Stadiums and Arenas of Canada part 2

[Oilkountry]

I was also going to mention Ottawa TD place both the Stadium and Arenas plus CTC and Raymond Chabot Grant Thornton Park puts it right up there with Winnipeg,Van,Edmonton. Actually if anything it stands out in some areas

[Oilkountry]

Originally Posted by esquire

Winnipeg's facilities are good but somewhat basic. Only IGF is truly exceptional by league standards... it is a beautiful stadium (and I would by no means take it for granted that new Mosaic is going to exceed it... the only way in which I think it may be better is that it looks very nice from the outside with a sleek exterior, but that's as far as I'd go right now).

MTS Centre is good but it's small and somewhat threadbare (no surprise given that it was an AHL venue for the first seven seasons) even though TNSE is correcting that.

Shaw Park deserves special mention for getting the construction phase under way... it was the first new pro venue built in Winnipeg in over 50 years and without it I doubt MTSC or IGF would have happened for many more years. It's nice and it has a great location, but once you get inside it's basically an average minor league ballpark.

It is pretty amazing that Winnipeg got this done, though... for a while in the late 90s it looked like we'd keep on using the old Winnipeg Arena and Stadium until the wind eventually knocked them down.

I'm not sure why you view the MTS Centre as Basic? It's a little smaller than most NHL arenas sure but the concourses easily fit the 5000 less people than most arenas have. Equal level of congestion that you see in edm and calgary. But either than that I don't see where you're coming from. Sure the finish lacks a bit but I'm sure this will be fixed. Ive been to every major arena in Canada but the CTC,ACC and Copps col. And to tell you the truth MTSC really doesn't lack that much at all. Its got built in restaurants and even a bar that open up to the bowl. Concourses that are surrounded by windows. Great big main atrium. Lounges on every level of the concourses. And Now that the bathroom situation is taken care of, I don't get it what it lacks. and its not even 1/4th way through a $40-$50 million renovation. Ive been to rogers arena which is well known as one of the best arenas in north america and to be honest I was equally as impressed with Winnipeg's digs. Concession choices are great! The thing ive always hated about MTS was the dull scoreboard. And we will Never see it again. If you're comparing it to Console energy center or Barclays than of course you're gonna find reasons to Complain about it. But is thats the case feel free to include Basically 80% of arenas in North america.

MTSC in my opinion stacks up nicely

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[EpicPonyTime]

Originally Posted by elly63

All we have about Calgary is rumour and one is it will be the best arena in the NHL and the other is the stadium's fans will "be comfortable" year round in a smaller capacity stadium than they have now (which says to me better sightlines than Commonwealth).

I hadn't heard any talk of the proposed stadium being smaller than McMahon. Hopefully it isn't by much. Much of the CFL is downsizing, but Calgary is one of the few cities that I think would benefit from having a larger-than-normal stadium. Hopefully the smallest they'll go is 35,000 and they can expand it larger than 40,000.

[eemy]

As far as I understand, the Gatineau Olympiques are supposed to be moving into a new arena shortly as well.

[BretttheRiderFan]

Having been to every CFL stadium save for Tim Hortons and TD Place, I guess I judge the stadiums a bit differently. As far as pure impressiveness of the facility coupled with size, Commonwealth is definitely #1, but as mentioned it lacks intimacy and atmosphere. This is really too bad, because Edmonton has consistently been one of the most loyal fanbases in the league and this city loves the Eskimos. Leading the league in attendance nearly every single year and the stadium looks half empty, and the atmosphere when you're at a game there is not great, even when it's full.

It would be wonderful hypothetically if we could have a smaller, football-specific stadium for the Eskimos and then I think the Eskimos faithful would be more appreciated across the league and the country (of course this is just dreaming, Commonwealth is a great stadium and doesn't need to go at all).

I was very impressed by Investors Group Field, as far as I'm concerned it's the perfect CFL stadium. It is modern, aesthetically pleasing (for me anyway), the right size for the CFL, has a great atmosphere and it just does something for me that Commonwealth can't. BC Place has that same pizzazz, but not the atmosphere of Winnipeg (though it CAN have that atmosphere as I witnessed at the 2011 GC).

