Confederation Line (Stage 1) | In Service 1.0

[roger1818]

Originally Posted by PHrenetic

Pertaining to the (much) earlier discussion of high heat related rail distortions....
an interesting detail in the latest C-Line construction update pictures :

https://www.ligneconfederationline.ca/wp...levated-guideway-2018-09-06-768x1024.jpg

Take a close look at the travel rails just before the end of the bridge - a sliding displacement expansion/contraction joint.

Thanks for sharing. That is very interesting. Here is a higher resolution version of that same picture to let you get a better view:

https://www.ligneconfederationline.ca/wp...Hurdman-elevated-guideway-2018-09-06.jpg

One thing I find strange is I would have thought that when installed on a tracks that the trains typically run in the same direction, they would want the transition from an inside rail to an outside rail, to eliminate the chance of the wheel flange of getting caught between the two rails and causing a derailment. It is done like that on the track the train is currently on; however, if you look at the other track, it is harder to see, but the joint is oriented the same way, thus backwards for an oncoming train. I am sure it is designed so that it it is safe for trains traveling in both directions, but I would have thought it slightly better this way.

[PHrenetic]

Originally Posted by roger1818

Thanks for sharing. That is very interesting. Here is a higher resolution version of that same picture to let you get a better view:

https://www.ligneconfederationline.ca/wp...Hurdman-elevated-guideway-2018-09-06.jpg

One thing I find strange is I would have thought that when installed on a tracks that the trains typically run in the same direction, they would want the transition from an inside rail to an outside rail, to eliminate the chance of the wheel flange of getting caught between the two rails and causing a derailment. It is done like that on the track the train is currently on; however, if you look at the other track, it is harder to see, but the joint is oriented the same way, thus backwards for an oncoming train. I am sure it is designed so that it it is safe for trains traveling in both directions, but I would have thought it slightly better this way.

Good Day.

Indeed I had spotted the same detail, and had the same thought about it. Thx for the higher res photo.

The only conclusion (with an assumption) I can surmise is that the same joint exists at the other end of the bridge, and that it is oriented for a greater expansion/contraction of the bridge and the rails upon it than for the rails of the approaches. IE - you recall those signs on the approaches to road/highway bridges that warn drivers "Bridge Freezes First - Slippery". Thus the same arrangement on both directions even though the wheel flanges are picking the point on one of the two in the pair.

That's the only concept I have to explain it.

EnJoy!

[Reecemartin]

[Deleted]

[vtecyo]

Originally Posted by PHrenetic

Good Day.

Indeed I had spotted the same detail, and had the same thought about it. Thx for the higher res photo.

The only conclusion (with an assumption) I can surmise is that the same joint exists at the other end of the bridge, and that it is oriented for a greater expansion/contraction of the bridge and the rails upon it than for the rails of the approaches. IE - you recall those signs on the approaches to road/highway bridges that warn drivers "Bridge Freezes First - Slippery". Thus the same arrangement on both directions even though the wheel flanges are picking the point on one of the two in the pair.

That's the only concept I have to explain it.

EnJoy!

I'm pretty sure that the flange on standard train wheels is only on their inside edge. Therefore the wheels would only come in contact with the smooth inside edge and top of the rails.

[roger1818]

Originally Posted by vtecyo

I'm pretty sure that the flange on standard train wheels is only on their inside edge. Therefore the wheels would only come in contact with the smooth inside edge and top of the rails.

Yes, the flanges are always on the inside as it acts like a differential at curves (an explanation can be found here).

The point is with the rails split on an angle like that, the inside edge won’t be perfectly smooth and could catch the flange. It probably isn’t a problem as long as it is on a straight section of track, the train is traveling slowly and the track is well maintained. In the opposite direction it would just flow from the inner rail to the outer one.

[OCCheetos]

Originally Posted by roger1818

Yes, the flanges are always on the inside as it acts like a differential at curves (an explanation can be found here).

