Canada's 'housing bubble' deemed close to bursting

[Nathan]

Originally Posted by Denscity

Using average incomes we are only using one persons income when often it is a couple that is buying a house and therefore we should be adding the two incomes together when determining what is affordable?

You can use median family income to account for that. I believe this would give you the overall median whether the household is single or dual-earner.

It was just posted somewhere on this forum recently I think; in the provincial economies or stats thread or something.

[theman23]

Originally Posted by cornholio

Ok. Where can a doctor with a 200k salary afford to buy a home? Because that qualifies you for roughly a $1 million dollar mortgage. You will not find a home in Vancouver for under a million that is not a tear down (requiring a $500k additional investment), that doctor will live a pretty modest life for the privilege, and by the way I think 95% of doctors can be replaced since their jobs are procedure oriented and as a result are overpaid (but that's another topic). Yes some locals are still buying houses, usually because they were already leveraged in the market and e just moving around, or helping their kids. It still happens, but less and less. I get this feeling you are out of touch with reality (no disrespect). I can tell you Killarney in east Vancouver is probably 90% mainland Chinese buyers right now, and very few are local's. Before you bring out the race card I have plenty of Chinese friends and co workers, people who live and work here obviously, hell I am a European Canadian refugee married to a South American East Asian immigrant so don't even bring out the xenophobic card.

The point here is that housing in Vancouver (and many other western cities) is being used as a vessel to move money out of China. Why? Because China imposes limits on how much money people can transfer out but they don't impose those same limits when a Chinese national is purchasing foreign property. That's why most of these houses are purchased with cash, yet miraculously end up being mortgaged right after, and often flipped repeatedly. This not only negatively effects locals, which should be obvious to you by now, but it also creates a bubble that puts our nations economy at risk. Because the status quo will not remain for ever, Chinas policies will change, Canadas policies will change, and sooner or later the money flowing into the market will stop or slow and the bubble will be exposed. Solution now, try to minimize the damage already done, stop the political correctness and get heavy handed and instill some confidence back in to Canadians that we can solve this problem and all come out of this better for it.

Now having said all this, are you people not impressed by the realism of bots that can be purchased created? Talking about st7180. Something to keep in mind when you are online, more and more manipulation going on. Just think what multi billion dollar intelligence agencies can do and corporations. A lesson to all from someone with a heavy IT background. :-)

So is it confirmed that st7180 is a bot?

What about that other vancouver poster with nearly identical posts? Sunsetmountainland? Has anyone checked into him yet?

[Berklon]

Originally Posted by theman23

So is it confirmed that st7180 is a bot?

Don't think he was an actual bot - at least not 100% of the time.
His trolling was way too real, and his responses half the time were definitely specific to the conversation. Although there were plenty of times he would post immediately after someone else has (even though previously it's been days since a post was made) and it would have nothing to do with the current conversation - he'd just post a random pro-RE link/quote. So I think it was a combination of real and bot.

Either way, I saw through his BS early on - and couldn't believe there were people here defending his ridiculous posts.

[sunsetmountainland]

Originally Posted by theman23

So is it confirmed that st7180 is a bot?

What about that other vancouver poster with nearly identical posts? Sunsetmountainland? Has anyone checked into him yet?

I do say I love it when a small fry calls me out!

[sunsetmountainland]

Originally Posted by Berklon

Don't think he was an actual bot - at least not 100% of the time.
His trolling was way too real, and his responses half the time were definitely specific to the conversation. Although there were plenty of times he would post immediately after someone else has (even though previously it's been days since a post was made) and it would have nothing to do with the current conversation - he'd just post a random pro-RE link/quote. So I think it was a combination of real and bot.

Either way, I saw through his BS early on - and couldn't believe there were people here defending his ridiculous posts.

I am not a troll I ask questions I find answers. I have factual information. I just like people to be honest prove themselves.

If you have something you disagree with that I have posted or said. Please feel free to debate with me!

Perhaps it is those whom disagree with me that are the real trolls? If they cannot actually debate with or argue with me because that is the case most of the time. The become personal and try to say I am a bot!

[Berklon]

Originally Posted by sunsetmountainland

I am not a troll I ask questions I find answers. I have factual information. I just like people to be honest prove themselves.

If you have something you disagree with that I have posted or said. Please feel free to debate with me!

Perhaps it is those whom disagree with me that are the real trolls? If they cannot actually debate with or argue with me because that is the case most of the time. The become personal and try to say I am a bot!

Not sure why you responded to me as the line I quoted and was responding to was referring to st7180.

