PHILADELPHIA | Highrise Development Thread IX

[eliasrapp98]

I know that the Vine Street Expressway is hopefully going to be capped, but is there any talk about getting rid of the interior streets on the Parkway? They are so intrusive and unneccessary. What could be great park area leading up to the art museum, perfect for concerts, etc, instead they 4 roads with a confusing, insanely large amount of lanes. Why is there no talk about dialing that road down?

[Flyers2001]

Originally Posted by GarCastle

They were promising Labor Day, but sounds like it is getting delayed (again). I suppose it's a moot point until they have a design for the new hospital anyway. Tearing down PT and the garage will not hold up anything else for quite awhile.

Cheers,
G.

They have also been doing studies for traffic in the area. They are concerned about the added traffic of moving valet vehicles from the PT garage back to 3600, while CHOP opens their new facility and the 1000 cars a day they are expecting. Health Services drive will be an absolute mess.

[philatonian]

Originally Posted by eliasrapp98

I know that the Vine Street Expressway is hopefully going to be capped, but is there any talk about getting rid of the interior streets on the Parkway? They are so intrusive and unneccessary. What could be great park area leading up to the art museum, perfect for concerts, etc, instead they 4 roads with a confusing, insanely large amount of lanes. Why is there no talk about dialing that road down?

No talk as of yet. And I imagine with the recent improvements, it wouldn't come up for a while. The thing I hate most about the inner streets is commuters treat them as an expressway to the NW and the 'burbs. I mean it's understandable. I've taken the Parkway to avoid 76 more times than I care to count, but it's not a freeway.

As for the VSE. They're redoing the street caps now but I haven't heard anything about capping the whole expressway. Definitely not east of Broad. That sounds kind of like a "Big Dig" pitch.

I'm one of the few weirdos who doesn't think it's that bad (or doesn't have to be that bad) without a full-on cap. And I live next to it (and listen to its roar all night long). I just think if it were lined with high, dense development it wouldn't be so bad. Basically, if the LDS apartments and the Eastern Tower equivalents lined all of Vine Street, the VSE wouldn't be the barrier it is.

[philatonian]

Good morning, Gotham! This picture makes me freakin' love this city!

Originally Posted by summersm343

https://www.flickr.com/photos/chenyuming...Vf74p-rX54Kg-rWTz49-rhxcaR-rWyaQG-rgMJgg

[JLKim]

Originally Posted by eliasrapp98

I know that the Vine Street Expressway is hopefully going to be capped, but is there any talk about getting rid of the interior streets on the Parkway? They are so intrusive and unneccessary. What could be great park area leading up to the art museum, perfect for concerts, etc, instead they 4 roads with a confusing, insanely large amount of lanes. Why is there no talk about dialing that road down?

I have seen some renderings with the middle traffic lanes removed. Nothing official has been proposed, but it would be awesome! http://www.cap676.com/renderings/

[eliasrapp98]

Originally Posted by JLKim

I have seen some renderings with the middle traffic lanes removed. Nothing official has been proposed, but it would be awesome! http://www.cap676.com/renderings/

http://www.broadstreetreview.com/art-architecture/philadelphias-benjamin-franklin-parkway
Great Article!

[Guipos08]

^^ Would be awesome to turn both circles on the parkway into pedestrian friendly squares

[McBane]

Originally Posted by philatonian

No talk as of yet. And I imagine with the recent improvements, it wouldn't come up for a while. The thing I hate most about the inner streets is commuters treat them as an expressway to the NW and the 'burbs. I mean it's understandable. I've taken the Parkway to avoid 76 more times than I care to count, but it's not a freeway.

As for the VSE. They're redoing the street caps now but I haven't heard anything about capping the whole expressway. Definitely not east of Broad. That sounds kind of like a "Big Dig" pitch.

I'm one of the few weirdos who doesn't think it's that bad (or doesn't have to be that bad) without a full-on cap. And I live next to it (and listen to its roar all night long). I just think if it were lined with high, dense development it wouldn't be so bad. Basically, if the LDS apartments and the Eastern Tower equivalents lined all of Vine Street, the VSE wouldn't be the barrier it is.

My solution for the Vine Street Expressway is to rezone both sides of Vine Street to make it easy for developers to build here. Remove height limits (realistically, no one is going to pitch 1000 footers here), FAR requirements, parking ratios, and all the other crap that developers fight over in their variance requests. Also, eliminate the million and one committees that review a typical project so as to expedite the process.

Let's face it, Vine Street is not attractive, it's not historic, and it's never going to be a quiet, pleasant-to-walk-on street, so why bother trying? If developers want to line the street with towers on parking podiums with no retail or other street level pleasantries, it would still be 1000x better than what's there now. And with the expressway right there, autocentric highrises would be attractive to many buyers who want to be in the city, but also need easy access to the burbs (this is the lure of buyers to Waterfront Square).

Rather then spending money to cap the expressway, this solution would cost the city nothing. Just takes innovative thinking and political will.

Regarding the Parkway, it's a clusterfk and there is no intuitive way for pedestrians to go from the Art Museum steps to Logan Circle/Love Park. Maybe about once or twice a year I find myself on the Parkway and always wind up in spots where the sidewalk just ends and I have to dodge speeding cars to get to where I'm going. It's not never a pleasant experience at all.

[MikeNigh]

imo turn the whole thing into a kind of central park, get towers lined up around it and a subway line along the side of it.

