PHILADELPHIA | Lowrise/General Developments Thread

[summersm343]

Pennsylvania DEP awards $575K for Delaware River projects including Chester trail, floating Schuylkill lab

The Pennsylvania Department of Environmental Protection announced $574,974 in funding Wednesday for 12 projects aimed at protecting parts of the Delaware River coastal zone.

Additionally, a $50,000 grant would go to John Bartram Association to support education staff at a FloatLab at Bartram’s Garden in Philadelphia that’s expected to open by 2023.

The FloatLab would extend over the river and feature a sloped platform that “allows visitors to engage directly with the river at eye level.” It would be supported on eight ballast chambers below the ring-shaped walking surface, allowing it to stay level as the tide moves in and out.

Other projects receiving funding within the zone lie in Philadelphia, Bucks, and Delaware Counties. They include:

-$75,000 to Fairmount Park Conservancy for a landscape architect to create a restoration plan for Pattison Lagoon in Philadelphia’s FDR Park.

Read more here:
https://www-inquirer-com.cdn.ampproject....re-river-estuary-watershed-20220105.html

[summersm343]

Permits Issued For 23-Unit Building At 3424 North 17th Street In Nicetown-Tioga

Current site:

Permits have been issued for the construction of a five-story, 23-unit mixed-use building at 3424 North 17th Street in Nicetown-Tioga, North Philadelphia. The development will rise on the west side of the block between Ontario and West Tioga streets. The structure will span a 7,798-square-foot footprint and will hold 23,964 square feet of floor space, which will include ground-floor commercial space. Residences will be located on floors two through five. The project will offer parking for six cars and seven bicycles. Permits list Scott Woodruff of Designblendz as the design professional and Backcourt Builders LLC as the contractor. Construction costs are specified at $3 million.

Despite its dreary present condition, the block, as well as the neighborhood as a whole, may be at the precipice of major positive change. First, the foundations for incoming development are all there, with ample construction-ready land, a solid volume of occupied housing stock (which ensures that the neighborhood does not feel desolate), proximity to Temple University Hospital (situated around five blocks to the east of the proposal site at 3424 North 17th Street), and mass transit adjacency (the Allegheny and Erie stations on the Broad Street Line may both be reached within a ten-minute walk of the proposal site).

Although Nicetown-Tioga is yet to see any notable volume of new development, there are signs that revival is already at hand. Over the past few years, the eight-story Art Deco building, which sat abandoned for years at 1700 West Tioga Street at the north end of the 3400 block, was renovated into Tioga Luxury Apartments by Lofts 1700 West Tioga LLC.:

1700 W. Tioga Street in the past:


1700 W. Tioga Street after renovations:


Read/view more here:
https://phillyyimby.com/2022/01/permits-...n-nicetown-tioga-north-philadelphia.html

[summersm343]

Permits Issued For 12-Unit Building At 4140 West Girard Avenue In East Parkside

Current site:

Permits have been issued for the construction of a four-story, 12-unit mixed-use building at 4140 West Girard Avenue in East Parkside, West Philadelphia. The structure will be located on the south side of the block between North 41st and North 42nd streets and will span a 2,600-square-foot footprint. The proposed 9,800 square feet of floor space translate into n average of just over 800 square feet per typical unit. The development will feature full sprinkling and a roof deck, which, due to the building’s future prominence, promises to offer sweeping skyline views. Permits list Francesco Zampetti as the design professional and Eugene Naydovich of Fitler Development as the contractor. The total construction cost is specified at $200,000, an oddly low figure for this relatively sizable development.

Read/view more here:
https://phillyyimby.com/2022/01/permits-...-in-east-parkside-west-philadelphia.html

[summersm343]

4.0 University Place - 41st & Market

Sorry for the small images, clipped from the State of University City 2022 Report:


Screen Shot 2022-01-06 at 1.37.19 PM by Mr. Summers, on Flickr


Screen Shot 2022-01-06 at 1.37.29 PM by Mr. Summers, on Flickr

State of University City 2022 Report:
https://issuu.com/universitycity/docs/the_state_of_university_city_2022

[summersm343]

Philly Water Department gets $3 million to build floating classroom on Schuylkill at Fairmount Dam

The Philadelphia Water Department says it recently received a $3 million grant to help build a 5,400-square-foot “Floating Water Workshop” on the Schuylkill River just south of Fairmount Water Works.

