Olympic Village & Southeast False Creek Updates Discussion

[misher]

Originally Posted by fredinno

You can't predict the future in such narrow strokes.

You can predict the minimum amount you need in your future vision.

For instance we need at the minimum 1 grocery store at major infrastructure and population hubs. And a few film studios.

An obvious example of whats missing, there is no nearby grocery store to Broadway and Granville or Burrard or Oak despite this being a major hub. And no the small expensive German place blocks south doesn't count.

The need for a grocery store is much higher than a coffee shop, or McDondalds, or a shoe store. And obviously with the specific zoning you would set property taxes at an amount that's appropriate.

[Changing City]

Originally Posted by misher

You can predict the minimum amount you need in your future vision.

For instance we need at the minimum 1 grocery store at major infrastructure and population hubs. And a few film studios.

An obvious example of whats missing, there is no nearby grocery store to Broadway and Granville or Burrard or Oak despite this being a major hub. And no the small expensive German place blocks south doesn't count.

The need for a grocery store is much higher than a coffee shop, or McDondalds, or a shoe store. And obviously with the specific zoning you would set property taxes at an amount that's appropriate.

I thought you were the free market libertarian? Nothing is preventing a grocery store opening on Broadway or in the South Granville area but the market. I assume you're referring to Meinhardt? It's been part of Pattison's Buy Low Foods for eight years.

And taxes don't work like that - you can't charge a different rate for different uses within a tax category - retail is retail is retail.

[WarrenC12]

Originally Posted by misher

An obvious example of whats missing, there is no nearby grocery store to Broadway and Granville or Burrard or Oak despite this being a major hub. And no the small expensive German place blocks south doesn't count.

Just how many do you need to jam into a single area? Granville Island sells a ton of grocery type foods.

No Frills on 4th.

I suspect most people head over to Cambie & Broadway for Whole Foods, Save-On, and No Frills.

IGA, Loblaws, and another Whole Foods are not far away to the west.

[misher]

Originally Posted by WarrenC12

Just how many do you need to jam into a single area? Granville Island sells a ton of grocery type foods.

No Frills on 4th.

I suspect most people head over to Cambie & Broadway for Whole Foods, Save-On, and No Frills.

IGA, Loblaws, and another Whole Foods are not far away to the west.

This was a common complaint at the last Broadway planning meeting from local residents.

Granville island is a steep hill to walk down and is quite distant for people living on the south side of Broadway.

Originally Posted by Changing City

I thought you were the free market libertarian? Nothing is preventing a grocery store opening on Broadway or in the South Granville area but the market. I assume you're referring to Meinhardt? It's been part of Pattison's Buy Low Foods for eight years.

And taxes don't work like that - you can't charge a different rate for different uses within a tax category - retail is retail is retail.

Yeah I am which is why I am saying in very limited areas. In the end as much as it bugs me we do need to force some things for the greater good.
And yeah Meinhardt.

[officedweller]

The broader question is whether residents would do all their grocery shopping at a local store.
People may want convenience - ie a grocery store within walking distance.
But how many people will shop there for all their groceries, especially if prices are high due to high rents?
Will people only shop there for convenient/last minute items and do the bulk of their shopping at a big box like Costco, Superstore or a discounter like No Frills?
(Think Urban Fare in Yaletown or Olympic Village - does anyone do all their shopping there?)

Not everyone is hampered by the need to walk to a grocery store. Those who drive (or use car shares, etc.) can combine trips when running errands and hit up grocery stores outside a walking radius.

There are a lot of factors impacting people's choice of grocery store, not just walking distance - price being one of the most prevalent.

[BodomReaper]

Originally Posted by Changing City

I thought you were the free market libertarian? Nothing is preventing a grocery store opening on Broadway or in the South Granville area but the market. I assume you're referring to Meinhardt? It's been part of Pattison's Buy Low Foods for eight years.

And taxes don't work like that - you can't charge a different rate for different uses within a tax category - retail is retail is retail.

Nothing except the absence of suitable retail spaces and development opportunities, which is a direct consequence (and intent) of terrible zoning. South Granville has ~40 blocks of apartments and no grocery store - a totally absurd outcome that can only be created by zoning.

[Changing City]

Originally Posted by BodomReaper

Nothing except the absence of suitable retail spaces and development opportunities, which is a direct consequence (and intent) of terrible zoning. South Granville has ~40 blocks of apartments and no grocery store - a totally absurd outcome that can only be created by zoning.

I used to live in the area, and it seemed odd that there wasn't a grocery store, although there were two fruit and veg stores until a few years ago, so it wasn't as bad as today, and IGA was closer too. But it's not zoning that stops there being grocery stores in that area.

Doesn't South Granville have a number of furniture stores that have opened over the past few years? While they obviously wouldn't be big enough for a larger format grocery store, they seem to be similar in scale to say the Nesters Market on Seymour, or Choices on Cambie. Zoning requires retail on both Granville and West Broadway, and there are some larger projects that could take a food store, like The Granvile around W7th or the replacement for Dennys. Whether any of the food store companies want to open in the area remains to be seen - but the zoning allows them.

