Olympic Village & Southeast False Creek Updates Discussion

[logan5]

The bottom blue section looks out of place with the rest, but in real life it may come across differently. I like seeing the massing broken up in large structures like this, and they have obviously done that here.

Been awhile since we had a building that has sparked a bit of conversation, which I think is a good sign (in this case).

[officedweller]

Originally Posted by GenWhy?

Blue brick is pretty tame. Would be interesting enough still as a white or charcoal.

https://www.dezeen.com/2018/10/16/damien...-trevillion-iridescent-turquoise-bricks/

That actually looks good, so there is hope for the blue bricks!

It would be nice to see a tower built with the same type of bricks used in various modernist academic buildings at UBC (ie the light gray ones used on Buchanan low-rise and other 1960s additions)

[Migrant_Coconut]

Originally Posted by dleung

Love the massing. The colours Vancouver rarely gets the colour thing right. It's either life-less grey clear-anodized, or some tacky unnatural colour that makes everything else seem even more colourless

Originally Posted by GenWhy?

Blue brick is pretty tame. Would be interesting enough still as a white or charcoal.

https://www.dezeen.com/2018/10/16/damien...-trevillion-iridescent-turquoise-bricks/

Yeah, it's not that the proposal's ugly, just LOUD. Need to come back with some richer, darker tones which actually complement each other.

[Vin]

Originally Posted by GenWhy?

MA+HG took upon this design on their own though, without input from the City, and in fact going against the City's pre-prescribed "rules" (example being The Pinnacle at Ontario & 1st).

In that case the architect is just horrible. In fact, I think it does not defy the City's prescribed "rules". The City loves broken up effects like this, only this is way uglier. And just like what Changing City's said, this merely consists of a few simple ugly blocks created by 3-year olds. In fact, it would have looked a lot better without that green eye sore with the arched windows.

Originally Posted by GenWhy?

Blue brick is pretty tame. Would be interesting enough still as a white or charcoal.

https://www.dezeen.com/2018/10/16/damien...-trevillion-iridescent-turquoise-bricks/

Thumbs up for this UK building. It actually reminds me of BC's heritage buildings: created during an era when aesthetics holds much importance in building designs. Sadly such beautiful structures are few and far between nowadays.

[MIPS]

Originally Posted by Jimbo604

Anyone think it is getting harder to find a place to get your car fixed in Vancouver as more and more are demolished, close, etc?

On paper body shops and service centers (and gas stations to that extent) are very expensive in Vancouver. They require large plots (multiple service bays and exterior parking) in light to medium zoned commercial/industrial areas which isn't cheap anymore (in part because these areas are now being redeveloped) and because laws prohibit or heavily restrict what can be built and operated over them (mostly in case of vehicle or chemical fires) they vertically waste space.

EG: The Cambie street Canadian Tire has the service center on the ground floor and the store is on the second floor (same model as the one on the Grandview highway) but you can't build offices or condos above that.

[Migrant_Coconut]

Would EV repair shops be compatible with multi-floor industrial?

[Changing City]

Originally Posted by MIPS

On paper body shops and service centers (and gas stations to that extent) are very expensive in Vancouver. They require large plots (multiple service bays and exterior parking) in light to medium zoned commercial/industrial areas which isn't cheap anymore (in part because these areas are now being redeveloped) and because laws prohibit or heavily restrict what can be built and operated over them (mostly in case of vehicle or chemical fires) they vertically waste space.

EG: The Cambie street Canadian Tire has the service center on the ground floor and the store is on the second floor (same model as the one on the Grandview highway) but you can't build offices or condos above that.

Almost none of that is true, although you can't put a building over the top of a gas station. You can put a vehicle service or repair shop underneath a condo, like the Honda sales and service centre on Kingsway, built underneath Stella over 10 years ago.

You can also put service and sales underneath an office building, as Jim Pattison is doing on Burrard Street, where his Toyota dealership will be moving back to soon.

And you can put car repair in an industrial area underneath other industrial and office space, as PC Urban are doing at 1055 Vernon Drive, where No.1 Collision will have their workshop below other space.

[WarrenC12]

Originally Posted by Migrant_Coconut

Would EV repair shops be compatible with multi-floor industrial?

Tesla's Service Centre on west 4th is at ground level and below in the parkade. No exhaust emissions and drastically fewer toxic liquids (oil) leaking should make it easier to shoehorn into different spaces.

[MIPS]

Originally Posted by Changing City

Almost none of that is true, although you can't put a building over the top of a gas station. You can put a vehicle service or repair shop underneath a condo.

I could of sworn there was a bunch of rules covering that. Weird caveats and obstacles like site hazard analysis, zoning restrictions and things that made it very hard if not impossible to zone for repair shops to exist on the ground floor of high-rises.

Okay nevermind then.

[Changing City]

Originally Posted by MIPS

I could of sworn there was a bunch of rules covering that. Weird caveats and obstacles like site hazard analysis, zoning restrictions and things that made it very hard if not impossible to zone for repair shops to exist on the ground floor of high-rises.

Okay nevermind then.

There might be design issues with venting etc. for certain activities like paint spraying, but the Vernon Drive example shows that new facilities can deal with that, and still put commercial uses on upper floors. Unlike the Downtown gas station, now acknowledged as an endangered species, car repair and service probably won't totally disappear, but it will evolve.

