Millennium Line - Evergreen Extension | Completed

[mrtinvan]

Did anyone else notice the glaring errors in the Vancouver Sun article?

The main image is Peter Fassbender looking through a construction fence at a set of MK1 Trains, yet the caption reads "Here Peter Fassbender, minister responsible for TransLink, takes a look at some of the new cars purchased for the Evergreen Line"

The article also says they are going to combine MK2 and MK1 trains in the same consist, which I am fairly certain isnt electrically possible. They can physically interconnect, but they are not electrically compatible.

It also kinda bugs me that they are attributing the purchase of the MK3's directly to the Evergreen Line project, when Translink bought them as part of a separate contract directly with Bombardier.

[trofirhen]

It'll be a great day when all the original MK1 trains are put into storage. I have nothing against them reall, but the're too small, too dated looking.
Look forward to their mothballing.

[Jebby]

Originally Posted by trofirhen

It'll be a great day when all the original MK1 trains are put into storage. I have nothing against them reall, but the're too small, too dated looking.
Look forward to their mothballing.

I'd switch them all over to the M-Line and keep all the new trains on the "expanded" Expo Line.

[WarrenC12]

Translink is in the middle of refurbishing the MK1 fleet for what I thought was another 20 years.

They are the least comfortable, but I'm all in favour of more trains in the overall inventory. We should strive for maximum frequency IMO, with the longest train sets we can build.

[finalcoolman]

Originally Posted by BCPhil

Shouldn't the residents in the area get the same courtesy from their city? When I was last there it wasn't a pleasant experience to walk around the area. I can't imagine if that was my daily routine for months.

The Coquitlam website says the work is supposed to be done in June. Is it going to be? I'm not trying to sound like I'm freaking out, just surprised by the lack of progress on this. I'm just curious if anyone in the area more frequently has notice any progress on the city's work.

Yes ofcourse the residents (pedestrians) should get the same courtesy. But the cold hard truth is that money talks, and getting out of the way of Christmas consumerism on the malls private property is a far greater priority in our capitalist society than mere pedestrians on public property.

Restoring all the parking stalls in Coquitlam Centre prior to the Christmas shopping season was a huge deal because let's face it, private vehicle owners going to the mall are likely to be bigger spenders than pedestrians walking down Pinetree trying to get to the bus loop. Hence the priorities in capitalism.

For the most part, the people in this city with the spending power heading to the mall in their BMW X5 don't really care about the condition of Pinetree Way, or the lack of sidewalks for the pedestrians walking in the rain on the side of the streets getting splashed by their own car, but do care if after arriving on the malls private property, their is a lack of stalls due to a bunch being closed off due to construction and the uncomfortableness of having to walk through a construction zone after getting out of their car in the malls parking lots.

[Kisai]

Originally Posted by WarrenC12

Translink is in the middle of refurbishing the MK1 fleet for what I thought was another 20 years.

They are the least comfortable, but I'm all in favour of more trains in the overall inventory. We should strive for maximum frequency IMO, with the longest train sets we can build.

The way things are going right now, we might be hanging on to them for 70 years.

As I mentioned elsewhere, Translink's own documents indicates that the vehicle lifetime is 61 (vs 41 for conventional LRT), so that means they shouldn't be retired before 2047. It may be shorter if parts can't be found/machined, by which those cars will just be taken out of service as they fail and salvaged for parts.

[aberdeen5698]

Originally Posted by WarrenC12

...I'm all in favour of more trains in the overall inventory. We should strive for maximum frequency IMO, with the longest train sets we can build.

Absolutely. An old, dated Mark I train in good running order is far superior to no train at all. And if you have, I dunno, $500 million to spend on rolling stock it's better to use it to keep the 150 older cars in server rather than retiring them and spending it on perhaps 30 to 50 new vehicles.

[BCPhil]

Originally Posted by Jebby

I'd switch them all over to the M-Line and keep all the new trains on the "expanded" Expo Line.

I don't know if it's a good idea to run the MKI on the Evergreen extension.

The MKI don't have AC, so half the time their windows are open. The Evergreen line has a 2km long tunnel. Open windows in tunnels are awful.

Even on the short tunnel just East of the Skybridge, when you are on an MK I it can be so loud that it is painful, and it's less than half what the new tunnel will be.

