Roads/Bridges projects/issues

[waterloowarrior]

Leitrim Widening/Realignment EA - Feb 2018 open house
https://ottawa.ca/en/leitrim-road-realig...ssment-study#open-house-display-boards-1

Roundabout coming to Barnsdale/PoW in 2019
https://ottawa.ca/en/barnsdale-prince-wales-intersection-modification

[hwy418]

Originally Posted by Kitchissippi

If Laurier was redone properly with bike tracks instead of the half-assed version they have now, it would probably result in wider sidewalks. Those bike lanes were just carved out of the roadway without touching the sidewalks.

The Laurier SBLs were designed as a pilot project from the outset since City staff had ZERO experience or confidence on the implementation of separated bike lanes or cycle tracks. It was purposely designed that way to be removed in case the end of the world came to be.

Sure the design is primitive by today's standards, but it will be upgraded to proper cycle tracks along with wider sidewalks some day. Not a chance they'll be removed - this is the project that started it all.

[Kitchissippi]

Originally Posted by J.OT13

Removing the Laurier bike lanes for wider sidewalks might not have been his idea, but it is valid. I agree with most of your points except for adding parking to replace street parking. There is enough as is.

Try telling that to Kelly Egan:

http://ottawacitizen.com/news/local-news/egan-how-downtown-has-grown-to-hate-your-car

[J.OT13]

Originally Posted by Kitchissippi

Try telling that to Kelly Egan:

http://ottawacitizen.com/news/local-news/egan-how-downtown-has-grown-to-hate-your-car

Ya, read that one this morning. Kind of think of it, I've had that problem....

[roger1818]

Originally Posted by Kitchissippi

IMO the city should:
1. insist/invest in more public parking garages so there is one at least 200 metres from any destination in the CBD, with enough new spaces to replace or even exceed current on-street spots. This would put some equivalency on car access vs LRT.

How do you define the boundary of the CBD and where did you get this 200m figure from? I would include privately owned but publicly accessible garages (not lots) in the analysis though.

Any increase in parking should be done by converting parking lots to multi-level parking garages, optimally under a new building. The city should not own any surface parking lots in central Ottawa. Those should only exist on plots of land reserved for future development.

2. install a system of electronic signs that display availability of parking in the garages in real time. This should reduce people driving around looking for spots, which constitutes a portion of internal downtown traffic.

Agreed

3. regulate short-term parking rates so they all charge the same as on-street rates in the city for the first hour.

Also, I have said this before, but the on street (and short-term parking) rates in the CBD should be tied to OC Transpo fares, so that when one goes up, so does the other. I believe street parking rates are at $3/hour and cash fare is $3.50, so maybe increase parking rates to $3.50/hour to start. That way 2 hours of parking is equal to round trip bus fare.

4. restrict all on-steet parking entirely in the CBD from Laurier on northwards 6am to 6pm

I'm not sure Laurier Ave (from end to end) is the correct boundary (I would have it further north along the western end and maybe a bit further south in the centre), but I agree in concept.

5. widen all sidewalks, restructuring some of them to provide delivery bays and flex parking spaces after hours like on Queen Street.

This would have to be a long term goal, but I agree.

Maybe we should also innovate ways of capturing the city's residual heat or geothermal energy/river water heat exchange to make the downtown streets ice- and snow-free in the winter with minimal plowing and salting

Not sure how feasible this would be, but it would be cool if it was.

Originally Posted by Kitchissippi

Try telling that to Kelly Egan:

http://ottawacitizen.com/news/local-news/egan-how-downtown-has-grown-to-hate-your-car

I have a feeling things have gotten worse because of LRT construction. If that is the case, things will get back to normal once LRT opens. If it isn't, the rules of supply and demand will cause the parking rates (especially the all day rates) to go up until we start to see the lots not quite filling up. Item 2 above will also help as it will allow people to find parking without driving around.

[Kitchissippi]

Originally Posted by roger1818

How do you define the boundary of the CBD and where did you get this 200m figure from? I would include privately owned but publicly accessible garages (not lots) in the analysis though.

Gloucester street one block south of Laurier is the official boundary of the CBD (downtown). 200m is arbitrary, the approximate length of a block and a half (or the sum of the long and short sides of one).

Definitely, privately owned but publicly accessible garages should all be included and integrated into the system in order for it to work efficiently. Once all the publicly accessible spaces are monitored it would also be easier to create an app for navigation systems that can direct people as well. They did this in Singapore:

[lrt's friend]

Originally Posted by Kitchissippi

Gloucester street one block south of Laurier is the official boundary of the CBD (downtown). 200m is arbitrary, the approximate length of a block and a half (or the sum of the long and short sides of one).

