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  #3861  
Old Posted Dec 22, 2016, 3:12 PM
Blesha13 Blesha13 is offline
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Originally Posted by CaliNative View Post
Tremendous demand for apartments/condos. A forest of 30-50 story towers needed.
There's lots of land in that area and needs to be developed with 30-50 stories ASAP
     
     
  #3862  
Old Posted Dec 22, 2016, 4:25 PM
mhays mhays is online now
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There will always be cycles. But offshore developers and financiers can follow different rules and philosophies, so their cycles can be very different from what we're used to.

For example sometimes money from China is looking for a safe haven more than a big return. Or the return horizon is much longer, i.e. less profit is expected which means risk of loss is also accepted.

I'd love to understand the various offshore components better. But a starting point is the concept that apartments follow more than one cycle depending on who's involved. Add that to the obvious point that condos, retirement housing, subsidized housing, and other types each have their own cycles with their own rules.
     
     
  #3863  
Old Posted Dec 22, 2016, 4:53 PM
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Everyone talking about the cycle being over is referring to statements made by Hunter a long while ago. I don't think Hunter even visits this site anymore, which is unfortunate since he was a major contributor with update photos.
     
     
  #3864  
Old Posted Dec 22, 2016, 5:25 PM
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Originally Posted by LAsam View Post
Everyone talking about the cycle being over is referring to statements made by Hunter a long while ago. I don't think Hunter even visits this site anymore, which is unfortunate since he was a major contributor with update photos.
Boo hoo to be perfectly honest. He's a talented photographer with a 🞵🞵🞵🞵🞵🞵 attitude. That's the best thing I can say about him. Anywayz...

Something I've noticed about the Grand Ave project....


http://urbanize.la/sites/default/files/styles/950w/public/field/image/grand1.jpg?itok=67HM0NzT

It resembles the (incomplete) Metropolitan Life North Building in NYC.


http://www.nyc-architecture.com/GRP/grp-MetLife.jpg

Least Gehry knows his history.
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  #3865  
Old Posted Dec 22, 2016, 5:50 PM
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^ Which is funny, because Gehry has spent the vast majority of his career rejecting architectural history and more symbolically mimicking nature in a local context. Disney Hall, for example, purposefully resembles a desert rose from above, which is a direct nod to LA's civic history is the context of it's geography.
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  #3866  
Old Posted Dec 22, 2016, 5:56 PM
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^ I remember hearing that his EMP project in Seattle is supposed to resemble a smashed electronic guitar. Least that's how I see it anyway. Personally, I happen to like this rendition. We'll see how it looks like in 2048 when it's finally complete.
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  #3867  
Old Posted Dec 22, 2016, 6:00 PM
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Originally Posted by mhays View Post
There will always be cycles. But offshore developers and financiers can follow different rules and philosophies, so their cycles can be very different from what we're used to.

For example sometimes money from China is looking for a safe haven more than a big return. Or the return horizon is much longer, i.e. less profit is expected which means risk of loss is also accepted.

I'd love to understand the various offshore components better. But a starting point is the concept that apartments follow more than one cycle depending on who's involved. Add that to the obvious point that condos, retirement housing, subsidized housing, and other types each have their own cycles with their own rules.
Yeah I'd like to better understand the intricacies of local real estate markets better. In my mind it's driven by 3 factors:

1. The business cycle, which is driven by monetary policy.
2. Short term demand, which can fluctuate wildly.
3. Short term supply, which is inelastic.

Separating out the business cycle, I think the last two are why we might witness natural real estate "cycles" where building starts fluctuate to match demand. And because short term supply is inelastic we should expect large large price swings around a long run equilibrium price point.
     
     
  #3868  
Old Posted Dec 22, 2016, 6:03 PM
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It could be different floor heights. Atlier is 352' and Level is 375' and CIM is at 330' but all 3 have the same floor count. I'm 100 percent sure Atlier is taller though. From all the photos i've seen it definitely appears taller than Level.

The second tower for 1212 Flower is only 31 floors but it's height is at 421 beating all the towers above whereas Mack Urban and Circa have 37 and 36 floors and are at 425 and 420 respectively.

If that tower is over 350' for a 29 story, i'm cheering. In fact, Apex II is only 28 stories and will be 312' so it's not crazy to think they just have tall floors.
I have a perfect view if level and altier from my roof top. Level is definitely taller
     
     
  #3869  
Old Posted Dec 22, 2016, 6:13 PM
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Does anyone have any guesses to when we will see renders for Onni's twins and the 48 story building? Same with the 714 foot one, and the three that were proposed last night. I am just pumped and want to see renders for them so bad.

As a side note as there been anymore news on the Angel Knolls project?
     
     
  #3870  
Old Posted Dec 22, 2016, 7:35 PM
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Originally Posted by BrandonJXN View Post
^ I remember hearing that his EMP project in Seattle is supposed to resemble a smashed electronic guitar. Least that's how I see it anyway. Personally, I happen to like this rendition. We'll see how it looks like in 2048 when it's finally complete.
I like it too. It's a bit understated by Gehry standards, which I think works out for the better in this instance. Shows some restraint. Needs to get started so we can get rid of that terrible parking garage...
     
