PHILADELPHIA | THE LAUREL @ 1911 Walnut | 604 FT | 48 FLOORS

[mcgrath618]

Originally Posted by jsbrook

Nope.

Nope to what? All of it?

[jsbrook]

Originally Posted by mcgrath618

Nope to what? All of it?

Most of it. It would a foolish developer who would delay their projects (especially in an entirely different part of town) on the hopes of being the beneficiary of an Amazon beauty contest. As to landing them, I do think we have a decent shot. But it's far from a foregone conclusion.

[Mr Saturn64]

1911 Walnut and SLS will definitely be built, if not taller, if Amazon HQ2 does come here. But I do agree that it would be foolish to build before knowing.

[City Wide]

Originally Posted by jsbrook

They are doing work on the Rittenhouse Square Coffeehouse and the Warwick that will house lower income housing.

I think the question 'who they is' might be important. Are they the owners of the rest of the project or are they part of the group that will run the buildings once they are renovated.

In either case I'm glad something is moving forward.

[skyscraper]

Originally Posted by Mr Saturn64

1911 Walnut and SLS will definitely be built, if not taller, if Amazon HQ2 does come here. But I do agree that it would be foolish to build before knowing.

I don't know about 1911 walnut, but I can tell you with certainty that SLS will be built sooner rather than later, and that its design is not contingent upon Amazon. The design is essentially done, and they are not waiting.

[jsbrook]

Originally Posted by Mr Saturn64

1911 Walnut and SLS will definitely be built, if not taller, if Amazon HQ2 does come here. But I do agree that it would be foolish to build before knowing.

Developers and their investors do not condition long-planned projects (especially in another part of town) on speculation of landing a well-heeled, job-producing corporate headquarters. Nor do they redo something that has gone through pain-staking review process and that s a product of difficult compromise with many constituencies to build a little taller. Amazon will produce NEW projects if we land it. It has no bearing on SLS or 1911 Walnut. It takes too long to plan and get projects through approval process and off-the-ground for something like this to have any impact whatsoever in decision-making.

[Philly-Drew]

Originally Posted by skyscraper

........I can tell you with certainty that SLS will be built sooner rather than later............

It’s already later. Way later.

[jsbrook]

Originally Posted by skyscraper

I can tell you with certainty that SLS will be built sooner rather than later.

So, you are directly involved with this project?

[skyscraper]

Originally Posted by jsbrook

So, you are directly involved with this project?

not yet, but I am told I will be. I have been keeping my finger on its pulse internally in the mean time.

[jsbrook]

Originally Posted by skyscraper

not yet, but I am told I will be. I have been keeping my finger on its pulse internally in the mean time.

Hope you are right!

[Jawnadelphia]

565 footer @ top left corner of the square pppppplease:


https://www.instagram.com/p/BcU5nvClD0h/?hl=en&taken-by=jp_ohanessian

[Boku]

Southern Land Co. seeks to 'set the market' with luxury tower on Rittenhouse Square

https://www.bizjournals.com/philadelphia...and-co-seeks-to-set-the-market-with.html

Sannapieco Development Corp., Dranoff Properties, and Arden Group have proven that a high-end — even ultra-luxury condominium market — exists in Philadelphia with their respective projects but Southern Land Co., which owns the last prime development site around Rittenhouse Square, believes it can exceed the bar those developers have so far set.

If successful, the air in Philadelphia is about to get a little more rarefied.

“It will be the most luxurious building at the best location in Philadelphia,” said Tim Downey, CEO and founder of the Nashville, Tenn., real estate company in a recent interview about the building Southern Land is designing for 1911 Walnut St. “We’re looking to set the market.”

In 2015, Southern Land paid $30 million for 1911 Walnut, a 0.83-acre property that Downey described, and others are likely to agree, as an “unbeatable, iconic location.” Since then, the company has been tinkering with the design.

Because the parcel is on Rittenhouse Square, one of the city’s best addresses, Downey is taking extra care designing the building, making certain it is well-positioned in the market. “We need to build the most luxurious building befitting of the location,” he said.

