Confederation Line (Stage 1) | In Service 1.0

[PHrenetic]

Originally Posted by zzptichka

Speaking of which...
Noticed they've been doing a lot of hydroseeding this year on different projects. Are they trying save a few bucks?

Like they tried to hydroseed grass here at Bayview. You don't need to be a landscape architect to know there is zero chance it will work.

Good Day.

Yep..... I've seen a fair amount of HydroSeed over the years.
General observation says that it only really works when:
- the slope is gentle and the water runoff is light, with no drainage channels headed at it.
- the seeding is heavy, and the watering is constant and frequent.
- there is NO competing traffic nor other passage (construction equipment, hydroseed truck, water truck).
- the seeding is repeated 3 to 4 times so as to take in overall, including a followup in the next year's season.
Cheaper - as a one-shot, yes, but questionable, given the repeated effort required for a proper result.
And as for weeds - BIG TIME unless exemtion-herbicided !

EnJoy!

[TransitZilla]

Originally Posted by PHrenetic

Good Day.

Yep..... I've seen a fair amount of HydroSeed over the years.
General observation says that it only really works when:
- the slope is gentle and the water runoff is light, with no drainage channels headed at it.
- the seeding is heavy, and the watering is constant and frequent.
- there is NO competing traffic nor other passage (construction equipment, hydroseed truck, water truck).
- the seeding is repeated 3 to 4 times so as to take in overall, including a followup in the next year's season.
Cheaper - as a one-shot, yes, but questionable, given the repeated effort required for a proper result.
And as for weeds - BIG TIME unless exemtion-herbicided !

EnJoy!

Typically city parks are almost all Hydroseeded.

The only place they normally install sod is around the perimeter of pathways, sand areas, etc.

[kmcamp]

Originally Posted by zzptichka

Speaking of which...
Noticed they've been doing a lot of hydroseeding this year on different projects. Are they trying save a few bucks?

Like they tried to hydroseed grass here at Bayview. You don't need to be a landscape architect to know there is zero chance it will work.

I thought the city pretty much always hydroseeded if it's a large area to cover.

[Kitchissippi]

If Rideau already has an occupancy permit, they really should be removing that construction trailer out of William Street ASAP since we are coming up to the height of the tourist season. They talk about the trains being the reason for the delay but they seem to be taking their sweet time with clean-up. It was supposed to be tidy before Canada 150, two years ago!

[Corvulpes]

a

[kmcamp]

https://youtu.be/6k1ZjbzoqdM

Just a little train spotting at the now fence free Lees this morning. You can just barely make out the door chime

[Badyouken]

Originally Posted by Corvulpes

This week they finally took down the platform-side construction fencing. The stations actually look like stations now. Cue this line in the latest email update: "A reminder to the public: please do not attempt to access any stations. While stations may look complete, they are still considered active construction sites and are not yet open to the public."

I was going to quote this line, it made me laugh. I think they're targeting this forum

Also they finally wrote: "Last week, the art installation at Tremblay Station was completed" after weeks (months?) of telling us it was underway.

[Badyouken]

Originally Posted by kmcamp

https://youtu.be/6k1ZjbzoqdM

Just a little train spotting at the now fence free Lees this morning. You can just barely make out the door chime

I really tried to strain my hearing, but couldn't make it out. Still, they're looking slick up close like this.

[J.OT13]

Originally Posted by kmcamp

https://youtu.be/6k1ZjbzoqdM

Just a little train spotting at the now fence free Lees this morning. You can just barely make out the door chime

Originally Posted by Badyouken

I really tried to strain my hearing, but couldn't make it out. Still, they're looking slick up close like this.

I was able to hear it on the video, ever so slightly. Not enough to recognize it in a lineup though. Tried to hear it while train spotting at Bayview a few weeks ago, but was unable. kmcamp, was the sound clearer in person?

As for the Tremblay Public Art, I feel like the updates listed it as "being installed" for a solid year, if not more.

[YOWflier]

My thoughts on all of these delays having been involved in both engineering development and project management and certification of massive programs like this are the following:

I completely understand peoples' need (or temptation) to react with anger and/or frustration and it's definitely warranted. However, at the risk of sounding like an apologist delays like this aren't exactly unusual (yes, even years-long delays) and the last thing we need or want is to go live with this project and have excessive/significant in-service issues. Those would be infinitely more disruptive and consequential to the delays we're having now, so I'm totally on-board with the City remaining steadfast in its refusal to accept a handover without a certain threshold of quality and reliability being reached.

Until then, the City should keep the heat on and continue to demand new dates from RTG, collecting a million bucks each time they blow past it. Succumbing to public pressure by accepting an immature product would be absolutely the wrong thing to do here. RTG owns this mess, let them stew in and pay for it.

[J.OT13]

I'm fine with the delays. It happens. Quite common in this day and age.

My problem is that RTG and the City had always made us believe that everything was under control and they'll be able to meet each deadline, no problem. Hell, on a few occasions, they made us believe they'd deliver ahead of time.

It should have been pretty obvious in 2017 and 2018 that stations, Rideau in particular, would not be ready. It should have been very obvious over the last year that the trains were not ready. Why continuously push back the deadline by a few months. Why not just be honest and say "yup, we need another year and we'll re-evaluate at that time". Is there a rule in the contact that says the next extended deadline can't be more than "x" number of months?