McMahon Stadium is absolutely atrocious, but has great sightlines and (I may get some flack for this) a better atmosphere than Commonwealth, even when it's not full. A new stadium in Calgary would be a real experience.

Come to think of it, I think the Esks and Stamps fanbases are both grossly underrated in this country.

From what I've seen, TD and THF seem to fit my criteria of what I like in a stadium quite nicely, though TD Place has always looked a lot more modern and cool to me than THF (at least the new stand and exterior), but obviously I haven't been to either.

I really think the new Mosaic, when you combine the facilities aspect with the gameday experience aspect, will blow all of them out of the water. That might just be my green coloured shades though.

[BretttheRiderFan]

Here would be my personal ranking of NHL and CFL facilities, then my personal overall considering all facilities in a city (I encourage you to critique)

NHL

1. Probably the Air Canada Centre
2. Bell Centre
3. Rogers Arena
4. Canadian Tire Centre
5. MTS Centre
6. Scotiabank Saddledome
7. Rexall Place

The top five here I think you can actually clump together pretty well, though I think the choice for bottom two is more clear. As far as atmosphere, there are different degrees of atmosphere but overall it's great anywhere you go in Canada and fluctuates depending on how good the team is. Generally speaking though, Montreal, Winnipeg and Vancouver have better atmosphere than the others. Worst I would assign to the ACC.

CFL (if you think I'm wrong anywhere, especially since I haven't been to THF and TD, please correct me)

1. Investors Group Field
2. BC Place
3. Commonwealth Stadium
4. Rogers Centre
5. TD Place
6. Tim Hortons Field
7. McMahon Stadium
8. Mosaic Stadium
9. Molson Stadium


I think when you combine for facilities like BMO, Saputo, the tennis centres, the Big O, Circuit Gilles Villeneuve, etc, you see that Toronto and Montreal really separate themselves. This isn't really due to many factors but sheer size advantage.

[BretttheRiderFan]

Any yeggers here, any news about Telus Field and a possible tenant? I would love to go to some games this summer (having grown up in Grande Prairie, being a huge baseball fan and just recently moved out here, the idea of walking to and from home and a game is so magical to me) but I haven't heard a thing about the Capitals or somebody else playing. Is there no team occupying the park? I see Oil Kings ads all over the sign when I drive by, does that mean the park is owned by Katz group?? I went to a Trappers game in their last season in 2004 and had a blast. Is that god-awful two turf system still there?

How does the stadium play into the plans for river valley development? Where will the new LRT station be in relation to the field? I just feel this will be a prime location in the future and could be a little jewel in the same ilk of Winnipeg. If you coupled this with a soccer-specific little stadium around Clark Field for FC Edmonton (similar maybe to Saputo pre-MLS) and new Rogers Place, we would undoubtedly have some of the best spectator sporting options and experiences in the country.

http://www.baseballeibf.ca/images/Telus%20Field%20001.jpg



http://www.capsbaseball.ca/wp-content/gallery/may-31-2011-caps-vs-calgary-vipers/oil8733.jpg



http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-RQDvxPAhves/ThH-B3GQPaI/AAAAAAAABOU/x06rUVgBjOw/s1600/IMG_0286.JPG



http://www.edmontonjournal.com/cms/binary/10972113.jpg

[elly63]

Originally Posted by EpicPonyTime

I hadn't heard any talk of the proposed stadium being smaller than McMahon. Hopefully it isn't by much. Much of the CFL is downsizing, but Calgary is one of the few cities that I think would benefit from having a larger-than-normal stadium. Hopefully the smallest they'll go is 35,000 and they can expand it larger than 40,000.

One report had 27k

[BretttheRiderFan]

For Calgary??? Wow. I'd think at the very bare minimum 30.

[Brik Chithaus]

Originally Posted by Oilkountry

^ wtf?!?

[eemy]

TD Place Arena/Civic Centre

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by Brik Chithaus

^ wtf?!?

The side from which the photo was taken (as well as the two ends) are three to four times as high as the short section you see there.

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by jeremy_haak

As far as I understand, the Gatineau Olympiques are supposed to be moving into a new arena shortly as well.

Yes, but this week our city council started dilly-dallying on the issue after all of the contractor bids came in much higher than they had anticipated. I don't know how this is going to go.