Officials said the grant, awarded in December, would help fund the workshop designed by Victoria Prizzia of Habithéque, Inc. that would serve as a “learning laboratory of hands-on STEAM-based (science, technology, engineering, art, and math) engagement for people of all ages using current environmental education strategies, technology, and creativity.” The floating workshop would connect to the east bank and Schuylkill River Trail via two gangways.

Officials said the demand for such programs is evidenced by those already in place that are at capacity at the Fairmount Water Works Interpretive Center.

Though the space would house reserved programs for students and adults, it would be open to the public for walk-on visits. Special performances and events are planned.

Read/view more here:
https://www.inquirer.com/science/climate/schulykill-floating-water-workshop-grant-20220106.html

[TempleGuy1000]

Originally Posted by Justin7

I think that is very much up for debate. If these brands believe the region can support one location, but not two, it follows that if not for KoP these stores would in fact likely be on Walnut (or somewhere in Rittenhouse). I personally believe KoP is a huge drain on the city.

It's absolutely up for debate. It's literally just a mall that could have been positioned anywhere.

The "Tyson's Corner" edge city dream that some people have is wildly out of touch with reality. We will never see the GDP growth rates the DC area saw as the Federal government grew over the last few decades that has enabled the massive growth of the NOVA area. If one area, like KOP, did grow that much, it's coming directly at the expense of other areas like University City or the Navy Yard (none the less the countless classical towns that need a shot of economic revitalization).

What we are talking about is an above average Simon mall, off the side of an interstate that has a business park attached to the backside of it and a casino / faux 'urban living' promenade across the other sides of the interstate.

I just want to point out how ridiculous the proposed stops are....

First Stop on the rail way to no where: Hederson Rd. Between Deklab Pike and I-276, currently nothing to walk to: https://www.google.com/maps/@40.0908351,...dIBPLZGhs7AD7LorpukDA!2e0!7i16384!8i8192

Second stop on the rail way to no where: Allendale Road, the service road for the mall parking lot (it's ironic this is where Cunningham's Piano is, considering they have closed every one of their stores in the city, a sign of more to come?): https://www.google.com/maps/@40.0911385,...itch%3D0%26thumbfov%3D100!7i16384!8i8192

Third Stop on the rail way to no where: Mall Blvd and Goddard Blvd (yes 40% of the proposed new stops are literally in the mall parking lot): https://www.google.com/maps/@40.0904436,...uvzB1Aq6AzwMBB9DpL7Ig!2e0!7i16384!8i8192

Fourth Stop: American and 1st: A suburban strip mall and a motel: https://www.google.com/maps/@40.0957786,...itch%3D0%26thumbfov%3D100!7i16384!8i8192

5th stop: An exburb office park with large parking lots, buildings set back a quarter mile from the road, and no sidewalks, it's also a planned park and ride to go the other direction: https://www.google.com/maps/@40.0951633,...itch%3D0%26thumbfov%3D100!7i13312!8i6656

The KOP Rail twitter account tweeted yesterday:

#KOPRail will make KOP Rail-accessible jobs attractive to young professionals and commuters who live a multimodal lifestyle.

https://twitter.com/KOPRail/status/1478720481477988354

Imagine living in Center City, catching the filthy MFL (it's been in rough shape the last month or so, SEPTA seems to either not care or have no budget to do anything), taking it to 69th street station (not a comfortable place to be for those who aren't use to it), waiting for the next "KOP" specific NHSL (sorry Bridgeport, you didn't make the cut for a revival), and taking the train to a parking lot where in most cases you probably will need to take another shuttle or bus to your job. "Young professionals" are going to do that one time, feel like the world's biggest idiot standing on the side of highways, and decide to never take it again. SEPTA seems to know this already because their ridership projections (7,500 riders) is absolutely pathetic. I would be damn curious to examine the cost per rider estimations for other projects of similar scale around the country. I have feeling this would easily be near the top.

