Federal Government & Politics | Election 2021 FORUM POLL

[JHikka]

Originally Posted by esquire

Portage-Lisgar basically is south... I bet you anything it's the people in Morden-Winkler/RM of Stanley who put up the numbers for the PPC candidate in that riding. If they had their own riding and didn't have to share it with the more sane folks around Portage it might have been the only one in Canada to elect a PPC MP.

We won't know until poll breakdowns are released (and even then they don't capture advance polls or mail-in ballots) but i'm guessing the same could be said for a lot of rural areas in Canada.

[travis3000]

Originally Posted by JHikka

I mean, the same sort of thing happens here on SSP. It's pretty common once you leave the city to hear people talking all types of shit about it. I had this happens a few months ago in Belleville when someone said that 'those fucking parasites' should stay in Toronto during COVID. It would make them more upset to know that their little town doesn't even cross Toronto's mind at all.

And not to mention Toronto is the economic engine of the entire province/country. Without the GTA most of these small town folk would be living on the streets.

I grew up in a small town about 1 hour north of Toronto. My riding (Simcoe-Grey) is one of the most reliable CPC ridings in Ontario. Even during the split- right time, our riding was one of the only ones to elect an Alliance member of parliament back in the 90s. I've heard all sorts of negative talk about Toronto but it's funny while people bash it , they also brag about it. "I got a job in Toronto" "Im moving to Toronto" "Im dating a guy from Toronto" "Let's go to Toronto for your birthday and get a hotel, go to a club" "Omg let's go see a concert in Toronto and have a nice dinner".

I've realized most of the negativity comes from jealousy/fear. I personally love Toronto. I make sure to visit at least once a month whether it a be a nice dinner, a boat ride on Lake Ontario, visiting the island, a concert, seeing friends and just walking around. It's a vibrant and fun city.

[WarrenC12]

Originally Posted by Bcasey25raptor

Western alienation isn't a problem in BC and anyone who claims it is is a grifter.

Of course western alienation is a thing in BC. A "problem"? Who knows.

BC has often sent opposition parties to Ottawa, and often feels left out of politics, like everybody else outside of Ontario and Quebec.

The Reform party was very strong here in the 90s.

[VANRIDERFAN]

Originally Posted by JHikka

We won't know until poll breakdowns are released (and even then they don't capture advance polls or mail-in ballots) but i'm guessing the same could be said for a lot of rural areas in Canada.

I just went through all the rural ridings of MB/SK and Portage Lisgar was the only riding where PPC got in the 20 percentile, next door to the east; Provencher 16% (next highest) and Dauphin Swan River 11%. In SK the PPC highest was 11% in Moose-Jaw-Lanigan-Lake Centre.

There are crack-pots for sure in the party. But I'm assuming that many of the Conservatives who voted PPC did it as a protest to the Conservatives knowing full well that the CPC would still win the riding handily.

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by travis3000

And not to mention Toronto is the economic engine of the entire province/country. Without the GTA most of these small town folk would be living on the streets.

Just a slight exaggeration there.

[esquire]

Originally Posted by Acajack

Just a slight exaggeration there.

C'mon man, without the likes of Rogers and Royal Bank I'd be subsisting on mushrooms and wild berries I foraged...

[flar]

The rural areas will be fine as long as China keeps buying their crops

[Innsertnamehere]

Originally Posted by travis3000

And not to mention Toronto is the economic engine of the entire province/country. Without the GTA most of these small town folk would be living on the streets.

I grew up in a small town about 1 hour north of Toronto. My riding (Simcoe-Grey) is one of the most reliable CPC ridings in Ontario. Even during the split- right time, our riding was one of the only ones to elect an Alliance member of parliament back in the 90s. I've heard all sorts of negative talk about Toronto but it's funny while people bash it , they also brag about it. "I got a job in Toronto" "Im moving to Toronto" "Im dating a guy from Toronto" "Let's go to Toronto for your birthday and get a hotel, go to a club" "Omg let's go see a concert in Toronto and have a nice dinner".

I've realized most of the negativity comes from jealousy/fear. I personally love Toronto. I make sure to visit at least once a month whether it a be a nice dinner, a boat ride on Lake Ontario, visiting the island, a concert, seeing friends and just walking around. It's a vibrant and fun city.

A lot of people are just intimidated by the "big city" I think, and avoid it and insult it for that reason.

Even among my urban planner circles, a lot of people from outside of Toronto are intimidated by it. And these are people who do "cities" for a living! They just don't know how to navigate it as it's just so fundamentally different. They enjoy visiting but scoff at living there.

It's quite funny to me really.

