Heavy Rail, Commuter Rail, & Intercity Transportation

[Metro-One]

Originally Posted by swimmer_spe

Western Alienation is a worry of this government. If they were asked by the US government to pay $1B for the section in Canada, they would. Then it would be a great way to show they care about anything west of the 89th Meridian.

Also more major green projects such as this will be good PR like never before. I once thought of this project as a pipe dream, but if Trump is defeated next year the all the necessary stars may have been aligned.

[logan5]

Originally Posted by ssiguy

Ottawa will NEVER, EVER contribute one dime towards this project before it gives billions to a similar line in the Windsor-Quebec City Corridor. Any HSR funding in Canada is going straight to The Corridor and anyone who thinks that's not the case is, forgive my bluntness, dilusional.

Justin Trudeau himself made the announcement that Amazon would be opening a large office in Vancouver, so Ottawa is very aware of the importance and the the economic spin-offs of a 48 minute link to Seattle. HSR to Vancouver would vault Vancouver into an economic power house in this country. Ottawa would jump at the opportunity. The federal contribution to to a Toronto/Montreal HSR would be massive compared to the small contribution required to complete the Vancouver section in a Seattle link.

[lokyin]

Originally Posted by ssiguy

Ottawa will NEVER, EVER contribute one dime towards this project before it gives billions to a similar line in the Windsor-Quebec City Corridor. Any HSR funding in Canada is going straight to The Corridor and anyone who thinks that's not the case is, forgive my bluntness, dilusional.

Originally Posted by trofirhen

You are 100% correct, IMO. Why? The Windsor-QC corridor is where the majority of Canadians live, and where the greatest number of federal ridings are, and where the votes are. Voilà.
And speaking of HSR in that corridor, although a true HSR is planned and may be in the works, the current fastest train in Canada is about as fast as some Paris commuter railways.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XMRS_qi4s0Q

Originally Posted by logan5

Justin Trudeau himself made the announcement that Amazon would be opening a large office in Vancouver, so Ottawa is very aware of the importance and the the economic spin-offs of a 48 minute link to Seattle. HSR to Vancouver would vault Vancouver into an economic power house in this country. Ottawa would jump at the opportunity. The federal contribution to to a Toronto/Montreal HSR would be massive compared to the small contribution required to complete the Vancouver section in a Seattle link.

I guess if it's done through a national transportation project fund of some kind, it could be that they have a pool of funds to concurrently enable a list projects that are to be funded like...
1) Windsor-Quebec HSR
2) Edmonton-Calgary
3) Vancouver-Seattle-Portland (Canadian Portion)
4) Lower Mainland / Fraser Valley Commuter Rail

That way it plays to having most money spent on "the corridor" yet also playing to appeasing Western needs... done via an application to achieve funding setup or something.

[fredinno]

Originally Posted by WarrenC12

Not the point. I asked about LRT terminating on SFU or if another bus transfer would still be required for students. The Hastings route to SFU is popular for students and SFU residents today.

Originally Posted by lokyin

Thanks for the numbers! Certainly gives a lot of context to substantiate the discussion.

Based on those numbers, Hastings certainly doesn't compare to Broadway, but I'm curious what the development/density potential is for the Hastings if it had a Skytrain line, compared to the UBC extension. Would we have a better ability to densify the Hastings corridor to create "town centres" at say Hastings & Commercial, Kootenay, Willingdon, Kensington (like how they're hub-ifying with tall towers at Brentwood, Lougheed, Coquitlam? Burnaby seems to be good at doing that (compared to CoV...)

And then if we compare that to the potential of, say, Broadway/Alma and Broadway/Macdonald's potential for higher density residential/employment. I mean, besides the current ridership numbers, perhaps the Skytrain deserves a shot at Hastings as a tool to create more viable density for the region.

And another idea... perhaps a Hastings Skytrain line can go to Kootenay Loop then turn north to tunnel through Burrard to north shore to Phibbs? Seems like an easier crossing there.

Wondering if an eastward Hastings line would actually get more "mayor's council" votes as it benefits more of the mayors / districts.