I think they should put the original MKII fleet on the Millennium line. Maybe in 2 car consists at first. But I have a feeling they'll need to run them in a mix of 2 and 4 car combinations soon enough.

And I think they should run the MKI in only 6 car combinations on the Expo line. For some reason, a 4 car MKI train always shows up when the platform is the most crowded with people waiting.

[BCPhil]

Originally Posted by Kisai

The way things are going right now, we might be hanging on to them for 70 years.

As I mentioned elsewhere, Translink's own documents indicates that the vehicle lifetime is 61 (vs 41 for conventional LRT), so that means they shouldn't be retired before 2047. It may be shorter if parts can't be found/machined, by which those cars will just be taken out of service as they fail and salvaged for parts.

According to Translink's own press release:

http://www.translink.ca/en/About-Us/Medi...k-Refurbish-Aging-SkyTrain-Vehicles.aspx

The original design life of the MKI cars was 25 years. And these upgrades will let them last another 15, for a total of 40 years of expected life.

Personally, I think they might be underestimating the actual life span of the vehicles. They might have an amortization of 25 years, but they are far from being in a retired state today, even without the refurbishment.

Originally Posted by aberdeen5698

Absolutely. An old, dated Mark I train in good running order is far superior to no train at all. And if you have, I dunno, $500 million to spend on rolling stock it's better to use it to keep the 150 older cars in server rather than retiring them and spending it on perhaps 30 to 50 new vehicles.

The refurbishment project is actually costing $37.9 million for the original 114 cars. Replacing the capacity with new MKIII trains would cost $262 million. So yeah, it's totally worth it for a cash strapped agency.

[MIPS]

They sure don't build em' like they used to

[Kisai]

Originally Posted by BCPhil

According to Translink's own press release:

http://www.translink.ca/en/About-Us/Medi...k-Refurbish-Aging-SkyTrain-Vehicles.aspx

The original design life of the MKI cars was 25 years. And these upgrades will let them last another 15, for a total of 40 years of expected life.

Personally, I think they might be underestimating the actual life span of the vehicles. They might have an amortization of 25 years, but they are far from being in a retired state today, even without the refurbishment.



The refurbishment project is actually costing $37.9 million for the original 114 cars. Replacing the capacity with new MKIII trains would cost $262 million. So yeah, it's totally worth it for a cash strapped agency.

Translink quoted 61 in the documents about extending the Expo and Millennium Lines (Surrey and Broadway), though this may be specifically the Bombardier Mark II and later models.

At any rate until we reach a point where the cars are breaking down too often and become too expensive to service, we can only speculate.

As opposed to the life of a bus which are only built to last 12 years but some transit agencies want to run them for 18.

[MIPS]

I'm trying to figure out how many instances besides broken doors the MK I's have broken down due to age related failures. All I can recall is we've had a lot of problems but they are all from external factors

-We had that derailment, but that was because a MK II in front of it dropped a shoe
-We had a LIM damaged early on, but that was because someone threw a signpost on the track
-We had a LIM burn out, but that was because a foreign object was on the track
-We had a catastrophic collector failure, but that was again because of stored parts in the guideway
-We had a window break, but that was because someone shot at the train

We don't seem to have corrosion issues, excessive wheel noise or paint jobs that look like crap and any of the above that might of been developing into a problem has been dealt with as part of the refurbishment. I could totally see the last MK I's being decom'd after 50 years of life which frankly would be incredible The only thing that could top that is zero in-service collisions. I don't think anyone has ever managed that.

[aberdeen5698]

Originally Posted by MIPS

I'm trying to figure out how many instances besides broken doors the MK I's have broken down due to age related failures.

I don't know if it was a vehicle or central control issue, but I experienced an interesting incident on a Mk I train in the very early days of Skytrain. After boarding an inbound train at 29th Ave. Station the doors closed but the train just sat there for several seconds. Then it became apparent that it was moving very slowly - in fact it was coasting, brakes off, down the hill towards Nanaimo station. It gradually picked up speed with no motor power (none of the typical LIM sounds) as it went down the hill, soon reached normal service speed for that segment, and continued accelerating. I was really wondering if it was going to stop at Nanaimo at all and whether it was under any kind of control at all when suddenly the emergency brakes kicked in and the train ground to a halt a few hundred feet short of the station. We sat there for a few seconds and then the LIM engaged and we pulled into the station more or less normally. The rest of the trip continued without incident.