Such superlatives take on a little more gravity when uttered by Downey. He’s calm, steady and soft spoken and has admittedly fallen in love with Philadelphia. The city, he said, should have a residential building that is equal to those of the same scale overlooking Central Park in New York. Downey believes Rittenhouse Square is nicer than Central Park and because of that, he feels a deep responsibility for making sure he gets 1911 Walnut right.

“We’re putting the most thought and care into this building than we have ever done,” he said, noting that at $300 million, it’s also the most expensive project Southern Land has undertaken.

A ground breaking for 1911 Walnut is a year overdue and is another nine months to a year away, said Brian Emmons, who has been hired by Southern Land to oversee its development. Emmons comes from Toll Brothers Inc., where he worked on the company’s Naval Square, 410 S. Front St., and Jeweler’s Square projects. At one point, Toll Brothers and Southern Land had entertained doing 1911 Walnut together but it got “too complicated,” Downey said.

The delay of 1911 Walnut may have some worried it is plagued by similar issues that stunted prior attempts at developing the property, such as overpaying for the land, a lack of money or bad market timing. That’s not the case. The land has been paid for and “we have the money to develop it,” Downey said.

The project has been redesigned, which has caused the postponement, and Southern Land is still figuring out how to position it. At first, it was going to be all apartments then at one point it was going to have 342 apartments, between 64 and 75 condominiums, and retail space that would wrap around Walnut, Sansom and 20th streets. In the redesign, Southern Land was encouraged to keep the condos but cut back on the number of apartments. Without any solicitation, 200 people called and wanted their names on a list, which initially didn’t exist, making known their interest in units that might come up for sale. Based on that, the company decided that the 48- to 49-story building will now have 200 rentals and 60 to 75 condominiums.

If the condos sell well, Southern Land will consider upping the number of for-sale units. The rentals will be on par to the condos and have high-end appointments. While someone can lease a rental unit for a year, they will also have a designated number of apartments that will be extended stay similar to Korman Communities’ AKA properties. The condo and apartments will have separate lobbies and a slew of amenities including indoor and outdoor pools and a rumored Equinox Sports Club is still under consideration. Restaurants will fill the retail space fronting Walnut and Sansom streets.

At this point, the developer plans to open a sales center next spring, break ground in 2019 and have the project completed by 2021.

[mcgrath618]

Ugh. Fine, I'd rather them wait than have them build a Wendy's.

[Nova08]

It seems like there is a least momentum forward so that is encouraging. But who knows what market impacts occur (good or bad) in the next 18 months before ground breaking.

This and the news about One Riverside should be a good non-scientific data point about the condo market in Philly.

[PhilliesPhan]

This is great news! I had no doubt that Southern Land was going to get this done, and I'm now even more pleased to hear the reasoning behind the delay. Southern Land is, understandably, trying to get this project right. This will be their biggest project on one of the most prime pieces of real estate in the entire nation. I hope the condos do end up selling well, as that may push the height of the building further up.

Speaking of a redesign, this also gives Southern Land the opportunity to redesign the retail space for a large department store. Although retail along Walnut stops at 18th Street, I could still see a department store in that area.

[iheartphilly]

Quote from the article:

“We’re putting the most thought and care into this building than we have ever done,” he said, noting that at $300 million, it’s also the most expensive project Southern Land has undertaken."

"The project has been redesigned, which has caused the postponement, and Southern Land is still figuring out how to position it. At first, it was going to be all apartments then at one point it was going to have 342 apartments, between 64 and 75 condominiums, and retail space that would wrap around Walnut, Sansom and 20th streets. In the redesign, Southern Land was encouraged to keep the condos but cut back on the number of apartments. Without any solicitation, 200 people called and wanted their names on a list, which initially didn’t exist, making known their interest in units that might come up for sale. Based on that, the company decided that the 48- to 49-story building will now have 200 rentals and 60 to 75 condominiums."

Honestly, $300MM doesn't sound like a lot for the size of the building and the number of rentals and condos. I'm wondering if that includes the price of the land or not too? For comparison, 500 Walnut has way less units, and I forget the price tag that was speculated, but maybe $75MM to $100MM is my guess.

