VIA Rail

[roger1818]

Originally Posted by Truenorth00

Tough sell to pitch projects that don't have any study behind them and with the end result that government will have to throw tens or hundreds of millions in new operating subsidies after the project is done.

To be fair, resumption of the Victoria–Courtenay train has been studied and the Federal government promised $7.5 million to do the repairs back in 2014, but never came through with the funds. ref1, ref2 Also, VIA Rail did list this route (along with the Matapédia – Gaspé route) as two of their Regional Services in their Summary of the 2018-2022 Corporate Plan on pg.21, but indicate that they "have been suspended for safety reasons."

[swimmer_spe]

Originally Posted by Truenorth00

The point of shovel ready projects is to build infrastructure and create jobs in the process. Not to incur more long term liabilities without substantial strategic gain.

I expect the vast majority of shovel ready projects to be municipal infrastructure projects that were deferred and then some medium horizon projects like HFR that have strategic benefit to the economy (in the long run) while creating some employment. There's already comments to this effect:

https://www.theglobeandmail.com/politics...ady-projects-for-post-shutdown-stimulus/

Tough sell to pitch projects that don't have any study behind them and with the end result that government will have to throw tens or hundreds of millions in new operating subsidies after the project is done.

Both that I mentioned have all the necessary stuff to do them. If anything, HFR is the only one without a fully planed plan.

Originally Posted by roger1818

By "The Dayliner" I assume you mean the Victoria–Courtenay train (aka the Malahat or E&N)? One issue is it will no longer be possible to have a station in downtown Victoria. The tracks were removed and the station was demolished when the Johnson Street Bridge was replaced in 2018. You could still have a station across the narrows in Victoria West, but you would need to find a new location for and build a new station.

Victoria Station Before & After

Image capture: Jun 2009 © 2020 Google


Image capture: May 2018 © 2020 Google

Originally Posted by roger1818

To be fair, resumption of the Victoria–Courtenay train has been studied and the Federal government promised $7.5 million to do the repairs back in 2014, but never came through with the funds. ref1, ref2 Also, VIA Rail did list this route (along with the Matapédia – Gaspé route) as two of their Regional Services in their Summary of the 2018-2022 Corporate Plan on pg.21, but indicate that they "have been suspended for safety reasons."

Yes, this is the Dayliner. I know that the Victoria Station is gone and won't be back. Howeverr, at the time of the Johnson St Bridge, there was a plan for the line to have it's own bridge, on the opposite side of where it was. The station was moved, and could be put back. This project is not much different than the restoration of the Churchill train.

[Truenorth00]

Originally Posted by roger1818

To be fair, resumption of the Victoria–Courtenay train has been studied and the Federal government promised $7.5 million to do the repairs back in 2014, but never came through with the funds. ref1, ref2 Also, VIA Rail did list this route (along with the Matapédia – Gaspé route) as two of their Regional Services in their Summary of the 2018-2022 Corporate Plan on pg.21, but indicate that they "have been suspended for safety reasons."

Thanks for the info! Didn't know this had already been studied in the past. Should be a candidate then. Would be curious to see where the BC government stands on their infrastructure priorities and if this is on there at all.

[scryer]

Originally Posted by Truenorth00

Thanks for the info! Didn't know this had already been studied in the past. Should be a candidate then. Would be curious to see where the BC government stands on their infrastructure priorities and if this is on there at all.

Unfortunately I don't think that the BC government has prioritized intercity rail solutions in the past (nor will it right now). Victoria is specifically a very tough place to lay down tracks because it's a city that really never had any rail corridors and, TBH, it is quite dense in the core for a city its size. And let's not forget the NIMBYs.

[swimmer_spe]

Originally Posted by Truenorth00

Thanks for the info! Didn't know this had already been studied in the past. Should be a candidate then. Would be curious to see where the BC government stands on their infrastructure priorities and if this is on there at all.

They have been talked about it, but not putting any money up for it. I imagine that various Skytrain extensions are more on their mind.

[swimmer_spe]

Originally Posted by scryer

Unfortunately I don't think that the BC government has prioritized intercity rail solutions in the past (nor will it right now). Victoria is specifically a very tough place to lay down tracks because it's a city that really never had any rail corridors and, TBH, it is quite dense in the core for a city its size. And let's not forget the NIMBYs.

The line I mentioned still exists in it's entirety, except for the terminus station in Victoria's downtown. What is needed is the replacement of the ties and some of the bridges are needing to be rehabilitated. Three things are all that is needed to return passenger rail on that line.

