Ottawa's Byward Market

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by YOWetal

Don't they only open at like 10 on weekdays? Seems pretty easy to notice anyone parking there well before 9.

.

Most malls open "officially" at 9-930 on weekdays but there is plenty of activity before then, that can explain the presence of cars in the parking. Cafés and such often open fairly early and some staff arrive before the stores open. Many malls also have office space inside the mall or adjacent to it, using the same parking.

[TheGoods]

Originally Posted by lrt's friend

We had a lady visitor from Edmonton recently who stayed in a hotel near the Rideau Centre. There was some concern about the seediness nearby especially in the evening.

The safety of the Market hasn’t changed in the last 25 years, I actually find it much safer now with all of the housing development that has people living in and around the market. With the new Rideau Centre, Claridge Plaza, 90 George St, Desjardins and RBC bank buildings and LRT with Rideau st. completion that will also help. Rideau St. was really bad, People don’t remember how bad Rideau st. was when we had the enclosures but most of the stores have left, only a few Tattoo parlors are left and they will leave in time when rent starts increasing with time.

All of the issues are late night / mornings in front of a night club after it closes at 3 or 4 am. The only area that I do not like walking, even in the day time is on George st, in front of the Salvation Army and that has been there forever. I have no issues walking with my family during the day and evening in the Market, feel very safe, I have been too so many cities were I cannot say that, cities half the size of Ottawa (mostly in the US).

[Kitchissippi]

The lighting on Rideau has been terrible, there's only a few proper street lights, the rest are those dim globe lamps. When they finally redo the street I hope they pay good attention to how it is lit as it greatly affects the perception of night time security. The reduction of bus stops/routes will also help, because the large number of people waiting gives cover to those who are loitering.

[acottawa]

I think a general improvement in the overall infrastructure would help. The lighting is a dog's breakfast of different styles and designs (and as was noted inadequate in many places), the paving is out of date, inconsistent and in bad shape. The market stalls look like they were bought second hand from a POW camp. There is still way to much space devoted to surface parking.

It is weird that despite being a key tourist attraction and one of the main entertainment areas in the city, Ottawa has put very little into market infrastructure. The market square is a good start, but it's unfortunate that other improvements could not have been made before 2017.

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by TheGoods

The safety of the Market hasn’t changed in the last 25 years, I actually find it much safer now with all of the housing development that has people living in and around the market. With the new Rideau Centre, Claridge Plaza, 90 George St, Desjardins and RBC bank buildings and LRT with Rideau st. completion that will also help. Rideau St. was really bad, People don’t remember how bad Rideau st. was when we had the enclosures but most of the stores have left, only a few Tattoo parlors are left and they will leave in time when rent starts increasing with time.

All of the issues are late night / mornings in front of a night club after it closes at 3 or 4 am. The only area that I do not like walking, even in the day time is on George st, in front of the Salvation Army and that has been there forever. I have no issues walking with my family during the day and evening in the Market, feel very safe, I have been too so many cities were I cannot say that, cities half the size of Ottawa (mostly in the US).

Rideau St. itself has been — for quite some time. The question is whether Rideau will become more like the Market or will the Market become more like Rideau. I think with the changes on Rideau that once everything is done the result will probably be the positive one: Rideau will become more like the Market (aka less grungy, more genteel).

[lrt's friend]

Originally Posted by Kitchissippi

The lighting on Rideau has been terrible, there's only a few proper street lights, the rest are those dim globe lamps. When they finally redo the street I hope they pay good attention to how it is lit as it greatly affects the perception of night time security. The reduction of bus stops/routes will also help, because the large number of people waiting gives cover to those who are loitering.

Generally, you want more pedestrians on the streets to improve safety not less.

[lrt's friend]

Originally Posted by Acajack

Rideau St. itself has been — for quite some time. The question is whether Rideau will become more like the Market or will the Market become more like Rideau. I think with the changes on Rideau that once everything is done the result will probably be the positive one: Rideau will become more like the Market (aka less grungy, more genteel).

The decline of Rideau relates to the opening of the Rideau Centre. Despite being a big success in itself, it drained the life out of Rideau Street. The interior of Rideau Centre became much more attractive than the sidewalks of Rideau Street.