[Redddog]

Originally Posted by PhilliesPhan

This is great news! I had no doubt that Southern Land was going to get this done, and I'm now even more pleased to hear the reasoning behind the delay. Southern Land is, understandably, trying to get this project right. This will be their biggest project on one of the most prime pieces of real estate in the entire nation. I hope the condos do end up selling well, as that may push the height of the building further up.

Speaking of a redesign, this also gives Southern Land the opportunity to redesign the retail space for a large department store. Although retail along Walnut stops at 18th Street, I could still see a department store in that area.

I like it. It's better to get it right. I'm not too worried about market shifts over the course of 18 months. The people who will inhabit this place aren't as exposed to near-term market conditions as the rest of us suckers.

I hope for some great restaurants (like the article mentioned). Love grabbing drinks and bites along the eastern edge in one of those outdoor places and more of that would be great.

[Londonee]

Originally Posted by PhilliesPhan

Speaking of a redesign, this also gives Southern Land the opportunity to redesign the retail space for a large department store. Although retail along Walnut stops at 18th Street, I could still see a department store in that area.

Small nitpick but Barneys and Barnes and Noble (and I guess technically Anthropologie) - 3 of the most popular stores along Walnut + Joe's Coffee - are on the western side of 18th stretching toward 19th. Ideally 3 or so banks on the 1800 block and the 1900 block would leave and open more room up for super prime on-the-square restaurant or retail. Banks or just the worst use of this space...

[City Wide]

Originally Posted by iheartphilly

Quote from the article:

“We’re putting the most thought and care into this building than we have ever done,” he said, noting that at $300 million, it’s also the most expensive project Southern Land has undertaken."

"The project has been redesigned, which has caused the postponement, and Southern Land is still figuring out how to position it. At first, it was going to be all apartments then at one point it was going to have 342 apartments, between 64 and 75 condominiums, and retail space that would wrap around Walnut, Sansom and 20th streets. In the redesign, Southern Land was encouraged to keep the condos but cut back on the number of apartments. Without any solicitation, 200 people called and wanted their names on a list, which initially didn’t exist, making known their interest in units that might come up for sale. Based on that, the company decided that the 48- to 49-story building will now have 200 rentals and 60 to 75 condominiums."

Honestly, $300MM doesn't sound like a lot for the size of the building and the number of rentals and condos. I'm wondering if that includes the price of the land or not too? For comparison, 500 Walnut has way less units, and I forget the price tag that was speculated, but maybe $75MM to $100MM is my guess.

I would agree with you that $300MM doesn't seem like such a big number for this project. But not my cash!
A couple small comments, "It will be the most luxurious building at the best location in Philadelphia"---does anyone ever say their project is going to be the 2nd or 3rd most luxurious building? I think comparing Rittenhouse Sq. to Central park isn't really very fair to either space. True, both are parks, but the difference in scale makes his statement alittle ridiculous. And lastly, at one point its said that ground breaking is 9 to 12 months away (meaning in 2018) and then the last line says ground breaking to happen in 2019.

All in all, I would say this article says nothing new, and just kicks the project down the road without really giving any reasons. The fact that at the peak of this market cycle they still don't have any concrete/specific plans nor a timetable, does concern me and I wonder how viable this development team is regardless of their good intentions. When they rolled into town 2+ years ago the vibe I got was that they were ready to move and move fast. I believe what they are proposing in terms of a mix use project is right for the site and unless their prices are way out of line, I think success is a given. The only reason I can see for this not being under construction right now is their ability to find the financial backing that's needed. Does anyone know how their project on Market St. in UC is working out?

[PHL10]

Originally Posted by City Wide

All in all, I would say this article says nothing new, and just kicks the project down the road without really giving any reasons. The fact that at the peak of this market cycle they still don't have any concrete/specific plans nor a timetable, does concern me and I wonder how viable this development team is regardless of their good intentions.

Totally agree. I was excited to see an update until I actually read the content.