[Williard Mouse]

Looking at the renderings of a capped VSE, it presents the possibility of walking or biking from river to river without crossing side streets ( if pedestrian bridges are part of the plan). With a connection to the Ben Franklin Bridge, it would be possible to walk/bike from Camden to the Schuylkill.

[Londonee]

The other, notable thing that image shows are buildings lining the Parkway's outer edge like Champs Elysees. I agree, when talking about the failings of the Parkway, the anti-pedestrian traffic nightmare that it is should be discussed...however, the fact that there's little commercial point to a mile long stretch of incredibly expensive to maintain park land beyond a few museums might actually be more important.

[Mappy]

Obligatory thoughts rendering

Originally Posted by Williard Mouse

Looking at the renderings of a capped VSE, it presents the possibility of walking or biking from river to river without crossing side streets ( if pedestrian bridges are part of the plan). With a connection to the Ben Franklin Bridge, it would be possible to walk/bike from Camden to the Schuylkill.

I've been piecing together ideas that would make a Delaware trail to Schuylkill Trail possible without and road crossings (except maybe on the parkway).
Key to this is capping 676, which has been discussed before. But the Parkway design from the Broad Street Review Article was an inspiration for the Logan Square and Parkway designs.

Anyway. Here is a link to the Album of images:
http://imgur.com/a/pkCMt#0

And an overview of the idea:



You'll notice I removed the diagonal parkway roads from Logan to JFK Plaza as well, and made that all green space within the grid system. Not married to this, but think it would be a possibility.

[Mappy]

Originally Posted by McBane

My solution for the Vine Street Expressway is to rezone both sides of Vine Street to make it easy for developers to build here. Remove height limits (realistically, no one is going to pitch 1000 footers here), FAR requirements, parking ratios, and all the other crap that developers fight over in their variance requests. Also, eliminate the million and one committees that review a typical project so as to expedite the process.

Let's face it, Vine Street is not attractive, it's not historic, and it's never going to be a quiet, pleasant-to-walk-on street, so why bother trying? If developers want to line the street with towers on parking podiums with no retail or other street level pleasantries, it would still be 1000x better than what's there now. And with the expressway right there, autocentric highrises would be attractive to many buyers who want to be in the city, but also need easy access to the burbs (this is the lure of buyers to Waterfront Square).

Rather then spending money to cap the expressway, this solution would cost the city nothing. Just takes innovative thinking and political will.

You might be right... But I think a pleasant greenway over a capped highway is possible.
And that those economic/zoning incentives you talk about should be a bargaining chip for developers to investment in the caps and greenspace in partnership with the City, DOT, and William Penn Foundation type organizations.

Something like this...http://imgur.com/HJUlX0i ... would have just street level traffic visible, wide sidewalks, dense development focused toward a large greenspace, with a continuous trail connecting the Delaware to the Parkway and Schuylkill. I would treat the caps like city-block-sized planters (designed by Longwood gardens? Philly Flower show competition?) with trees ect., and an series of elevated 20' wide trail bridges going over and through them.

[Williard Mouse]

Mappy's river to river green trail would be truly transformative for the city, improving on the city's already famed walkability. The resulting green space and noise reduction would provide impetus for McBane's idea of residential towers along Vine St. A Win-Win situation.

[Mappy]

Originally Posted by Williard Mouse

Mappy's river to river green trail would be truly transformative for the city, improving on the city's already famed walkability. The resulting green space and noise reduction would provide impetus for McBane's idea of residential towers along Vine St. A Win-Win situation.

thanks... the other benefit I was going for was creating an alternative to the City Line trench park that the Rail Park folks are aiming at. The idea being to keep the City Line available for heavy or light rail (maybe BRT to start?). This could serve from 8th & market to the zoo, possibly to 30th st Station, or even the Navy Yard via the 25th st viaduct.

[summersm343]

WuXi AppTec Inc. is expanding at the Navy Yard into a third building.

WuXi AppTec Inc. is expanding into a third building at the Philadelphia Navy Yard and will occupy a 145,000-square-foot structure that Liberty Property Trust is scheduled to break ground on tomorrow.

http://www.bizjournals.com/philadelphia/...tyto-construct-new-building-at-navy.html

[McBane]

Not quite. The premise behind my idea is that Vine Street sucks, so the city will loosen zoning and regulatory requirements to lure developers to build here, despite the fact that it's a busy highway-like street. The result would be profitable towers without the amenities that the city and community advocates demand like retail, hidden parking, public art, etc. or the prolonged hassle with the various review committees.

On the other hand, if the city/state/feds were to invest billions in capping the expressway, then developers would flock to Vine Street on their own accord. And b/c of the public investment, the city would (rightly) take the opposite approach - they would enforce strict zoning rules so that any new development complements the city's vision for grand new Vine Street.

[McBane]

Last week, I posted an article that included a list of projects in Philadelphia that were seeking state funding. One of them was a proposal to turn the former Inquirer building into a hotel. Additional details have been published today:

http://www.philly.com/philly/business/20...project_at_former_Inquirer_building.html

[josef]

Originally Posted by summersm343

WuXi AppTec Inc. is expanding at the Navy Yard into a third building.

http://www.bizjournals.com/philadelphia/...tyto-construct-new-building-at-navy.html

Great to hear! But.. my god... this building is horrific.

[iheartphilly]

Originally Posted by josef

Great to hear! But.. my god... this building is horrific.

Yeah, none of the new buildings are going to win any design awards.