There were no announcements of any kind. It was a weird incident and I've never experienced anything like it since.

[MIPS]

Originally Posted by aberdeen5698

I don't know if it was a vehicle or central control issue, but I experienced an interesting incident on a Mk I train in the very early days of Skytrain. After boarding an inbound train at 29th Ave. Station the doors closed but the train just sat there for several seconds. Then it became apparent that it was moving very slowly - in fact it was coasting, brakes off, down the hill towards Nanaimo station. It gradually picked up speed with no motor power (none of the typical LIM sounds) as it went down the hill, soon reached normal service speed for that segment, and continued accelerating. I was really wondering if it was going to stop at Nanaimo at all and whether it was under any kind of control at all when suddenly the emergency brakes kicked in and the train ground to a halt a few hundred feet short of the station. We sat there for a few seconds and then the LIM engaged and we pulled into the station more or less normally. The rest of the trip continued without incident.

There were no announcements of any kind. It was a weird incident and I've never experienced anything like it since.

Nope, that was a bug. The system took a while to get all the really weird wrinkles ironed out. Worth pointing out that on opening day the first train that pulled into New West forgot the door buttons existed and an attendant had to manually open the doors. Embarrassing.
We also had issues with the system forgetting switch positions and derailing, plus an incident before we opened where a train was deleted form the system by accident and the system didn't give off a warning, resulting in two trains colliding in OMC.

[SpongeG]

may 5/6 2016 burquitlam station

20160505_173105 by snub_you, on Flickr

20160506_190709 by snub_you, on Flickr

fancy lights or art?
20160506_190714 by snub_you, on Flickr

[ryanmaccdn]

Originally Posted by aberdeen5698

I don't know if it was a vehicle or central control issue, but I experienced an interesting incident on a Mk I train in the very early days of Skytrain. After boarding an inbound train at 29th Ave. Station the doors closed but the train just sat there for several seconds. Then it became apparent that it was moving very slowly - in fact it was coasting, brakes off, down the hill towards Nanaimo station. It gradually picked up speed with no motor power (none of the typical LIM sounds) as it went down the hill, soon reached normal service speed for that segment, and continued accelerating. I was really wondering if it was going to stop at Nanaimo at all and whether it was under any kind of control at all when suddenly the emergency brakes kicked in and the train ground to a halt a few hundred feet short of the station. We sat there for a few seconds and then the LIM engaged and we pulled into the station more or less normally. The rest of the trip continued without incident.

There were no announcements of any kind. It was a weird incident and I've never experienced anything like it since.

About two years ago I experienced the same issue in two different incidents.


One early morning when it was really wet we were climbing the hill after passing the OMC about to stop at Edmonds. I guess a train ahead was held for a period so our train stopped at the top of the hill. All the sudden out of nowhere the train started free falling back down the hill towards the OMC.

About as we hit the turn the emergency breaks hit and we came to a somewhat gradual halt. We were very close to crashing into the next train. We sat there for a min and then heard the LIM start up again and we proceeded on like nothing happened.

A second time I was on a train that left Royal Oak towards Metrotown (Mark 2.5), and all off the sudden the LIM just cut off and we coasted on momentum for like a whole minute.... the lights went out and it was dead silence. Then the LIM just kicked in out of nowhere like nothing had happened and just gradually sped us up again to cruising speed.

[red-paladin]

I love seeing the M-line grade station details as they are finished.

[Mac Write]

The cut outs sounds like it was due to the power rail failing.

[officedweller]

Pics from the Evergreen Line website:

Test train with Lincoln Station in the background:


http://www.evergreenline.gov.bc.ca/

Building the center wall in the tunnel:


http://www.evergreenline.gov.bc.ca/

Coquitlam Central Station:


http://www.evergreenline.gov.bc.ca/

Inlet Centre Station - west entrance:


http://www.evergreenline.gov.bc.ca/

Suter Brook Creek enhancement area Port Moody:


http://www.evergreenline.gov.bc.ca/

Lafarge Lake - Douglas Station:


http://www.evergreenline.gov.bc.ca/

[trofirhen]

All looking sleek and smooth rather like a Northern European city, the forest and the building clusters sise by side. It'll be even better when they get those MarkI out and the Mark3 in.