Confederation Line (Stage 1) | In Service 1.0

[kmcamp]

Originally Posted by lrt's friend

Unless this is at the final exit to the station, this can still be disorienting. Any benefit is lost if you have to make a number of turns before exiting the station.


I am so used to looking at maps with up being north, that the odd time that I see one turned around, just baffles me. I looked at that map and thought. What??? Since when does LRT make that curve to the north and immediately thought this was not even Ottawa. Or was that the Laurier Avenue bridge and City Hall at the bottom?

Maybe it makes more sense given the location that it is posted. Will the station exit to the north have this the other way around?

I hope we have wayfaring signs throughout downtown once the subways open, not just at exits. Pointing arrows to key locations including walking time.

These maps are always right at the exit. Inside the station, (shown in one of the promotional videos) they will have the more traditional North up map at various points in the walls

[J.OT13]

This particular map is at the elevator entrance inside the Rideau Centre. Facing south.

I guess I can somewhat understand why the map's orientation would be based on where the person is standing, though it still seems strange.


https://www.otrainfans.ca/snapshot-updates/snapshot-for-rideau-station-june-28-2019

[YOWetal]

Originally Posted by kmcamp

These maps are always right at the exit. Inside the station, (shown in one of the promotional videos) they will have the more traditional North up map at various points in the walls

The problem is most of the highlighted destinations are better accessed from a different exit. For example the Parliament Hill icon should point you towards the Col By exit or whatever that will be called. The exits aren't too far apart at this station but taking the wrong exit is one of the biggest annoyances when using an unfamiliar Metro system.

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by YOWetal

The problem is most of the highlighted destinations are better accessed from a different exit. For example the Parliament Hill icon should point you towards the Col By exit or whatever that will be called. The exits aren't too far apart at this station but taking the wrong exit is one of the biggest annoyances when using an unfamiliar Metro system.

I assume that these maps will be complemented by lots of overhead signage directing people to various destinations, and that these will send them to the optimal exits.

(And that's how most people navigate stations, I gather.)

[Badyouken]

Seeing doubles again at Bayview this morning. This is a positive sign!

[kmcamp]

Originally Posted by YOWetal

The problem is most of the highlighted destinations are better accessed from a different exit. For example the Parliament Hill icon should point you towards the Col By exit or whatever that will be called. The exits aren't too far apart at this station but taking the wrong exit is one of the biggest annoyances when using an unfamiliar Metro system.

That's what the maps inside the station would be for. You're already at the exit in this case. Also, the Col By exit isn't accessible, so some users have to use this particular exit.

[Kitchissippi]

Originally Posted by caveat.doctor

As a best principle of design, wayfinding maps should be oriented according to how the viewer would be facing. They seem to have done it right here.

Not necessarily best practice as it is a very subjective issue depending on implementation and scale. People tend to form mental maps in which they imagine their journey from origin to destination, and if they started out planning out their route on a north-up map, it is easier for them to relate to similarly oriented maps to measure their progress. Contextually oriented maps are great for interior spaces where cardinal points don't matter (eg. a mall floorplan), but on a large scale where one's route can take several twists and turns, it can be very confusing to be confronted with various rotated maps along the way.

[J.OT13]

The theory that the map orientation is based on the person's position has been busted. I noticed today in Lyon's Podium entrance a map on the north wall with the "upside down" south on the top orientation.

Just another case of WTF on the part of those involved (RTG, OC and the City).

[harls]

There are a few signs up in the Byward market with arrows and a train symbol to direct people to the Confederation line. I remember seeing one near the Laff.

[Truenorth00]

Originally Posted by J.OT13

The theory that the map orientation is based on the person's position has been busted. I noticed today in Lyon's Podium entrance a map on the north wall with the "upside down" south on the top orientation.

Just another case of WTF on the part of those involved (RTG, OC and the City).

For a consortium wit so much international experience building transit, they really do seem like amateurs.

[Badyouken]

Doubles again this morning at Bayview, though right now there's one that's stopped on the lead-up to the station going west.

[OTownandDown]

There's three days remaining for the trains to get figured out, right? Anybody hear anything about the 7th since the announcement?

I too have been seeing mostly doubles lately, and the frequency is very very high. At Lees the other day, it was almost a constant cacophony of train symphony.

I wonder what's less annoying for those poor apartment dwellers at Lees. The extreme loudness of the turbo-charged buses exiting the station, or the shrill whine of the tracks as trains go by at slightly less frequency?

[J.OT13]

Originally Posted by OTownandDown

There's three days remaining for the trains to get figured out, right? Anybody hear anything about the 7th since the announcement?

I too have been seeing mostly doubles lately, and the frequency is very very high. At Lees the other day, it was almost a constant cacophony of train symphony.

I wonder what's less annoying for those poor apartment dwellers at Lees. The extreme loudness of the turbo-charged buses exiting the station, or the shrill whine of the tracks as trains go by at slightly less frequency?

There is also the noise from thousands of cars speeding on the highway and now the Nicholas Bridge replacement.