The problem is the same with any LRT project that uses parking lanes. If you're going to take parking lanes from businesses, it's way more likely to go forwards due to cost (Hundred of millions vs Billions)by upgrading the 95 to BRT (not 'Rapidbus' curb bus lanes (which would be closer to the tens of millions)). https://imgur.com/a/uVyZY

Originally Posted by SpongeG

with the Seattle-Vancouver high speed rail link how much is Canada expected to contribute?

people in Chilliwack seem kinda pissed about it based on comments I've been reading.

Source?

I guess the idea of commuter rail to Chilliwack never dies. Ask them to join TransLink (and pay all the extra taxes that that brings), and in exchange, give them rail. Seems fair.

[twoNeurons]

Remember, a Vancouver–Seattle link wouldn't necessarily be seen as prioritizing the West over the East... as this link really is more about connecting Canada and the USA. The contributions to a Windsor Line would eclipse this line by a large margin as it would an all-in-Canada line.

And as for Chilliwack... yes they'll complain... but in reality, HSR lines are more like ground airports than train lines.

If you look at ridership for HSR it's VERY commonly MOSTLY point-to-point. There will be FAR more Vancouver-Seattle trips than Bellingham to Seattle... or Vancouver to Everett.

Take a look at Japanese trains... Out of 18 trains per hour between Tokyo and Osaka... only ONE makes all the stops. The MAJORITY are Nozomi service and make stops ONLY at Shinagawa, Yokohama (essentially a suburb of Tokyo), Nagoya, and Kyoto on their way to Osaka.

The new 500km/h line they're building will likely have 5 or 6 trains / hour... 4 of them with exactly 0 stops between Tokyo(Shinagawa) and Nagoya.

HSR train lines are more like medium-distance airports. And no one complains that the airplanes in the sky aren't making pit stops in Bellingham to pick up passengers on the way to Seatac.

[officedweller]

White Rock train whistles to be silenced at end of month
BY RENEE BERNARD
Posted Jan 16, 2020 8:45 pm PST Last Updated Jan 16, 2020 at 9:52 pm PST
...
Starting on Jan. 29, the whistles will be, more or less, silenced due to a new whistle policy which applies to eight railway crossings in the city.
...
The eight crossings had to be upgraded according to Transport Canada standards.

“It was expensive. We had to create new rail crossings,” Kristjanson says. “The rail crossings were uncontrolled before so to meet the regulations to cease the whistles, they had to have automatic gates that go down and bells. It’s not going to be silent, the bells are still going to go off, but it’s a lot less decibels than the trains.”
...

https://www.citynews1130.com/2020/01/16/white-rock-train-whistles-silenced/

[Bdawe]

Some shiny new track on the Burrard Inlet Line

[VancouverOfTheFuture]

Originally Posted by Bdawe

Some shiny new track on the Burrard Inlet Line

well they do plan to double track it. it is crazy that just in the 90s they had nearly abandoned it and now it can see 12 trains a day.

[Bdawe]

Originally Posted by VancouverOfTheFuture

well they do plan to double track it. it is crazy that just in the 90s they had nearly abandoned it and now it can see 12 trains a day.

Which still surprises because it still fouls the CP line to run anything that way.

I've always wondered if, given all the overpasses built over the years, if they would have saved any money to elevate the line decades ago

[VancouverOfTheFuture]

Originally Posted by Bdawe

I've always wondered if, given all the overpasses built over the years, if they would have saved any money to elevate the line decades ago

they cant alleviate it. they are talking about doubling it because what there now isn't enough. the complete opposite of that. they'd be kicking themselves forever had they divested it. even the CPR is looking at ways to add another track on their line. but without carving out lots of rock, i don't see it happening.

the Burrard Inlet Line is the only non-CPR line going to a major industrial area in Vancouver. and Centerm/Vanterm are very busy ports.

[swimmer_spe]

Originally Posted by VancouverOfTheFuture

they cant alleviate it. they are talking about doubling it because what there now isn't enough. the complete opposite of that. they'd be kicking themselves forever had they divested it. even the CPR is looking at ways to add another track on their line. but without carving out lots of rock, i don't see it happening.

the Burrard Inlet Line is the only non-CPR line going to a major industrial area in Vancouver. and Centerm/Vanterm are very busy ports.

Is this the line in North Van?

[Bdawe]

Originally Posted by swimmer_spe

Is this the line in North Van?

