The Great Canadian Sports Attendance, Marketing and TV Ratings Thread

[JHikka]

Originally Posted by Hackslack

How has MLS support been this year for Canada’s teams? Are they maxing out the reduced capacity, if there are any of those measures still in place? (hard to keep track of)

It's tough to really say anything about attendance for anyone in 2021 because of the global pandemic. TFC have had a dismal year and the crowds show, CFM and VWFC have had average crowds considering. Not MLS but HFX have had a really good year despite everything, and the others in CPL are accordingly varying depending on capacities and interest. There won't be anything to glean from attendances at events until probably 2022 or 2023.

[esquire]

Valour FC didn't do very well at the gate... I think it's partially pandemic related (people apprehensive about being in crowds, lack of season ticket marketing due to uncertainty) and also due to their piss-poor on-field performance. The season started well but then Andrew Jean-Baptiste got injured and it pretty well went down the toilet.

VFC could have reduced their ticket prices (or at least offer some deals) to get some people in the place. I might have gone to some of those late season games on a BOGO deal or for $10 tickets or some such. That last game I don't think there were even a thousand people there by the looks of the pictures.

[q12]

All NLL games will be broadcast by both TSN and ESPN.

[esquire]

Good for NLL, it could use the visibility. I wonder a) how many games will be on the broadcast networks, and b) how much it's worth?

[thurmas]

Winnipeg Jets won 4 straight now. Winnipeg Blue Bombers 10-1 putting up possibly the most dominant defense in CFL history and the Winnipeg ICE currently 11-0 first place in the WHL and I don’t think they even have a local radio deal in Winnipeg right now since bell shutdown TSN 1290 let alone any television coverage.

[esquire]

Originally Posted by thurmas

Winnipeg Jets won 4 straight now. Winnipeg Blue Bombers 10-1 putting up possibly the most dominant defense in CFL history and the Winnipeg ICE currently 11-0 first place in the WHL and I don’t think they even have a local radio deal in Winnipeg right now since bell shutdown TSN 1290 let alone any television coverage.

The ICE are still on 1290... it's like a lingering vestige of TSN 1290 with Brian Munz and Kevin Olszewski doing the games.

The amusing thing is that 1290 is now a comedy station called "FUNNY 1290", but whenever hockey is on they refer to it by the more dignified "CFRW 1290" It would be nice to see the ICE get some TV coverage but the problem is that Wayne Fleming Arena probably sucks for television... even watching game highlights you can barely see what the hell is going on.

As a longtime Winnipeg sports fan I don't think we have had such good and bountiful times in at least 30 years. Now we just need the hockey teams to join the Bombers in filling up the trophy case!

[blueandgoldguy]

I've been hearing that TFC's losses this year will approach or even exceed $30 million US! I guess that's not surprising as their season ticket base has dropped to 15,000 or so and many games had 7,000 fans in the stands. A few years ago, when the team was averaging around 25,000 per game their losses were $19 million US, so I guess that $30 million number I have heard circulating makes sense.

[esquire]

Originally Posted by blueandgoldguy

I've been hearing that TFC's losses this year will approach or even exceed $30 million US! I guess that's not surprising as their season ticket base has dropped to 15,000 or so and many games had 7,000 fans in the stands. A few years ago, when the team was averaging around 25,000 per game their losses were $19 million US, so I guess that $30 million number I have heard circulating makes sense.

I find this baffling, I don't get why a team that had established a solid local fanbase would be suffering this much. Their ticket prices are not unreasonable, and their games are played outdoors which should reduce if not altogether eliminate covid-related hesitancy to attend.

[JHikka]

TFC didn't activate and hold STHs to matches for 2021 so the attendances were people who physically bought tickets for each match.

In saying that, they had an abysmal year despite still having the 2nd-highest payroll in MLS (at $17M USD) - they'll be shedding a lot of that deadweight in the winter so that'll decrease. An aberration of a year and probably not anything that will trend long-term. For any team, TFC or otherwise, it'll be really, really difficult to extrapolate much of anything from 2021 with much use until we're well beyond 2022 and 2023.

Originally Posted by esquire

I find this baffling, I don't get why a team that had established a solid local fanbase would be suffering this much. Their ticket prices are not unreasonable, and their games are played outdoors which should reduce if not altogether eliminate covid-related hesitancy to attend.

Team was bad and tickets aren't cheap. MLSE isn't moving prices around to adjust for demand. You can buy resales for $15-30 but tickets direct from MLSE still cost upwards of $30-50 which is far too much for an awful team.

[king10]

Originally Posted by esquire

I find this baffling, I don't get why a team that had established a solid local fanbase would be suffering this much. Their ticket prices are not unreasonable, and their games are played outdoors which should reduce if not altogether eliminate covid-related hesitancy to attend.

Team has been terrible this year and the knowledgeable fans are fed up with the teams leadership.

Once they start winning fans will be back.

[Denscity]

25000 people at the Vancouver Whitecaps match then right after almost 19000 for the Canucks game across the street.

