PHILADELPHIA | Highrise Development Thread IX

[Gonzo the Great]

[QUOTE=Groundhog;8085719]Don't forget, there were a lot of people from outside the metro in attendance as well (I didn't go into too detailed of talks with strangers, but people, but I personally ran into people from Baltimore, North Jersey,


No matter how big or small , Queen said it best .

We are the champions, my friends
And we'll keep on fighting...till the end
We are the champions, We are the champions
No time for losers cause we are the champions...
Of the world

[shakman]

Originally Posted by Groundhog

Don't forget, there were a lot of people from outside the metro in attendance as well (I didn't go into too detailed of talks with strangers, but people, but I personally ran into people from Baltimore, North Jersey, Providence and Minneapolis) and, as some have said below, if you include the people who popped their heads out for a few minutes or watched from their office or apartment in the second most dense downtown in the country, then I think even the visible crowd shots are undercutting how many people partook.

I'm not going to make any guesses at actual size, but I will say it was significantly more than the Phillies parade 10 years ago (the fact that it ended on the Parkway definitely helped). So whatever you estimate that was, add at least a quarter to it, if not more.

I took the Amtrak from Washington DC. I never knew so many Eagles fans were in the DC area.

[hammersklavier]

Originally Posted by allovertown

100 Smaller companies, especially start ups would not net 50,000 jobs. It's more like 1,000 smaller companies. This is why Philly is willing to offer Amazon incentives unlike anything they'd be willing to offer a 50 person company.

Edit: Milksteak already said it better right above me.

I would say that "jobs" is a bad metric -- how many times is it used to justify massive subsidies with the expected benefits either unrealized or slower to realize than anticipated?

But of course that begs the question of which metric(s) would be more appropriate to gauge economic development. I would augur that net startup formation would be a halfway decent metric here, because if you're getting a lot of startups and they're surviving a decent period of time, that's symptomatic of strong bottom-up economic activity (i.e. your average person is able to find the resources to turn their ideas into reality). But startups are necessarily small shops, and it takes time for them to turn into major employers ... which ultimately the consumer class whose primary demand is for stable employment.

[iheartphilly]

Originally Posted by hammersklavier

I would say that "jobs" is a bad metric -- how many times is it used to justify massive subsidies with the expected benefits either unrealized or slower to realize than anticipated?

But of course that begs the question of which metric(s) would be more appropriate to gauge economic development. I would augur that net startup formation would be a halfway decent metric here, because if you're getting a lot of startups and they're surviving a decent period of time, that's symptomatic of strong bottom-up economic activity (i.e. your average person is able to find the resources to turn their ideas into reality). But startups are necessarily small shops, and it takes time for them to turn into major employers ... which ultimately the consumer class whose primary demand is for stable employment.

Startups need capital (private equity or venture capital, even rich investors) and failure rates can be high. Re-locating mid-size to large companies that want to expand is a better option if we are talking about a choice.

Ideally, having both is ideal and realistic for Philly. One can be an impetus for the other, like how CTC or CC invests in a start up or buys smaller firms and integrates it into its business plan. One day the start up grows up and employs more people because it can sell more products and/or services. Symbiotic relationships.

[BenKatzPhillytoParis]

Originally Posted by shakman

I took the Amtrak from Washington DC. I never knew so many Eagles fans were in the DC area.

There are Eagles fans everywhere! I watched the game live at a bar in Saint Petersburg, Russia (so 2:30 to 6:30 am) and the spot was full of passionate Eagles fans.

[JohnIII]

Originally Posted by BenKatzPhillytoParis

There are Eagles fans everywhere! I watched the game live at a bar in Saint Petersburg, Russia (so 2:30 to 6:30 am) and the spot was full of passionate Eagles fans.

I can second your motion on that; I know a few people on the Paris Police Prefecture who are Eagles fans; they were pretty glad when we went to the Super Bowl and I know they loved that game.

[iheartphilly]

This is a very good sign for 1911 Walnut on the condo side. It means there are buys out there willing to plunk down above the $4MM and above Territory.

Consider One riverside sold one of its penthouse for a cool $7million.

http://www.philly.com/philly/business/re...lls-7-million-philly-buyer-20180216.html

[jsbrook]

Originally Posted by iheartphilly

This is a very good sign for 1911 Walnut on the condo side. It means there are buys out there willing to plunk down above the $4MM and above Territory.

Consider One riverside sold one of its penthouse for a cool $7million.

http://www.philly.com/philly/business/re...lls-7-million-philly-buyer-20180216.html

Not many...But 1911 Walnut only has 2 full floor units and a bi-level penthouse. Most of the condos are 2 and 3 BRs and will be in the $2-4MM range. There are a lot of them, though...more than Philly has seen in any one building. 10 Rittenhouse and One Riverside (and the Ritz) had more smaller units mixed in. Hopefully it is successful. It seems to be a go from what I'm hearing.