[sunsetmountainland]

If your want to make something of yourself! You will, you do not have to be a millionaire.

You can make $40,000 or $50,000 a year invest properly and do well. I certainly respect the chinese investor buying in Vancouver! I have told Leo plenty of times he should do it!

I have already explained how it can be done. People have been told of the mountains the borders and the logistics! The fact is someone from Toronto or the ROC does not have a clue.

The fact is the Chinese buyer is in Australia the U.S. as well as Canada. We are competing for investment. Why would someone from China not want to buy in Vancouver?

The fact of the matter is it is not just China it is also the Middle east, Vancouver has the most Iranians in north america after Los Angeles.

This has not happened overnight most you you guys are just blind!

Sorry I am going to post some more info I know most of you do not like facts.

http://business.financialpost.com/invest...wealth-says-worlds-biggest-money-manager

This is not new news boys and girls!

[lio45]

Originally Posted by theman23

What about that other vancouver poster with nearly identical posts? Sunsetmountainland? Has anyone checked into him yet?

sunsetmountainland is a lot more reasonable than st7160, can be engaged in discussion, addresses arguments with custom-made posts instead of blindly giving us links, will accept to disclose enough stuff about himself (unlike st7160), won't post the same nonsense over and over ignoring that it's been debunked ("Vancouver property taxes are the lowest"), admits that Toronto is not a warm city in February, etc.

[lio45]

Originally Posted by sunsetmountainland

If your want to make something of yourself! You will, you do not have to be a millionaire.

You can make $40,000 or $50,000 a year invest properly and do well. I certainly respect the chinese investor buying in Vancouver! I have told Leo plenty of times he should do it!

I have already explained how it can be done. People have been told of the mountains the borders and the logistics! The fact is someone from Toronto or the ROC does not have a clue.

I don't think it's as doable in 2015 for someone who's just starting as you seem to think. Completely different market than when you started yourself in the '90s. The bar to entry is a lot higher.

Let's say I make $50k a year, what do you suggest I do to start?

[MolsonExport]

Originally Posted by Berklon

Don't think he was an actual bot - at least not 100% of the time.
His trolling was way too real, and his responses half the time were definitely specific to the conversation. Although there were plenty of times he would post immediately after someone else has (even though previously it's been days since a post was made) and it would have nothing to do with the current conversation - he'd just post a random pro-RE link/quote. So I think it was a combination of real and bot.

Either way, I saw through his BS early on - and couldn't believe there were people here defending his ridiculous posts.

My thoughts exactly. Especially on the part in bold.

[lio45]

Attention, all...

*clears throat*



"Property prices are currently totally out of whack in Vancouver. The market displays most of the characteristics of a typical bubble. Rich Chinese investors likely have played a role in this."




(Just doing a little test.)

[koops65]

"The city of Vancouver has issued a bulletin requiring developers to abstain from omitting certain floor numbers from new buildings in an effort to simplify the work of first responders. In short, the days of skipping 'unlucky' numbers such as 4 and 13 are numbered.

As of Oct. 20, the city requires all new buildings to follow a consecutive, increasing number system for floor and suite lettering. Simply put: you can't skip any numbers

Existing buildings that have avoided a traditional numbering system may be required to change numbers on a case-by-case basis."


http://www.ctvnews.ca/canada/days-of-van...cky-floor-numbers-are-numbered-1.2643783

[Andy6]

Do they do suite numbering with floor+letter there? That's how mine is in Toronto but it is now so rare that it usually takes me numerous repetitions before people grasp the idea that there is a letter in my apartment "number". The lettering of suites used to be very common (other than very small buildings where it was just "Suite 1", "Suite 2", etc., with no reference to floor) but seemed to go out of fashion in the 70s.

[kwoldtimer]

Originally Posted by koops65

"The city of Vancouver has issued a bulletin requiring developers to abstain from omitting certain floor numbers from new buildings in an effort to simplify the work of first responders. In short, the days of skipping 'unlucky' numbers such as 4 and 13 are numbered.

As of Oct. 20, the city requires all new buildings to follow a consecutive, increasing number system for floor and suite lettering. Simply put: you can't skip any numbers

Existing buildings that have avoided a traditional numbering system may be required to change numbers on a case-by-case basis."


http://www.ctvnews.ca/canada/days-of-van...cky-floor-numbers-are-numbered-1.2643783

I wonder if our fundamental freedoms under the Charter can be stretched to cover superstition? I expect we'll find out....

[someone123]

Originally Posted by lio45

I don't think it's as doable in 2015 for someone who's just starting as you seem to think. Completely different market than when you started yourself in the '90s. The bar to entry is a lot higher.

