PHILADELPHIA | Highrise Development Thread IX

[EastSideHBG]

Originally Posted by GarCastle

Isn't Mall shopping down significantly over the recent years? I guess I just cannot picture people driving from Philly out to KOP Mall any longer. Mall days are numbered. I had some guy with an unmarked truck dropping off an Amazon package on a SUNDAY. With online retailers doing that, I cannot see how store fronts are going to survive much longer. Especially when free shipping and no tax comes into the mix.

I live right near the Willow Grove mall and whenever I'm there it's tweens and/or parents getting their toddlers out of the house. That's usually why I'm there, to get the kids out of the house even for an hour (not for the tweens LOL).

Cheers,
G.

"Mall days are numbered" has been said for years now yet many still perform well and studies are showing that millennials may actually be heading back into malls because as iheartphilly said, some things just don't go as well online (clothing, certain electronics, etc.). Also, there is reason to believe that malls are heading back upward due to the social experience...in KOP's case, it is nothing to see families and friends together for an entire day of shopping and for an experience you just couldn't get online.

I think the notion that malls aren't doing well comes into play because some areas over saturated themselves with malls (and crappy ones at that; small, poorly designed, poor lighting...) and an area can't sustain all of these malls when there are other competitors that weren't around decades ago.

The malls left standing do need to reinvent themselves to avoid getting stale but we do see that happening now.

[summersm343]

Originally Posted by Kidphilly

I looked at the Marina view proposal and it says dead. Driving donw 95 would make me think this thing is rising as we speak

It is now One Water Street and is a completely different proposal and different developer:

http://forum.skyscraperpage.com/showthread.php?t=211345

[MikeNigh]

Originally Posted by summersm343

It is now One Water Street and is a completely different proposal and different developer:

http://forum.skyscraperpage.com/showthread.php?t=211345

Is it possible we can get that project to show up under this forum? http://forum.skyscraperpage.com/tags.php?tag=philadelphia

[DIESELPOLO]

Originally Posted by GarCastle

Isn't Mall shopping down significantly over the recent years? I guess I just cannot picture people driving from Philly out to KOP Mall any longer. Mall days are numbered...

I wouldn't write off the mall completely, but we (Philly and America) could be over-retailed, which would probably necessitate winding down less strategic malls--and those not easily redevelop-able--and aging strip centers.

[Jawnadelphia]

Originally Posted by MikeNigh

Is it possible we can get that project to show up under this forum? http://forum.skyscraperpage.com/tags.php?tag=philadelphia

Good luck with that Mike.

I've tried emailing admin (Kevinfromtexas) to get:

One Water
Philly Live
Penn Medicine South Tower (Penn Center for Advanced Cellular Therapeutics)
and the Penn Medicine Tower proposal threads

moved over to the Philly main forum section -- I guess he didn't get the memo.

[1487]

Originally Posted by summersm343

It is now One Water Street and is a completely different proposal and different developer:

http://forum.skyscraperpage.com/showthread.php?t=211345

I saw this project from the El on Friday, its up to the 3rd or 4th floor.

[McBane]

A couple Monday morning comments:

1. Thrilled about the Hale building. The article makes it seem as if the design is controversial today. Is there anyone who doesn't like this building today? It needs some TLC but it's amazing. It's beauty and longtime condition reminds me of the Divine Lorraine, just on a smaller scale and in a less challenging location.

2. I don't think the sale of 21st/Chestnut is good nor bad. In all likelihood, Buck's business model is to develop, get the building fully leased/sold, and then get out and move to the next project. They're builders, not landlords. BTW, will that restaurant space EVER open?

3. The demand for malls is not what it used to be and so malls that are surrounded by better competition or malls that can't retain their anchor tenants are dying. But the KOP is a specialty mall, a regional draw. It's not going anywhere anytime soon.

[allovertown]

Originally Posted by TallCoolOne

Good luck with that Mike.

I've tried emailing admin (Kevinfromtexas) to get:

One Water
Philly Live
Penn Medicine South Tower (Penn Center for Advanced Cellular Therapeutics)
and the Penn Medicine Tower proposal threads

moved over to the Philly main forum section -- I guess he didn't get the memo.

