul 30, 2022, 3:34 PM
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I agree with all of you actually, the Jazz frequencies were kind of ridiculous for routes like YYJ before. I'm sure the choice was appeciated by people on the island and business, but it was overkill and probably a $ loser. As people have said, the target market on those flights is connecting pax, and the frequency was way higher than it needed to be to accomodate these flights.

As for smaller routes, the difference between 1 and 2 daily flights, or 2 and 3 daily flights, is fairly significant. It really can change plans and connections drastically. 18 down to 9 or 10 is still providing a lot of connectivity. But 1 or 2 really limits it. So capacity is higher due to the DH4s, but losing a frequency would be annoying on those routes. But if the routes are strong enough, AC will add frequency for sure. They aren't out of the loop, they constantly adjust their regional schedules. I think a lot of the reduction was COVID related, so once we are back to normal traffic, they could add back some frequencies. The 2 down to 1 daily is really brutal though, 2 should be the minimum frequency for any regional route, IMO. A morning and evening is the minimum, otherwise the flights are useless (or very inconvenient) to a ton of travellers. I'm thinking of YZF, YYD, and YZP. These should all be at least 2 daily, I hope they bump them up again.

AC is really hammering YYC, the YYC-YEG flights were frequent up until COVID, despite the competition from WS. They have really done a thorough analysis of their routes and made it clear which ones were going to get trimmed. I don't feel like they are even fighting for it anymore. Basically just either keeping the status quo or reducing, to keep WS honest I guess.

I feel like YVR is really an anomoly amonest the largest Canadian airports (YYZ, YVR, YUL, and YYC) in terms of it's split amongst WS and WS and general traveller preference. YYZ is dominated by AC, YYC is dominated by WS, and YUL has a strong (but not dominant) AC, but almost no WS. YVR has very strong AC and WS (AC obv more just due to their network reach), but WS is very popular from YVR and an important market. Just judging from people's preferences, I feel like Vancouver peeps are split between preferring WS or AC. But YYC is overwhelmingly WS, and YYZ is certainly more in the AC campe than WS, and at YUL, WS isn't a factor. Kind of reminds me of LAX. Their airline split is fascinating to me. They are then only airline to be a true hub for every major US airline. And the split between airlines is breathtakingly close:

1 Delta Air Lines 5,113,928 20.85%
2 American Airlines 4,430,550 18.06%
3 United Airlines 4,040,619 16.47%
4 Southwest Airlines 2,506,337 10.22%
5 Alaska Airlines 1,870,460 7.63%
(wikipedia https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Los_Angeles_International_Airport#cite_note-165 )

Those carriers are very close to each other, with none being overly dominant. For large airports, this is rare. Having all the major carriers compete on many routes is not common, it's a testament to it's traffic draw and diversity.

While YVR isn't in the same league as LAX by any means, I feel like it is very diverse and both AC and WS have strong pressence, plus lots of international carriers. YYZ is similar to a degree, but I'd argue their AC service really dominates, despite WS having a decent showing. AC is still very clearly dominant to a higher degree than YVR.

YUL is diverse in that it has strong AC and strong international carriers, but has nothing from WS. YYC is the only one of the 4 that are really in fortress hub territory. WS's dominance is supreme, it's taken AC on at every turn, with their European expansion taking away any sector dominance AC might have had. AC is likely not going to fight anymore on these, they will operate them as long as they make money (and more than what could be made elsewhere) but probably aren't putting any more in. But who knows, AC could surprise everyone and start basing more planes at YYC and launch routes again, if oil stays high and the $$$ flows like it's 2007, then they might. But all indications are they are dialing back YYC service.

YVR is definitely hustling right now, and attracting more routes and new airlines than would be expected during "recessionary" times. Let's hope the traffic pans out and they stick, but it is a boost of confidnce to see foreign carriers and AC launch new and exciting routes, they obviously chose them for an educated reason and not just rock paper scissors. The math behind the scenes must be positive
     
     
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