If you really read their project plan more closely too, they expect a lot of the riders to be mall workers. They have a whole section on their site titled "Will the extension cause litter and crime?". Talk about some "coded language". And let's be real, those paragraphs represent more of a concern for "the community" than I have ever seen SEPTA make towards the city. Why? Because SEPTA is almost completely ran by Montgomery County officials. Leslie Richards is looking out for her own.

So if you own property around the Mall or already a resident of the area, I'm sure you feel like you are personally gaining something. For the rest of the 5.5 million people in the Philadelphia area that don't go that way very often too bad, SEPTA's "broke" and won't increase or improve service.

Sorry for the rant but it's definitely a topic that gets me going. I think what bothers me most, and why I have been so critical of Philadelphia area officials lately, is it seems every other city in America is actually wising up. Ditching inclusionary zoning, looking to create visionary rail lines like the Interborough Express, or like DC, increasing the metro frequency to make riding easier. Philadelphia, in typical fashion, seems to be a decade late and a billion dollars short.

[PHLtoNYC]

Originally Posted by summersm343

I'm sorry.... what? King of Prussia mall won't exist 19 years from now? Lol.

How does KOP Mall not serve the same purpose as other big malls? What exactly do you mean by that? King of Prussia Mall is literally one of the largest, most visited and most successful malls in the entire country. I'm not sure how you think that's going to evaporate in 19 years. Everything I'm seeing is that KOP Mall is only solidifying it's dominance.... not dying.

https://www.cnbc.com/2020/07/03/the-10-m...ica-before-the-coronavirus-pandemic.html
https://www.travelchannel.com/interests/shopping/articles/top-10-us-shopping-malls
https://www.statista.com/statistics/741804/leading-us-malls-by-sales-per-square-foot/

I get that you guys are urbanists and want what's best for the city... I do too... however, this dream of KOP mall dying and all these stores coming to Center City is never going to happen. We live in a country that favors suburban living over urban living unfortunately. The majority of the wealth in the region is on the Main Line, most of whom would prefer to drive to KOP mall to go shopping than Center City.

Unfortunately, you guys are looking at this the wrong way. Without KOP, most of these stores probably wouldn't be in this region at all at this point. We should be rooting for KOPs continued success, and hope to build up transit options to KOP and continue to let KOP build up and urbanize as a new urban/modern urban satellite city of Philadelphia - think Tyson's Corner.

Then, we have to hope Center City and surrounds continue to build up, and continue to gain desirability amongst the wealthy and tourists and attract some of these stores to open second locations in the region.

I don't see this dynamic between KOP and Center City and how retailers look at the region changing anytime soon - definitely not within the next 19/20 years. We have to hope Center City continues to gain desirability amongst retailers to open their second locations here.

Agreed. And per friends who work for Nordstrom corporate and other high-end retailers, KoP retail outposts are always top 1% of an entire portfolio. The sole lux shopping destination in a region of 6M+ people will not fail for that reason alone. As you said, KoP is at the center of a very affluent densely populated region, and that entire section of Montgomery County is a major employment hub. Plus, Simon's yearly reports place KoP as a premiere property (along with a few other malls).

I would wager Mall of America and American Dream Mall are in danger of closing or restructuring way before KoP (if at all). Mall of America already lost big tenants including most luxury retailers, and is relic of the 90s. American Dream has been a flop since it started (referring to the NJ one), it has gained traction with the theme park offerings, but it's isolated and competing with a saturated retail market.