He added threads for me in the past. As I remember though it was a real pain and involved him having to contact the website manager. Doesn't hurt to keep trying though. I think the real key is putting them in the right place when the threads are created.

[summersm343]

New Threads

AC Hotel by Marriot - hotel - 14 floors
http://forum.skyscraperpage.com/showthread.php?p=7101949#post7101949

Hudson Hotel - hotel/retail - 13 floors
http://forum.skyscraperpage.com/showthread.php?p=7101958#post7101958

1100 N. Delaware - residential/retail - 13 floors
http://forum.skyscraperpage.com/showthread.php?p=7101974#post7101974

3675 Science Center - office/retail - 12 floors
http://forum.skyscraperpage.com/showthread.php?p=7101981#post7101981

[sayitaintso]

Originally Posted by MikeNigh

Is this good or bad? Seems cheap considering the granary sold for $120M and was built for $66M. I guess it's still making a profit over it's $100M construction.

"William Rich of Delta Associates, of Washington, which tracks the rental market, said the apartment vacancy rate in the city fell to 1.6 percent in the second quarter from 5 percent a year earlier. This occurred even while competition in the market, especially in Center City, continued to increase, Rich said.

Effective rents -- minus concessions and allowances -- rose 4 percent in the same 12 months, he said, to an average of $2,226 a month for high-end high-rise units."

I had to read this twice because I couldn't believe it. A year ago vacancy was around 4% and it was forecast to get to 5 or 6% with all the new inventory coming on market.

I don' know if people realize this but its an absolutely jaw dropping statement for those of us who track numbers like this.

For vacancy to be at 1.6%! after all this construction. I am at a loss for words. CCs(Pine to vine) population must have increased by at least 5000 in the last year to essentially cover all new inventory AND drop the old inventory from 4% to 1.6%. Just shocking. 1.6% is virtually unheard of. I can't remember the last time it was below 2%.

I'm surprised there hasn't been more discussion on this point. Saturation is much further off than I originally thought.

[MikeNigh]

Originally Posted by sayitaintso

"William Rich of Delta Associates, of Washington, which tracks the rental market, said the apartment vacancy rate in the city fell to 1.6 percent in the second quarter from 5 percent a year earlier. This occurred even while competition in the market, especially in Center City, continued to increase, Rich said.

Effective rents -- minus concessions and allowances -- rose 4 percent in the same 12 months, he said, to an average of $2,226 a month for high-end high-rise units."

I had to read this twice because I couldn't believe it. A year ago vacancy was around 4% and it was forecast to get to 5 or 6% with all the new inventory coming on market.

I don' know if people realize this but its an absolutely jaw dropping statement for those of us who track numbers like this.

For vacancy to be at 1%! after all this construction. I am at a loss for words. CCs(Pine to vine) population must have increased by at least 5000 in the last year to essentially cover all new inventory AND drop the old inventory from 4% to 1%. Just shocking. Im surprised there hasn't been more discussion on this point.

So we have a if you build it they will come market but still we get 1919 market and 1900 arch...

[summersm343]

Originally Posted by sayitaintso

"William Rich of Delta Associates, of Washington, which tracks the rental market, said the apartment vacancy rate in the city fell to 1.6 percent in the second quarter from 5 percent a year earlier. This occurred even while competition in the market, especially in Center City, continued to increase, Rich said.

Effective rents -- minus concessions and allowances -- rose 4 percent in the same 12 months, he said, to an average of $2,226 a month for high-end high-rise units."

I had to read this twice because I couldn't believe it. A year ago vacancy was around 4% and it was forecast to get to 5 or 6% with all the new inventory coming on market.

I don' know if people realize this but its an absolutely jaw dropping statement for those of us who track numbers like this.

For vacancy to be at 1.6%! after all this construction. I am at a loss for words. CCs(Pine to vine) population must have increased by at least 5000 in the last year to essentially cover all new inventory AND drop the old inventory from 4% to 1.6%. Just shocking. 1.6% is virtually unheard of. I can't remember the last time it was below 2%.

