PHILADELPHIA | Highrise Development Thread IX

[wondertwinalpha]

Originally Posted by cafeguy

Looks like there might be life to that water front project we all liked. Can't remember which one it is though...

http://www.philly.com/philly/business/20150729_Center_City_land_deal_linked_to_PMC.html

PMC executive vice president Jonathan Stavin said the company intended to construct residential buildings on the property.
http://www.philly.com/philly/business/20...l_linked_to_PMC.html#FL3BtTe0etzyZMMy.99

This is the project that was proposed for the large plot of that site.

http://forum.skyscraperpage.com/showthread.php?t=210203

[Knight Hospitaller]

Originally Posted by cafeguy

Looks like there might be life to that water front project we all liked. Can't remember which one it is though...

http://www.philly.com/philly/business/20150729_Center_City_land_deal_linked_to_PMC.html

That would be River City: http://www.bizjournals.com/philadelphia/...ux-big-center-city-development-site.html

Not sure how much it was liked:http://citypaper.net/Blogs/PHILAPHILIA-Dead-Ass-Proposal-of-the-Week-Philadelphia-River-City/

EDIT: Botched this with a lack of reference to RiverWalk.

[PHL1]

IBC Leases More Space ....at 19 and Market

http://www.bizjournals.com/philadelphia/...cross-more-center-city-office-space.html

[summersm343]

Committee OKs renovations for Divine Lorraine

Eric Blumenfeld visited City Hall on Tuesday to present his plans for renovating the former Divine Lorraine Hotel on North Broad Street to the Architectural Committee of the Historical Commission.

The renovation plans, summarized by Philly Mag last week, include a sunken outdoor garden area on the south side of the building and a small handful of restaurants along the ground floor. The upper floors will be reworked into 109 apartment units. Blumenfeld secured the last of the funding he needed for the renovation last month with a loan from the Philadelphia Redevelopment Authority.

http://planphilly.com/articles/2015/07/28/committee-oks-renovations-for-divine-lorraine

[summersm343]

Originally Posted by PHL1

IBC Leases More Space ....at 19 and Market

http://www.bizjournals.com/philadelphia/...cross-more-center-city-office-space.html

This is huge for gobbling up available office space.

[summersm343]

Philly is quickly gobbling up new apartment buildings

http://planphilly.com/articles/2015/07/28/philly-is-quickly-gobbling-up-new-apartment-buildings

[1487]

Originally Posted by PHL1

IBC Leases More Space ....at 19 and Market

http://www.bizjournals.com/philadelphia/...cross-more-center-city-office-space.html

Hard to believe they would move anyone from Utopian suburban office parks with low taxes to 1900 Market. News of a company like DOW leaving gets lots of discussion about how the City is not business friendly or competitive- news like this- no so much. This is a huge lease.

[BenKatzPhillytoParis]

Originally Posted by 1487

Hard to believe they would move anyone from Utopian suburban office parks with low taxes to 1900 Market. News of a company like DOW leaving gets lots of discussion about how the City is not business friendly or competitive- news like this- no so much. This is a huge lease.

In Russia now, and bizjournals website doesn't work here. Can someone post how many workers moving from suburbs to downtown it is and square footage please? Thanks, really appreciate it.

[ePlanningPhila]

Originally Posted by cafeguy

Looks like there might be life to that water front project we all liked. Can't remember which one it is though...

http://www.philly.com/philly/business/20150729_Center_City_land_deal_linked_to_PMC.html

This is scary, considering that everything PMC develops for the most part, is complete junk. The fact they will own the blocks facing the Schuylkill from Chestnut to Market and JFK to Arch is terrifying. There architectural record is abysmal and considering these are prime parcels that define the city, across the river from the 2nd largest transit station in the nation, we should expect nothing but world class architecture.

Every time I walk past CITC construction, I keep hoping one of the cranes will accidentally knock down the disaster that is 1900 Arch.

[br323206]

Originally Posted by BenKatzPhillytoParis

In Russia now, and bizjournals website doesn't work here. Can someone post how many workers moving from suburbs to downtown it is and square footage please? Thanks, really appreciate it.

Total of 228,000 square feet, including the 112,000 that they previously occupied in April. Will consolidate two suburban locations. No details on which locations or number of employees.

[allovertown]

Originally Posted by ePlanningPhila

This is scary, considering that everything PMC develops for the most part, is complete junk. The fact they will own the blocks facing the Schuylkill from Chestnut to Market and JFK to Arch is terrifying. There architectural record is abysmal and considering these are prime parcels that define the city, across the river from the 2nd largest transit station in the nation, we should expect nothing but world class architecture.

Every time I walk past CITC construction, I keep hoping one of the cranes will accidentally knock down the disaster that is 1900 Arch.

Prime parcels that will define the city? That's a bit much don't you think?

And calling a location a "Prime parcel" I think has a bit more to do than location. For example any parcel that has train tracks running in the middle of it would be pretty hard to call prime IMHO. This land they just bought has been vacant forever. It's a tricky property to build on and despite previous renders that had some excited, nothing was ever going to happen here unless this lot was sold.