Definitely, privately owned but publicly accessible garages should all be included and integrated into the system in order for it to work efficiently. Once all the publicly accessible spaces are monitored it would also be easier to create an app for navigation systems that can direct people as well. They did this in Singapore:

Isn't there something similar to this sign in Old Montreal?

[roger1818]

Originally Posted by lrt's friend

Isn't there something similar to this sign in Old Montreal?

I was thinking the same thing, but couldn't find a picture online. I think there is one somewhere near McGill & Wellington.

Edit: I found it in street-view, but they seem to be off at the time the photo was taken. If you go back in time you see the old green parking signs.

https://goo.gl/maps/sfLZHFw8s4o

[phil235]

Originally Posted by lrt's friend

Isn't there something similar to this sign in Old Montreal?

This is a great idea. Also, we could have it now, without building more garages. There is no reason that private parking lots can't provide this information via the same sign.

[phil235]

Originally Posted by Kitchissippi

Try telling that to Kelly Egan:

http://ottawacitizen.com/news/local-news/egan-how-downtown-has-grown-to-hate-your-car

From the article:

"This is the future, one supposes: the city doesn’t particularly want you to use your car — downtown, maybe anywhere, the private sector has run out of places to park it, the economics of deep underground parking lots no longer make sense, and nobody but other motorists is interested in your whining."

That is really the crux of it, what Egan suggests is a public policy issue. He is looking for subsidized parking spaces downtown so he can drive to his meetings. He doesn't want to pay the actual cost of parking his car in an area with high land values. "Commerce" depends on cheap parking it would seem.

All of the rest of the article is basically noise that plays to his readership. As if the removal of a few on-street spots on Laurier and O'Connor (not sure if O'Connor actually lost any spots downtown) had any real impact on a parking inventory consisting of more than 12,000 spaces. And of course if we spend millions to build more parking as he suggests, that parking will be fed by the same road network, more people will drive and we'll end up with congestion that will inevitably delay his arrival at some other meeting and will form the basis for his next article.

But headlines about how Ottawa hates his car do bring the old white guy commenters out in force. This one created a spectacular echo-chamber of whining about bike lanes and the fact that these suburbanites can't fly into downtown at 60 or 70 kmph and park for free in front of their destinations. The ones who "never" go downtown because of the lack of parking, but still have lots of opinions on it ("Absolutely nobody I know goes downtown anymore - it's too busy"). One guy from Metcalfe actually suggested that the solution is to de-intensify downtown (and make it more like Metcalfe I suppose).

I always tell myself I won't read the comments, and then I do anyway, and get depressed.

[zzptichka]

I've noticed that many people like Egan and his readers who complain about short-term parking downtown don't consider underground garages as parking.
Even on weekends when it's free they would be circling the streets looking for an on-street spot (like they'd be doing at Costco) without even thinking about going into half-empty underground garage like World Exchange Plaza or City Hall.
I guess they think only office workers with a monthly pass can park there or something.

Real-time signs and educational campaign should go along with on-street parking spots removal to help ease their pain.

[acottawa]

It seems like Egan tried several expensive underground lots as a first step, so he seems somewhat atypical of people who complain about downtown parking (who are usually afraid of spending money and/or using parking garages).

The obvious solution is to raise parking rates to better balance the supply and demand of parking.

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by lrt's friend

Isn't there something similar to this sign in Old Montreal?

Quebec City has a bunch of them in the old part of town.

[danishh]

I would tend to agree that all egan's article suggests is that the price of indoor parking downtown is too low for current demand. Perhaps if the price rose, the economics of building new underground parking would be viable again.

[roger1818]

Originally Posted by danishh

I would tend to agree that all egan's article suggests is that the price of indoor parking downtown is too low for current demand.

Yup, I basically said the same thing above.

Perhaps if the price rose, the economics of building new underground parking would be viable again.

I dispute his allegation that underground parking is not viable. I have seen several development plans that include underground parking, some of them well out of the CBD. Yes the new hospital is claiming it is too expensive, but they get land for free and the province won't give them any money to build a parking garage, to they have incentive to sprawl.

[J.OT13]

Turns out they will build the new Civic's parking underground.

[begratto]

Originally Posted by lrt's friend

Isn't there something similar to this sign in Old Montreal?

There are many of those in Old Montreal and the city centre already (example on Google Streetview), and the City of Montreal just signed a contract to have 139 more installed.