I also understand we are all urbanists and love the city, but I don't have a disdain for KoP, I think it's fantastic that the Philadelphia region has powerhouse suburban hubs. The mentality shouldn't be Philadelphia vs. the Suburbs, it should be a unified region against New York, DC, Harrisburg, etc. The KoP resentment should be geared toward City Leaders for the consistent a@@ backward approach to simple economics. If Philadelphia suddenly adopted a pro-economic growth strategy I doubt it would affect KoP, but it would certainly poke at the side of DC, Boston, New York, etc. I may be misinterpreting, but it feels like some place blame on KoP for Philadelphia's economic shortcomings, I don't see it like that. But agree to disagree if that is the case.

And I'm in the minority, but I still applaud the KoP Town Center. The infusion of retail, residential, and now office is the best example of modern "instant urbanism" (as Sandy calls it) I have encountered.

*I will add my disclaimer (I always add in City Data). NO, I am NOT saying the KoP Town Center competes with Media, Ardmore, West Chester, etc. I am saying it's a well executed attempt at introducing a downtown to a car-centric suburb and I can understand the desirability for some. My 3 critiques are...

1. Residential should have been constructed above the stores on Main Street, not just surrounding it.

2. Sadly the center is trapped by highways and cannot expand outside of its confines.

3. The proposed Septa route has no stop planned IN the center (not the fault of the center).

However, I agree with the group that Septa can accomplish a lot more IN Philadelphia before focusing on the KoP rail line. And if the rail line must happen, they need to start over.

[PHLtoNYC]

Originally Posted by summersm343

8-Story, 49-Unit Building to Replace St. Laurentius Church in Fishtown

Current view:


Read/view more here:
http://www.rising.realestate/8-story-49-unit-building-to-replace-st-laurentius-church-in-fishtown/

What a sad ending to what could have been a wonderful project...

[TempleGuy1000]

Originally Posted by PHLtoNYC

I also understand we are all urbanists and love the city, but I don't have a disdain for KoP, I think it's fantastic that the Philadelphia region has powerhouse suburban hubs. The mentality shouldn't be Philadelphia vs. the Suburbs, it should be a unified region against New York, DC, Harrisburg, etc. The KoP resentment should be geared toward City Leaders for the consistent a@@ backward approach to simple economics. If Philadelphia suddenly adopted a pro-economic growth strategy I doubt it would affect KoP, but it would certainly poke at the side of DC, Boston, New York, etc. I may be misinterpreting, but it feels like some place blame on KoP for Philadelphia's economic shortcomings, I don't see it like that. But agree to disagree if that is the case.

Growth, especially in a mature economy with a low birth rate, is a finite thing. Businesses have been being lured out to the suburbs from the city for generations, to act as if the growth of KOP hasn't come at the expense of the city or surrounding towns like Norristown is misguided. And yes, other places growing might take away from KOP, but literally who cares? It's a mall.

[iheartphilly]

I would love to see high-end retail shops or a mini-mall get incorporated into the projects at Schulkilly Yards, UCity Square, or the 30th Street Station plan in that general area as it gets built out over time. Something like the mixed-use over the last decade in the development coined as Manhattan West in NYC. With the refresh of the 30th street station, it could be a real destination for travelers and locals.

[mcgrath618]

Originally Posted by iheartphilly

Schulkilly Yards

Best typo this century

[mcgrath618]

Originally Posted by TempleGuy1000

It's absolutely up for debate. It's literally just a mall that could have been positioned anywhere.

The "Tyson's Corner" edge city dream that some people have is wildly out of touch with reality. We will never see the GDP growth rates the DC area saw as the Federal government grew over the last few decades that has enabled the massive growth of the NOVA area. If one area, like KOP, did grow that much, it's coming directly at the expense of other areas like University City or the Navy Yard (none the less the countless classical towns that need a shot of economic revitalization).

What we are talking about is an above average Simon mall, off the side of an interstate that has a business park attached to the backside of it and a casino / faux 'urban living' promenade across the other sides of the interstate.

I just want to point out how ridiculous the proposed stops are....