I mean honestly what is "scary" about this? Say what you will about PMC, they have been getting things done. The things that they get done may look shitty, but shitty looking buildings still have people living in them, still add to the vitality of the city.

Besides what's critical about the site they just purchased has very little to do with what this building will look like and everything to do with how this site is laid out and maximizing what you can do with a stretch of very awkward parcels. If they build a building that literately looks like a giant turd but provides additional public access to the Schuylkill Trail and ground floor spaces for restaurants and cafe that could serve trail users, while also doing something, anything to activate the tiny slivers of land that sit between the train tracks and JFK from 20th to 23rd then this project would be a net win.

A property with this many headache inducing aspects is the type of lot that the real big boys wouldn't even bother with and the small guys can't possibly handle. A company like PMC is what is needed to actually get something done here. Relax, step back from the ledge. This is good news.

[BenKatzPhillytoParis]

Originally Posted by br323206

Total of 228,000 square feet, including the 112,000 that they previously occupied in April. Will consolidate two suburban locations. No details on which locations or number of employees.

Great, thanks BR.

[ePlanningPhila]

Originally Posted by allovertown

Prime parcels that will define the city? That's a bit much don't you think?

And calling a location a "Prime parcel" I think has a bit more to do than location. For example any parcel that has train tracks running in the middle of it would be pretty hard to call prime IMHO. This land they just bought has been vacant forever. It's a tricky property to build on and despite previous renders that had some excited, nothing was ever going to happen here unless this lot was sold.

I mean honestly what is "scary" about this? Say what you will about PMC, they have been getting things done. The things that they get done may look shitty, but shitty looking buildings still have people living in them, still add to the vitality of the city.

Besides what's critical about the site they just purchased has very little to do with what this building will look like and everything to do with how this site is laid out and maximizing what you can do with a stretch of very awkward parcels. If they build a building that literately looks like a giant turd but provides additional public access to the Schuylkill Trail and ground floor spaces for restaurants and cafe that could serve trail users, while also doing something, anything to activate the tiny slivers of land that sit between the train tracks and JFK from 20th to 23rd then this project would be a net win.

A property with this many headache inducing aspects is the type of lot that the real big boys wouldn't even bother with and the small guys can't possibly handle. A company like PMC is what is needed to actually get something done here. Relax, step back from the ledge. This is good news.

I respect your opinion. And agree that while this does not have to be world class architecture, we should be expecting more from this development company. This city deserves more than shitty boxes. You cannot tell me when you walk past 1900 arch you are not embarrassed. That building is an embarrassment to this city, I think my suburban high school looks more dignified and carries more architectural integrity.

I do not think it is extending one's reach, to demand this city elevates the standard of architecture being developed. What defines this city, is its architecture. And when we slowly start to allow that integrity to be lowered, we over time, are giving this city to profit mongers, who fail to properly invest in a place. Putting up shitty boxes is not "investment". If you want that type of investment, go out to the sprawling suburbs, where development companies have scarred america, and left us with a whole lot of shitty boxes that no one cares about.

I am pro development. I do not expect a billion dollar project. I am aware of construction costs. But this project merits quality architecture and this city needs to demand it from PMC. Because what they have been giving us, is lackluster.

[jsbrook]

Originally Posted by allovertown

Prime parcels that will define the city? That's a bit much don't you think?

And calling a location a "Prime parcel" I think has a bit more to do than location. For example any parcel that has train tracks running in the middle of it would be pretty hard to call prime IMHO. This land they just bought has been vacant forever. It's a tricky property to build on and despite previous renders that had some excited, nothing was ever going to happen here unless this lot was sold.

I mean honestly what is "scary" about this? Say what you will about PMC, they have been getting things done. The things that they get done may look shitty, but shitty looking buildings still have people living in them, still add to the vitality of the city.

Besides what's critical about the site they just purchased has very little to do with what this building will look like and everything to do with how this site is laid out and maximizing what you can do with a stretch of very awkward parcels. If they build a building that literately looks like a giant turd but provides additional public access to the Schuylkill Trail and ground floor spaces for restaurants and cafe that could serve trail users, while also doing something, anything to activate the tiny slivers of land that sit between the train tracks and JFK from 20th to 23rd then this project would be a net win.

A property with this many headache inducing aspects is the type of lot that the real big boys wouldn't even bother with and the small guys can't possibly handle. A company like PMC is what is needed to actually get something done here. Relax, step back from the ledge. This is good news.

I think this is misguided thinking. The news is meh, at best. These are parcels that have the potentially to be something huge (and yes, location is part of that), and it's natural to feel disappointment that they weren't purchased by a developer with a reputation for quality projects. I would love to see Philly's riverfront develop like Chicago, though that is greatly complicated if not made all but impossible by extremely poor highway and railroad placement. Still, big missed opportunities here if PMC puts up garbage.

[allovertown]

Originally Posted by ePlanningPhila

I respect your opinion. And agree that while this does not have to be world class architecture, we should be expecting more from this development company. This city deserves more than shitty boxes. You cannot tell me when you walk past 1900 arch you are not embarrassed. That building is an embarrassment to this city, I think my suburban high school looks more dignified and carries more architectural integrity.