[PHrenetic]

Good Day.

@ ac888yow and J.OT13 :

Agreed. in as far as a full wait on accepting it until it is REALLY honest-to-god finished/fixed/reliable/operational.
That is indeed THE most important aspect of all of this, and I too have no problem in accepting that as fact.

@ J.OT13 :

Agreed. In as far as the BS promises, deadlines, hand-over dates, etc.
THAT is the biggest driver of impatience and <anger> of the whole situation. Repeated let-downs.

The reliability is not the fiasco (that is, not most of it); it is the repeated oh-no-problem, it's-right-around-the-corner delivery promises.
We here can accept that there are issues that must be properly worked through, and that just takes time.
The general public, on the other hand, is not quite so understanding of that fact, and RTG and City are pandering to the push-back that such an announcement would have.
Give credit, Manconi is, within limits, expressing this very point, repeatedly, on each update.
I blame more Jimmy and his ready-to-go statements and attitude over the last year.
For example, the March 31 deadline was, IMO, one that RTG went with almost entirely at Jimmy's push of PR BS. And of course we saw that result.
The latest one (whatever the vague date really was) was very similar. So.

Note to Jimmy - kill the BS and posturing.
Note to RTG - please give us an honest push-date.

Keep on Enduring !

[kmcamp]

Originally Posted by Badyouken

I really tried to strain my hearing, but couldn't make it out. Still, they're looking slick up close like this.

In person it's also barely audible. I couldn't tell you exactly what it is, though it sounds vaguely Vancouveresque to me

[kmcamp]

Originally Posted by PHrenetic

Good Day.

@ ac888yow and J.OT13 :

Agreed. in as far as a full wait on accepting it until it is REALLY honest-to-god finished/fixed/reliable/operational.
That is indeed THE most important aspect of all of this, and I too have no problem in accepting that as fact.

@ J.OT13 :

Agreed. In as far as the BS promises, deadlines, hand-over dates, etc.
THAT is the biggest driver of impatience and <anger> of the whole situation. Repeated let-downs.

The reliability is not the fiasco (that is, not most of it); it is the repeated oh-no-problem, it's-right-around-the-corner delivery promises.
We here can accept that there are issues that must be properly worked through, and that just takes time.
The general public, on the other hand, is not quite so understanding of that fact, and RTG and City are pandering to the push-back that such an announcement would have.
Give credit, Manconi is, within limits, expressing this very point, repeatedly, on each update.
I blame more Jimmy and his ready-to-go statements and attitude over the last year.
For example, the March 31 deadline was, IMO, one that RTG went with almost entirely at Jimmy's push of PR BS. And of course we saw that result.
The latest one (whatever the vague date really was) was very similar. So.

Note to Jimmy - kill the BS and posturing.
Note to RTG - please give us an honest push-date.

Keep on Enduring !

I think I agree it's the mayor rather than Manconi who's been really flogging the just around the corner horse.

The blame on Manconi is changing to post LRT bus routes when he was quite certain RTG was going to miss, and perhaps being very tight lipped about it, holding everything for Fedco meetings

[J.OT13]

Considering Manconi's bluntness and honesty at the FEDCO meetings and the fact that he seems pretty knowledgeable on the project and what is needed for completion, it seems out of character to jump the 🞵🞵🞵 and make all of those changes for a train that hasn't come. Sometimes I wonder if it was his call or if he was pressured. Perhaps he didn't have the votes on the OC Transpo Board, if there is such a thing.

[lrt's friend]

I have not been complaining about the delays. I understand that this is a very complex project and it is crucial that they get it right. It is a new model of LRV being first built for the Ottawa project. We will appreciate its value when it is operational. The new model will be particularly important when these trains start crossing the Greenbelt, when the higher max. speed will provide faster service.

Part of the problem with all the false startup dates was last fall's municipal election. The general public is not always well informed so an optimistic date was needed to make sure that we did not have a revolution at city hall. I think having a stable city hall at this point was important to bring Phase 1 to a happy conclusion and to move forward with Phase 2 quickly. If we had turfed out many city councilors, who knows what could have happened.

The latest round of delays is very similar to software development. They often say that 90% completion takes 50% of the time. It is that last 10% that can be very unpredictable in getting the kinks out. So, I think we are seeing the uncertainty of getting that last 10% done.

[Kitchissippi]

I think pretending the Q2 deadline was still possible until the last minute might have played a role in getting Stage 2 approved. I imagine if the vote were held today council would be more sceptical about pouring more money into the project. Had they admitted to another delay back then, it could have jeopardized expansion.

[roger1818]

Originally Posted by lrt's friend

The latest round of delays is very similar to software development. They often say that 90% completion takes 50% of the time. It is that last 10% that can be very unpredictable in getting the kinks out. So, I think we are seeing the uncertainty of getting that last 10% done.

That is refereed to as the 80-20 Rule (or Pareto principle), whereby it take 20% of the time to do 80% of the work and 80% of the time to do the remaining 20% of the work.

[sseguin]

The Q1 2019 Confederation Line Quarterly Memo to Council was just released to media. I have shared it on O-Train Fans for your interest:

https://www.otrainfans.ca/blogs/memo-q1-2019-confederation-line-quarterly-memo-to-council

[FrancisBM]

I totally agree that it is absolutely a let down the way we were pumped up for this for the agonizing start of it.