Ottawa intercity bus terminal relocation

[c_speed3108]

Thinking of locations.

Hurdman is the obvious choice as it has LRT to downtown and east as well as the transitway heading south. Even bus connections to CHEO. Close to the 417.

Tremblay is interesting as VIA station is well equipped with everything from washrooms, waiting areas, even a coffee shop. Buses would with go in P1 or possibly backfill in the space freed up from the removal of the transitway and convert that to either a bus area or parking.

St Laurent would really only work if the Grey Hound became a mall tenant as there is no parking, space to stage cabs etc.

Its doubtfully they would want it as far east as Blair and there are few advantages over St laurent.


Downtown. The only easy place would be the old Laurier station. The disadvantage is there would be few if any facilities and little room to stage buses or even cabs etc. Also no directly near an LRT station.

Can't see the NCC wanting part of lebreton to be a bus station.

Bayview would technically have room in the old bus lay-up. Probably NCC land. Disadvantage is that it is hard to get to the highway.

Tunney's might have room once phase 2 opens. Certainly doesn't in the short term. Highway access is not great.

Can't see it in Westboro or west of there.

Not much in the way of Trillium line options.

[khabibulin]

Originally Posted by HighwayStar

Winnipeg has a full intercity bus terminal... located right at the Airport.

#1 - It used to

#2 - Greyhound permanently ceased operations in Manitoba, Saskatchewan and Alberta

#3 - The bus terminal at the airport was demolished a few years ago.

Greyhound Canada announced in March 2008[8] that it would move the Winnipeg bus terminal from the Mall Centre in downtown Winnipeg to a new C$6.3 million building with a single storey structure with separate areas for freight and passengers[9] inside of a 930 m2 (10,000 sq ft) of passenger space and 930 m2 (10,000 sq ft) of cargo processing space[8] at the Winnipeg International Airport.[10] The terminal moved operations on August 15, 2009,[11] where it had been for 45 years.[9]

The terminal was a hub for Greyhound, with buses originating from and travelling to Vancouver; Edmonton; Calgary; Medicine Hat; and Toronto. On October 30, 2018 Greyhound Canada stopped serving western Canada, causing the closure of the bus terminal.[12]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Winnipeg_Bus_Terminal

[Catenary]

Originally Posted by GeoNerd

Wait, the Hurdman bus loop isn't a fare-paid zone. Only the train station is fare-paid, right?

The bus loop at Hurdman is within the Fare-Paid Zone. It's accessed through the train station during the day, with no barriers between the train and the bus.

At night, they open a gate next to the station so you can get to the buses without going through the station. The bus loop is not a FPZ when the train is closed, the same as Tunney's.

[roger1818]

Originally Posted by lrt's friend

Perhaps, we should have a regional transit thread for this discussion.

We have the Rural Bus Network thread. Maybe a moderator can move this discussion there.

[rocketphish]

Originally Posted by roger1818

We have the Rural Bus Network thread. Maybe a moderator can move this discussion there.

I've moved the regional bus and rail transportation discussion over here:
https://skyscraperpage.com/forum/showthread.php?t=236845

This thread is for Ottawa's bus station relocation.

[Dominion301]

Originally Posted by Truenorth00

Good opportunity for VIA, Coach Canada, Megabus, etc

Will be interesting to see where the new bus station in Ottawa will be located. Re-visiting the Tremblay train station makes by far the most sense. It's a 15 minute ride on the train to downtown. Cabs are parked there. Adding buses to Via would make adding a restaurant and maybe a convenience store viable options at the train station. It's also 3 minutes from the Queensway and direct access to Montreal. There should be sufficient layup room already at the train station for 10 buses.

I imagine Ontario Northland will (post-pandemic) increase service to Northern Ontario now that their competitor is gone.

I wonder if local bus lines like Leduc or 417 might go after the Ottawa-Montreal route? Time to revive Voyageur.

