Winnipeg Construction IX

[buzzg]

^Agreed. "The New Winnipeg Hotel" would be nice there.

[Labroco]

Originally Posted by Wpg_Guy

That drives me crazy how many main floor windows are covered downtown, most notably the Paris building, the Curry building, CDI College, Portage Place...

Well I agree with you about “storefronts” but it really depends on the use of the space... true grade level windows seem to call out to be transparent. Many older bldgs have half basements with glass... 399 Graham and 219 Vaughn are the same bldgs constructing in 1929 I believe and we have owned them both since 1946. They are well build concrete apt bldgs that over the years have converted the front units to commercial or back to residential dependinging on the market. What I can tell you, 399 Graham’s lower windows are / were covered for privacy for the user. 219 Vaughn lent itself to a retail use and were transparent. They are full for the most part with new Canadians that have small tidy spaces.The buildings have quietly provided exactly what is needed over the years. Clean affordable accommodation with never the slightest government help or subsidy yet constantly over regulated. As legacy properties we are emotionally attached and look after them well. They are not “new and exciting” but an important component to a successful urban environment. I’m hopeful Winnipeg’s downtown is truely improving for people.

Sorry I got a little off track on a dated paint job... I’m seeing the new colour of the day as Burnt Umber or Siena this season. It should compliment our brickwork nicely!

[dmacc]

I think it would be really nice to see a building go up at the SW corner of Edmonton and St. Mary with a sky walk connecting the Taylor Mcaffray Building and the convention centre. This would complete a full circle connection for the skywalk system from Bell MTS through City place to the RBCCC Through Taylor Mcafray to HBC to Portage place and back to Bell MTS. This would be a huge step to connecting 90% of downtown together in a climate controlled environment.

[Biff]

That lot is still owned by Lakeview I believe. As far as I know there are no plans for that site.

[rkspec]

Originally Posted by Labroco

Ugh... another “black” building ...

One might as well well paint it seafoam green.

This is such a tired trend already. Sorry but you never paint over brick.

I promise you I will NEVER paint 399 Graham...

EVER...

There is a building on William ave, looks like they sprayed some sand based color treatment that looks really good and looks like its going to last a very long time. I guess this can be a (costly) alternative to paint?
The before was the dull gray above.

https://www.google.ca/maps/place/William...0579b850e!8m2!3d49.9038754!4d-97.1546477

[pspeid]

Originally Posted by Biff

That lot is still owned by Lakeview I believe. As far as I know there are no plans for that site.

I thought many years ago a small hotel was suggested for that site, am I wrong? You would think it still might be feasible to have a medium-priced hotel linked to the convention centre?

[Biff]

If I remember how it went - Lakeview had plans for a 12-14 storey hotel (ugliest building I have ever seen) for the site. The Convention Centre expansion came around with its promise to include a "Convention Centre Hotel" which was not the Lakeview proposal. Lakeview felt this new CC Hotel would be in direct competition with their hotel and instead focused all their attention to the development of the airport area hotels - Sheraton and Grand and mothballing their St Mary's plans.

[dmacc]

Though it may not be pretty, it would have been nice to have.

[esquire]

^ There were a few iterations of that design as I recall... Lakeview tried to get something going back in the 2000s but it obviously never took off.

Too bad for them that they didn't get it built... if it had been completed in 2007, it would have had over a decade of being the only new hotel attached to the Convention Centre via skywalk, until the Sutton Place opens in a year or two. Probably would have done quite well for Lakeview.

[optimusREIM]

Originally Posted by Biff

If I remember how it went - Lakeview had plans for a 12-14 storey hotel (ugliest building I have ever seen) for the site. The Convention Centre expansion came around with its promise to include a "Convention Centre Hotel" which was not the Lakeview proposal. Lakeview felt this new CC Hotel would be in direct competition with their hotel and instead focused all their attention to the development of the airport area hotels - Sheraton and Grand and mothballing their St Mary's plans.

As ugly as that is (and good god is it ever ugly), the massing looks perfect. That size of building there would be perfect. One could go quite a bit taller there too but it wouldn't do much except make an impact on the skyline at that point. In terms of filling in the street it's a shame that this never got built. I think the best thing for that lot would be some sort of residential hotel retail mixed use project. It would be pretty ideally situated if you're an employee working in any of the major buildings downtown and it is next to TNS and not far from the Convention Centre or from the arena. The only thing that the area would need, the lynchpin to hold it all together is a goddam grocery store or two. They don't have to be Costco or Sobeys sized boxes to be effective, but they just need to be moderately well-stocked, which is not really that hard even in a small space.

[pspeid]

Originally Posted by optimusREIM

The only thing that the area would need, the lynchpin to hold it all together is a goddam grocery store or two. They don't have to be Costco or Sobeys sized boxes to be effective, but they just need to be moderately well-stocked, which is not really that hard even in a small space.