My guess for why there are fewer vehicle repair business licences, (assuming that actually means fewer businesses, as car sales and repair often have multiple licences), is that there's less business. The indications are that Vancouver resident's annual vehicle km driven is falling. ICBC data shows fewer crashes in Vancouver and across the Lower Mainland between 2016 and 2019, and a lot less in 2020, so there's less repair work. Cars are more reliable, and more specialist, so dealerships tend to get more service work (compared to the many independent repair shops years ago). Business taxes have risen, especially in locations on arterials that could be retail, or have residential above. And EVs will require even fewer service locations, so it's not a great business to start up, while older owners are retiring.

[jollyburger]

In 2017, ICBC spent about about $1.5 billion on vehicle repairs, nearly half of that — $745 million — at auto body shops.

Vehicle damage repair costs went up 50% between 2012-2017 sounds like a huge increase. (There were some changes to their repair programs after some of these articles were published to try to curb costs)

https://globalnews.ca/news/4742271/icbc-...n-in-2012-is-it-getting-value-for-money/

And a lot of inflation in parts costs even with less reported crashes to ICBC:

https://www.cheknews.ca/commentary-the-rocketing-cost-of-auto-repairs-673505/

[officedweller]

Probably lots more electronics involved adding costs. ie a side view mirror may now have lights, dimming, blind spot detection, together with the control motors.

Originally Posted by Changing City

... Cars are more reliable, and more specialist, so dealerships tend to get more service work (compared to the many independent repair shops years ago).

Together with business taxes, I think that the cars are so complex nowadays that you probably need deep pockets to run a shop.

[whatnext]

Originally Posted by jollyburger

Vehicle damage repair costs went up 50% between 2012-2017 sounds like a huge increase. (There were some changes to their repair programs after some of these articles were published to try to curb costs)

https://globalnews.ca/news/4742271/icbc-...n-in-2012-is-it-getting-value-for-money/

And a lot of inflation in parts costs even with less reported crashes to ICBC:

https://www.cheknews.ca/commentary-the-rocketing-cost-of-auto-repairs-673505/

Doesn't that sort of coincide with the BC Lieberals doing away with most ICBC claim centres and estimators and turning over estimating to the body shop owners? What could go wrong.....

[jollyburger]

Originally Posted by whatnext

Doesn't that sort of coincide with the BC Lieberals doing away with most ICBC claim centres and estimators and turning over estimating to the body shop owners? What could go wrong.....

Yeah I don't remember when that was introduced.

Recent PwC report on the auto repair industry in BC:

The total number of collision repair claims in BC have begun a downward trend as of 2017 when 250,641 collision repair
claims were reported to ICBC and continued to decline in 2018 and 2019. This does not include glass claims. ICBC
projects that COVID-19 will favourably influence this decline in frequency as fewer drivers are on the roads, signalling a
sustained downward trend.

While frequency is declining, the costs associated with a collision repair claim are increasing. Average severity of a
collision repair claim at ICBC increased by 4% per year between 2015 and 2019, to $3,176 in 2019. This suggests that
the collision repair cost pressures facing ICBC are aligned with the broader trend of rising severity across Canada.

https://www.icbc.com/partners/material-damage/Documents/pibr-industry-report.pdf

[rofina]

Originally Posted by jollyburger

Yeah I don't remember when that was introduced.

Recent PwC report on the auto repair industry in BC:



https://www.icbc.com/partners/material-damage/Documents/pibr-industry-report.pdf

Labor and material costs are wild.

Even something like an F150 is made of aluminum these days, expensive to fix.

To take off and replace a bumper with sensors and repaint the same is $2000-3000 of damage.

I simple fender bender that once cost $800 is now probably closer to $3000.

[jlousa]

Originally Posted by WarrenC12

Tesla's Service Centre on west 4th is at ground level and below in the parkade. No exhaust emissions and drastically fewer toxic liquids (oil) leaking should make it easier to shoehorn into different spaces.

The lithium batteries would pose a serious issue. We are not allowed to use lithium ion batteries in any ups/dc plant in multiple locations we have due to fire code.

[WarrenC12]

Originally Posted by jlousa

The lithium batteries would pose a serious issue. We are not allowed to use lithium ion batteries in any ups/dc plant in multiple locations we have due to fire code.

Do you know what the zoning is for their West 4th service centre? There are condos above it.

[Changing City]

Originally Posted by WarrenC12

Do you know what the zoning is for their West 4th service centre? There are condos above it.

It wasn't rezoned, so it's standard C-2, I believe. Presumably most Tesla service is straightforward, and doesn't involve anything potentially risky with the batteries. Having a lot of Teslas sitting in the same place is no different than having them sat in the charging stations in Pacific Centre. If there is any limitation on what they can do on W4th, they have the Powell St service centre, which is in an industrial zone.

[WarrenC12]

Originally Posted by Changing City

It wasn't rezoned, so it's standard C-2, I believe. Presumably most Tesla service is straightforward, and doesn't involve anything potentially risky with the batteries. Having a lot of Teslas sitting in the same place is no different than having them sat in the charging stations in Pacific Centre. If there is any limitation on what they can do on W4th, they have the Powell St service centre, which is in an industrial zone.

I'm not sure they do much at Powell anymore, all of my service has been at West 4th, and it looks to be pretty fully capable.

Agree on the battery thing, it makes no sense.

The packs are sealed anyway, even a full high voltage replacement shouldn't involve any real risk.

[WarrenC12]

Second and Main is finally seeing occupancy with people moving in over the past week or so.

Nothing happening with any of the ground level retail from what I can see.