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  #2341  
Old Posted Jan 31, 2018, 5:55 PM
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I was just wondering what an aborted walrus would think about this
     
     
  #2342  
Old Posted Jan 31, 2018, 6:02 PM
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Originally Posted by AbortedWalrus View Post
If this new healthcare initiative from Amazon is going to be located in their HQ2 campus (which is unknown) it would certainly give an advantage to cities like Boston, Raleigh, and Philadelphia.
Couldn't disagree more. Healthcare today is so involved with government (did anyone else catch Trump's promise to lower drug prices last night?) that I see what Amazon and the rest seem to be planning to do as a strong reason to be inside (or near to) the Beltway. This won't be about medical research. This will be about health policy and regulation and whether they'll even be allowed to do what they are planning under a variety of federal rules and regulations.
     
     
  #2343  
Old Posted Jan 31, 2018, 6:16 PM
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Guys it's a really tough case to argue that Amazon is a monopoly when their entire business model is heavily associated with plunging prices for consumers. Monopolies typically price gouge because they aggressively eliminate competition. Amazon aggressively eliminates competition the Wal Mart way: by having a business model that drops prices by so much that people go out of business in droves.
yea and then when youre the lone man standing you can dictate prices to be whatever you want them to be....hence the fears of monopoly
     
     
  #2344  
Old Posted Jan 31, 2018, 6:31 PM
UrbanRevival UrbanRevival is offline
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Couldn't disagree more. Healthcare today is so involved with government (did anyone else catch Trump's promise to lower drug prices last night?) that I see what Amazon and the rest seem to be planning to do as a strong reason to be inside (or near to) the Beltway. This won't be about medical research. This will be about health policy and regulation and whether they'll even be allowed to do what they are planning under a variety of federal rules and regulations.
But major corporate interest in federal policy is certainly nothing new, nor is it unique in any sense to the healthcare industry. In fact, all the major tech companies are bound to be much more scrutinized by the Feds in the coming years due to previously-unknown-but-becoming-much-clearer business power and manipulation. But that certainly doesn't necessitate a wholesale DC presence. A government relations branch in/around DC, sure, but why spend extra money on a significant presence in a local office market with uber-inflated real estate based only on the federal government when the bulk of your operations can be done elsewhere just as successfully and more economically?

That said, I do think it's safe to say that any foray into healthcare by Amazon will involve a "well-rounded" group of minds that must include those with medical research and policy backgrounds.
     
     
  #2345  
Old Posted Jan 31, 2018, 6:35 PM
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yea and then when youre the lone man standing you can dictate prices to be whatever you want them to be....hence the fears of monopoly
Bingo! drop prices until your the last man standing and the only game in town.
It's a short term strategy for long term gain.
     
     
  #2346  
Old Posted Jan 31, 2018, 6:57 PM
ScreamShatter ScreamShatter is offline
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Originally Posted by Pedestrian View Post
Couldn't disagree more. Healthcare today is so involved with government (did anyone else catch Trump's promise to lower drug prices last night?) that I see what Amazon and the rest seem to be planning to do as a strong reason to be inside (or near to) the Beltway. This won't be about medical research. This will be about health policy and regulation and whether they'll even be allowed to do what they are planning under a variety of federal rules and regulations.
No doubt you are right about the dc relationship with healthcare. That said, Amazon will have lobbyists in dc to handle that aspect.

What I think is an equally big part of the cost equation for drug prices is signing contracts with Pharma companies. It’s establishing those relationships and then building out a front end pharma platform that can balance against complex regulations and risk management eras while also leveraging Amazons existing distribution structure. The only way to build such a platform would be to have employees (thousands of them) with direct industry experience who have the knowledge to can lay out the tech requirements to build the platform. That doesn’t come by hiring kids straight out of college. That comes by hiring more tenured industry professionals in combination with other medical consultants.

Let’s play out the scenario. How will Amazon be able to build a platform that can manage prescriptions, including controlled substances, and deliver to my door? Let’s say I have a prescription for adderall which requires a physical script in paper...how will amazon consume that given it’s not entered electronically? How will Amazons order management system know how to stock prescriptions that require special care? How will they handle the audit and compliance required by gov law? There are so many tough questions that would require people with direct industry experience to know in order to design and build such a complex front end solution that would integrate with a backend distribution service. Totally doable. Completely disruptive. Requires the right talent stream and long term funding stream to design, build, rollout, and maintain such an endeavor.
     