On that note (and I know this is an old, old, old topic of discussion) does anyone know of any kind of movement from a large grocery chain on having a downtown presence? The discussion always revolves around the density of residential downtown, but good gosh, haven't we reached that yet??? Sorry, getting a little impatient here....

[bomberjet]

Seeing how nothing happened at 330 Main with the grocer, I wouldn't expect anything soon.

[esquire]

Originally Posted by pspeid

On that note (and I know this is an old, old, old topic of discussion) does anyone know of any kind of movement from a large grocery chain on having a downtown presence? The discussion always revolves around the density of residential downtown, but good gosh, haven't we reached that yet??? Sorry, getting a little impatient here....

[buzzg]

With TNS 3 & 4 coming in, new developments nearby Graham, Republic Architecture's renovation, the RBCCC and WAG expansions, and some other under-the-radar new or refreshed projects in that area... that Lakeview lot and the underutilized Garriock Insurance property all of a sudden look a lot more ripe for development. Some others on that end of St. Mary as well. It'd be a great hotel location, really close to OV as well.

As for the Winnipeg Hotel – I'd love to see them do the exact thing that was proposed for the St. Charles a number of years ago. Nice modern addition to the historic hotel – can use the existing building for lobby, bar, meeting rooms, etc. and build a new building for modern suites.

[CoryB]

Originally Posted by pspeid

On that note (and I know this is an old, old, old topic of discussion) does anyone know of any kind of movement from a large grocery chain on having a downtown presence?

Covered this off many times now. Grocery retailing as a whole is 5-10 years into the shift from large format, deep inventory in person shopping to an order online for delivery to your house or a pickup point. A transition phase may include pickup locations with highly limited grocery stock for in person shopping similar to what is already stocked at Shoppers.

As the model is moving to a local warehouse fulfilling online orders for delivery there is absolutely zero interest from the big players in the grocery market and building out there store networks further. Notice how Save on Foods made a big splash on their entry to the market but has yet to build even one more location? Also note how Sobey's/Safeway has been closing locations and Loblaws has been shifting from company owned stores to franchise owned stores?

[cheswick]

Originally Posted by CoryB

Covered this off many times now. Grocery retailing as a whole is 5-10 years into the shift from large format, deep inventory in person shopping to an order online for delivery to your house or a pickup point. A transition phase may include pickup locations with highly limited grocery stock for in person shopping similar to what is already stocked at Shoppers.

As the model is moving to a local warehouse fulfilling online orders for delivery there is absolutely zero interest from the big players in the grocery market and building out there store networks further. Notice how Save on Foods made a big splash on their entry to the market but has yet to build even one more location? Also note how Sobey's/Safeway has been closing locations and Loblaws has been shifting from company owned stores to franchise owned stores?

Well obviously they're closing locations, Sobeys parent acquired Safeway and there were redundancies. That coupled with a terrible transition of Safeway that saw them bleed clientele.

[Curmudgeon]

Are increased security costs for a downtown grocery store a major issue? I wonder.

[cheswick]

Originally Posted by Curmudgeon

Are increased security costs for a downtown grocery store a major issue? I wonder.

The owner of the former Buck or Two in Portage Place cited that she lost $100k a year to shoplifting. So you would think there is an extra cost to security and theft you wouldn't have elsewhere.

With that said they didn't want to vacate the location but couldn't come to lease terms with Portage Place.

[pspeid]

Originally Posted by CoryB

Covered this off many times now. Grocery retailing as a whole is 5-10 years into the shift from large format, deep inventory in person shopping to an order online for delivery to your house or a pickup point. A transition phase may include pickup locations with highly limited grocery stock for in person shopping similar to what is already stocked at Shoppers.

As the model is moving to a local warehouse fulfilling online orders for delivery there is absolutely zero interest from the big players in the grocery market and building out there store networks further. Notice how Save on Foods made a big splash on their entry to the market but has yet to build even one more location? Also note how Sobey's/Safeway has been closing locations and Loblaws has been shifting from company owned stores to franchise owned stores?

So is the perceived "need" for a downtown grocery outlet a myth, or is it just impractical from a business standpoint? Would downtown residents be happier with a number of smaller "boutique" food retailers (bakeries, fancy meats, etc.) than with a Sobeys? Sorry to keep on nit-picking at this point (and yes I know it's been discussed to death) but is seems like "a large downtown grocery store" is often trotted out as a combined magic bullet and Holy Grail to make downtown residency flourish.

[Wpg_Guy]

I think we’ll need to see some of these newer projects actually fill up with residents before we see a grocery store. A lot could change once True North, 300 Main, medical arts, 185 Smith actually have people living in them.