[roger1818]

I was searching for who owns Central Station and found this article from February which hadn't been posted in this thread:

Developer Brigil to buy former downtown Greyhound terminal

Plan involves restaurants, hotels, luxury condos for Catherine Street site

CBC News · Posted: Feb 15, 2021 3:37 PM ET | Last Updated: February 15

The Greyhound bus terminal in Ottawa on Oct. 1, 2020. Real estate developer Brigil says it has purchased the site and plans to replace it with luxury condos, office space, restaurants and retail shops. (Jean Delise/Radio-Canada)

---

Real estate developer Brigil is purchasing the site of Ottawa's former downtown Greyhound bus terminal and is planning a major redevelopment of the property, the company announced Monday.

The one-hectare Ottawa Central Station site on Catherine Street is a "a prime location for a prestigious project promoting urban densification," the company said in a news release.

Plans are already underway to build a multi-use space featuring luxury rental condos, office space, hotel buildings, restaurants and retail stores, Brigil said.

Greyhound had operated out of the station since 1994 but announced its plans to leave the terminal in October, after suspending bus service across the country in May because of the COVID-19 pandemic.

The station is owned by the Crerar Group of Companies, a commercial real estate firm. Brigil said its offer to purchase was accepted in December with conditions, and that the final sale will close March 1.

"I am delighted that the Brigil team is the one that gets to conceptualize this new project, committed as we are to building comprehensive living environments where residents can thrive, said Brigil president and founder Gilles Desjardins in the press release.

Zoning permits 27 storeys

The company also said it has invited architectural firms from Ottawa, Toronto and Montreal to participate in a design competition. It intends to submit project plans to the City of Ottawa in the spring and to begin construction in 2023.

Current zoning rules would allow the company to build up to 27 storeys high, the release said.

Founded in 1985, Brigil has built some 12,000 housing units across the National Capital Region and plans to build 33,000 more over the next 15 years, according to the company.

Greyhound bus services remain suspended across Canada. The transportation company has not announced a new terminal location in Ottawa.

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/ottawa/brigil-purchase-ottawa-central-station-1.5914705

[roger1818]

Originally Posted by Dominion301

Will be interesting to see where the new bus station in Ottawa will be located. Re-visiting the Tremblay train station makes by far the most sense. It's a 15 minute ride on the train to downtown. Cabs are parked there. Adding buses to Via would make adding a restaurant and maybe a convenience store viable options at the train station. It's also 3 minutes from the Queensway and direct access to Montreal. There should be sufficient layup room already at the train station for 10 buses.

It certainly will be interesting to see how this unfolds. With the old depot having been sold, the VIA Rail station makes sense, especially since Ontario Northland's bus already stops there.

I imagine Ontario Northland will (post-pandemic) increase service to Northern Ontario now that their competitor is gone.

Greyhound had 1 bus a day, so I certainly could see Ontario Northland adding a second bus after COVID.

I wonder if local bus lines like Leduc or 417 might go after the Ottawa-Montreal route? Time to revive Voyageur.

If I was a betting man, I would put my money on megabus, since they already run the Toronto-Montreal bus, but anything is possible. Judging by the number of buses per day (pre COVID) I think Ottawa-Montreal was one of Greyhound's more successful routes.

Someone like Leduc or 417 might pick up Greyhound's Ottawa-Kingston and Ottawa-Cornwall routes. The only thing is their commuter buses are subsidised and I don't know if they would want to take on the risk of running an unsubsidised route.

[CityTech]

Why not both? Leduc and Megabus both running the route. Competition is good.

[Truenorth00]

Originally Posted by Dominion301

Will be interesting to see where the new bus station in Ottawa will be located. Re-visiting the Tremblay train station makes by far the most sense. It's a 15 minute ride on the train to downtown. Cabs are parked there. Adding buses to Via would make adding a restaurant and maybe a convenience store viable options at the train station. It's also 3 minutes from the Queensway and direct access to Montreal. There should be sufficient layup room already at the train station for 10 buses.

I imagine Ontario Northland will (post-pandemic) increase service to Northern Ontario now that their competitor is gone.

It would be amazing to see Ontario Northland build a terminal at Tremblay. Dunno how much funding and authority VIA has to do this. But I really hope somebody is pushing this.