     
  #2347  
Old Posted Jan 31, 2018, 7:39 PM
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But why would people buy meds for example from Amazon if they up the price really high? They will just go to other alternatives. This is actually really exciting, Amazon has the massive clout, along with the other two brands to make a huge mark on the market.

Why would JP Morgan, for instance, do this with no profit in mind? One guess is the fact we are talking about them right now, this is really good PR for the face of Big Finance, an industry that hasnt looked so good in a few decades.
Probably to control their own health care costs. Dimon has always been a Democrat, so there is nothing particularly surprising that these three relatively liberal CEOs are doing this.
     
     
  #2348  
Old Posted Jan 31, 2018, 8:02 PM
LouisVanDerWright LouisVanDerWright is offline
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Bingo! drop prices until your the last man standing and the only game in town.
It's a short term strategy for long term gain.
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Originally Posted by Via Chicago View Post
yea and then when youre the lone man standing you can dictate prices to be whatever you want them to be....hence the fears of monopoly
This will never happen though because Amazon is competing in all sorts of different markets and doesn't even have a majority share in any of them. The only thing it dominates is e-commerce, but even there it's got serious competition with other big heavy hitters like Wal-Mart moving in on their strategy. They would have to be fools to try to squeeze out competition in some small retail sector because the additional gains wouldn't be worth the instant anti-trust concerns it would generate.

This is why you see them trying to focus their investments and energy into cracking new markets. This healthcare thing is an obvious target because skyrocketing prices indicate there is money to be made in that sector. If Amazon can distill a way of tapping those inflated prices, they are going to make a hell of a lot more money than they would by dumping in a market to squeeze out competitors. They don't need to do that, they have much bigger and more lucrative fish to fry.
     
     
  #2349  
Old Posted Jan 31, 2018, 8:20 PM
AbortedWalrus AbortedWalrus is offline
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Originally Posted by Pedestrian View Post
Couldn't disagree more. Healthcare today is so involved with government (did anyone else catch Trump's promise to lower drug prices last night?) that I see what Amazon and the rest seem to be planning to do as a strong reason to be inside (or near to) the Beltway. This won't be about medical research. This will be about health policy and regulation and whether they'll even be allowed to do what they are planning under a variety of federal rules and regulations.
And yet Joe Biden commuted from the Philadelphia metro to DC for his entire political career. Philadelphia's position makes it possible to do both easily.
     
     
  #2350  
Old Posted Jan 31, 2018, 8:52 PM
IrishIllini IrishIllini is offline
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A lot of shade thrown in this thread recently...

From my perspective, Amazon cares about three things:
1. Recruiting
2. Affordable housing
3. Transit

Philadelphia performs well across these three areas. In my opinion, Chicago and Philadelphia should be the two finalists. I think Chicago has the edge in categories 1 and 3. 2 is a wash. Chicago is a bit more affordable I believe, but they're pretty much on the same playing field.

I'm struggling to see how Dallas or Atlanta are actually competitive, although I do think they're in the top 5. They're as costly as Chicago or Philadelphia (which are easier places to sell IMO) without the transit or recruiting pipelines. I guess I'm just not seeing any major benefit to being in Dallas or Atlanta. Before someone mentions it, weather is not going to be what drives this decision. Seattle is hardly a tropical paradise and has served Amazon well thus far.

I guess Philadelphia's location is a plus if being near DC is any sort of requirement for Amazon, but how often would they be sending executives or representatives to DC? Would it matter that Philadelphia has fairly direct rail access when every "real" contender has direct flights to DC multiple times per day? If Amazon wants to be near DC for whatever reason, they're probably going to end up near a Metro Station in NoVa or Maryland.

I agree with TUP that Philadelphia's pharma presence isn't a knockout/slam dunk for the city's bid. Pharma has evolved to mean many things from traditional pharmaceuticals to biotech and more. Boston, SF, Chicago, and others are no slouches here. SF isn't in the running for HQ2, but Boston and Chicago certainly are.
     
     
  #2351  
Old Posted Jan 31, 2018, 10:26 PM
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Man. Moody's is harsh on chi town.

Btw, who is that cbs girl... (Green)
     
     
  #2352  
Old Posted Jan 31, 2018, 10:44 PM
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Man. Moody's is harsh on chi town.

Btw, who is that cbs girl... (Green)
That Moody’s analysis was absolute garbage. I looked at their model and data. They didn’t even put any weight on city or metro population, for goodness’ sake. And they used fundamentally inconsistent measures. For example, they used a “quality of life” metric derived using housing prices and employment, among other things, and then threw it back in with housing prices and employment to predict Amazon’s choice. Econometrically, that’s akin to predicting someone’s weight based on their calorie consumption, and then using that predicted weight to predict their calorie consumption.
     