The point is with the rails split on an angle like that, the inside edge won’t be perfectly smooth and could catch the flange. It probably isn’t a problem as long as it is on a straight section of track, the train is traveling slowly and the track is well maintained. In the opposite direction it would just flow from the inner rail to the outer one.

How fast are test trains running across the bridge?

I remember at doors open the simulated train was restricted to 30km/h when crossing that bridge and I was never sure if that was just a random variable of that particular simulation or something that would be enforced for real.

Thinking more about it, it would be pretty weird if they did put speed restrictions on the bridge because of the expansion joint.. if it were that big of an issue they could have probably just use jointed rail instead (like the Rideau bridge on the Trillium Line).

[PHrenetic]

Good Day.

As to picking the points.... I have to believe they have ground the points and set the tightness and angle to a high number switch equivalent, allowing a high speed. (Indeed, given that this is not a switch, it will have been spiked (clipped) to a far tighter specification). I cannot see speed restrictions of any nature due to either factor of the points or the fact of it being a bridge; rather, that would have been designed in. The Hurdman bridge approaches are straight at both ends, so no angular displacement of the flanges due to an approach or integral curve should be seen. Any speed restrictions should/would only be due to weather extremes, damage, or maintenance pending, as would be the case everywhere else in the system. Similarly, I would hope that they have designed the actual switches in the system with a similar attention to not having any speed restrictions due solely to the fact of a switch in that spot. Even the crossover diamonds should not have a speed restriction on the straight-through alignment. (All switches have a speed restriction on the divergent alignment.)
The speed restrictions we have seen to this point are due solely to the nature of this time - testing, preliminary operations, and pure caution for a new installation. Speeds should already be increasing to eventually reach full operating standards - no restrictions. Indeed, certification testing requires attaining 110-150 % of normal operating conditions with no restrictions or limitations. This is applicable to both the vehicles and the infrastructure upon which they travel. I recall awhile back that they made an announcement upon the occasion of one of the early vehicles reaching 120 kph on the Cyrville-Blair stretch. Normal operation speeds are expected to hit only 100 kph.

EnJoy!

[sseguin]

The City of Ottawa just released a Confederation Line update memo.

You can consult it here on the O-Train Fans site: https://www.otrainfans.ca/blogs/o-train-confederation-line-project-update-october-2-2018

Important notes from the memo are as follows:

• Major milestone reached on September 11, 2018 when a train completed the first end-to-end run by traveling between Tunney's Pasture to Blair Station.
• Train movement and testing has begun in the downtown tunnel.
• Automatic Train Operation is operating and in use on the eastern track. Expanding to the western tracks and tunnel sections soon.
• The city continues to monitor and track the project but there is currently no change from the update provided at FEDCO on September 10, 2018. As a result, no update to the Revenue Service Availability Date at this time.

[rocketphish]

'It's not a puddle': Labour council releases photo of water leaked into LRT tunnel

Joanne Laucius, Ottawa Citizen
Updated: October 2, 2018



The Ottawa and District Labour Council has released a photo of water that had leaked in the the LRT tunnel.

The photo, taken more than a month ago according to the labour council, raises questions about the safety of workers on the project, said labour council president Sean McKenny. But it’s also not the worst photo McKenny has seen of working conditions underground. Others have not been made public.

“There are a number of photos that we have that are worse. But this is the one that really shows the water piece (of the problem),” he said. “It’s not a puddle. It’s significant.”

The workers are concerned about having to walk through the water, said McKenny. “When you have water like that, you never know what you’re walking on or into. There have been issues with workers falling and tripping because of the amount of debris.”

There are additional concerns because there are also a lot of power tools and electrical cords in use in the tunnel, he said. “The city says safety is a priority. If it were a priority, we wouldn’t have a photo like this floating around.”

Kenny said the photo was taken a least a month ago by workers at the west portal, near LeBreton Flats.

In a statement, Steven Cripps, the city’s director of O-Train construction, said the photo was taken after a record rainfall on July 25 when the location was running on temporary sump pumps.