I do not think it is extending one's reach, to demand this city elevates the standard of architecture being developed. What defines this city, is its architecture. And when we slowly start to allow that integrity to be lowered, we over time, are giving this city to profit mongers, who fail to properly invest in a place. Putting up shitty boxes is not "investment". If you want that type of investment, go out to the sprawling suburbs, where development companies have scarred america, and left us with a whole lot of shitty boxes that no one cares about.

I am pro development. I do not expect a billion dollar project. I am aware of construction costs. But this project merits quality architecture and this city needs to demand it from PMC. Because what they have been giving us, is lackluster.

1900 Arch is an ugly building. But I'm certainly not embarrassed when I walk past it. Embarrassment to the city? You're being overly dramatic.

Honestly I think the AAA addition they built looks fine, but I have zero issue with the city demanding more from PMC. I'd love to see better quality from PMC and I hope we get it with these two important plots. My point was simply that I'm not about to jump off a bridge just because PMC now owns these properties. Something is going to get built here, on a plot that I was not very optimistic about seeing something built on anytime soon. On the whole I think that's good news. Hopefully the city will hold PMC accountable and we'll even get a halfway decent looking building here.

[Plokoon11]

What if PMC building something of quality? Maybe they've been waiting for a good area for something that can be seen.

[Knight Hospitaller]

With respect to PMC or anything else, never settle, but never let the perfect be the enemy of the good. I'd prefer a meh building to expanses of asphalt, weed trees, razor wire, broken glass and graffiti. Things are happening in this town in (formerly) peripheral locations that, having lived here almost my entire life (and all of my adult life), I had always considered outside the life of Center City. That has me "psyched." My first job out of college was at 20th & Arch. I might as well have worked in the suburbs because it was far away from most Center City activity. Now look at that area (1900 Arch included).

[br323206]

Originally Posted by ePlanningPhila

I respect your opinion. And agree that while this does not have to be world class architecture, we should be expecting more from this development company. This city deserves more than shitty boxes. You cannot tell me when you walk past 1900 arch you are not embarrassed. That building is an embarrassment to this city, I think my suburban high school looks more dignified and carries more architectural integrity.

I do not think it is extending one's reach, to demand this city elevates the standard of architecture being developed. What defines this city, is its architecture. And when we slowly start to allow that integrity to be lowered, we over time, are giving this city to profit mongers, who fail to properly invest in a place. Putting up shitty boxes is not "investment". If you want that type of investment, go out to the sprawling suburbs, where development companies have scarred america, and left us with a whole lot of shitty boxes that no one cares about.

I am pro development. I do not expect a billion dollar project. I am aware of construction costs. But this project merits quality architecture and this city needs to demand it from PMC. Because what they have been giving us, is lackluster.

The interesting thing about posts like this is that if you go to the threads for Chicago, LA, New York, Boston, etc. you'll see people on every single thread complaining about the "shitty boxes" that are getting built and how they are embarrassed. There are people in all those places saying "they would never allow this in (insert other city here)" yet all those cities have projects that exhibit mediocre architecture.

Point is: Some projects will be amazing. Others will just fill a need, while being architecturally uninspiring. There are tons of buildings around Center City that are uglier than 1900 Arch. There are tons that are better.

Also for more perspective, just the other day there was an article about Boston that came down to "New York knows how to build nice new buildings. Philadelphia knows how to build nice new buildings. Why can't Boston get better architecture on its new buildings?"

[1487]

Originally Posted by ePlanningPhila

This is scary, considering that everything PMC develops for the most part, is complete junk. The fact they will own the blocks facing the Schuylkill from Chestnut to Market and JFK to Arch is terrifying. There architectural record is abysmal and considering these are prime parcels that define the city, across the river from the 2nd largest transit station in the nation, we should expect nothing but world class architecture.

Every time I walk past CITC construction, I keep hoping one of the cranes will accidentally knock down the disaster that is 1900 Arch.

Its not scaring me at all. Im hopeful something of size gets placed on that parking lot. even if its relatively generic modern residential architecture.

[1487]

Originally Posted by allovertown

1900 Arch is an ugly building. But I'm certainly not embarrassed when I walk past it. Embarrassment to the city? You're being overly dramatic.

Honestly I think the AAA addition they built looks fine, but I have zero issue with the city demanding more from PMC. I'd love to see better quality from PMC and I hope we get it with these two important plots. My point was simply that I'm not about to jump off a bridge just because PMC now owns these properties. Something is going to get built here, on a plot that I was not very optimistic about seeing something built on anytime soon. On the whole I think that's good news. Hopefully the city will hold PMC accountable and we'll even get a halfway decent looking building here.

I think many people (including Inga S) are a little confused about what the city can demand. The city isnt in the business of dictating design to developers. The CDR process was created in order to attempt to shape large projects but their opinions aren't binding and they cannot force a developer to do anything. thus far, it seems most developers that get ravaged at an CDR hearing attempt to make at least basic design changes but thats about all you can hope for. If the city is making a major concession on zoning or something that offers a little leeway to demand design details that go above and beyond but that doesn't apply to many projects. the city really has minimal leverage over a private development being built on privately acquired land.