Our hope is that the explosion of condos in the area, will increase foot traffic and therefore re-animate Rideau Street. This will be a bigger factor than the subway or the recent Rideau Centre expansion, which are just extensions of the self contained and sanitized Rideau Centre environment.

I think of all my trips to the Rideau Centre by transit and most stay within the confines of the Rideau Centre. On the occasions that I go beyond, it is to go north or west. I never venture to the south or east.

[TheGoods]

Originally Posted by lrt's friend

The decline of Rideau relates to the opening of the Rideau Centre. Despite being a big success in itself, it drained the life out of Rideau Street. The interior of Rideau Centre became much more attractive than the sidewalks of Rideau Street.

Our hope is that the explosion of condos in the area, will increase foot traffic and therefore re-animate Rideau Street. This will be a bigger factor than the subway or the recent Rideau Centre expansion, which are just extensions of the self contained and sanitized Rideau Centre environment.

I think of all my trips to the Rideau Centre by transit and most stay within the confines of the Rideau Centre. On the occasions that I go beyond, it is to go north or west. I never venture to the south or east.

I would say it was the Rideau Street enclosures and not opening any of the stores to the street more than the Rideau Centre. They learnt from their mistakes and with the new Rideau Centre, every store will have an entrance to the street, that will create foot traffic on the street and by closing Nicholas and adding patio space for Joey’, that will really help and will create a gateway to the William street enclosure. You are already seeing change on Rideau Street with stores such as Urban Outfitter, WLKN, a new RBC and Desjardins. There was no reason to go outside in the past but now, on a beautiful day, why not take a stroll on Rideau if there are shops and restaurants. There was always foot traffic on Rideau, all waiting to take the bus but there was no appeal in the area, I actually felt in the past that I do not want to get caught in the middle of a drug deal.

[acottawa]

Originally Posted by lrt's friend

The decline of Rideau relates to the opening of the Rideau Centre. Despite being a big success in itself, it drained the life out of Rideau Street. The interior of Rideau Centre became much more attractive than the sidewalks of Rideau Street.

Would the independent department stores have survived much longer or would they have closed anyway and shopping shifted even more to the suburbs? (That was an actual question - I have no idea)

[Kitchissippi]

Originally Posted by lrt's friend

Generally, you want more pedestrians on the streets to improve safety not less.

That's true if they're moving around. When they're standing around waiting, it makes it difficult for law enforcers to differentiate them from loiterers. It's not long before it becomes a hangout for vagrants. Probably one of the biggest reasons why most transit malls have failed.

[Uhuniau]

Originally Posted by Kitchissippi

The lighting on Rideau has been terrible, there's only a few proper street lights, the rest are those dim globe lamps. When they finally redo the street I hope they pay good attention to how it is lit as it greatly affects the perception of night time security. The reduction of bus stops/routes will also help, because the large number of people waiting gives cover to those who are loitering.

The "reduction of bus stops", and the scattering of the Rideau Street hub to the four winds as downtown routes are chopped up and removed from a single transfer point to many, will REDUCE safety.

There is safety in numbers. That's why existing Bus Crappid Transit stations have Night Stops for use from 9 p.m. to the end of the service day. That's why, among other reasons, breaking up the single downtown bus hub is an idiotic idea that could only have been dreamed up by councillors, transit planners, and city bureaucrats who don't actually use transit or walk downtown streets at night.

[Uhuniau]

Originally Posted by lrt's friend

Our hope is that the explosion of condos in the area, will increase foot traffic and therefore re-animate Rideau Street. This will be a bigger factor than the subway or the recent Rideau Centre expansion, which are just extensions of the self contained and sanitized Rideau Centre environment.

I think of all my trips to the Rideau Centre by transit and most stay within the confines of the Rideau Centre. On the occasions that I go beyond, it is to go north or west. I never venture to the south or east.

Restoring ALL local downtown bus routes to Rideau Street, making it the* transfer point for bus-bus transit transfers in the core, and a* transfer point for all local bus transfers to/from the LRT, would help secure that steady pedestrian presence.

However, the City and OC Transpo have deemed it more important to give into the NCC's anti-bus fetishism on Wellington Street - sorry, beautiful "Confederation Boulevard" - and to satisfy the owners of the Rideau Centre. The rest of us can go to hell.