“With the location still under construction, temporary pumps could not handle the excessive amount of water from the record-breaking rainfall, resulting in localized flooding,” said Cripps. “When the project is complete, permanent sump pumps and drainage systems will handle any water infiltration during inclement weather.”

Cripps added that the LRT tunnel has a waterproof layer around it because the tunnel is below the water table.

“If water leaks still occur, RTG (the Rideau Transit Group, the consortium building the east-west LRT line) addresses them on an individual, case-by-case basis using an injection mechanism that is very effective as the injected material solidifies and becomes impenetrable.”

McKenny said the labour council understood that the photo was taken when the pumping system was not working, which allowed a significant amount of water to accumulate. “Surely there would be a backup pump,” he said.

Last month, the city’s finance and economic development committee heard the Rideau Transit Group could not meet the Nov. 2 deadline and that the Confederation line won’t launch until 2019.

Meanwhile, it’s unclear how many workers have been injured in the tunnel project. Some injuries have been reported by paramedics and other details have been released to the media through documents.

In March, work on a section of the Rideau Street section of the project was halted after two workers were hospitalized with minor injuries after two transportation devices collided. In July 2017, a worker suffered a neck injury when equipment at a tunnel entry point on Queen Street fell on his head. In March 2017, a crane operator escaped injury when he leaped from the crane as it tipped over while lifting a small cement mixer into a hole at a tunnel near Laurier Avenue and Waller Street.

Postmedia reported in August 2017 that it had acquired seven sets of minutes from meetings of the LRT Confederation Line’s joint health and safety committee from the Ottawa and District Labour Council. The January 2017 meeting included a note about labour ministry inspectors investigating a worker who lost consciousness while working along the old Transitway near Carruthers Avenue, as well as descriptions of other injuries, including a worker amputating the tip of his thumb when a circular saw kicked back, a worker straining his groin while repositioning a steel beam, a worker receiving seven stitches to close a wound on an index finger from a steel burr, and a worker’s ring finger crushed while repositioning equipment.

McKenny said he believes the number of injuries reported to the Ontario Ministry of Labour don’t reflect the actual number of injuries suffered on the project. Some workers do not seek compensation, so they are not counted, he said.

Workers also don’t want their employers to know that they have shared photos of conditions on the job site for fear of losing opportunities to work, said McKenny. “A lot of workers are reluctant to rock the boat.”

https://ottawacitizen.com/news/local-new...es-photo-of-water-leaked-into-lrt-tunnel

[kmcamp]

Originally Posted by rocketphish

'It's not a puddle': Labour council releases photo of water leaked into LRT tunnel

Joanne Laucius, Ottawa Citizen
Updated: October 2, 2018



The Ottawa and District Labour Council has released a photo of water that had leaked in the the LRT tunnel.

The photo, taken more than a month ago according to the labour council, raises questions about the safety of workers on the project, said labour council president Sean McKenny. But it’s also not the worst photo McKenny has seen of working conditions underground. Others have not been made public.

“There are a number of photos that we have that are worse. But this is the one that really shows the water piece (of the problem),” he said. “It’s not a puddle. It’s significant.”

The workers are concerned about having to walk through the water, said McKenny. “When you have water like that, you never know what you’re walking on or into. There have been issues with workers falling and tripping because of the amount of debris.”

There are additional concerns because there are also a lot of power tools and electrical cords in use in the tunnel, he said. “The city says safety is a priority. If it were a priority, we wouldn’t have a photo like this floating around.”

Kenny said the photo was taken a least a month ago by workers at the west portal, near LeBreton Flats.

In a statement, Steven Cripps, the city’s director of O-Train construction, said the photo was taken after a record rainfall on July 25 when the location was running on temporary sump pumps.

“With the location still under construction, temporary pumps could not handle the excessive amount of water from the record-breaking rainfall, resulting in localized flooding,” said Cripps. “When the project is complete, permanent sump pumps and drainage systems will handle any water infiltration during inclement weather.”