Originally Posted by Dominion301

I wonder if local bus lines like Leduc or 417 might go after the Ottawa-Montreal route? Time to revive Voyageur.

I'm sure there will be lots of competition for this route. VIA might give them a run for their money if they can increase frequencies. And put that new fleet to work....

[Acajack]

Orléans Express is starting intercity motorcoach service on a Montreal-Ottawa-Gatineau route tomorrow.

Stops in the region AFAIK will be:

Ottawa VIA Rail station

Downtown somewhere on Slater

Place du Portage

Promenades Gatineau

[rocketphish]

Quiet loss — Ottawa's lack of a central, inter-city bus station hurts us all
How can the Canadian capital not have a bus station? And how did we not realize it was happening?

Janine Debanné, Ottawa Citizen
Oct 31, 2022 • 1 hour ago • 3 minute read



On an unseasonably warm late October day, I decided to go visit the old bus station with one of my architecture students. This was after a long conversation in which we decided that rejuvenating the bus station by folding a multi-use building — concert hall, hotel, affordable housing — into it would make a great thesis project. While I was aware that the site had been sold to Brigil, I remained somehow confident that the bus station would magically reopen. In the busyness of my life, I had not connected the dots.

My student and I arrived only to find that the site had recently been completely razed. The dusty lot’s huge dimensions were legible for the first time, and the row of houses along Argyle Street now read much more clearly. As a person who grew up in the Outaouais, I hold many memories of this place. Flashes of pickups and drop-offs from decades past filled my mind — from the first time I went to Montreal without my parents as a teen with my friend Stef, to the through-window wave to my mother looking back up at me through her tears the day I moved to Toronto and left home for the first time, in 1990.

I do not doubt that my feelings are shared by many others, be they citizens of Ottawa or of the myriad towns and cities to which this old bus station connected Canada’s capital. For the bus station — unflashy as it was — was a place of emotion.

A sign that reads “Building with Purpose” now forecasts the development that will follow the 15-minute city paradigm (and without inter-city travel, 15 minutes might be as far as some can go). The ghost of the un-beautiful, un-loved yet loved, corrugated brown metal / buff brick combo building pressed a long, shallow hole on the ground.

But how can the Canadian capital not have a bus station? And how did this happen so quietly?

We all know that the COVID years left urbanity and its rituals, such as inter-city travel, in parentheses. Once known as Voyageur Colonial and as of 1998 as Greyhound, the privately owned bus company that ran its operations on Catherine Street was the bloodline linking the capital and a constellation of small and larger towns and cities in Ontario and Quebec, an agent of nationhood and regional understanding. Bus stations in Ontario and Canada — these unassuming builders of connection — ensure the unfolding of fine-grained life and are especially important for the non-wealthy. We notice their quiet erosion.

Dave from Dave’s Drum Shop across the street from the station has watched the site through the pandemic and since the sale to Brigil last year, and witnessed the demolition a few weeks back. We spoke at his amazing store, and with his permission, I share his touching account of having repeatedly watched people arrive with their bags to travel — only to discover in shock that the station was closed, and now, completely gone.

The pandemic brought us inward to a kind of life that elevated the private home. Citizens of Ottawa now reckon with lasting changes and fallouts to the public realm, including the loss of inter-city bus travel. In letting the bus station close and sell to private condo developers without outcry, we have relinquished what for some was an affordable luxury and for others an essential lifeline. How great would it have been for this city to have been able to be the buyer, and for it to have reopened the station and developed affordable housing atop it? We have all lost.

The question of whether Canada’s capital should have a central bus station is a regional more than a municipal question, but we must ask it. The hinges between municipal, regional and federal politics open gaps through which services slip (and convoys rise). Inter-city travel is one of them, and in our city, its fall has recently left a very real and dusty gap in the urban fabric. It is time to fight for territorial connectivity and the relationships that keep us going, one 56-seater at a time.