[Migrant_Coconut]

And even if you do zone exclusively for a grocery store every (let's say) 2km, there's no guarantee that it'll stay open in a free market economy. That idea only works in the back of Patrick Condon's brain.

[WarrenC12]

Originally Posted by Migrant_Coconut

And even if you do zone exclusively for a grocery store every (let's say) 2km, there's no guarantee that it'll stay open in a free market economy. That idea only works in the back of Patrick Condon's brain.

Just look at Olympic Village. They "forced" Urban fare in there, years before any store would have chosen to enter the market in that place. And despite being in a very dense area, it's still not too busy.

[misher]

Originally Posted by WarrenC12

Just look at Olympic Village. They "forced" Urban fare in there, years before any store would have chosen to enter the market in that place. And despite being in a very dense area, it's still not too busy.

Vancouver hasn't been a "free market" for decades.

[nds88]

Originally Posted by WarrenC12

Just look at Olympic Village. They "forced" Urban fare in there, years before any store would have chosen to enter the market in that place. And despite being in a very dense area, it's still not too busy.

Most people aren't inclined to spend 2-3x for basics compared to Superstore, No Frills etc. Urban Fare is only good if you need some obscure seasoning/sauce, otherwise, the average person shops elsewhere.

[WarrenC12]

Originally Posted by misher

Vancouver hasn't been a "free market" for decades.

Citation needed.

[WarrenC12]

Originally Posted by nds88

Most people aren't inclined to spend 2-3x for basics compared to Superstore, No Frills etc. Urban Fare is only good if you need some obscure seasoning/sauce, otherwise, the average person shops elsewhere.

I didn't say they were. UF in Yaletown is jammed on weeknights though.

Just pointing out that people will shop where they want, and grocery chains have extremely detailed data on where they can/should open other locations, and what sub-brand to open.

Some in here seem to think we need a planned economy.

[Feathered Friend]

http://www.jtadevco.com/current-projects#/coming-soon-confidential-site-flase-creek-vancouver/

An Unexpected Landmark – Olympic Village Rental Homes Mark A Shift Towards Vancouver’s Middle Class

5 West 2nd Avenue
To say these last few weeks have altered all of our lives would be an understatement. In our case, Hannah and I have been forced to delay our summer wedding, and cancel a trip to Ontario we expected to take in March. I’m not sure which disappointed her more, as though we’ve spent a substantial amount of time planning our nuptials, she’s been eager to attend the later event since we were teased about the ramblings of a drunken bird.

We weren’t heading to Toronto, Ottawa, or the Niagara Falls, as this meeting was scheduled at the Creekside Community Centre. Granted, this community may seem foreign to some, as this once decayed industrial zone has undergone a major transformation since 1994 (photograph – pg 4). It may have had a rough start, but this project at the corner of Ontario Street and 2nd Avenue will finish the Olympic Village’s desirable “Shipyard” Neighbourhood.

https://cityduo.wordpress.com/2020/04/03...a-shift-towards-vancouvers-middle-class/

[WarrenC12]

That's a current body/repair shop right? If I'm not mistaken, they just put up a new awning and signage the other week. I was a bit surprised as I thought it was on the way out.

[cov]

I 100% thought that body shop and the 2 car cleaners next door are fronts for money laundering.

[zahav]

The car cleaning place with the elephant sign always seems busy, lots of cars in and out. It very well might be a front, but I kind of like it there. With Brewhall next door it kind of fits in that block weirdly enough. But that car repair place is super sketchy, and the building is so out of place now. The upstairs used to host drum circles lol and probably a lot more. I would much rather this building go down that the cute car wash.

What about that giant stretch from Crowe St. to the social housing building? There's Clubhouse Japananese there, then another collission place, and a place that sells weird home decor that's always "going out of business". There is a Colliers for sale sign that's been there forever that says "New Price", but not idea if it's current. Also don't know if those buildings are a bunch of different owners or the same. It is really the last eyesore stretch in the north of 2nd area and is fairly large so could be a two-tower development even. Anyone know anything about it?

[Changing City]

Originally Posted by zahav

What about that giant stretch from Crowe St. to the social housing building? There's Clubhouse Japananese there, then another collission place, and a place that sells weird home decor that's always "going out of business". There is a Colliers for sale sign that's been there forever that says "New Price", but not idea if it's current. Also don't know if those buildings are a bunch of different owners or the same. It is really the last eyesore stretch in the north of 2nd area and is fairly large so could be a two-tower development even. Anyone know anything about it?

Those buildings are owned by Executive Group, who developed West, the three tower project nearby. They had an initial design a few years ago, but decided to sell instead. So far no sign of a buyer, despite the 'new price'. It could be quite a while before anything happens there now.

[zahav]

Thanks for the info! They should just develop it themselves at this point, their product seems well suited to this area in terms of quality and price

[officedweller]

Originally Posted by Feathered Friend

http://www.jtadevco.com/current-projects#/coming-soon-confidential-site-flase-creek-vancouver/

https://cityduo.wordpress.com/2020/04/03...a-shift-towards-vancouvers-middle-class/

Nice, thanks!
The massing looks good, but not sure about the colour scheme.
Also, the inset balconies will make it stand out for a new building in Vancouver.