Cripps added that the LRT tunnel has a waterproof layer around it because the tunnel is below the water table.

“If water leaks still occur, RTG (the Rideau Transit Group, the consortium building the east-west LRT line) addresses them on an individual, case-by-case basis using an injection mechanism that is very effective as the injected material solidifies and becomes impenetrable.”

McKenny said the labour council understood that the photo was taken when the pumping system was not working, which allowed a significant amount of water to accumulate. “Surely there would be a backup pump,” he said.

Last month, the city’s finance and economic development committee heard the Rideau Transit Group could not meet the Nov. 2 deadline and that the Confederation line won’t launch until 2019.

Meanwhile, it’s unclear how many workers have been injured in the tunnel project. Some injuries have been reported by paramedics and other details have been released to the media through documents.

In March, work on a section of the Rideau Street section of the project was halted after two workers were hospitalized with minor injuries after two transportation devices collided. In July 2017, a worker suffered a neck injury when equipment at a tunnel entry point on Queen Street fell on his head. In March 2017, a crane operator escaped injury when he leaped from the crane as it tipped over while lifting a small cement mixer into a hole at a tunnel near Laurier Avenue and Waller Street.

Postmedia reported in August 2017 that it had acquired seven sets of minutes from meetings of the LRT Confederation Line’s joint health and safety committee from the Ottawa and District Labour Council. The January 2017 meeting included a note about labour ministry inspectors investigating a worker who lost consciousness while working along the old Transitway near Carruthers Avenue, as well as descriptions of other injuries, including a worker amputating the tip of his thumb when a circular saw kicked back, a worker straining his groin while repositioning a steel beam, a worker receiving seven stitches to close a wound on an index finger from a steel burr, and a worker’s ring finger crushed while repositioning equipment.

McKenny said he believes the number of injuries reported to the Ontario Ministry of Labour don’t reflect the actual number of injuries suffered on the project. Some workers do not seek compensation, so they are not counted, he said.

Workers also don’t want their employers to know that they have shared photos of conditions on the job site for fear of losing opportunities to work, said McKenny. “A lot of workers are reluctant to rock the boat.”

https://ottawacitizen.com/news/local-new...es-photo-of-water-leaked-into-lrt-tunnel

While I truly believe that workplace safety is important, I feel that the workers themselves aren't always living up to their side of the bargain. E.g the crane incident where the guy had to jump was caused by him not deploying the out riggers, in another case a worker jumped blind over a half wall and injured himself because there was debris on the other side.

[daud]

while I still think its all worth it; this project is probably going to miss another deadline (or they won't provide one because there is no point). I was going to post last weekend about having past 2 station sites (parliament and Rideau) and noting how unbelievably incomplete they looked-even from street level but this article sort of confirms that there is still lots to do...

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/ottawa/no-new-date-ottawa-lrt-opening-1.4847915

Any bets on when this might be fully operational for the public?

[Horus]

Whether or not this is feasible, I don't know, but a good target opening for the LRT would be the March break week in mid-March. Just having predictably lower ridership for the first week might be useful.

[kmcamp]

Originally Posted by daud

while I still think its all worth it; this project is probably going to miss another deadline (or they won't provide one because there is no point). I was going to post last weekend about having past 2 station sites (parliament and Rideau) and noting how unbelievably incomplete they looked-even from street level but this article sort of confirms that there is still lots to do...

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/ottawa/no-new-date-ottawa-lrt-opening-1.4847915

Any bets on when this might be fully operational for the public?

I'm betting on May, one full year behind schedule. I predict RTG will attempt a handover in December, with some obvious deficiencies that the city will reject, and thus handover would happen sometime in late January. I then predict that the city's testing phase will find some sort of problem, because problems always seem to pop up in similar projects in the testing phase. Back and forth between the city and RTG will go into April, thus May being when it opens for real.

