The not so Great Racism in Canada Thread - Page 88

Acajack · #**1741** Posted **Jun 17, 2020, 7:13 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by rousseau

If Matt Taibbi says it, you know it's true. In a lament on the state of the American press, this:

That scene where the Minneapolis mayor did a walk of shame through the braying mob? Chilling in a very Biblical and/or Maoist sense.

• Video Link

The impression I get keeps getting stronger and stronger. We're going to look back on this time in ten or twenty years with horror, and it's pretty damn clear that it's not the mobs who are going to end up on the right side of history.

The biggest groundswell right now isn't happening where the mob thinks it is. (They think it's overwhelmingly on their side.)

It's not an alt-right thing either.

It's really in the middle, and it's saying "uhhh, wait a minute now".

You hear very little of this under people's real names right now, as the mob is an extremely intimidating force.

Though you do hear it a lot on forums such as this one, given that we are anonymous.

But it's very noteworthy that almost no one with any authority is willing to say that in front of a microphone right now.

It's not because they're more morally virtuous or enlightened than we are. It's because they are afraid of the mob.

MonctonRad · #**1742** Posted **Jun 17, 2020, 7:17 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Acajack

It's not because they're more morally virtuous or enlightened than we are. It's because they are afraid of the mob.

It's like the French Revolution out there! Where's Robespierre????

wave46 · #**1743** Posted **Jun 17, 2020, 7:21 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Acajack

The biggest groundswell right now isn't happening where the mob thinks it is. (They think it's overwhelmingly on their side.)

It's not an alt-right thing either.

It's really in the middle, and it's saying "uhhh, wait a minute now".

You hear very little of this under people's real names right now, as the mob is an extremely intimidating force.

Though you do hear it a lot on forums such as this one, given that we are anonymous.

But it's very noteworthy that almost no one with any authority is willing to say that in front of a microphone right now.

It's not because they're more morally virtuous or enlightened than we are. It's because they are afraid of the mob.

Ah, the Silent Majority.

I do notice that the leadership of the Democratic Party is very quiet on these protests. Biden is nowhere to be seen.

They know their path to the White House lies in the Silent Majority, not the mob. If they get too close to the mob, the Silent Majority chooses Trump.

memememe76 · #**1744** Posted **Jun 17, 2020, 7:24 PM**

Everyone thinks they're reasonable, their voices aren't being heard, bleh. Who says they're part of the mob?

Acajack · #**1745** Posted **Jun 17, 2020, 7:27 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by wave46

Ah, the Silent Majority.

I do notice that the leadership of the Democratic Party is very quiet on these protests. Biden is nowhere to be seen.

They know their path to the White House lies in the Silent Majority, not the mob. If they get too close to the mob, the Silent Majority chooses Trump.

This is my reading as well.

The Dems also know that in a two-party system with Trump as the antichrist on the other side, they have the mob's support regardless.

But another big danger for them is that even without any blunders by the Dems, the mob could still antagonize the silent majority by themselves and push them into the arms of Trump

SignalHillHiker · #**1746** Posted **Jun 17, 2020, 7:29 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Acajack

The biggest groundswell right now isn't happening where the mob thinks it is. (They think it's overwhelmingly on their side.)

It's not an alt-right thing either.

It's really in the middle, and it's saying "uhhh, wait a minute now".

You hear very little of this under people's real names right now, as the mob is an extremely intimidating force.

Though you do hear it a lot on forums such as this one, given that we are anonymous.

But it's very noteworthy that almost no one with any authority is willing to say that in front of a microphone right now.

It's not because they're more morally virtuous or enlightened than we are. It's because they are afraid of the mob.

I get a hint of this...

I don't think we're facing a revolution. Some places will follow Compton's lead and improve, but the ruling classes won't let much change and the majority of people don't give a 🞵🞵🞵🞵 either way and will continue to be satisfied with their lives.

I don't think any of this represents any ideological agreement or disagreement with the "mobs". It's just societal momentum and inertia are whatever.

rousseau · #**1747** Posted **Jun 17, 2020, 7:30 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Acajack

The biggest groundswell right now isn't happening where the mob thinks it is. (They think it's overwhelmingly on their side.)

It's not an alt-right thing either.

It's really in the middle, and it's saying "uhhh, wait a minute now".