Let's say I make $50k a year, what do you suggest I do to start?

Another thing to keep in mind is that values are still appreciating, so the down payment you need to get a house increases year over year, probably by almost as much as you can manage to save on a $50k salary in this city.

Condos are not appreciating by as much as houses but and some shoeboxes are in the 200s or lower, but the lack of appreciation in value also means that you are not going to be able to flip one of those and buy a house later on.

BC also happens to have a negative savings rate overall. People literally spend more than they earn here every year (some of that might be West Side homemakers with $0 in income buying Gucci bags or whatever). Very few people are actually "getting ahead", and if you buy real estate here you need to be able to bid against other people who are absolutely bonkers and willing to put themselves into a precarious financial position in order to own real estate. It doesn't seem like a great idea for middle class people. Middle class and younger people are better off renting, maybe buying a modest condo, or moving away if they want a nice place to live. This is why they have been leaving BC and moving to places like Alberta lately, although that may have slowed down a bit.

[mistercorporate]

Originally Posted by sunsetmountainland

If your want to make something of yourself! You will, you do not have to be a millionaire.

You can make $40,000 or $50,000 a year invest properly and do well. I certainly respect the chinese investor buying in Vancouver! I have told Leo plenty of times he should do it!

I have already explained how it can be done. People have been told of the mountains the borders and the logistics! The fact is someone from Toronto or the ROC does not have a clue.

The fact is the Chinese buyer is in Australia the U.S. as well as Canada. We are competing for investment. Why would someone from China not want to buy in Vancouver?

The fact of the matter is it is not just China it is also the Middle east, Vancouver has the most Iranians in north america after Los Angeles.

This has not happened overnight most you you guys are just blind!

Sorry I am going to post some more info I know most of you do not like facts.

http://business.financialpost.com/invest...wealth-says-worlds-biggest-money-manager

This is not new news boys and girls!

You are a dishonest fool, and the gall you display in stating that someone in Toronto or the RoC doesn't have a clue is thoroughly obnoxious. For the record, I used to live in Vancouver for a number of years. I also have investments in Real Estate in Australia. Australia and the rest of the industrialized world are not competing for Chinese Real Estate investment. Both Oz and NZ have recently enacted legislation restricting foreign investment specifically due to the uncivil and sociopathic way Chinese real estate investors have been behaving. They are the gold standard in insensitive real estate exploitation. Canada is also late to the game and is only now coming to terms with how unpalatable these "investors" are behaving, thanks to them all foreign real estate investors are going to suffer.

[ssiguy]

sunsetmountainland........

You're comment speaks volumes about both your priorities and mentality.

"if you want to make something of yourself" and then go into how to make money in real estate clearly exemplifies where your priorities lie.

Newsflash............. not everyone considers making money as "making something of yourself". Decent people do not view their personal goals and values by wealth accumulation but rather their humanity, concern for others less fortunate, helping their local community, being responsible neighbours and friends, loving parents and family members, willing to make personal sacrifices to help others in need, and concern for the wider world and not just their own personal circumstances.

I am soooooooo glad I am not making "something of myself" using your standards.

[Berklon]

CMHC chief says foreign buyers may be behind ‘substantial portion’ of luxury home sales

I guess you can put this in the "Well, duuuhhh" category.

[theman23]

Originally Posted by sunsetmountainland

If your want to make something of yourself! You will, you do not have to be a millionaire.

You can make $40,000 or $50,000 a year invest properly and do well. I certainly respect the chinese investor buying in Vancouver! I have told Leo plenty of times he should do it!

I have already explained how it can be done. People have been told of the mountains the borders and the logistics! The fact is someone from Toronto or the ROC does not have a clue.

The fact is the Chinese buyer is in Australia the U.S. as well as Canada. We are competing for investment. Why would someone from China not want to buy in Vancouver?

The fact of the matter is it is not just China it is also the Middle east, Vancouver has the most Iranians in north america after Los Angeles.

This has not happened overnight most you you guys are just blind!

Sorry I am going to post some more info I know most of you do not like facts.

http://business.financialpost.com/invest...wealth-says-worlds-biggest-money-manager

This is not new news boys and girls!

A quick google search shows that Vancouver doesnt even have the most Iranians in Canada. Lord knows what else youre making up.

[urbancanadian]

Skimming through this thread (which was painful), I don't understand where some of these posters are coming from? I've never seen them in the Vancouver section. Hell, I've barely noticed them outside this thread. I dunno, just thought it was weird...