First Stop on the rail way to no where: Hederson Rd. Between Deklab Pike and I-276, currently nothing to walk to: https://www.google.com/maps/@40.0908351,...dIBPLZGhs7AD7LorpukDA!2e0!7i16384!8i8192

Second stop on the rail way to no where: Allendale Road, the service road for the mall parking lot (it's ironic this is where Cunningham's Piano is, considering they have closed every one of their stores in the city, a sign of more to come?): https://www.google.com/maps/@40.0911385,...itch%3D0%26thumbfov%3D100!7i16384!8i8192

Third Stop on the rail way to no where: Mall Blvd and Goddard Blvd (yes 40% of the proposed new stops are literally in the mall parking lot): https://www.google.com/maps/@40.0904436,...uvzB1Aq6AzwMBB9DpL7Ig!2e0!7i16384!8i8192

Fourth Stop: American and 1st: A suburban strip mall and a motel: https://www.google.com/maps/@40.0957786,...itch%3D0%26thumbfov%3D100!7i16384!8i8192

5th stop: An exburb office park with large parking lots, buildings set back a quarter mile from the road, and no sidewalks, it's also a planned park and ride to go the other direction: https://www.google.com/maps/@40.0951633,...itch%3D0%26thumbfov%3D100!7i13312!8i6656

The KOP Rail twitter account tweeted yesterday:

https://twitter.com/KOPRail/status/1478720481477988354

Imagine living in Center City, catching the filthy MFL (it's been in rough shape the last month or so, SEPTA seems to either not care or have no budget to do anything), taking it to 69th street station (not a comfortable place to be for those who aren't use to it), waiting for the next "KOP" specific NHSL (sorry Bridgeport, you didn't make the cut for a revival), and taking the train to a parking lot where in most cases you probably will need to take another shuttle or bus to your job. "Young professionals" are going to do that one time, feel like the world's biggest idiot standing on the side of highways, and decide to never take it again. SEPTA seems to know this already because their ridership projections (7,500 riders) is absolutely pathetic. I would be damn curious to examine the cost per rider estimations for other projects of similar scale around the country. I have feeling this would easily be near the top.

If you really read their project plan more closely too, they expect a lot of the riders to be mall workers. They have a whole section on their site titled "Will the extension cause litter and crime?". Talk about some "coded language". And let's be real, those paragraphs represent more of a concern for "the community" than I have ever seen SEPTA make towards the city. Why? Because SEPTA is almost completely ran by Montgomery County officials. Leslie Richards is looking out for her own.

So if you own property around the Mall or already a resident of the area, I'm sure you feel like you are personally gaining something. For the rest of the 5.5 million people in the Philadelphia area that don't go that way very often too bad, SEPTA's "broke" and won't increase or improve service.

Sorry for the rant but it's definitely a topic that gets me going. I think what bothers me most, and why I have been so critical of Philadelphia area officials lately, is it seems every other city in America is actually wising up. Ditching inclusionary zoning, looking to create visionary rail lines like the Interborough Express, or like DC, increasing the metro frequency to make riding easier. Philadelphia, in typical fashion, seems to be a decade late and a billion dollars short.

You've summarized my feelings perfectly well.

To be clear though, SEPTA is actually broke, and it's the fault of Harrisburg. They are able to talk about building a project like this because of how the federal government subsidizes these things. They can't get much more money for day-to-day stuff from the feds right now (and certainly not from the state, not for lack of trying), but they can get money for a new project. Rather than apply for one of these TIGER grants for, say, a Navy Yard extension or a Roosevelt Boulevard spur or literally anything else, they chose KOP rail because it seemed like it was most likely to pass under an unfavorable admin (the previous president). I don't know why they haven't just cut their losses at this point, but the project is ill-conceived and has ballooned to over $1B last time I checked.

[summersm343]

Originally Posted by TempleGuy1000

It's absolutely up for debate. It's literally just a mall that could have been positioned anywhere.

The "Tyson's Corner" edge city dream that some people have is wildly out of touch with reality. We will never see the GDP growth rates the DC area saw as the Federal government grew over the last few decades that has enabled the massive growth of the NOVA area. If one area, like KOP, did grow that much, it's coming directly at the expense of other areas like University City or the Navy Yard (none the less the countless classical towns that need a shot of economic revitalization).