[roger1818]

Originally Posted by scryer

Unfortunately I don't think that the BC government has prioritized intercity rail solutions in the past (nor will it right now).

They are actually more supportive than you are implying. They had committed to contribute (along with the local and federal governments) to the line's refurbishment in 2014 and in 2019 the provincial government commissioned an updated detailed assessment of the current condition of the tracks. ref

Victoria is specifically a very tough place to lay down tracks because it's a city that really never had any rail corridors and, TBH, it is quite dense in the core for a city its size.

Not true. It was apparently the third Canadian city to have trams (which have long been torn up) and there were three main rail lines to Victioria that merged and terminated at the former rail station just east of the Johnson Street bridge (see map at bottom of the post). Two of the rail lines have been torn up and turned into trails (the Galloping Goose Regional Trail and the Lochside Regional Trail)

The smallness and density works in Victoria's favour as a station anywhere in the city will be within easy walking distance of anywhere in the downtown.

And let's not forget the NIMBYs.

NIMBYs are always a problem, but in a left leaning population, they are less of a problem. A bigger concern is the "Island Corridor Foundation" as they are apparently fighting to have the rails torn up and have it turned into another trail ref. I am disappointed at this as I was involved back in the early 90's in the development of the Galloping Goose Trail and the origination at the time was intentionally called Rails With Trails to show support for the return of the tracks on the ROW in the future (the tracks had already been torn up and the ROW was already showing signs of being absorbed by surrounding property owners).

[JHikka]

https://www.newswire.ca/news-releases/vi...he-canadian-and-the-ocean-802444174.html

MONTRÉAL, May 6, 2020 /CNW Telbec/ - As the COVID-19 crisis continues to disrupt its passenger services from coast to coast, VIA Rail Canada (VIA Rail) announces the extension of the suspension of the Canadian and the Ocean services, its long-distance routes, and the suspension of the Sleeper class on the Winnipeg-Churchill route until November 1, 2020.

[swimmer_spe]

Originally Posted by JHikka

https://www.newswire.ca/news-releases/vi...he-canadian-and-the-ocean-802444174.html

MONTRÉAL, May 6, 2020 /CNW Telbec/ - As the COVID-19 crisis continues to disrupt its passenger services from coast to coast, VIA Rail Canada (VIA Rail) announces the extension of the suspension of the Canadian and the Ocean services, its long-distance routes, and the suspension of the Sleeper class on the Winnipeg-Churchill route until November 1, 2020.

If only it could be broken up into chunks.... Oh, wait, I suggested that before.

It wouldn't be ideal, but at least a run of a day or so, sitting up would help you get where you need to go.

That is what happens when you move your model from a transportation model into a tourism model.

[esquire]

Originally Posted by JHikka

https://www.newswire.ca/news-releases/vi...he-canadian-and-the-ocean-802444174.html

MONTRÉAL, May 6, 2020 /CNW Telbec/ - As the COVID-19 crisis continues to disrupt its passenger services from coast to coast, VIA Rail Canada (VIA Rail) announces the extension of the suspension of the Canadian and the Ocean services, its long-distance routes, and the suspension of the Sleeper class on the Winnipeg-Churchill route until November 1, 2020.

Incredible. So all that's left until November are the Quebec City-Windsor Corridor services?

[milomilo]

Originally Posted by esquire

Incredible. So all that's left until November are the Quebec City-Windsor Corridor services?

The only part of the network that approaches "proper" rail service, and thus is useful to its users?

[Truenorth00]

Originally Posted by milomilo

The only part of the network that approaches "proper" rail service, and thus is useful to its users?

Not to mention over two thirds of VIA's revenue.

[esquire]

^ Thank you both for those useless responses.

With the somewhat vague way that the press release is worded, at first glance I took it to mean that the suspension of the Canadian/the Ocean/long-distance routes, and the suspension of the Sleeper class on the Winnipeg-Churchill route were two separate things with only the latter having a planned restart date of November 1. But it does appear that everything outside of the corridor except, I'm assuming, essential remote services are cancelled until November.

[Urban_Sky]

Originally Posted by esquire

^ Thank you both for those useless responses.

With the somewhat vague way that the press release is worded, at first glance I took it to mean that the suspension of the Canadian/the Ocean/long-distance routes, and the suspension of the Sleeper class on the Winnipeg-Churchill route were two separate things with only the latter having a planned restart date of November 1. But it does appear that everything outside of the corridor except, I'm assuming, essential remote services are cancelled until November.

