Confederation Line (Stage 1) | In Service 1.0

[roger1818]

Originally Posted by lrt's friend

Good Luck! There is only so much you can do with a street that is far from a showcase street.

Its a bit hit and miss. The stretch between Bank and O'Connor, should clean up nicely. Further west, Queen and Kent, and Queen and Lyon, some development is needed, but there is potential in the long term. Further east, while up to Metcalfe isn't bad (with some development), I'm not sure much can be done between Metcalfe and Elgin.

[Uhuniau]

Originally Posted by roger1818

Its a bit hit and miss. The stretch between Bank and O'Connor, should clean up nicely. Further west, Queen and Kent, and Queen and Lyon, some development is needed, but there is potential in the long term. Further east, while up to Metcalfe isn't bad (with some development), I'm not sure much can be done between Metcalfe and Elgin.

Demolish the god-awful RBC building and start over?

[roger1818]

Originally Posted by Uhuniau

Demolish the god-awful RBC building and start over?

The Thomas D'Arcy McGee Building (formerly the Royal Bank Centre) isn't bad from it's front on Spark St, but I agree it is awful from the back on Queen. At the corner of Queen and Metcalfe it is so close to the road, there is only room for a tiny tiny sidewalk (and of course they had to put the fire hydrant on the narrowest part of the sidewalk).

Front:


Back:

[lrt's friend]

I remember the previous building or the previous version of this building (I am not if it was a full replacement or not) but it was awful too especially on the Queen Street side. Any building that has little street interaction is a dud. The 60s, 70s and 80s were an awful era for urban office and retail design.

[roger1818]

Originally Posted by lrt's friend

I remember the previous building or the previous version of this building (I am not if it was a full replacement or not) but it was awful too especially on the Queen Street side. Any building that has little street interaction is a dud. The 60s, 70s and 80s were an awful era for urban office and retail design.

According to SBSA, the "Original structure was progressively renovated in phases, with sections being demolished as new construction was ready for replacement thereby allowing personnel to continue functioning on the premises at all times."

Regardless, Larco Investments (its current owner) wouldn't want to demolish a perfectly functional building just because it doesn't look nice. Given that it is only about a quarter to a third of its way through its expected useful life (it opened in 1981), we will probably have to put up with it for another 50 to 70 years.

[lrt's friend]

Originally Posted by roger1818

According to SBSA, the "Original structure was progressively renovated in phases, with sections being demolished as new construction was ready for replacement thereby allowing personnel to continue functioning on the premises at all times."

Regardless, Larco Investments (its current owner) wouldn't want to demolish a perfectly functional building just because it doesn't look nice. Given that it is only about a quarter to a third of its way through its expected useful life (it opened in 1981), we will probably have to put up with it for another 50 to 70 years.

I am looking at the GEO Ottawa air photos and there was a major transformation of this location between 1976 and 1991. I know that the building from my childhood appeared in both the 1965 and 1976 photos and I believe that this version was built around 1960. Nevertheless, that building from the 60s also had blank walls facing Queen Street.

[roger1818]

Originally Posted by lrt's friend

I am looking at the GEO Ottawa air photos and there was a major transformation of this location between 1976 and 1991.

Given that its current incarnation opened in 1981, that would make sense.

[J.OT13]

Originally Posted by kevinbottawa

The Ottawa Sun article has a few details that aren't in the CBC article.



http://ottawasun.com/news/local-news/tra...wcm/f06885c6-d7ac-43ab-ae7f-aafd4fb993fe

Thanks for the video. Nice to see the progress. We can even see some of the public art going up at Lyon and Bayview.

• Video Link

[J.OT13]

The old RBC building. Personally, I'm a big fan of the mid-century modern look of the previous rendition rubbing elbows with historic department stores. Admittedly, the Queen façde was even then pretty terrible.





http://urbsite.blogspot.ca/2013/05/royal-trust-royal-bank.html

[roger1818]

Originally Posted by J.OT13

The old RBC building. Personally, I'm a big fan of the mid-century modern look of the previous rendition rubbing elbows with historic department stores. Admittedly, the Queen façde was even then pretty terrible.

I was just looking at those pictures and I think this is the only one that shows the Queen Street side of the building (you can see the peace tower in the background). I think the first one in your post shown is taken from the North.

It is hard to tell but it looks like there were store fronts at ground level as opposed to blank or glass walls.

[lrt's friend]

Yep. the first picture is facing the Sparks and Metcalfe intersection. The second is the Queen Street view from a parking lot that was there for years. I think the Queen Street side had a men's shop, Noel Kerr, may have been the name. A little nostalgia as my Dad's friend's drug store sign is in the first picture right on the edge of picture. It was on the north side of Sparks at Metcalfe back in the 60s.