What we are talking about is an above average Simon mall, off the side of an interstate that has a business park attached to the backside of it and a casino / faux 'urban living' promenade across the other sides of the interstate.

I just want to point out how ridiculous the proposed stops are....

There's some things in your post I agree with, and some things I disagree with.

You say other areas are thinking big, and Philadelphia isn't, but then in your own post, you display the same short-sighted viewpoint that many people in this region do.

Philadelphia and Montgomery County are the two fastest growing continues in Pennsylvania. We're not talking about some backwater areas here. I'm not saying KOP is going to be EXACTLY like Tyson's Corner, but it could 150% be something akin to that. Why not?? Look at KOP towncenter as an example of what King of Prussia could be. The grow is certainly there that Philadelphia and Mongtomery County can growth side by side and play off of one another. We have to work together as a REGION and stop viewing it as city vs. suburbs.

Top 10 Fastest Growing PA Counties by Number of Residents Added:
Philadelphia (77,791)
Montgomery (56,679)
Chester (35,527)
Lancaster (33,539)
Allegheny (27,230)
Lehigh (25,060)
Cumberland (24,063)
York (21,466)
Bucks (21,289)
Dauphin (18,301)

While I do agree that this isn't the right approach to get transit to KOP, I do believe it needs to happen. If this is the only way to make it happen currently, it is better than nothing honestly. KOP needs transit options if we want it to continue to grow in a more urban way, and not a more car centric way. One or two stops are very clearly meant for the mall which is a HUGE tourist attraction as well. The one stop at First Ave is where the Casino is, there are businesses and hotels there, and there will be a Top Golf there. Upper Merion township and KOP are actually pushing hard to make First Ave more walkable too, and connect it to the KOP Town Center.

Whether you or McGrath or any other KOP haters want to believe it or not, KOP is a HUGE employment hub, third largest in the region after Center City and University City. Furthermore, KOP Mall is a HUGE tourist attraction and one of the biggest and best malls in the United States. Period. Many people from all over the US and international visitors to the region go to KOP Mall. Remember that KOP mall is also a big draw from not just the PA side of the Philly suburbs but also South Jersey, Delaware, the Lehigh Valley, Lancaster/Harrisburg area as well.

Above average Simon Mall? Come on with this nonsense. KOP Mall is the best of the best. The cream of the crop. 20+ million visitors a year. It's a huge draw for the area whether any of you want to believe it or not. It's one of the best shopping destinations in the country, period. There are stores located in KOP mall that are only available in a select few regions across the entirety of America. Bottega Veneta, Christian Louboutin, David Yurman, Fendi, Jimmy Choo, Loro Piana, Neiman Marcus, Oliver Peoples, Salvatore Ferragamo, Scotch & Soda, etc..... these are stores that usually have around no more than 30 stores in the United States, and they chose King of Prussia as one of their stores. KOP Mall is easily one of the top retail destinations in the US. You typically cannot find these brands outside of a select few Metro areas - NYC, LA, Chicago, San Francisco, DC, Philadelphia, Boston, Miami, Las Vegas, Atlanta, Dallas and Houston. THAT'S IT. Again... we should be proud of KOP and thankfully it draws in so many large, unique and luxury brands that we otherwise simply would not have.
https://www.travelchannel.com/interests/shopping/articles/top-10-us-shopping-malls
https://www.listsforall.com/best-malls-i...talk.com/best-shopping-malls-in-america/

[summersm343]

Originally Posted by PHLtoNYC

*I will add my disclaimer (I always add in City Data). NO, I am NOT saying the KoP Town Center competes with Media, Ardmore, West Chester, etc. I am saying it's a well executed attempt at introducing a downtown to a car-centric suburb and I can understand the desirability for some. My 3 critiques are...

1. Residential should have been constructed above the stores on Main Street, not just surrounding it.

2. Sadly the center is trapped by highways and cannot expand outside of its confines.

3. The proposed Septa route has no stop planned IN the center (not the fault of the center).

However, I agree with the group that Septa can accomplish a lot more IN Philadelphia before focusing on the KoP rail line. And if the rail line must happen, they need to start over.

