Millennium Line - Broadway Extension: Planning & Pre-Construction

[s211]

My Translink mole tells me that Broadway is a done deal.

In my view, all the right reasons for running down 10th are being ignored for purely political reasons. But of course that's just my view.

[logan5]

Yeah, I don't know what we are gaining if we use TBM along Broadway. Businesses will still be affected, as will traffic. You will still have to reduce lanes all the same.


http://thecanadaline.com/construction-hi...entre-construction-history/#.WDO50PkrIzY

[Metro-One]

You are getting me excited...

[Bdawe]

Do recall that the City of Vancouver is supposed to be pledged to cover the cost of all 'not technically necessary' tunneling .

[Sheba]

Originally Posted by ronthecivil

Why should the rest of the Lower Mainland, and the residents of BC, pay the premium because Vancouver residents aren't willing to go through the disruptions every other city in the region that has gotten skytrain has had to suffer through?

If I was the province I would pay my third for a cut and cover option, and not a penny more.

Originally Posted by Bdawe

Do recall that the City of Vancouver is supposed to be pledged to cover the cost of all 'not technically necessary' tunneling .

I think it was in the mayors plan that was voted down (but don't quote me on that). The Province will pay their share as if it was an elevated line and CoV has to make up the difference for it to be a tunnel. As far as I'm concerned, if they're willing to pay for a tunnel then they can have one.

[officedweller]

Originally Posted by s211

In my view, all the right reasons for running down 10th are being ignored for purely political reasons. But of course that's just my view.

Unfortunate, but not unexpected.

[waves]

They won't go down 10th because they don't want to disrupt the residents?

[AMTDGT]

Originally Posted by waves

They won't go down 10th because they don't want to disrupt the residents?

Nope...they don't want to disrupt the bike lobby.

[retro_orange]

Originally Posted by waves

They won't go down 10th because they don't want to disrupt the residents?

You would think 10th would be an excellent choice as it wouldn't affect many businesses. The vast majority, if not all residential along 10th has it's vehicle access and a rear entrance off the alley, plus they could still have the station entrances on Broadway. Move the bikes to 11th or 12th during construction.

[Migrant_Coconut]

Originally Posted by retro_orange

You would think 10th would be an excellent choice as it wouldn't affect many businesses. The vast majority, if not all residential along 10th has it's vehicle access and a rear entrance off the alley, plus they could still have the station entrances on Broadway. Move the bikes to 11th or 12th during construction.

Clearly, you have never witnessed the firepower of a fully-operational bike lobby.

[jlousa]

Originally Posted by AMTDGT

Nope...they don't want to disrupt the bike lobby.

Come on, the bike lobby isn't quite that powerful, but if you had said that the city wants traffic on Broadway disrupted for years to punish drivers in the hopes of getting people out of their cars I'd be more likely to believe you. Count me as one of those surprised they don't just go cut and cover along 10th to save money, spend up the process and still keep their promises that made regarding Broadway.

[Trainguy]

Originally Posted by jlousa

Come on, the bike lobby isn't quite that powerful, but if you had said that the city wants traffic on Broadway disrupted for years to punish drivers in the hopes of getting people out of their cars I'd be more likely to believe you. Count me as one of those surprised they don't just go cut and cover along 10th to save money, spend up the process and still keep their promises that made regarding Broadway.

Oh, but tunneling is so much more exciting especially with all the cave ins and unexpected stuff popping up, not to mention the extra costs and time involved. However, it does keep the people affected quieter unlike the Canada Line boondoggle.

[s211]

Originally Posted by jlousa

Come on, the bike lobby isn't quite that powerful

I beg to differ. It's greater than any group (if any) lobbying to keep Broadway functional during the construction mess.

[aberdeen5698]

Originally Posted by s211

I beg to differ. It's greater than any group (if any) lobbying to keep Broadway functional during the construction mess.

The Cambie merchants association became pretty high profile during the construction of the Canada Line. They weren't able to accomplish their goals, but you can bet that the Broadway merchants learned a thing or two from them and they're ready to make their voice heard. I wouldn't count them out.

[dothediu]

Originally Posted by s211

My Translink mole tells me that Broadway is a done deal.

Does your translink mole or anyone here know whether broadway extension is happening first, or Surrey LRT?

[Rockrain_BC]

Originally Posted by scryer

Just some good discussion happening on the South Of Fraser Rapid Transit thread that I wanted to relocate here...

Now for my opinions.

To me, 4-6 years for that short of distance is ridiculous. Now I get that there are definitely going to be utilities that need to be relocated and that anything that goes underground gets complicated and expensive but to me, the cut-and-cover option sounds like the better way to go.

Now I don't know what all of the problems were during the Canada Line construction using this method but from what I understand the biggest problem was drivers getting into traffic jams on Cambie because of the reduced road availability. Just briefly going over the map, to me, it looks like there are more roads traveling long distances from east to west along the Broadway corridor therefore opening up more alternative routes than the Cambie corridor has going North to South. With this in mind, would it not make the cut-and-cover method a more feasible option to consider?

4-6 years of construction really does sound like a ridiculously long time for such a short distance. Wow.

Do you think another reason why construction will take 4-6 years is because only a couple stations will be built at a given time? Say, Main Street, Oak, and Arbutus station will be built first. Once the station box is filled and the road is restored, then the Cambie and Granville stations will begin construction? All of this in order to reduce construction impact on the Broadway corridor as a whole? Not at all well-versed in engineering and subway construction though so I could totally be wrong at this.

This project has had so many hurdles, I just really want this extension to be built. To Cambie or Arbutus at the very least, though UBC is most preferable.

[s211]

Originally Posted by dothediu

Does your translink mole or anyone here know whether broadway extension is happening first, or Surrey LRT?

Didn't come up during my chat.

[aberdeen5698]

Originally Posted by Rockrain_BC

4-6 years of construction really does sound like a ridiculously long time for such a short distance. Wow.

I think people here have gotten spoiled by previous Skytrain expansion projects which were mostly either elevated or followed preexisting rights of way. Those could be built with minimal impact on traffic and subsurface infrastructure. Construction along the heavily-traveled and critical Broadway corridor is going to be far more technically challenging.

[swimmer_spe]

Originally Posted by aberdeen5698

I think people here have gotten spoiled by previous Skytrain expansion projects which were mostly either elevated or followed preexisting rights of way. Those could be built with minimal impact on traffic and subsurface infrastructure. Construction along the heavily-traveled and critical Broadway corridor is going to be far more technically challenging.

And much, much more expensive.

[Sheba]

Originally Posted by aberdeen5698

I think people here have gotten spoiled by previous Skytrain expansion projects which were mostly either elevated or followed preexisting rights of way. Those could be built with minimal impact on traffic and subsurface infrastructure. Construction along the heavily-traveled and critical Broadway corridor is going to be far more technically challenging.

This takes me back to when I said that I expected the first section of the Expo extension down Fraser Hwy to be finished first. It had nothing to do with which is more worthy. Broadway is around 6k of bored tunnel and they figure it's going to take 4 - 6 years to build.

About 6k from King George Station down Fraser Hwy takes you to about 162nd St, and I certainly wouldn't expect that to take as long to build elevated Skytrain, even with the tree lobby protesting cutting down some trees in Green Timbers Park to (finally) widen Fraser Hwy. Just look at what happened with the Evergreen tunnel - and that's not even as long as Broadway to Arbutus. These things always take longer than we expect them to.