You hear very little of this under people's real names right now, as the mob is an extremely intimidating force.

Though you do hear it a lot on forums such as this one, given that we are anonymous.

But it's very noteworthy that almost no one with any authority is willing to say that in front of a microphone right now.

It's not because they're more morally virtuous or enlightened than we are. It's because they are afraid of the mob.

Every now and then I'm sorely tempted to engage my hectoring Facebook "friends" in discussion about this, but I always take a deep breath, push back from my desk, and say "🞵🞵🞵🞵 it, it's not worth it."

Acajack · #**1748** Posted **Jun 17, 2020, 7:34 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by rousseau

Every now and then I'm sorely tempted to engage my hectoring Facebook "friends" in discussion about this, but I always take a deep breath, push back from my desk, and say "🞵🞵🞵🞵 it, it's not worth it."

Smart decision!

Acajack · #**1749** Posted **Jun 17, 2020, 7:37 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by SignalHillHiker

I get a hint of this...

I don't think we're facing a revolution. Some places will follow Compton's lead and improve, but the ruling classes won't let much change and the majority of people don't give a 🞵🞵🞵🞵 either way and will continue to be satisfied with their lives.

I don't think any of this represents any ideological agreement or disagreement with the "mobs". It's just societal momentum and inertia are whatever.

Post-war western societies were set up with stability in mind.

A big part of keeping them stable is giving the population (or at least as big a share as possible) a personal stake in the future of the system.

Inertia is the goal.

The more people have everything to lose in seeing the apple cart upset, the better it is for the system.

wave46 · #**1750** Posted **Jun 17, 2020, 7:38 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by SignalHillHiker

I get a hint of this...

I don't think we're facing a revolution. Some places will follow Compton's lead and improve, but the ruling classes won't let much change and the majority of people don't give a 🞵🞵🞵🞵 either way and will continue to be satisfied with their lives.

I don't think any of this represents any ideological agreement or disagreement with the "mobs". It's just societal momentum and inertia are whatever.

There is a disconnect between the real world and social media.

I think social media is here to stay, but I'm not sure anybody who values a filter in their life will keep using it regularly. The militant will harass the militant and the majority will just keep posting pictures of their food, cat or whatever.

Have we seen peak Facebook yet? It's interesting to note that the trendiest apps are one that reveal a lot less about one's self than formerly. Maybe that's the future, I suppose.

I sure as hell wouldn't put my social details out in the open. I value my privacy too much.

Acajack · #**1751** Posted **Jun 17, 2020, 7:49 PM**

On the Aunt Jemima file...

I have noticed that it's hit the Québécois news wires and social media.

Almost all the comments are exactly the same as mine: it was a beloved image of a sweet lady who was proud to cook for her family, that one never would have considered racist.

But as MolsonEx says, context is everything.

someone123 · #**1752** Posted **Jun 17, 2020, 7:50 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by SignalHillHiker

I don't think we're facing a revolution. Some places will follow Compton's lead and improve, but the ruling classes won't let much change and the majority of people don't give a 🞵🞵🞵🞵 either way and will continue to be satisfied with their lives.

What is exceptional in the US is just how many formerly middle class university-educated folks and even those in positions of authority and power are expressing "burn it down" sentiment. That is exactly what revolution means. You don't want to tweak the old system, you want to blow it up and you hope something better will replace it.

The mayor of Seattle paints an equivocal picture of the CHOP situation where a police building was vandalized and law and order have broken down in part of the city. According to the police chief there, 911 calls there went up 3x and the ability of police to respond is limited. She also spoke about ID checks being done by random armed people in the area.

Questioning a break down of law and order has little to do with race or anti-racism. I doubt the average South Side Chicago resident wanted their local Walgreens vandalized or shut down.

I think Donald Trump has a lot to do with this attitude. Hopefully the US will one day have at least a semi-competent president who restores some faith in "the system".

My impression is that we don't suffer from this issue nearly as much in Canada. Some extreme voices try to paint Justin Trudeau as a disastrous Trumpian figure but that view does not seem to be catching on.

Acajack · #**1753** Posted **Jun 17, 2020, 7:53 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by someone123

What is exceptional in the US is just how many formerly middle class university-educated folks and even those in positions of authority and power are expressing "burn it down" sentiment. .