     
  #2353  
Old Posted Jan 31, 2018, 10:45 PM
the urban politician the urban politician is offline
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Originally Posted by Khantilever View Post
That Moody’s analysis was absolute garbage. I looked at their model and data. They didn’t even put any weight on city or metro population, for goodness’ sake. And they used fundamentally inconsistent measures. For example, they used a “quality of life” metric derived using housing prices and employment, among other things, and then threw it back in with housing prices and employment to predict Amazon’s choice. Econometrically, that’s akin to predicting someone’s weight based on their calorie consumption, and then using that predicted weight to predict their calorie consumption.
Moody’s is primarily an agency focused on creditworthiness. Obviously they have issues with Chicago...
     
     
  #2354  
Old Posted Jan 31, 2018, 10:54 PM
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https://www.theonion.com/amazon-warehouses-stocked-with-20-000-doctors-in-prepar-1822604236


Amazon Warehouses Stocked With 20,000 Doctors In Preparation For Healthcare Launch


Today 2:44pm



SEATTLE—Saying the online retailer was attempting to get ahead of the anticipated rush, Amazon CEO Jeff Bezos announced Wednesday that his company’s warehouses have been stocked with 20,000 doctors in preparation for the launch of his new healthcare initiative. “As part of our mission to always be expanding our selection of goods and services, we will soon begin offering Amazon customers access to thousands of physicians, each of whom will be capable of prescribing a wide array of treatment options and can be delivered right to your door,” said Bezos, noting that Amazon also plans to keep more than 50,000 competitively priced nurses, physician assistants, and pharmacists in stock at all times.

...































     
     
  #2355  
Old Posted Jan 31, 2018, 11:08 PM
Khantilever Khantilever is offline
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Moody’s is primarily an agency focused on creditworthiness. Obviously they have issues with Chicago...
Haha I didn’t even think about that but definitely. Suppose they made a model and it predicted Chicago would win. These guys are surrounded by coworkers talking about how terrible Illinois and Chicago’s finances are. I’m sure they’d immediately assume something’s wrong and tweak it until Chicago drops in the ranking.
     
     
  #2356  
Old Posted Feb 1, 2018, 12:31 AM
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Haha I didn’t even think about that but definitely. Suppose they made a model and it predicted Chicago would win. These guys are surrounded by coworkers talking about how terrible Illinois and Chicago’s finances are. I’m sure they’d immediately assume something’s wrong and tweak it until Chicago drops in the ranking.
Not that I disagree with any prediction on their part that Chicago won't be the site of Amazon's HQ2--I don't think it will be--but Moody's is one of the outfits who said mortgage bonds were AAA credits in 2008 so take their opinions for what they are worth.
     
     
  #2357  
Old Posted Feb 1, 2018, 5:18 AM
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The more and more I read into this three headed hydra the less worried I become working the health care industry.




http://www.chicagobusiness.com/article/2...-berkshire-hathaway-cant-fix-healthcares

January 31, 2018

Bezos, Buffett and Dimon can't solve health care's ills



Even with their combined brainpower, resources, and a U.S. employee base of 1 million people, the new partnership formed by Amazon, Berkshire Hathaway, and JPMorgan Chase will have a tough time curing the persistent ills of the $3.3 trillion U.S. health care industry. But the size of the target—with health care accounting for 18 percent of domestic GDP—is too large for these three world-class organizations not to try to disrupt the system, if only to wring some cost savings for their employees.


Controlling costs will be a monumental task, given rising health care consumption, the aging population and increasing number of chronic diseases and conditions. The harsh reality in health care is obesity, poor diets and lack of exercise are major risks. Greater technology usage also adds to skyrocketing costs. It's expensive, and the reality is that, by extending life expectancy, the technology also adds to higher costs for health care as people live into their 80s and even 90s and beyond.
More
:


For three companies with the will and good intentions, but no expertise in health care delivery, these challenges could prove to be insurmountable.

Yet there is a void in health care now that the Affordable Care Act, after numerous repeal attempts, has been largely undermined by the new tax legislation,

...


News of the partnership and the potential that its solutions could scale elsewhere were enough to send shock waves through the health care sector, with the market value of 10 large, publicly traded health insurance and pharmacy companies losing a combined $30 billion—on a day when the overall stock market sold off sharply.