The following VIA trains are still operating as the current (temporary) schedule remains in force until further notice:

• Quebec-Montreal-Ottawa: 39 (daily)
• Ottawa-Montreal-Quebec: 22 (daily)
• Montreal-Toronto: 63 (daily)
• Toronto-Montreal: 66 (daily)
• Ottawa-Toronto: 53 (daily)
• Toronto-Ottawa: 44 (daily)
• Toronto-Windsor: 75 (daily)
• Windsor-Toronto: 72 (daily)
• Toronto-Sarnia: 87 (daily)
• Sarnia-Toronto: 84 (daily)
• Montreal-Jonquiere: 601 (Fridays only)
• Jonquiere-Montreal: 600 (Sundays only)
• Montreal-Senneterre: 603 (Fridays only)
• Senneterre-Montreal: 604 (Sundays only)
• Sudbury-White River: 185 (Saturdays only)
• White River-Sudbury: 186 (Sundays only)
• Winnipeg-Churchill: 693 (Sunday+Tuesday, i.e. as per regular schedule)
• Churchill-Winnipeg: 692 (Thursday+Saturday, i.e. as per regular schedule)
• The Pas-Churchill: 691 (Friday, i.e. as per regular schedule)
• Churchill-The Pas: 690 (Tuesday, i.e. as per regular schedule)

All trains operate with Economy class only (i.e. no Business or Sleeper accommodations are offered at this point).

If you want me to participate further in this discussion, please create a separate thread, as it's impossible for me to engage in a meaningful discussion if the person accounting for by far the most posts in this thread blocks me from interacting with him...

[esquire]

^ Thanks for the information, Urban_Sky!

Interesting to see that the Winnipeg-Churchill train is running with coaches only. I presume there must be a sleeping car in the consist to provide crew accommodations...

[swimmer_spe]

Originally Posted by esquire

^ Thank you both for those useless responses.

With the somewhat vague way that the press release is worded, at first glance I took it to mean that the suspension of the Canadian/the Ocean/long-distance routes, and the suspension of the Sleeper class on the Winnipeg-Churchill route were two separate things with only the latter having a planned restart date of November 1. But it does appear that everything outside of the corridor except, I'm assuming, essential remote services are cancelled until November.

It is interesting, the only route outside the corridor not affected is the Sudbury - White River train. Thinking about it, the Montreal - Senneterre/Jonquiere should also be able to run unchanged.

Maybe this, along with other things that have been happening in the last few months might make VIA open their eyes to the realities of running passenger service that does not serve the country as a whole.

Most likely, this might be the excuse they need to shut all the other routes down.

[esquire]

Originally Posted by swimmer_spe

Maybe this, along with other things that have been happening in the last few months might make VIA open their eyes to the realities of running passenger service that does not serve the country as a whole.

Most likely, this might be the excuse they need to shut all the other routes down.

The current situation would provide the perfect cover for a political decision to do just that... either to cut back service dramatically, or to eliminate it altogether.

[roger1818]

Originally Posted by swimmer_spe

It is interesting, the only route outside the corridor not affected is the Sudbury - White River train. Thinking about it, the Montreal - Senneterre/Jonquiere should also be able to run unchanged.

Maybe this, along with other things that have been happening in the last few months might make VIA open their eyes to the realities of running passenger service that does not serve the country as a whole.

Most likely, this might be the excuse they need to shut all the other routes down.

If you actually read Urban_Sky's posts, you would know that there are other trains running outside of the corridor, but I won't repeat what he said since you seem more interested in FUD than the truth.

[GoTrans]

Originally Posted by esquire

The current situation would provide the perfect cover for a political decision to do just that... either to cut back service dramatically, or to eliminate it altogether.

Unfortunately the Liberals could easily get rid of the western services as there is no political fallout for them. They have already lost the support of the people in the west and have rendered the transcontinental service irrelevant to the citizens and taxpayers of the western provinces. If they were smart they would replace the transcontinental service with a series of short daytime or overnight trains providing daily service to the west.

In the east they would lose some political support but they have once again rendered the train irrelevant to most people's needs.

[swimmer_spe]

Originally Posted by roger1818

If you actually read Urban_Sky's posts, you would know that there are other trains running outside of the corridor, but I won't repeat what he said since you seem more interested in FUD than the truth.

Due to many reasons, I have blocked him. I feel that we no longer can have a civil conversation, so, it is better to not expose all of you to it. Unless that is what you really want....