Janine Debanné is Associate Professor, Azrieli School of Architecture and Urbanism, Carleton University.

https://ottawacitizen.com/opinion/debann...tral-inter-city-bus-station-hurts-us-all

[silvergate]

Originally Posted by rocketphish

Quiet loss — Ottawa's lack of a central, inter-city bus station hurts us all
How can the Canadian capital not have a bus station? And how did we not realize it was happening?

Janine Debanné, Ottawa Citizen
Oct 31, 2022 • 1 hour ago • 3 minute read



On an unseasonably warm late October day, I decided to go visit the old bus station with one of my architecture students. This was after a long conversation in which we decided that rejuvenating the bus station by folding a multi-use building — concert hall, hotel, affordable housing — into it would make a great thesis project. While I was aware that the site had been sold to Brigil, I remained somehow confident that the bus station would magically reopen. In the busyness of my life, I had not connected the dots.

My student and I arrived only to find that the site had recently been completely razed. The dusty lot’s huge dimensions were legible for the first time, and the row of houses along Argyle Street now read much more clearly. As a person who grew up in the Outaouais, I hold many memories of this place. Flashes of pickups and drop-offs from decades past filled my mind — from the first time I went to Montreal without my parents as a teen with my friend Stef, to the through-window wave to my mother looking back up at me through her tears the day I moved to Toronto and left home for the first time, in 1990.

I do not doubt that my feelings are shared by many others, be they citizens of Ottawa or of the myriad towns and cities to which this old bus station connected Canada’s capital. For the bus station — unflashy as it was — was a place of emotion.

A sign that reads “Building with Purpose” now forecasts the development that will follow the 15-minute city paradigm (and without inter-city travel, 15 minutes might be as far as some can go). The ghost of the un-beautiful, un-loved yet loved, corrugated brown metal / buff brick combo building pressed a long, shallow hole on the ground.

But how can the Canadian capital not have a bus station? And how did this happen so quietly?

We all know that the COVID years left urbanity and its rituals, such as inter-city travel, in parentheses. Once known as Voyageur Colonial and as of 1998 as Greyhound, the privately owned bus company that ran its operations on Catherine Street was the bloodline linking the capital and a constellation of small and larger towns and cities in Ontario and Quebec, an agent of nationhood and regional understanding. Bus stations in Ontario and Canada — these unassuming builders of connection — ensure the unfolding of fine-grained life and are especially important for the non-wealthy. We notice their quiet erosion.

Dave from Dave’s Drum Shop across the street from the station has watched the site through the pandemic and since the sale to Brigil last year, and witnessed the demolition a few weeks back. We spoke at his amazing store, and with his permission, I share his touching account of having repeatedly watched people arrive with their bags to travel — only to discover in shock that the station was closed, and now, completely gone.

The pandemic brought us inward to a kind of life that elevated the private home. Citizens of Ottawa now reckon with lasting changes and fallouts to the public realm, including the loss of inter-city bus travel. In letting the bus station close and sell to private condo developers without outcry, we have relinquished what for some was an affordable luxury and for others an essential lifeline. How great would it have been for this city to have been able to be the buyer, and for it to have reopened the station and developed affordable housing atop it? We have all lost.

The question of whether Canada’s capital should have a central bus station is a regional more than a municipal question, but we must ask it. The hinges between municipal, regional and federal politics open gaps through which services slip (and convoys rise). Inter-city travel is one of them, and in our city, its fall has recently left a very real and dusty gap in the urban fabric. It is time to fight for territorial connectivity and the relationships that keep us going, one 56-seater at a time.


Janine Debanné is Associate Professor, Azrieli School of Architecture and Urbanism, Carleton University.

https://ottawacitizen.com/opinion/debann...tral-inter-city-bus-station-hurts-us-all

Does this person not have access to the internet to think there are no more inter-city busses?

[J.OT13]

Never been familiar with what was offered, but I assume most routes still exist in one form or another, even if they were gone gone for a little while (a few months?)

I don't find the loss of the central bus station to be all that tragic. If was never in a great location in the first place, a kilometer away from the main bus routes through the city and a few city blocks from grossly unreliable, overcrowded and infrequent routes on Bank, Gladstone and Catherine. Situation now with intercity buses picking up passengers at Tremblay and St. Laurent, both well served by the O-Train, is far better.