Are they actually "formerly" middle class? I would wager most of them still are, and if they are younger are at least on the express route to the middle and upper classes.

Acajack · #**1754** Posted **Jun 17, 2020, 7:55 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by someone123

The mayor of Seattle paints an equivocal picture of the CHOP situation where a police building was vandalized and law and order have broken down in part of the city. According to the police chief there, 911 calls there went up 3x and the ability of police to respond is limited. She also spoke about ID checks being done by random armed people in the area.
.

Is this actually confirmed? I am actually hearing a lot of denials about the situation there, and claims that it isn't chaotic at all.

someone123 · #**1755** Posted **Jun 17, 2020, 7:55 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Acajack

Are they actually "formerly" middle class? I would wager most of them still are, and if they are younger are at least on the express route to the middle and upper classes.

I meant to paint a picture of a vast swath of American society. At the bottom end of that swath is a bunch of (mostly white, but racially mixed) university-educated younger people with debt and awful employment prospects. That group tends to be in the "burn it down" camp, for obvious reasons. But then more surprisingly as you move up to the middle and upper classes, in the progressive parts of the US at least, you still find a lot of pseudo-Marxist rhetoric.

Another important aspect is that the poor Millennial grads mostly have comparatively well-off Boomer parents, which makes things much worse.

Of course I am skeptical that Berkeley profs who own multimillion dollar houses truly want to burn it all down. But they are acting as an accelerant rather than stabilizing factor even though they are very privileged in our current economic order.

WarrenC12 · #**1756** Posted **Jun 17, 2020, 7:57 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by wave46

Ah, the Silent Majority.

I do notice that the leadership of the Democratic Party is very quiet on these protests. Biden is nowhere to be seen.

They know their path to the White House lies in the Silent Majority, not the mob. If they get too close to the mob, the Silent Majority chooses Trump.

Absolutely. As if any mainstream candidate is going to use "Defund" or "Abolish" the police anywhere near their platform.

WarrenC12 · #**1757** Posted **Jun 17, 2020, 7:59 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Acajack

Post-war western societies were set up with stability in mind.

A big part of keeping them stable is giving the population (or at least as big a share as possible) a personal stake in the future of the system.

Inertia is the goal.

The more people have everything to lose in seeing the apple cart upset, the better it is for the system.

That's correct. The current problem, which has gotten worse since "Occupy Wall Street" is that Millenials are facing a pretty grim future. Boomers have climbed up the financial ladder and taken it up with them.

It's no wonder they are upset...

wave46 · #**1758** Posted **Jun 17, 2020, 8:17 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Acajack

Post-war western societies were set up with stability in mind.

A big part of keeping them stable is giving the population (or at least as big a share as possible) a personal stake in the future of the system.

Inertia is the goal.

The more people have everything to lose in seeing the apple cart upset, the better it is for the system.

Indeed.

The upper crust should worry about this, unless they are rich enough to plan to cash out just before 🞵🞵🞵🞵 hits the fan.

However, the short-sightedness of 'get rich now, pay later' is a sweet one in the immediate term. Depending on inertia, you could conceivably come out ahead by tossing less fortunate people under the bus. It works, until it doesn't, at which point you'd better have a quick exit planned.

That's a damned big 🞵🞵🞵🞵🞵🞵 though.

someone123 · #**1759** Posted **Jun 17, 2020, 8:19 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by wave46

The upper crust should worry about this, unless they are rich enough to plan to cash out just before 🞵🞵🞵🞵 hits the fan.

I don't think "so rich the political state of your country has no effect on you" is a real thing.

You can move to a bunker on a remote island, sure, but that's still a change in lifestyle that will be disappointing for a New York-London-Paris socialite, and you still need to trust your servants. The rich benefit from stability and widespread health and prosperity. The billionaires who don't think they need healthy public institutions are fools.

Donald Trump is more at risk of dying of covid than the average Millennial. Some phenomena are great equalizers and wealth can't change everything.

Chadillaccc · #**1760** Posted **Jun 17, 2020, 8:48 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Acajack

Post-war western societies were set up with stability in mind.

A big part of keeping them stable is giving the population (or at least as big a share as possible) a personal stake in the future of the system.

Inertia is the goal.

The more people have everything to lose in seeing the apple cart upset, the better it is for the system.

That is disgracefully true :/