[Horus]

Originally Posted by Acajack

Yes, but this week our city council started dilly-dallying on the issue after all of the contractor bids came in much higher than they had anticipated. I don't know how this is going to go.

Yeah, this isn't going to resolve any time soon by the looks of it. All they have now is a proposal for a new arena for the Olympiques, but in the time it's going to take to get a satisfactory bid and actually build the thing, I'd thave to think the Olympiques are staying put at the Bob for at least 3 more seasons.

[esquire]

Ottawa's facilities are good, but CTC is the only real standout. I will say that Ottawa probably has one of the best secondary rinks in the country in terms of venue quality and location. It's actually somewhat surprising that in a country like this only Vancouver and (sort of) Ottawa have two decent-sized arenas. Even Toronto lacks a second barn... it's a long way down from ACC to Ricoh.

[elly63]

Originally Posted by BretttheRiderFan

For Calgary??? Wow. I'd think at the very bare minimum 30.

I suppose it depends on if it was fully integrated with the fieldhouse or not. That would be the worst if they built it (the stadium) with a track.

[Nathan]

Originally Posted by BretttheRiderFan

For Calgary??? Wow. I'd think at the very bare minimum 30.

I would think that pride at least would put them in the Regina and Winnipeg range.

27k seems lower than their recent average attendances too, which would definitely rise in a new stadium.

I really hope they don't go for something that small... They'd sort of stick out in a back way in the West Division.

[esquire]

Yeah, 27K seems oddly small, to the point where it could hinder Calgary's ability to attract non-football events like major concerts, international sports events and the like. Winnipeg has received good use from IGF and its 33K seats... in addition to football, there have been big outdoor shows like McCartney, Swift, Jay-Z/Beyonce, this year there will be AC/DC, the Women's World Cup, the Heritage Classic in all likelihood next season... all of those benefit from the venue's seating capacity.

It's all the more strange when you consider that the Stamps have generally averaged crowds of more than 27K over the past 20 years or so. I would think 30K expandable to 40K would be the absolute minimum for Calgary... realistically it should probably be around the 38K expandable to 45K mark. Even a permanent capacity of 45K would not be unreasonable for such a big and growing city with a strong football fanbase.

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by esquire

Yeah, 27K seems oddly small, to the point where it could hinder Calgary's ability to attract non-football events like major concerts, international sports events and the like. Winnipeg has received good use from IGF and its 33K seats... in addition to football, there have been big outdoor shows like McCartney, Swift, Jay-Z/Beyonce, this year there will be AC/DC, the Women's World Cup, the Heritage Classic in all likelihood next season... all of those benefit from the venue's seating capacity.

It's all the more strange when you consider that the Stamps have generally averaged crowds of more than 27K over the past 20 years or so. I would think 30K expandable to 40K would be the absolute minimum for Calgary... realistically it should probably be around the 38K expandable to 45K mark. Even a permanent capacity of 45K would not be unreasonable for such a big and growing city with a strong football fanbase.

For the sake of comparison, Vancouver built BC Place around 1983 when it had about the same metro population as Calgary does today.

Of course, it was a different era and there were different circumstances. They had Expo 86 coming up - although I never understood why they "needed" a new large domed stadium for an Expo...

[esquire]

Originally Posted by Acajack

For the sake of comparison, Vancouver built BC Place around 1983 when it had about the same metro population as Calgary does today.

Of course, it was a different era and there were different circumstances. They had Expo 86 coming up - although I never understood why they "needed" a new large domed stadium for an Expo...

In the early 80s the CFL still drew pretty big crowds and more or less kept pace with the NFL's stadiums in those days. Expanded Exhibition Stadium, Olympic Stadium, Commonwealth Stadium and BC Place would have generally been on par with what the NFL was building at the time, if only a little bit smaller (as opposed to IGF and Mosaic which are roughly half the capacity of new NFL venues). So there was that need for a large seating bowl, combined with the push for a MLB team at the time which also would have required that capacity.

But yes, I take your point... I'm not sure what need there would be for a stadium in connection with a World's Fair. At the time BC Place was conceived, Empire Stadium was not even 30 years old, so it's not like it was falling apart. Maybe between Expo's needs and the desire for baseball, that was enough to justify a new stadium.