[Truenorth00]

Racism too. I've had people tell me (a brown guy) that Toronto is "not Canadian".

That's sort of universal to major metros all over the developed world. They are not seen as fitting the national stereotype anymore, because of their diversity.

[wg_flamip]

Originally Posted by Acajack

Just a slight exaggeration there.

For most of the country, for sure an exaggeration; however, there is a fairly large swath of the province near Toronto (particularly North/East) whose economy would tank completely without tourism and other forms of support from the GTA. I briefly lived in and have family connections to this area, and it's definitely where I've heard the most open contempt for Toronto. This is often a thinly veiled racism really as visible minority/immigrant = "from Toronto" to a lot of these people. When someone from the Kawarthas talks about "those people from Toronto" coming up to fish without a licence or to spread gang violence to their little town, for example, there is definitely a racial element encoded.

[travis3000]

Sorry guys Im half Italian, I tend to exaggerate just a little when trying to prove my points

But in all seriousness the GTA is the economic engine for Southern ON. A solid chunk of people in my area do commute to the GTA for work, and if they don't their company is still controlled/ran by corporates in Toronto and area. Many people rely on residents from GTA to keep afloat. For instance my Dad and grandfather operate a smoked meat and cheese business in the Muskoka's . Without GTA tourists coming up to visit and opening their wallets my family's business would be a sliver of the size it currently is.

[manny_santos]

Originally Posted by travis3000

And not to mention Toronto is the economic engine of the entire province/country. Without the GTA most of these small town folk would be living on the streets.

I grew up in a small town about 1 hour north of Toronto. My riding (Simcoe-Grey) is one of the most reliable CPC ridings in Ontario. Even during the split- right time, our riding was one of the only ones to elect an Alliance member of parliament back in the 90s. I've heard all sorts of negative talk about Toronto but it's funny while people bash it , they also brag about it. "I got a job in Toronto" "Im moving to Toronto" "Im dating a guy from Toronto" "Let's go to Toronto for your birthday and get a hotel, go to a club" "Omg let's go see a concert in Toronto and have a nice dinner".

I've realized most of the negativity comes from jealousy/fear. I personally love Toronto. I make sure to visit at least once a month whether it a be a nice dinner, a boat ride on Lake Ontario, visiting the island, a concert, seeing friends and just walking around. It's a vibrant and fun city.

Jealousy is part of it. I grew up in London during the 90s and 2000s when we had a lot of white collar jobs move from London to Toronto and the GTA. There used to be a lot more head office opportunities for business graduates like myself in London, but almost all of them are gone now - though the pandemic has probably shifted this due to the growth in remote work. A couple of the big ones that moved over the past 25 years were Labatt's sometime after it was bought by Interbrew, and Canada Trust after it merged with TD. I think that especially after the 2008-09 economic downtown, there was a sense in London, rightly or wrongly, that Toronto was "taking our jobs", especially as London was much more severely impacted by that recession than Toronto in some ways. At one point, I think around 2010, there was a report showing the very high number of Western graduates who were leaving London after graduation, and it was used to highlight the declining number of opportunities there compared with cities such as Toronto.

Another part of it is a sense that Torontonians don't understand the rest of Ontario, and this sense is felt in parts of rural and Northern Ontario. A good example of this was the cancellation of the spring bear hunt, which in Northern Ontario was considered vital to keeping the bear population in check. People up there felt that this change was made by bureaucrats in Toronto who didn't understand the North. (Ironically this happened while Mike Harris was premier, and he was from North Bay.)

[Bcasey25raptor]

Originally Posted by SpongeG

my feed is full of it, I grew up in NE BC and they vote Liberals Provincially and Conservatives federally and don't understand why they work their asses off so Quebecers can live off their money.

Canada is run by an Eastern Dictatorship and unless BC gets proportional representation we need to separate is their mantra.

Here is what one woman wrote about some comments about why/how did Trudeau win? She is also an anti-vaxxer

I had commented the West separating would just be swallowed up by the USA after she had posted some crazy rant and then she followed up with this.



and this



and this

The northeast isn't really BC, it's more of an extension of Alberta

Also these people make up an infinitesimally tiny minority of people that they shouldn't be taken seriously. There isn't any western alienation, theres partisan cons butthurt they lost again.

[Bcasey25raptor]

Cons won lest of the vote as a percent of the population in BC than they did in Ontario, this still rings true if you include the PPC in the totals for both.

BC does NOT have a problem with western alienation and i'm getting sick and fucking tired of being lumped in with Alberta.

Rural BC has more hostility to Vancouver than it does Ottawa.

As for sending opposition parties to office? Ontario and Quebec has done that too, how the bloody hell is BC unique on this?