* Use of definite and indefinite articles is on purpose.

[Uhuniau]

Originally Posted by Kitchissippi

That's true if they're moving around. When they're standing around waiting, it makes it difficult for law enforcers to differentiate them from loiterers.

Maybe we need to hire some observant cops who can watch the crowd for more than five or ten minutes: transit users don't stay put for more than about 5-10 minutes during the day, and - thanks to the garbage schedules and routings - half an hour at night or on weekends.

It's not long before it becomes a hangout for vagrants. Probably one of the biggest reasons why most transit malls have failed.

The Ottawa transit mall was demolished over 20 years ago; are the — vagrants still there?

[phil123]

Originally Posted by lrt's friend

Realistically, the Confederation Line is not going to make a whole lot of difference for the ByWard Market especially in the evenings. The reach of the Confederation Line is whole lot shorter than the Transitways and for the vast majority who live beyond that reach, we still have that unreliable bus transfer to get home with a bus every 30 or 60 minutes.

Right now, if you are going out for dinner or going to a club and live beyond a direct transit link, you are almost certainly driving to the Market as has been in the case in the past and at present.

It might not make a difference now, but as has been the case with Toronto, most of the residential developments constructed within the current boom there (+-15 years) have been built along the major subway and transit lines.

I don't see this being any different in Ottawa, especially with the construction of the Confederation Line. Connecting areas that are going through intensification, like Preston Street and the Lebreton Flats, will only serve to make these areas more desirable. Yes the rate of construction is not as visible, but the confederation line creates the infrastructure that supports this growth and in turn make a difference.

My point being that, the reach may not have to go as far as the transit ways to make a difference, especially with the way that the area west of downtown is growing.

[rocketphish]

City hopes reorganization will resurrect ByWard and Parkdale markets

Jon Willing, Ottawa Citizen
Published on: April 4, 2017 | Last Updated: April 4, 2017 1:01 PM EDT

Council’s finance and economic development committee on Tuesday approved a new governance structure for the ByWard and Parkdale markets, with hopes that severing oversight from city hall will produce fresh ideas.

Vendors are closing. Revenues are in the pits. Customers are going to other markets.

The city has been reacting to change, but struggling to draw up plans for the future.

The answer? A not-for-profit municipal services corporation to run the markets starting in 2018.

That’s the city’s expectation, anyway, since U.S. consultant Project for Public Spaces first recommended the governance structure after a 2013 study.

By pulling the bureaucracy out of the markets business, the city believes there will be a new perspective to running the operations.

The 190-year-old ByWard Market is the city’s chief concern. It’s a major tourism magnet and it’s under more competition from other districts, like Lansdowne Park, which has its own farmers market.

“It breaks my heart to see the ByWard going where it is,” vendor Gerard Rochon said, calling for a new emphasis on the sale of local food.

“It’s fundamental. It goes to the root of the problem. It goes to what do you have on that street as vendors,” Rochon said.

Andy Terauds of the Ottawa Farmers’ Market Association said only producers should be selling at the markets, not resellers.

“After all, they’re called farmer’s market by most people,” Terauds said. “It should be the farmers they’re supporting.”

Claude Bonnet of Moulin De Provence called for changes in the central ByWard Market building, which he says is charging unsustainable rents. It’s hard to pay rent and utilities when businesses are only selling pastries, vegetables and meat, Bonnet said.

The city says market rates are being charged at the central building.

Today, the economic and development branch is in charge of vending at both markets and the real estate management at the Clarence Street parking garage. The city-owned central building in the ByWard Market has been run by a property manager and that contract is done at the end of 2017.

The city has $476,000 available this year to get the new municipal services corporation off the ground. The money would pay for legal costs and recruitment activities for a board and executive director.

The first two years under new oversight are expected to result in deficits, but a surplus is projected for 2020.

Coun. Allan Hubley, chair of council’s audit committee, wants to make sure the municipal services corporation can be scrutinized by the city’s auditor general.

Council will be asked to approve the governance plan on April 12.

After that, councillors Mathieu Fleury, Jeff Leiper and Mayor Jim Watson would be tasked to find the chair, vice-chair and treasurer of the new nine-member board of the municipal services corporation. The other six members would be approved by council.