100% yes. KOP adds a new urbanism area that the Philadelphia region is lacking. Most other regions have these new urbanism type of developments now. KOP is really the only one in the Philadelphia region and to a lesser extent Exton as well. I guess we can include Glassboro in South Jersey too. There's nothing wrong with offering something new and different and it could be so much more too.

[summersm343]

Originally Posted by iheartphilly

I would love to see high-end retail shops or a mini-mall get incorporated into the projects at Schulkilly Yards, UCity Square, or the 30th Street Station plan in that general area as it gets built out over time. Something like the mixed-use over the last decade in the development coined as Manhattan West in NYC. With the refresh of the 30th street station, it could be a real destination for travelers and locals.

Not going to happen with uCity Square and at this point, probably not Schuylkill Yards either but I would LOVE for this to be made part of the plans for a potential future 30th Street Station district. Makes a ton of sense.

[3rd&Brown]

There are maybe 3-5 malls in the entire country in KOP's league from a revenue & prestige perspective. Simon knows this which is why it continues to invest in the area.

It's like South Coast Plaza, Ala Moana, KOP, Shops at Bal Habour, Houston Galleria, and that's it, TBH.

There are smaller malls like Short Hills in NJ that have the prestige, but they don't have the sheer size of KOP.

Phipps Plaza in Atlanta used to be in that league IMO but a lot of the luxury flagships have moved to the surrounding complexes. I think this one is called Buckhead Village. It's extremely posh compared to any "lifestyle" center I've seen. It's also more believably new urbanist because on many blocks, there are offices, hotels, and residential right above or nestled among the retail, not just off to the side.

https://www.google.com/maps/@33.8383056,...OhqXjn3ngKQn7L4qD7udg!2e0!7i16384!8i8192

[steve_phl]

Originally Posted by summersm343

The for lease signs - are they for the building or the specific space? Shakespeare Book Co. literally just opened lol. Can't imagine that's struggling. Swarovski not sure - but wouldn't be surprised to see them move to elsewhere on Walnut. Free People though? They're a part of Urban Outfitters and Anthropologie which is headquartered in Philadelphia. Can't imagine it closes - maybe moves?

Walked by Free People today and a sign in the window confirms they are closing 1/15 and moving: “We’ll be opening our new space on Walnut Street summer 2022”.

[PHLtoNYC]

Originally Posted by TempleGuy1000

Growth, especially in a mature economy with a low birth rate, is a finite thing. Businesses have been being lured out to the suburbs from the city for generations, to act as if the growth of KOP hasn't come at the expense of the city or surrounding towns like Norristown is misguided. And yes, other places growing might take away from KOP, but literally who cares? It's a mall.

But why blame the suburbs? Many suburban regions are more strategic with economic friendliness. Philadelphia leaders could do the exact same thing, and I guarantee it would steal way more thunder than currently from cities all over the country, rather than musical chairs with the suburbs.

And Summers already explained in great detail, but I want to emphasize your baseless comment... "literally who cares? It's a mall". Like what?! Upper Merion at large is far more than "a mall", it is a top 5 employment hub in the entire state. I don't know why people here hate that so much?... Many on here trash the rest of the state for a crappy economy and lack of jobs, and our own suburbs are home to several massive economic centers, KoP leading the bunch. I generally agree with your posts, but I'm lost on this on... And again, to blame Philadelphia's economic woes on KoP is silly to me. So Idk...

[PHLtoNYC]

Originally Posted by steve_phl

Walked by Free People today and a sign in the window confirms they are closing 1/15 and moving: “We’ll be opening our new space on Walnut Street summer 2022”.

Good to hear!

[Jayfar]

Originally Posted by summersm343

Shakespeare Book Co. literally just opened lol. Can't imagine that's struggling.

Shakespeare & Co opened here 3-1/4 years ago, in October 2018: https://billypenn.com/2018/10/07/shakespeare-co-bookstore-and-cafe-is-now-open-in-rittenhouse/