Department Store consolidation did not do Ottawa well. Hudson's Bay bought out Freiman's. Hudson Bay bought out Morgan's. Simpson's bought out Murphy-Gambles then Hudson Bay bought out Simpson's and everything closed down on Sparks.

As a kid, I loved the old globe street lights. They were so human scaled and elegant. Too bad they ripped them all out, not long after these pictures were taken.

[J.OT13]

Originally Posted by roger1818

I was just looking at those pictures and I think this is the only one that shows the Queen Street side of the building (you can see the peace tower in the background). I think the first one in your post shown is taken from the North.

It is hard to tell but it looks like there were store fronts at ground level as opposed to blank or glass walls.

Yup. First pic is north/west corner from Metcalfe.

[M00dy]

Originally Posted by roger1818

My point was that apparently before Edmonton, the Thales system had only been used on grade separated systems, so if the 2006 plan were to use the same system, we could have been suffering from the same issues Edmonton is having (since it was to have trains run on the surface through downtown). Apparently Edmonton are still only able to have 15 minute frequencies on the Metro Line, instead of the 5 minute frequencies planned.

Ahhh I missed that you were talking about the proposed surface LRT system. Yes since the confederation line is a separated system it won't have those same issues.

[GoTrans]

Originally Posted by roger1818

My point was that apparently before Edmonton, the Thales system had only been used on grade separated systems, so if the 2006 plan were to use the same system, we could have been suffering from the same issues Edmonton is having (since it was to have trains run on the surface through downtown). Apparently Edmonton are still only able to have 15 minute frequencies on the Metro Line, instead of the 5 minute frequencies planned.

Part of the problem in Edmonton is that they tried to mesh the Thales CBTC with the existential by legacy system they had because they didn't want spend the money to have one unified train control system.

[eltodesukane]

Originally Posted by roger1818

The Thomas D'Arcy McGee Building (formerly the Royal Bank Centre) isn't bad from it's front on Spark St, but I agree it is awful from the back on Queen. At the corner of Queen and Metcalfe it is so close to the road, there is only room for a tiny tiny sidewalk (and of course they had to put the fire hydrant on the narrowest part of the sidewalk).

[swimmer_spe]

How much vacant land is within walking distance of the future stations exist?

I am thinking of the future TOD

[roger1818]

Originally Posted by roger1818

Its a bit hit and miss. The stretch between Bank and O'Connor, should clean up nicely. Further west, Queen and Kent, and Queen and Lyon, some development is needed, but there is potential in the long term. Further east, while up to Metcalfe isn't bad (with some development), I'm not sure much can be done between Metcalfe and Elgin.

Looking again at the Roll plan drawings for the Queen Street renewal project (which are out of date as they don't include the modifications to Lyon St, shown here, to allow north bound buses), I realized the project scope is from Bay st to half way between O'Connor and Metcalfe.

Confined to these boundaries, the biggest blight, IMHO, is the surface parking lot at 280 Queen Street (at corner of Kent). With its close proximity to the Lyon East entrance, I am surprised that there aren't any plans to develop this land (to my knowledge).

The other large blight is the L shaped surface parking lot at Lyon and Albert. The Lyon West entrance is occupying the part of the parking lot facing Queen Street, so it won't be so bad. Eventually Claridge Homes plan to develop the land (integrating the station into the building) but I haven't heard a time frame for that.

Other than those issues, I don't see any other big blights. It may not be perfect, but I think when all is said and done, it will be pretty good.

[Uhuniau]

Originally Posted by roger1818

Confined to these boundaries, the biggest blight, IMHO, is the surface parking lot at 280 Queen Street (at corner of Kent). With its close proximity to the Lyon East entrance, I am surprised that there aren't any plans to develop this land (to my knowledge).

I would strongly suspect such plans exist or will exist soon in the offices of the property owners.

[roger1818]

Originally Posted by Uhuniau

I would strongly suspect such plans exist or will exist soon in the offices of the property owners.

I saw some evidence that the land might be for sale.

[McC]

Originally Posted by roger1818

Confined to these boundaries, the biggest blight, IMHO, is the surface parking lot at 280 Queen Street (at corner of Kent). With its close proximity to the Lyon East entrance, I am surprised that there aren't any plans to develop this land (to my knowledge).

Once upon a time this was to be Place de Ville Phase III, planned for 3 19-storey office towers. Brookfield put that plan on ice when they put forward the proposal to replace the PdeV Podium building with a 19-storey tower (which is now also on ice.). So far as I know, that lot is still owned by Brookfield.