[email protected]
twitter.com/JonathanWilling

http://ottawacitizen.com/news/local-news...hall-brings-hopes-of-byward-resurrection

[rocketphish]

Big changes on York Street as pop-up event centre replaces on-street parking this summer
Parking spots on York Street in the Byward Market have been removed until after Labour Day.

By: Alex Abdelwahab, Metro
Published on Mon Apr 24 2017



The city is installing 40 shipping containers on York Street, in the ByWard Market, this week, as it sets up an event space that will have free programming all summer.

As part of Ottawa 2017, the city is creating a one-block “Inspiration Village,” with free exhibits and performances happening every day from Victoria Day weekend through Labour Day.

“That’s where we will pay tribute to provinces and territories, showing all regions of Canada,” Guy Laflamme, executive director of Ottawa 2017, said, describing it as the base camp for activities.

Laflamme said the area will also have a stage, where some of the city’s summer festivals, including Canada Scene at the National Arts Centre, will provide free teaser performances to coincide with performances at their official sites.

To install Inspiration Village, the city has removed on-street parking on York Street between Sussex Drive and ByWard Market Square until after Labour Day.

Laflamme called the area “one of the most beautiful, prime spots in the downtown core.”

"We’re going from using it as parking to transforming it into a public gathering space,” he said.

All entry-points to the market will be open this week and throughout the summer. There will be temporary lane closures until Sunday.

According to Laflamme, the idea for the Inspiration Village originates in South Africa, where a similar structure was built. The city will officially launch the initiative on April 27.

In the meantime, Ottawa has launched a call for performers on its website. The city is looking for emerging artists and established performers, Aboriginal and cultural artists, sporting and educational organizations.

http://www.metronews.ca/news/ottawa/2017...replacing-on-street-parking-on-york.html

[OTSkyline]

I'm not sure I would call this short row of parking one of "the most beautiful prime spots in downtown Ottawa" but whatever...

This might be a good idea but could also turn into a disaster (really? 13 shipping containers stationed there?).

I do agree they need to start coming up with events or programming for the Byward Market. Doing nothing and just having a bunch of restaurants open isn't enough anymore to entice people to drive, walk or take transit there and spend an evening (or the weekend).

Perhaps this is also a test to see if the market can live without these 26 or so parking spaces (I totally made that up, I have no clue how many). But if so, it might be a cause to remove them permanently as of next year for example... Imagine if they could remove them, and make this whole area a nice plaza with cobblestone, lamp posts, perhaps a fountain or fireplace... some cool lighting features... You know, a real gathering spot.

[McC]

there is a small fountain there already. I'd like a nice row of shade trees down the middle of York, myself.

[YOWetal]

Not sure about the container idea either. But it is crazy to have so many parking spots (I would say its closer to 100) in such a prime spot. It also encourages people to endlessly circle looking for that mythical free spot.

[UrbOttawa]

Originally Posted by OTSkyline

I'm not sure I would call this short row of parking one of "the most beautiful prime spots in downtown Ottawa" but whatever...

This might be a good idea but could also turn into a disaster (really? 13 shipping containers stationed there?).

I do agree they need to start coming up with events or programming for the Byward Market. Doing nothing and just having a bunch of restaurants open isn't enough anymore to entice people to drive, walk or take transit there and spend an evening (or the weekend).

Perhaps this is also a test to see if the market can live without these 26 or so parking spaces (I totally made that up, I have no clue how many). But if so, it might be a cause to remove them permanently as of next year for example... Imagine if they could remove them, and make this whole area a nice plaza with cobblestone, lamp posts, perhaps a fountain or fireplace... some cool lighting features... You know, a real gathering spot.

There's a few 'Box Parks' made of shipping containers in London that are actually quite interesting and tastefully designed. They're filled with pop up shops as well as food truck type restaurants. This part of York probably wouldn't be the most fitting place since it's a bit more historic, however I could see it fitting quite well in Hintonburg/Wellington West or in a less prominent area of the market.


https://a2.ah-assets.net/uploads/photo/path/5591/retina_BoxPark-8.jpg


https://www.boxpark.co.uk/assets/Uploads/boxpark-retailers2.jpg