But even with the leadership firepower behind this new venture, health care is an extremely complex problem to fix. In the joint statement, Amazon's Jeff Bezos acknowledged that "we enter into this challenge open-eyed about the degree of difficulty." Berkshire's Warren Buffett added: "Our group does not come to this problem with answers. But we do not accept it as inevitable. Rather, we share the belief that putting our collective resources behind the country's best talent can, in time, check the rise in health costs while concurrently enhancing patient satisfaction and outcomes."

Employers and employees alike are seeking ways to improve health and wellness for individuals and to lower the cost of providing health care in the U.S. It's also a competitive issue. With health care closing in on 20 percent of GDP, the U.S. is less globally competitive. In contrast, health expenditures in Germany, the Netherlands, France and Sweden account for about 11 percent of their GDPs. In Japan, health care is about 10 percent of GDP.


Any progress in reining in health care expenditures would be a huge positive for Amazon, Berkshire Hathaway and JPMorgan Chase internally as they manage health care costs for their employees and dependents. And given Amazon's massive reach to consumers in every demographic in the U.S., and its appetite to expand (reportedly, it has been looking at pharmaceuticals), health care is an obvious target. But making the first inroads will prove whether this is only good intentions or a plan that can yield real actions and results.

Harry Kraemer is a professor at Kellogg School of Management at Northwestern University and the former CEO of Baxter.
     
     
  #2358  
Old Posted Feb 1, 2018, 6:54 AM
jtown,man jtown,man is offline
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Originally Posted by Antares41 View Post
Bingo! drop prices until your the last man standing and the only game in town.
It's a short term strategy for long term gain.
This is a rather Leninistic view. Think about what youre really saying....

Every competitor of Amazon fails. Amazon takes a med, for instance, from 20.00 dollars a month to 100.00. What happens? In the simplistic view, people pay it and we move on. In the real world, a competitor will pop up and Amazon will be challenged. Remember that Epipen scandal(I believe it was an epipen?)? The CEO was publically shammed and like Rite Aid or someone made a generic one for a lot less. The free market works.

Just imagine if Amazon "tricked" the world. Raising prices after they have a huge market share. Its incredibly dumb to imagine this as our world of markets are largely based on public perception and choice. The internet makes monopolies a joke today.
     
     
  #2359  
Old Posted Feb 1, 2018, 4:13 PM
IrishIllini IrishIllini is offline
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This is a rather Leninistic view. Think about what youre really saying....

Every competitor of Amazon fails. Amazon takes a med, for instance, from 20.00 dollars a month to 100.00. What happens? In the simplistic view, people pay it and we move on. In the real world, a competitor will pop up and Amazon will be challenged. Remember that Epipen scandal(I believe it was an epipen?)? The CEO was publically shammed and like Rite Aid or someone made a generic one for a lot less. The free market works.

Just imagine if Amazon "tricked" the world. Raising prices after they have a huge market share. Its incredibly dumb to imagine this as our world of markets are largely based on public perception and choice. The internet makes monopolies a joke today.
I don't know if I agree with your last sentence. It takes a lot of time, money, and manpower to set up the infrastructure necessary to compete with a giant like Amazon. The internet may give you options, but how many of those options are competitively priced and offering same day delivery?
     
     
  #2360  
Old Posted Feb 1, 2018, 4:15 PM
LouisVanDerWright LouisVanDerWright is offline
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This is a rather Leninistic view. Think about what youre really saying....

Every competitor of Amazon fails. Amazon takes a med, for instance, from 20.00 dollars a month to 100.00. What happens? In the simplistic view, people pay it and we move on. In the real world, a competitor will pop up and Amazon will be challenged. Remember that Epipen scandal(I believe it was an epipen?)? The CEO was publically shammed and like Rite Aid or someone made a generic one for a lot less. The free market works.

Just imagine if Amazon "tricked" the world. Raising prices after they have a huge market share. Its incredibly dumb to imagine this as our world of markets are largely based on public perception and choice. The internet makes monopolies a joke today.

^^^ Bingo, also this isn't a typical monopolistic industry, retail does not have high barriers to entry, it doesn't involve the control of underlying natural resources used in production, there's not a huge network effect (i.e. where you buy your retail goods doesn't strongly influence where your friends buy them), there aren't legal barriers like IP or copyright...

The fact of the matter is that Amazon is still a drop in a very very large bucket. The retail industry is huge, it shouldn't be surprising that Amazon, with an innovative and effective business model, is also huge. This is not without precedent since Montgomery Ward, Sears, Wal-Mart, etc have all followed the "giant retail behemoth with an innovative distribution model essentially making money off of wholesale economics of scale" model. Each of these companies have also generated their own competition as their success attracted copycats who picked up on their easily duplicated models.
     
     
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