     
  #3871  
Old Posted Dec 22, 2016, 7:47 PM
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  #3872  
Old Posted Dec 22, 2016, 7:54 PM
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That looks amazing.

Last edited by Jun; Dec 22, 2016 at 8:13 PM.
     
     
  #3873  
Old Posted Dec 22, 2016, 8:09 PM
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So Olympia...kinda takes the sting out of not getting the initial Park5th tower. Very similar design aspects and judging from the render, with the Ritz at 670 or so, the taller tower appears to be close to 800 ft, if not a bit more.
     
     
  #3874  
Old Posted Dec 22, 2016, 8:25 PM
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Insane.

Because of this project creating huge density in that block, I would love for AEG to consider moving the proposed Marriott expansion to the south of the existing hotel and west of Nokia theater on top of the parking garage where the tent currently resides. No point in having that building lost in the view of that first photo from the west. Would also place it across the street to the north from the convention center instead of an additional block away.

Anyone know if there are restrictions to what can be built on top of that garage? Is that lot incorporated into the plans for the convention center redesign?
     
     
  #3875  
Old Posted Dec 22, 2016, 8:42 PM
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Originally Posted by colemonkee View Post
^ Which is funny, because Gehry has spent the vast majority of his career rejecting architectural history and more symbolically mimicking nature in a local context. Disney Hall, for example, purposefully resembles a desert rose from above, which is a direct nod to LA's civic history is the context of it's geography.
I think Gehry is referencing his own history, more than he is referencing any other building or architectural history in general.

The original design for WD Hall was a building made up of a series of stacked boxes, rotated on axis one on top of the other. The model of the building was shown in the Getty's Overdrive exhibition. The Grand Avenue (GA) towers with their stacked boxes and setbacks pay homage to the original design.

So too does the curtain wall of the towers. WD Hall was supposed to be clad in the same limestone as the administrative building in the back. Gehry even developed code for cutting the limestone blocks into the curved pieces required by the final design. In the end, however, it became too expensive.

As to the rose, I forget exactly when the association with roses happened. I am not sure Gehry knew that Lillian Disney had an affection for roses before he submitted his competition entry, the one with the stacked boxes. Of course, as the design evolved, he did play with the metaphor of a rose more, but he never made it literal. He's also compared the hall to a galleon (ship)

As to architectural history in general, one could probably compare the GA towers to any New York tower with setbacks. It became a type there, it is sort of an anomaly here especially in the context of the structural steel towers of Bunker Hill.

The more interesting comparison, however, might be to the Battery Park City development in New York. Like Battery Park City, the GA complex serves as a podium for the buildings around them, providing them with context, grounding them. That's what Battery Park did for the original Twin Towers. This is a rare posture for Gehry. His building usually create their own context. But here it is more about what surrounds the complex than the complex itself. In short, it seems that Gehry wanted to create a place that expresses some solidarity with the boxy and stone-clad forms of Isozaki's MOCA and that establishes a scalar transition between the Bunker Hill towers, his own Walt Disney Hall, and the County/Federal Buildings. Back to basics for Gehry and very well done.

Last edited by LDVArch; Dec 22, 2016 at 8:52 PM.
     
     
  #3876  
Old Posted Dec 22, 2016, 9:17 PM
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^ Very well put, and I honestly didn't know about the history of the designs of Disney Hall. That's some great context. I do like the stone on the facade of the new towers, and hope that they stick with it.

As for Olympia, I really like what I see here so far, and agree with circuitfiend that there are elements of Park 5th in here. Materials will make or break this one, but I have high confidence in SOM. The Federal Courthouse turned out great. Let's just hope they use a high quality of fritted glass on those balcony railings.
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  #3877  
Old Posted Dec 22, 2016, 9:18 PM
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Originally Posted by blackcat23 View Post
Based on relation to the JW/Ritz, the tallest tower looks to be around 800 feet, second tallest 500 feet, and shortest 400 feet.

And kudos to Shenglong for not commissioning Gensler or RTKL as architect. I love SOM.
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  #3878  
Old Posted Dec 22, 2016, 10:02 PM
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Originally Posted by Quixote View Post
Based on relation to the JW/Ritz, the tallest tower looks to be around 800 feet, second tallest 500 feet, and shortest 400 feet.

And kudos to Shenglong for not commissioning Gensler or RTKL as architect. I love SOM.
Towers are too boxy. Need at least a spire on the tallest one.
     
     
  #3879  
Old Posted Dec 22, 2016, 10:22 PM
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Olympia looks amazing!

Honey has leased all of the 6th floor of L&R's parking garage across from Metropolis

http://therealdeal.com/la/2016/12/22/sho...or-offices-above-dtla-parking-structure/
     
     
  #3880  
Old Posted Dec 22, 2016, 10:33 PM
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I'm continually amazed by the extremely rapid transformation of Downtown and its skyline, but is anyone beginning to think that these massive projects are causing us to miss out on opportunities for density? One or two (sometimes three) towers per block? We can do better. Olympia, Oceanwide, MFA's 8th and Figueroa tower....and hopefully the Moxie Hotel twins will go up behind Circa, because, otherwise, that is also a missed density opportunity at the hands of a single large development.
     
     
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