Calgary International Airport II

[Mazrim]

Originally Posted by Acey

Sounds reasonably valid, no? that a WS Plus seat is comparable to the hard product of a J seat on an Air France narrowbody.

I think it was more about auto-correct making that tougher to follow than anything.

[casper]

Originally Posted by s211

Yes that does not make sense. NEW tablet with odd auto correct.

The hard product for Westjet plus and AIR France business class on the narrow body aircraft are the same. The soft product, e.g. food and wine are quite a bit weaker on westjet.

[outoftheice]

Was walking through the arrivals level of the international terminal the other day and noticed that the escalators that took people up to the security checkpoint for Canadian flight connections have been blocked off and some rather permanent looking signs now direct people up to the departures level and the A/C security check points.

I thought the whole idea of the new terminal was to allow connecting passengers to pass through security right away and then make use of the YYC Link shuttles or moving sidewalks to quickly reach their connecting flights at the A/B/C gates. Has this whole concept now been scrapped? If so, why? I'm shocked that the airport would rather have passengers doing the long walk to the A gates on the unsecure side when they've spent a small fortune setting up multiple systems to speed passengers along on the secure side.

[PPAR]

Originally Posted by outoftheice

Was walking through the arrivals level of the international terminal the other day and noticed that the escalators that took people up to the security checkpoint for Canadian flight connections have been blocked off and some rather permanent looking signs now direct people up to the departures level and the A/C security check points.

I thought the whole idea of the new terminal was to allow connecting passengers to pass through security right away and then make use of the YYC Link shuttles or moving sidewalks to quickly reach their connecting flights at the A/B/C gates. Has this whole concept now been scrapped? If so, why? I'm shocked that the airport would rather have passengers doing the long walk to the A gates on the unsecure side when they've spent a small fortune setting up multiple systems to speed passengers along on the secure side.

The last time I passed through the international terminal I noticed a related change. There were signs directing connecting passengers to exit customs through the doors that led to the public concourse. As soon as you left customs, another sign directed connecting passengers down another hallway (not sure where it led) but given the public access to this hallway, it was clear that the passengers would need to be completely re-screened.

[FormerWingTipper]

Yes, it appears the CAA wants it to be more complicated for connecting passengers. The Screening Checkpoint at ITD is now closed at all times. So the passengers have to back track all the way to C or A. It is especially funny when you are connecting to a C70-73 gate given that you arrive at ITB and leave at ITB but have to walk all the way to DTB and back. What a pain.

[Tobuz]

So, if I’m understanding this correctly, OSS has been shut down??

(I’d that’s correct, wow. Seems like that would be a huge step backwards for an airport that aspires to be a major hub.)

[Blader]

^^^
Is the shutdown temporary pending needed changes?

[Cage]

Originally Posted by PPAR

The last time I passed through the international terminal I noticed a related change. There were signs directing connecting passengers to exit customs through the doors that led to the public concourse.

Originally Posted by outoftheice

Was walking through the arrivals level of the international terminal the other day and noticed that the escalators that took people up to the security checkpoint for Canadian flight connections have been blocked off and some rather permanent looking signs now direct people up to the departures level and the A/C security check points.

I thought the whole idea of the new terminal was to allow connecting passengers to pass through security right away and then make use of the YYC Link shuttles or moving sidewalks to quickly reach their connecting flights at the A/B/C gates.

From what I understand form recent YYC/CAA announcements, personal observations, and the recent Calgary Chamber of Commerce luncheon with Bob Sartor; there have been a number of preboard security screening changes to accommodate the winter WestJet schedule.

There are two big impacts:
(1) Checkpoint D now closes at certain times of the midday and evening hours. Pax are directed to clear security at checkpoint C. Aeromexico is tghe biggest benefactor of this "enhancement". Checkpoint C will open 3 hours before departure.
(2) The international to Domestic connections pre-board screening has closed for the winter season. This was the unpublished preboard screening station that let out at the YYC link D/E terminus station.

If we go back one year, WS complained the new terminal didnt work for them. WS explained all the easy to understand aspects of their beef, but left out the more complicated points.

Simply put, One Stop Security and Travel Without Visa programs don't work for WS and their codeshare and interline partners. Additionally the programs are highly confusing for the majority of WS guests.

OSS and TWoV require some backend computer wizardry to operate. Example: WS->WS is okay but KL->WS requires an interface that KL is not willing to develop. Even if the computer system is set up, the traveler might be sent through regular arrival process if their declaration raises red flags (above limit, no previous experience crossing border, etc.).

Originally Posted by Tobuz

So, if I’m understanding this correctly, OSS has been shut down??

OSS is still available, however my understanding is that its an AC only thing. WS doesn't want to do OSS or TWoV at any of their hubs.

Currently, YVR, YYC, and YYZ are open for both programs. For AC at YYZ, the OSS and TWoV is huge initiative that is leading the country. YYZ has a shuttle bus to take OSS pax from the international processing to domestic wing until such time as a walking corridor can be built. YVR is constantly playing catch up, expect the CBSA arrival hall configuration to undergo major renovations in the near future. These renos will fix their remaining OSS problems. YYC was designed from day 1 for these programs.

[Tarsus]

Originally Posted by Acey

To the surprise of maybe someone who hasn't seen the AA codeshares evaporate in GDS...

http://news.delta.com/delta-and-westjet-agree-form-joint-venture

Surely somebody will have a go at ATL. If it fails they split the risk. Patiently awaiting a) Cage's thoughts on this and b) the first WS 789 to arrive in SkyTeam colours and c) the terribly-performing WS YYC-DFW to get quietly pulled.