I'm surprised there hasn't been more discussion on this point. Saturation is much further off than I originally thought.

Agreed. Huge news. I smell more developments coming down the pipeline.

[summersm343]

Why Israel's PhysiMax likes Philly for expansion

PhysiMax, an Israeli online video analysis service that identifies injury-causing movement patterns, is set to grow its U.S. presence in Philadelphia, calling the City of Brotherly Love a desirable place to build because of the city's well-rooted healthcare industry and the potential to connect with the area's professional sports teams.

The tech company, which already has a New York office, was one of the first foreign firms to make a commitment to Mayor Michael Nutter to expand in Philadelphia.

http://www.bizjournals.com/philadelphia/...imax-aharoni-nutter-phila-expansion.html

[Human Scale]

Originally Posted by summersm343

Agreed. Huge news. I smell more developments coming down the pipeline.

And we need more hotels too. I just paid $250 for a night at the Holiday Inn Express. THE HOLIDAY INN EXPRESS!!!

[1487]

conversion building is half leased according to this article.

http://www.bizjournals.com/philadelphia/...enir-chestnut-apartments-microunits.html

[Philly Fan]

Murano success a sign of Market Street West's rise

The story of the Center City condo market's turnaround stands 43 stories tall at 2101 Market St.

That's the address of the Murano, the bluish glass-and-steel high-rise that in June 2009, as the real estate bust choked the life out of sales, was the first locally to resort to an auction.

Next month, the last of the Murano's 302 original units will go to settlement - a milestone that local real estate observers consider not only a measure of market strength but a 180-degree turnaround in the perception of the viability of that Market Street West.
"The area between 20th Street and the Schuylkill River is clearly filling in the dead zones with new residential and mixed-use projects," said developer Carl Dranoff.

"Look for the Schuylkill River to become a connector instead of a divider between University City and Center City," said Dranoff, who is building One Riverside, a luxury-condominium high-rise at 25th and Locust Streets.

[1487]

Originally Posted by Philly Fan

Murano success a sign of Market Street West's rise

this is good news for the supply of condos on the market.

[tsarstruck]

Originally Posted by Human Scale

And we need more hotels too. I just paid $250 for a night at the Holiday Inn Express. THE HOLIDAY INN EXPRESS!!!

Not to say that we do or do not need more hotels, but this kind of anecdote is not particularly helpful and fits into the whole "not the plural of data" cliche. A quick Google search turns up several four star hotels available for this weekend under $200. In Boston, a city who people on this board have suggested has the ratio of hotels we should be jealous of, the far-flung next-to-a-Home-Depot Holiday Inn Express is displaying a $389 rate for this weekend. That you paid $250 recently makes me think that you booked at a time of especially high demand.

And not for nothing, while Philadelphia hotels are doing well and there are a lot of new rooms in the pipeline, there is this:

Though occupancy rates in the Philadelphia region are up from 2009, when they sank to a 20-year low, they still lag far behind rates in New York and Boston, according to data from Jones Lang LaSalle, a commercial real estate services firm, and Smith Travel Research.

"Philadelphia is a good market, not a 'Wow, unbelievable' market," said Andrew Benioff, a hotel specialist at Philadelphia's Llenrock Group real estate finance and advisory firm. "With this new supply, I think it's maybe a little too much."

http://articles.philly.com/2015-06-22/bu...cy-rates-more-hotel-rooms-pkf-consulting

[hammersklavier]

Originally Posted by MikeNigh

So we have a if you build it they will come market but still we get 1919 market and 1900 arch...

Large projects generally take several years to get off the ground. Not just construction: property acquisition, site planning, etc. A lot of work has already gone in by the time the first presentations are made, and after those you usually need to wait another year or two before you see site movement.

[1487]

http://www.philly.com/philly/business/re..._residences_on_2100_block_of_Market.html

looks like we wont see anything here for at least 2 years. Good news about another tenant (a big one) at 1900 market- but one wonders if its just a company vacating another CC office building.