[GtownFriend]

Count the cranes; ChinaTown, W, CTC, even Hamilton. Plus Alexander and One Franklin.


676 West by Darren LoPrinzi, on Flickr

[summersm343]

The Alexander - luxury apartments/retail - 370 FT - 32 FLOORS - COMPLETE

The building is complete, and the thread will be moved to the Completed Projects Archive.



Thread here:
http://forum.skyscraperpage.com/showthread.php?p=8090322#post8090322

[TechTalkGuy]

Tell me about the retail portion of the Alexander.

[duffey]

Originally Posted by summersm343

The Alexander - luxury apartments/retail - 370 FT - 32 FLOORS - COMPLETE

The building is complete, and the thread will be moved to the Completed Projects Archive.



Thread here:
http://forum.skyscraperpage.com/showthread.php?p=8090322#post8090322

Shout out to my alma mater St Joe's Prep's Church of the Gesu in the background!

[mcgrath618]

Originally Posted by duffey

Shout out to my alma mater St Joe's Prep's Church of the Gesu in the background!

Yea Prep! Currently in my senior year.

[cafeguy]

The key thing...the most important thing...the beautiful thing about this building is its demonstration that 676 without caps can ABSOLUTELY WORK. Look at this image...instead of looking like the end of the city, it looks like a continuation of the city. With proper density and ground floor retail, we can accomplish the same exact thing we seek to accomplish by capping 676, but at a fraction of the cost.

There's no need to cap 676. What we need to do (and what's more realistic to happen) is to upzone the fuck out of these parcels and force ground floor retail.

[jsbrook]

Originally Posted by cafeguy

The key thing...the most important thing...the beautiful thing about this building is its demonstration that 676 without caps can ABSOLUTELY WORK. Look at this image...instead of looking like the end of the city, it looks like a continuation of the city. With proper density and ground floor retail, we can accomplish the same exact thing we seek to accomplish by capping 676, but at a fraction of the cost.

There's no need to cap 676. What we need to do (and what's more realistic to happen) is to upzone the fuck out of these parcels and force ground floor retail.

As stunning as it is, this building does not show that. Ideally, we will still find money to cap 676. At least between 19th and 16th.

[SEFTA]

Capping 676 would be a big deal. Not just the cost, but a real distinction for Philly. It would be world class project. It would raise the perception of not just Vine Street but Philadelphia. Comparing this to other big projects that other comparable cities are planning, it would be right on par and not a stretch at all. There are numerous plans to cap inner city freeways. I think Penn's Landing is one of the first to come to fruition and I think it is the right direction. It's the type of thing great cities do. Great cities do great projects. You want to compete? Compete. Settling for less is what you get and it will show.

[iamrobk]

Forget about a 'big dig'-esque project capping the entire thing any time soon IMO but I think it's semi-realistic to hope for a cap from 21st to 16th, then eventually to Broad, and then to 10th. Sadly it'll be impossible to do anything with it east of 10th (you'd actually need a big dig type project to completely redo 676, 95, and the bridge), but I think the move of the police HQ and redeveloping the parking lots around Franklin Square could do wonders for that area regardless.

[ebuilder]

Originally Posted by iamrobk

Forget about a 'big dig'-esque project capping the entire thing any time soon IMO but I think it's semi-realistic to hope for a cap from 21st to 16th, then eventually to Broad, and then to 10th. Sadly it'll be impossible to do anything with it east of 10th (you'd actually need a big dig type project to completely redo 676, 95, and the bridge), but I think the move of the police HQ and redeveloping the parking lots around Franklin Square could do wonders for that area regardless.

whatever would happen would be localized like the PL project. You will NOT see any major billion dollar project coming anytime soon with the current federal funding realities. Something like the big dig would never happen today with the transportation funding situation being what it is now. There are very few really large projects like this going on in America unless they are connected with tolls or special referendum based funding. PA doesn't do referendums for special taxes to fund projects.

[iamrobk]

Originally Posted by ebuilder

whatever would happen would be localized like the PL project. You will NOT see any major billion dollar project coming anytime soon with the current federal funding realities. Something like the big dig would never happen today with the transportation funding situation being what it is now. There are very few really large projects like this going on in America unless they are connected with tolls or special referendum based funding. PA doesn't do referendums for special taxes to fund projects.

To be clear, by "soon" I meant in the next 15-20 years. Agreed nothing big will be happening in the next 5 or so... but beyond that, who the hell knows.

[Urbanthusiat]

I think Philadelphia will get this done once it's done the new Delaware River I-95 cap. It just makes too much sense. This isn't a "Big Dig" type project - it has already been dug, and that's the real expensive part. It is literally a sunk cost. I would guess a full capping of I-676 would cost around $500 million. Expensive, no doubt, but not like the Big Dig.