I would hope so. Speaking of which my brother left this morning for ATL via IAH. I'm sure there is business for it, and like you said, by splitting the risk it would be more doable.

[rotten42]

I travel to Charlotte once a month. I would love to connect through Atlanta over Houston.

[PPAR]

I wonder if Delta could assign delivery of at least some their new C-series jets to WestJet to operate on the partnered routes, avoiding the tariff? This could be a workaround at least until Airbus has the US assembly operations established. Alternatively WestJet could operate the planes until qualifying as used, then Delta could take ownership.

[casper]

Originally Posted by PPAR

I wonder if Delta could assign delivery of at least some their new C-series jets to WestJet to operate on the partnered routes, avoiding the tariff? This could be a workaround at least until Airbus has the US assembly operations established. Alternatively WestJet could operate the planes until qualifying as used, then Delta could take ownership.

I don't know what the deal is with the Boeing 717. I was on one of those on the Seattle Vegas route recently. Nice aircraft, probably the closest thing to the C-series in operation. I think Delta got those used as well.

[Chinook Arch]

Originally Posted by PPAR

I wonder if Delta could assign delivery of at least some their new C-series jets to WestJet to operate on the partnered routes, avoiding the tariff? This could be a workaround at least until Airbus has the US assembly operations established. Alternatively WestJet could operate the planes until qualifying as used, then Delta could take ownership.

Maybe Delta could use one of their A350's

[DoubleK]

Originally Posted by casper

I don't know what the deal is with the Boeing 717. I was on one of those on the Seattle Vegas route recently. Nice aircraft, probably the closest thing to the C-series in operation. I think Delta got those used as well.

I thought I read that they were old Southwest planes.

[PPAR]

Originally Posted by casper

I don't know what the deal is with the Boeing 717. I was on one of those on the Seattle Vegas route recently. Nice aircraft, probably the closest thing to the C-series in operation. I think Delta got those used as well.

The Boeing 717 was targeted at the exact same market as the C-series (100-150 seats). It was actually a McDonnell Douglas designed jet, a direct descendant of the DC9. Boeing bought McDonnell out before it went into production and it was relabeled the 717. Boeing stoped production after about 5 years, as they preferred to just up sell the customer to the 737.
This is why Boeing is so obnoxious in its claim of injury by Bombardier. They left the small jet market, after deciding it was not economical for them.

[casper]

Originally Posted by Acey

It wasn't economical because carriers didn't want to buy them. They're highly sought now, but not when they ended production.

Interesting parallels.....

Boeing buys the 717 (an under-performing aircraft) from an aerospace company that is focused in other areas (military). For good measure it buy the rest of the company. Tries to market it for a while. Gives up and then goes back to building its slightly bigger jets.

Delta falls in love with the thing, (or gets a great deal) and builds out the lower end of its fleet with it.

.... compare and contrast to....

Airbus buys the C-series (an under-performing aircraft) from an aerospace company that is focused in other areas (business just and regional). For good measure it buys ..... Tries to market it for a while. .....

Delta falls in love with the thing, (or gets a great deal) and builds out the lower end of its fleet with it.



On a more related note. It sounds like a great aircraft for WestJet. Now that they have moved on from the silliness of only flying a single type of aircraft in Canada. They should buy some, regardless of the problem Delta has. I was on the 737-600 last month between YVR-YYC. A route this is well served by increased frequency. Canada also has lots of cities where something the size of 737-600 is a good fit. It would help build out its YYC.

[Trans Canada]

To the spotters, a rare Volga Dnepr IL-76 just landed at YYC (VDA5244)



IMG_0400 (May 2010) by RAF-YYC, on Flickr

[YYCguys]

Whoa! That’s cool! Is it a military transport plane? What is the windowed area beneath the nose (passenger or crew area perhaps?)?

[Cage]

Originally Posted by casper

Interesting parallels.....

Boeing buys the 717 (an under-performing aircraft) from an aerospace company that is focused in other areas (military). For good measure it buy the rest of the company. Tries to market it for a while. Gives up and then goes back to building its slightly bigger jets.

Delta falls in love with the thing, (or gets a great deal) and builds out the lower end of its fleet with it.

The 717 originated with the MD95 airframe. When Boeing purchased McDonnell Douglas, they closed production of the MD90 program as it competed (rather poorly) with the 737. Boeing transferred the MD95 specs to the 717. Consequently the 717 was an orphan aircraft and only MD88 and MD90 customers wanted the 717.

When AC was looking for a 100 seat airplane, the 717 was compared favourably against the A318 but significantly under performed the E190 in all categories. The icing on the cake was commonalty between the E190 and E175.

[thenoflyzone]

Originally Posted by YYCguys

Whoa! That’s cool! Is it a military transport plane? What is the windowed area beneath the nose (passenger or crew area perhaps?)?

Crew area, for the navigator. Very common for Russian airliners of the 60s and 70s to have glass noses such as this, mostly used by the navigators. Russia wasn't well covered by radar back in those days (especially Siberia), and radio NAVAIDS were few and far between. So the navigators on board had to have the ability to look outside to help them navigate.

Pic here.

Read the following for some more info.

http://www.airliners.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=745975

https://www.reddit.com/r/aviation/comments/2krqe1/why_do_many_sovietrussian_transport_planes_have/