[Denscity]

And the Whitecaps made the playoffs!!

[JHikka]

Bathurst joins Baie-Comeau in the group of QMJHL teams which require direct municipal funding to stay afloat:

Originally Posted by JHikka

via Francois Le Blanc of Radio Canada:

The City of Bathurst has agreed to begin funding the AB Titan to ensure the team stays in Bathurst. $75,000 from the lodging tax and another $100,000 over two years from general municipal funds. And the City will help the team find additional revenue sources.

https://twitter.com/RCFrancois/status/1460610065434656772

[esquire]

Originally Posted by JHikka

Bathurst joins Baie-Comeau in the group of QMJHL teams which require direct municipal funding to stay afloat:

Subsidizing a major junior hockey team seems like quite a burden for a place as small as Bathurst (pop. 11,897) to take on.

I admit I'm a bit of a noob when it comes to junior hockey (at least in the paying close attention sense), but I do find their business models curious. There are so many teams that can barely draw a crowd during the regular season... I don't get how they can all make it work year after year.

[JHikka]

Originally Posted by JHikka

https://www.sportsbusinessjournal.com/Daily/Closing-Bell/2021/10/26/NFL-international.aspx

Nineteen NFL teams bid for int'l marketing rights
BY BEN FISCHER
10.26.2021

https://twitter.com/NFL345/status/1471191683203227652/photo/1

The league announced Wednesday that 18 teams have been awarded marketing rights across eight different countries. This initiative, known as the International Home Marketing Areas program, grants clubs access to international territories for marketing, fan engagement and commercialization as they build their global brands and drive NFL fan growth internationally.

Strategic efforts in these international markets include: in-person and digital marketing, corporate sponsorship sales, fan events and activations, youth football activities, merchandise sales and co-marketing relationships with other sports and entertainment properties in the market.

https://www.nfl.com/news/nfl-awards-international-marketing-rights-to-18-teams-in-eight-countries

[esquire]

^ Very curious to me that the Bills are not included among the teams sharing the Canadian territory. At one time they had a pretty significant Canadian fanbase. In the 90s when they were playing in a series of Super Bowls they seemed like the de facto Southern Ontario home team.

At the same time the Minnesota Vikings are included, but I would think their fanbase is pretty tiny in comparison and made up mostly of a small number of people in Southern Manitoba, NWO and maybe a handful in Southern Sask. I remember at one time Scott Taylor of the Winnipeg Free Press was doing his damndest to get people to care about the Vikings but it never worked, most NFL fans just cheered for whatever team they liked. I'd imagine the Packers probably have far more fans around here than the Vikings do.

[JHikka]

Originally Posted by esquire

^ Very curious to me that the Bills are not included among the teams sharing the Canadian territory. At one time they had a pretty significant Canadian fanbase. In the 90s when they were playing in a series of Super Bowls they seemed like the de facto Southern Ontario home team.

At the same time the Minnesota Vikings are included, but I would think their fanbase is pretty tiny in comparison and made up mostly of a small number of people in Southern Manitoba, NWO and maybe a handful in Southern Sask. I remember at one time Scott Taylor of the Winnipeg Free Press was doing his damndest to get people to care about the Vikings but it never worked, most NFL fans just cheered for whatever team they liked. I'd imagine the Packers probably have far more fans around here than the Vikings do.

Curious that neither Buffalo or Green Bay are one of the 18 teams looking for international partnerships as a part of this program. I assumed back in October that Buffalo would be an easy one but I guess not.

AFAIK Buffalo's Canadian fanbase is still pretty strong. I know a handful of Bills STHs in Toronto and Hamilton who routinely went down for games pre-COVID. It's also interesting that the Bills don't have the crowd issues in 2021 that the Sabres are currently experiencing, so I guess they can rely on local Upstate NY market a lot more than the Sabres can, and rely a lot less on Southern Ontario than the Sabres do.

I guess we'll see what comes of the increased Vikings and Seahawks presence in Canada. The Seahawks are the more interesting of the two given their proximity to Vancouver and how the Lions have been doing as of late, IMO.

[esquire]

The Seahawks seem like more of a natural fit because of their proximity to Vancouver and area.

The Vikings don't really have that advantage. I know some people around here who have Vikings season tickets but not many are actual Vikings fans, they tend to go down to watch the teams they actually do like or very big games and then just sell off the rest. I suppose it's possible, but I'd be surprised if there were more than 1,000 Canadians who regularly attend Vikings games, like more than 1 game a season, at least pre-covid. Maybe more hold season tickets as speculators.

[JHikka]

For the 'TSN doesn't want to show BC teams!!!' crowd.



https://twitter.com/CHLHockey/status/1471540666564026370/photo/1

[esquire]

Why are the Winnipeg ICE never on CBC or TSN? They're only the number one ranked team in the country... I know our arena probably sucks for broadcasts but they do play road games in legitimate junior rinks.

It is nice to see some more live junior hockey on those networks, though. The next step is for those networks to do a game of the week for the entire season and create some predictability in the TV schedule.