[Badyouken]

I think bed bugs are a bigger concern for Lees apartment dwellers

[kmcamp]

Originally Posted by Badyouken

I think bed bugs are a bigger concern for Lees apartment dwellers

While passing Lees and uOttawa this on my bike commute this week, took a few videos

• Video Link


• Video Link

Edit: the embed doesn't seem to be working on the forum
https://youtu.be/VA-sk6OxNrE
https://youtu.be/QVwlEFpwWQc

[OCCheetos]

One thing I noticed while watching the trains over the weekend was that the arrivals board jumps around a lot. One moment it'll say one of the next trains is 11 minutes away, and then the next it'll show that it's 4 minutes away. Also, all Tunney's-bound trains were displayed as "Held" on the signs at Bayview, though trains were still continuing through normally.

Also while I was at Tunney's on Saturday, only one of the platforms was closed meaning inbound and outbound trains were using the same platform. On one occasion, the inbound (towards Tunney's) train had to wait for the outbound train to leave, and the switch to switch over before it could pull into the station. The other trains I saw arrive didn't have to wait as long since the outbound train left earlier.

An interesting tidbit, when that first inbound train (the one that had to stop) was approaching the switch, the switch was initially set to diverge the train to the other track, but as it got closer the switch switched towards the closed platform (the other train hadn't left yet). After the outbound train had left and the track was clear, the switch switched back. The switches are pretty fast (too bad the Trillium Line can't be like that).

[caveat.doctor]

Originally Posted by Kitchissippi

Not necessarily best practice as it is a very subjective issue depending on implementation and scale. People tend to form mental maps in which they imagine their journey from origin to destination, and if they started out planning out their route on a north-up map, it is easier for them to relate to similarly oriented maps to measure their progress. Contextually oriented maps are great for interior spaces where cardinal points don't matter (eg. a mall floorplan)

I see your point - improved access to maps generally, e.g. on phones, might also contribute to this:

Originally Posted by https://www.esri.com/arcgis-blog/products/product/mapping/map-orientation-when-true-north-is-not-at-the-top/

That said, with the increased use of hand-held devices and the ability to rotate the map either to the direction of travel or with north at the top, perhaps more map users will become better able to use north-at-top maps all the time, and we can begin to rely on their improved map reading skills to design maps this way more often.

Originally Posted by Kitchissippi

but on a large scale where one's route can take several twists and turns, it can be very confusing to be confronted with various rotated maps along the way.

The overall "bland" design of the map adds to your last point: because there's poor contrast between landmarks and land types (e.g. parks should be green, but the OC Transpo maps don't show that), the cues that the user would rely on to orient the map are missing.

Originally Posted by J.OT13

The theory that the map orientation is based on the person's position has been busted. I noticed today in Lyon's Podium entrance a map on the north wall with the "upside down" south on the top orientation.

Just another case of WTF on the part of those involved (RTG, OC and the City).

Similar problem with inconsistency on the wayfinding signage on the sidewalks: some have a clear and intuitive train symbol, arrow and distance



while others just say the name, without any indication of distance, or even that it's for a station



It's as if there was a standard template, and then someone deliberately removed it to type in "Tunney's Pasture" and make it less clear.

[kmcamp]

Originally Posted by caveat.doctor

I see your point - improved access to maps generally, e.g. on phones, might also contribute to this:






The overall "bland" design of the map adds to your last point: because there's poor contrast betw 90een landmarks and land types (e.g. parks should be green, but the OC Transpo maps don't show that), the cues that the user would rely on to orient the map are missing.



Similar problem with inconsistency on the wayfinding signage on the sidewalks: some have a clear and intuitive train symbol, arrow and distance



while others just say the name, without any indication of distance, or even that it's for a station



It's as if there was a standard template, and then someone deliberately removed it to type in "Tunney's Pasture" and make it less clear.

Tunney's pasture seems to be the only one in that particular style. It was also the first sign that appeared, so it seems like they went back to the drawing board after.

I do think though they should have put the distance on all signs, they only seem to do it if the distance is over 600m

[OCCheetos]

Well, although there are plenty of inconsistencies and oddities with the signage, one nice feature I noticed at Hurdman today is that the stop flags now have small placards at about chest level that indicate the platform letter and stop code in print as well as in braille. A useful accessibility feature.

[caveat.doctor]

Originally Posted by kmcamp

Tunney's pasture seems to be the only one in that particular style. It was also the first sign that appeared, so it seems like they went back to the drawing board after.

I do think though they should have put the distance on all signs, they only seem to do it if the distance is over 600m

I'm sure I remember seeing a "Bayview" sign as well somewhere along Albert, but didn't get a photo of it. I hope you're right though, and that it won't be difficult to replace that Tunney's Pasture one (it's blocking the space for the Wellington West BIA banners, so it should be taken down anyway).

Noting the distance if over a minimum seems reasonable - depending on ability/mood/weather/etc, many users would want know if it's more than, say, 500 m before committing to a walk vs waiting for a bus. Shorter distances, where the station become quickly obvious, aren't as critical to include.