[PHrenetic]

Originally Posted by kmcamp

I'm betting on May, one full year behind schedule. I predict RTG will attempt a handover in December, with some obvious deficiencies that the city will reject, and thus handover would happen sometime in late January. I then predict that the city's testing phase will find some sort of problem, because problems always seem to pop up in similar projects in the testing phase. Back and forth between the city and RTG will go into April, thus May being when it opens for real.

Good Day.

Yep----May.
This is pretty much what we were all predicting back on 13 Sept when this first came out.
It also happens to be pretty much when the original completion was anticipated back when the contract was first let in 2011/2012, before Jimmy and the City 'asked' (pushed) them to get it done a year faster.
Kinda makes one think that RTG's original plan had the give and leeway for eventualities like the sinkholes and other happenstance events of an otherwise unpredictable nature.
Ah well..... as usual, politics 'trump' realities !!!

We Shall See !

[roger1818]

Originally Posted by Horus

Whether or not this is feasible, I don't know, but a good target opening for the LRT would be the March break week in mid-March. Just having predictably lower ridership for the first week might be useful.

That would make a lot of sense. We have also past the worst of the winter weather by then.

Originally Posted by kmcamp

I'm betting on May, one full year behind schedule. I predict RTG will attempt a handover in December, with some obvious deficiencies that the city will reject, and thus handover would happen sometime in late January. I then predict that the city's testing phase will find some sort of problem, because problems always seem to pop up in similar projects in the testing phase. Back and forth between the city and RTG will go into April, thus May being when it opens for real.

The first week of May would also be a logical choice as the universities will be out, so once again there will be reduced ridership. Also, winter should be 95% over by then.

[Truenorth00]

I'm an optimist. I vote for February.

Contractors do this all the time. They are calculating how much they can cut back on production (over time in construction) vs. penalties imposed. Once we get into November, RTG is now paying for all the bus diversions, plus the million dollar penalty. And they are losing interest on progress payments sitting in they city's bank account. They are now incentivized to finish. Waiting till May will be quite costly to them. Or they get embroiled in a bitter court fight to get paid for the last bit. Not a scenario they or the city wants.

I predict a handover by Christmas and testing all through Jan with service launch sometime in Feb.

If you look at the photos, with the exception of the tunneled stations, all the rest look like they will be finished by end-November at the latest. And as those stations wrap up, labour is freed up to be re-assigned elsewhere. With that in mind, I think they'll be able to hand over by the end of the year or early in Jan.

There is the question of what flaws are found during testing. But keep in mind that there's also testing ongoing with the vehicle, catenary, etc. There's also certification that they have to get to be given occupancy permits for each station. So at the point of the handover, stations and motive systems will have have completed substantial testing, inspection and certification. The city's considerations beyond that are almost entirely operational.

I think we might see a short soft launch too, if they do launch in the winter. Weather being variable, might as well have a week where diversion routes are still running and people are getting used to taking the system and trying it out, before full conversion.

[kmcamp]

Given the general track record of projects like this world wide, our delays aren't the end of the world. Many cities have the delays measured in years, like Amsterdam's 7 year delay for the nord line

[Truenorth00]

Originally Posted by kmcamp

Given the general track record of projects like this world wide, our delays aren't the end of the world. Many cities have the delays measured in years, like Amsterdam's 7 year delay for the nord line

Absolutely. A year's delay in the grand scheme of things is not terminal.

The impact, however, is serious. This is the absolute core of Ottawa's network. The long construction period and delays, along with diversions do impact ridership. And the costs add up.

All that said, I'd rather they take the time to get it right than rush to handover. Having a system that breaks down constantly while new would really rob public confidence.

[OTSkyline]

There's also a reading week for universities in February. Perhaps a good week to launch with reduced congestion and volume?

[Truenorth00]

Originally Posted by OTSkyline

There's also a reading week for universities in February. Perhaps a good week to launch with reduced congestion and volume?

How much do reduced loads really matter at launch? You still have to run the same peak schedules. If you break down, you'll still have to the same mitigation plan in place. The only difference is fewer pissed off riders possibly.