It's the line from False Creek to the Waterfront. The viaduct in the background is Hastings Street

[VancouverOfTheFuture]

Originally Posted by swimmer_spe

Is this the line in North Van?

no, it connects from the False Creek flats rail-yards by Central Station to the Centerm of the port. so it would continue through the Grandview Cut. the new overpass at Powell crosses it.

Originally Posted by Bdawe

It's the line from False Creek to the Waterfront. The viaduct in the background is Hastings Street

correct


the plan, before the virus anyways, was to double track it, and from what i heard the Grandview cut as well. i believe this would happen around the same time as the Prior St underpass and various road closures/reroutes around the tracks.

[Bdawe]

Originally Posted by VancouverOfTheFuture

the plan, before the virus anyways, was to double track it, and from what i heard the Grandview cut as well. i believe this would happen around the same time as the Prior St underpass and various road closures/reroutes around the tracks.

They've been doing some work all up and down the line lately. They replaced the switch at Slocan Street where it goes from one track through the cut to two. They've replaced rails all up and down the BI Line, and they are building the new siding between Piper and Willingdon in Burnaby. It *seems* like they might be clearing the right of way for double tracking on the BI Line, but not sure when the second track will go in

[twoNeurons]

Originally Posted by Bdawe

They've been doing some work all up and down the line lately. They replaced the switch at Slocan Street where it goes from one track through the cut to two. They've replaced rails all up and down the BI Line, and they are building the new siding between Piper and Willingdon in Burnaby. It *seems* like they might be clearing the right of way for double tracking on the BI Line, but not sure when the second track will go in

If they double track this line are there plans for any new overpasses?

I don't think ALL the streets need them, but Venables will likely benefit from one as well as incorporating a bike overpass from Union (perhaps a horseshoe design for the bike overpass)?

This would put La Casa Gelato in its shadow, but I think they almost would need to purchase that property to double track the line around there.

If you pull up a Google maps image right now there's a train passing, which kind of tell you how busy that section of track is if it got caught on the satellite pass.

It looks like Apple Maps digitally strips most of the trains from the maps, nice.

The Transition from 2 to 1 track around Union (Apple and Google Maps):
https://www.screencast.com/t/KziPPKR6Qz
https://www.screencast.com/t/kD9Bio90

Tracks including yard and Hastings Overpass (Apple and Google Maps):
https://www.screencast.com/t/0Mb7ojJwe
https://www.screencast.com/t/8sgMejmDO

[Changing City]

Originally Posted by twoNeurons

If they double track this line are there plans for any new overpasses?

I don't think ALL the streets need them, but Venables will likely benefit from one as well as incorporating a bike overpass from Union (perhaps a horseshoe design for the bike overpass)?

This would put La Casa Gelato in its shadow, but I think they almost would need to purchase that property to double track the line around there.

It's going to be an underpass on Prior/Venables.

[twoNeurons]

Originally Posted by twoNeurons

If they double track this line are there plans for any new overpasses?

Okay... I just realized that the Prior street Underpass IS the Venables crossing. I'm assuming they'll incorporate a bike lane as well? I'll have to look up the Prior St. Underpass designs.

[twoNeurons]

Originally Posted by Changing City

It's going to be an underpass on Prior/Venables.

Yes, thanks for this. I had a bit of a brain fart.

[Changing City]

Originally Posted by twoNeurons

Okay... I just realized that the Prior street Underpass IS the Venables crossing. I'm assuming they'll incorporate a bike lane as well? I'll have to look up the Prior St. Underpass designs.

Yes - it's on the north side (in the image looking east)

They're currently piling for the south edge of the parkade under the rebuilt Villa Cathay care home. (The tower phase is complete; now they're redeveloping the old building alongside). I don't know if they needed that to build the care home parkade anyway, but it seems a good idea if they're putting to new underpass alongside, so that may be why they're taking the opportunity while construction is underway.

[Alex Mackinnon]

I doubt much would be happening on the underpass alignment yet. To my knowledge, the neighbourhood association is still fighting the city on this one.

They're pissed that the city wants to keep Venables and Prior as the main traffic carrying street in the neighbourhood.

The city proposed calming Venables/Prior at the same time as installing the underpass. It's the usual slowly trying to decide if they want to 🞵🞵🞵🞵 or blow, and doing both poorly. I think its ridiculous that they spent all these years investigating other alignments and have gone back to Prior. So much face palm.