[c_speed3108]

There seems to be a disconnect between available parking and people knowing where to find it.

Street parking is popular because it is reasonably easy to locate.

I would consider myself reasonably well versed in downtown parking and just this last month I discovered no less than two garages that are easy to parking in during the evening/weekends. One is free and the other is a cheap city owned on.

Things like those electronic signs would be cool. I would like some sort of standardized publicly parking sign (say some sort of style of giant letter P) that could be easily spotted driving down a street. Right now it is very difficult to tell which buildings off parking to the public and which do not.

With all the demands on street space - pedestrians, bikes, buses, even cars I have never felt that vehicle storage should be a priority...particularly on major streets - like bank, or rideau or wellington or laurier.

[AndyMEng]

Originally Posted by c_speed3108

There seems to be a disconnect between available parking and people knowing where to find it.

Street parking is popular because it is reasonably easy to locate.

I would consider myself reasonably well versed in downtown parking and just this last month I discovered no less than two garages that are easy to parking in during the evening/weekends. One is free and the other is a cheap city owned on.

Things like those electronic signs would be cool. I would like some sort of standardized publicly parking sign (say some sort of style of giant letter P) that could be easily spotted driving down a street. Right now it is very difficult to tell which buildings off parking to the public and which do not.

With all the demands on street space - pedestrians, bikes, buses, even cars I have never felt that vehicle storage should be a priority...particularly on major streets - like bank, or rideau or wellington or laurier.

I live downtown, work in the burbs, and never have had a problem street parking when I arrive home after work (as my building doesn't have parking...1890's era Bank St. row). I generally park around 5:30pm and have no issues finding a space within 100ft of Bank street.

Race weekend, pride, glowfair, or other random things like Remembrance Day and Canada Day make parking downtown fairly difficult.

City Hall, Bank and Nepean (City parking garage west of bank on nepean), and World Exchange are ALL free on weekends. I'm sure I'm missing others, but there's that. And that's on top of all the street parking.

Weekdays, I'm not sure about the car warriors who need to find parking. You need to be able to afford the $275/month for underground, OR just be a well-paid public servant with included parking.

TBH, people who work in a downtown core should either live there, or take public transit. Unless you need to drive from place to place during your working hours, I'm sorry but having 100k parking spots downtown is just not feasible. PLUS I can't physically or emotionally imagine having to drive from Downtown to Kanata or Orleans each day. I see these poor bastards day after day slogging their way down the highway and shed a single tear for them. I don't understand it.

I drive for a part of my work, therefore I have a car. But I'm going against demand in traffic and parking, so it's grrrreat!

[roger1818]

Originally Posted by AndyMEng

I live downtown, work in the burbs, and never have had a problem street parking when I arrive home after work (as my building doesn't have parking...1890's era Bank St. row). I generally park around 5:30pm and have no issues finding a space within 100ft of Bank street.

I'm not surprised. By 5:30pm the parking situation should have cleared up most days.

City Hall, Bank and Nepean (City parking garage west of bank on nepean), and World Exchange are ALL free on weekends. I'm sure I'm missing others, but there's that. And that's on top of all the street parking.

City Hall isn't free on weekends, but it is very cheap ($0.50 per 30 min, $2 max from 6 am to 6 pm or 6 pm to 6 am as well as Monday to Friday 6 pm to 6 am). It has become a go to for me when I do need to drive to that part of town evenings and weekends as the fact that it isn't free means there is usually space, but it is so cheap, it might as well be free.

According to the city's website, the following city owned, downtown lots are free on weekends:

• Gloucester Garage (Saturday, Sunday and holidays, also M-F 9 pm to 8:30 am)
• Albert and Lyon Parking Lot (Saturday and Sunday)
• Kent and Queen Parking Lot (Saturday and Sunday)
• Slater Parking Lot (Saturday and Sunday)
• Tech High School Parking Lot (Saturday and Sunday)

Weekdays, I'm not sure about the car warriors who need to find parking. You need to be able to afford the $275/month for underground, OR just be a well-paid public servant with included parking.

The original article was related to short term or occasional parking on Weekdays, not parking for commuters.

TBH, people who work in a downtown core should either live there, or take public transit. Unless you need to drive from place to place during your working hours, I'm sorry but having 100k parking spots downtown is just not feasible. PLUS I can't physically or emotionally imagine having to drive from Downtown to Kanata or Orleans each day. I see these poor bastards day after day slogging their way down the highway and shed a single tear for them. I don't understand it.

I agree. The easiest way to solve the problem is to reduce the number of people commuting to/from downtown by car.