Western alienation is a political tool dragged up by cons every time they lose an election, sow the seeds of regional division, divide and conquer. The CPC MPs and news journalists who are playing these games are treasonous.

[Bcasey25raptor]

Originally Posted by WarrenC12

Of course western alienation is a thing in BC. A "problem"? Who knows.

BC has often sent opposition parties to Ottawa, and often feels left out of politics, like everybody else outside of Ontario and Quebec.

The Reform party was very strong here in the 90s.

BC hasn't been left out of politics for YEARS. BC has joined the Lurentian Consensus, don't drag us into Alberta's politics, less than 34% of BCers voted CPC this election, more Ontarians as a percentage of the population voted CPC than we did.

Huge numbers here voted NDP but NDP doesn't hate the Canadian project.


Western Alienation isn't a thing, rural alienation is.

[jigglysquishy]

BC returning more NDP than Toronto, Ottawa, and Montreal combined clearly shows BC politics is not the same as central politics.

The NDP were started partially as a protest to the Liberals being too Ontario and Quebec centric. In the 90s, BC was sending more reform than Ontario.

Western alienation isn't strong at all in Vancouver, but venture out into rural eastern BC and you hear similar rhetoric to the prairies.

Outside parts of Calgary, western alienation is not a major political factor in urban politics.

[thurmas]

Originally Posted by travis3000

And not to mention Toronto is the economic engine of the entire province/country. Without the GTA most of these small town folk would be living on the streets.

I grew up in a small town about 1 hour north of Toronto. My riding (Simcoe-Grey) is one of the most reliable CPC ridings in Ontario. Even during the split- right time, our riding was one of the only ones to elect an Alliance member of parliament back in the 90s. I've heard all sorts of negative talk about Toronto but it's funny while people bash it , they also brag about it. "I got a job in Toronto" "Im moving to Toronto" "Im dating a guy from Toronto" "Let's go to Toronto for your birthday and get a hotel, go to a club" "Omg let's go see a concert in Toronto and have a nice dinner".

I've realized most of the negativity comes from jealousy/fear. I personally love Toronto. I make sure to visit at least once a month whether it a be a nice dinner, a boat ride on Lake Ontario, visiting the island, a concert, seeing friends and just walking around. It's a vibrant and fun city.

Maybe out east Toronto is mainly a banking hub and warehouse centre for a lot of American firms the rest of Canada would still survive if there was no Toronto

[Bcasey25raptor]

Originally Posted by jigglysquishy

BC returning more NDP than Toronto, Ottawa, and Montreal combined clearly shows BC politics is not the same as central politics.

The NDP were started partially as a protest to the Liberals being too Ontario and Quebec centric. In the 90s, BC was sending more reform than Ontario.

Western alienation isn't strong at all in Vancouver, but venture out into rural eastern BC and you hear similar rhetoric to the prairies.

The NDP was started as a farmers and workers party and has evolved to become the voice of progressive Canada. The modern NDP is nothing like what it was when Tommy Douglas ran it.

I voted NDP, I don;t hold any negative feelings towards eastern Canada and neither do any of my NDP friends.

Also the 90s was over 20 years ago, we have an entire generation or 2 voting now that didn't vote back then.

The reform movement back then was supported for reasons that are no longer relevant to BC. Polls consistently show BC is more progressive and educated than almost anywhere else in the country.

A reform style party would do very poorly in BC in 2021+

[Truenorth00]

Originally Posted by manny_santos

Jealousy is part of it. I grew up in London during the 90s and 2000s when we had a lot of white collar jobs move from London to Toronto and the GTA. There used to be a lot more head office opportunities for business graduates like myself in London, but almost all of them are gone now - though the pandemic has probably shifted this due to the growth in remote work. A couple of the big ones that moved over the past 25 years were Labatt's sometime after it was bought by Interbrew, and Canada Trust after it merged with TD. I think that especially after the 2008-09 economic downtown, there was a sense in London, rightly or wrongly, that Toronto was "taking our jobs", especially as London was much more severely impacted by that recession than Toronto in some ways. At one point, I think around 2010, there was a report showing the very high number of Western graduates who were leaving London after graduation, and it was used to highlight the declining number of opportunities there compared with cities such as Toronto.

Ironically, better public transport infrastructure (that voters outside the GTA often opposed in the past) could have made keeping some of those jobs in London more viable. Imagine if getting to London took just one hr by HSR instead of the recently ridiculous 4 hr GO train offering.

[flar]

Originally Posted by Truenorth00

ridiculous 4 hr GO train offering.

I heard this the other day. That's incredibly slow, London to Toronto is only two hours by car!