That said, it would be nice if they could pick one place for all intercity buses with a proper indoor waiting area, arrival screens and lockers (are those still a thing?). VIA seems to be the most logical spot, since they already have an oversized, underused station. Hurdman comes to mind, if they could close off the concourse area below the tracks and add arrival screens (for OC and intercity buses) benches, heating and a/c.

[thewave46]

Originally Posted by J.OT13

Never been familiar with what was offered, but I assume most routes still exist in one form or another, even if they were gone gone for a little while (a few months?)

I don't find the loss of the central bus station to be all that tragic. If was never in a great location in the first place, a kilometer away from the main bus routes through the city and a few city blocks from grossly unreliable, overcrowded and infrequent routes on Bank, Gladstone and Catherine. Situation now with intercity buses picking up passengers at Tremblay and St. Laurent, both well served by the O-Train, is far better.

That said, it would be nice if they could pick one place for all intercity buses with a proper indoor waiting area, arrival screens and lockers (are those still a thing?). VIA seems to be the most logical spot, since they already have an oversized, underused station. Hurdman comes to mind, if they could close off the concourse area below the tracks and add arrival screens (for OC and intercity buses) benches, heating and a/c.

VIA station mostly makes sense for the bus terminal, I agree. At VIA, one can hit the Confederation Line and actually get somewhere without a vehicle, moreso than the previous downtown location.

The previous station was basically an industrial lane and required hiking, a car, or a taxi ride to get somewhere. Bay at Dundas, it was not, with TTC nearby. Heck, it wasn't even Yorkdale.

[acottawa]

Originally Posted by silvergate

Does this person not have access to the internet to think there are no more inter-city busses?

Also you would think a professor of architecture would have at least as passing knowledge of what was going on around town, particularly within a few hundred meters of campus. Greyhound (when there was a Greyhound) left the terminal in 2020 and it closed in 2021.

[YOWetal]

Originally Posted by silvergate

Does this person not have access to the internet to think there are no more inter-city busses?

Routes are quickly coming back and I would argue better than ever but the lucrative Toronto and Montreal routes. I don't think there is a North Bay or any routes further west or to the US at all. I don't imagine someone has actually arrived on one bus and departed on another in many years so the actual station does seem like a small loss. I get the nostalgia though and thought is was a well written.

[acottawa]

Originally Posted by YOWetal

Routes are quickly coming back and I would argue better than ever but the lucrative Toronto and Montreal routes. I don't think there is a North Bay or any routes further west or to the US at all. I don't imagine someone has actually arrived on one bus and departed on another in many years so the actual station does seem like a small loss. I get the nostalgia though and thought is was a well written.

Ontario Northland still has regular trips to Sudbury from the Via station. You can buy a ticket (with multiple transfers) as far as Winnipeg. Even before the pandemic there was only one US trip, to Syracuse with really weird hours.

[YOWetal]

Originally Posted by acottawa

Ontario Northland still has regular trips to Sudbury from the Via station. You can buy a ticket (with multiple transfers) as far as Winnipeg. Even before the pandemic there was only one US trip, to Syracuse with really weird hours.

So yeah Montreal to Winnipeg might require an LRT ride from St Laurent Centre depending on which provider you use.

NYC and Boston were options via Montreal though resumption of those routes is a Montreal issue rather than a Ottawa issue. I think one was restored and the train is still paused.

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by Acajack

Orléans Express is starting intercity motorcoach service on a Montreal-Ottawa-Gatineau route tomorrow.

Stops in the region AFAIK will be:

Ottawa VIA Rail station

Downtown somewhere on Slater

Place du Portage

Promenades Gatineau

In addition to Orléans Express, Autobus Maheux (based in Abitibi) also now does an Ottawa-Gatineau-Laval-Montreal run via A-50.

Ottawa stops are downtown (?) and St. Laurent/Coventry.

Maheux also runs a line down from Maniwaki to the Rideau Centre.