The Independent (180 Kingsway) | 64.7m | 19fl | Completed

[whatnext]

Originally Posted by SFUVancouver

I would say that cranky people opposed this, which broadens the spectrum beyond hipsters, some of whom were certainly opposed, to include a diverse array of homeowners and renters that are opposed to change in the neighbourhood. I'm supportive of this project and wish I were in a position to buy at this point. I expect that many, if not most, of the initial buyers will be investors and there will be more than a few assignments ready to pick up shortly before it's completed, so in a few years' time when I should be ready to buy I will be able to look seriously at this place. I bet that more than a few people are going to stretch to buy before the transit referendum, correctly expecting the property to appreciate in value if and when the SkyTrain subway extension becomes more likely. With that said, I've heard enough horror stories about deficiencies and headaches of new buildings to want to steer clear until six months to a year have passed.

Only if you define 'cranky' as those who don't bow down and scrape at every developer proposal that comes along. I know it comes as shock to some to discover that some people actually value the character and fabric of their neighbourhood over the next bright shiny real estate bauble placed in front of them.

[SFUVancouver]

Originally Posted by whatnext

Only if you define 'cranky' as those who don't bow down and scrape at every developer proposal that comes along. I know it comes as shock to some to discover that some people actually value the character and fabric of their neighbourhood over the next bright shiny real estate bauble placed in front of them.

No, I wouldn't use that definition at all. I would use cranky because there was virtually nothing that could have been proposed for that site that would not have elicited opposition and vitriol from some, especially those who are opposed to development on spec and/or are frustrated that the market is not delivering housing that is affordable or attractive to them. Those are valid grievances but it's also unrealistic to expect that a brand new building will be inexpensive and broadly affordable. In time, the building will move to a lower rung of the housing quality/cost ladder and it will be proportionately more affordable than today, plus the long-term employment opportunities created by the building, and the positive impact that more people will have on the neighbourhood, are not easily dismissed benefits. But it's a big tower that's going to be taller than its neighbours and that's where it ends for a lot of people. I get that.

There are still people, myself included, who do not see the neighbourhood's character and fabric being in peril because of this tower. I'm not sure what defines a bight shiny real estate bauble, but I know that the site is located at the intersection of three major arterials, it is within easy walking distance of an existing SkyTrain station at Cambie and Broadway, and it is a part of the second largest employment centre in the province, after downtown Vancouver. There is also a high likelihood that there will be a station built next door when the Broadway line is extended, and the VSB-owned Kingsway Mall site will be developed in the relatively near future with multiple mid-rise/towers, and the urban design intent for Kingsway is taller buildings at major intersections all the way to Burnaby, with mid-rise towers and more cubic low/mid-rise streetwall buildings in between the major nodes. I support this and the Kingsway and Broadway site is a part of this. Main Street is not being changed one iota; it remains a low/mid-rise street with an urban design and building architecture that is sympathetic to existing heritage buildings and their material pallet. Main Street and Kingsway meet and this meeting and juxtaposition of differing urban design and architecture is interesting to me and I believe it will make for a more interesting city.

[whatnext]

Originally Posted by SFUVancouver

No, I wouldn't use that definition at all. I would use cranky because there was virtually nothing that could have been proposed for that site that would not have elicited opposition and vitriol from some, especially those who are opposed to development on spec and/or are frustrated that the market is not delivering housing that is affordable or attractive to them. Those are valid grievances but it's also unrealistic to expect that a brand new building will be inexpensive and broadly affordable. In time, the building will move to a lower rung of the housing quality/cost ladder and it will be proportionately more affordable than today, plus the long-term employment opportunities created by the building, and the positive impact that more people will have on the neighbourhood, are not easily dismissed benefits. But it's a big tower that's going to be taller than its neighbours and that's where it ends for a lot of people. I get that.

There are still people, myself included, who do not see the neighbourhood's character and fabric being in peril because of this tower. I'm not sure what defines a bight shiny real estate bauble, but I know that the site is located at the intersection of three major arterials, it is within easy walking distance of an existing SkyTrain station at Cambie and Broadway, and it is a part of the second largest employment centre in the province, after downtown Vancouver. There is also a high likelihood that there will be a station built next door when the Broadway line is extended, and the VSB-owned Kingsway Mall site will be developed in the relatively near future with multiple mid-rise/towers, and the urban design intent for Kingsway is taller buildings at major intersections all the way to Burnaby, with mid-rise towers and more cubic mid-rise streetwall buildings in between the major nodes. I support this and the Kingsway and Broadway site is a part of this. Main Street is not being changed one iota; it remains a mid-rise street with an urban design and building architecture that is sympathetic to existing heritage buildings and their material pallet. Main Street and Kingsway meet and this meeting and juxtaposition of differing urban design and architecture is interesting to me and will make for a more interesting city.

There was virtually nobody who opposed increasing density at Main & Broadway. What the neighbourhood asked is that the form be sympathetic to the Lee Building and other heritage apartments in the area. Instead they got a warmed over version of the architectural dreck served up at King Ed & Kingsway and unsurprisingly rubberstamped by Gregor & his developer-funded Vision parrots.

And you're trying to include the Rize project in the Broadway City-Hall station catchment?! It's a kilometre away.

[Homeowner]

Originally Posted by Vanelevatorman

630 sqft is a one bedroom in my opinion, not a two bedroom. But with today's real estate pricing I guess they are trying to keep costs down and affordable for the average Vancouverite (read non overseas buyer).

This is the new norm,where one bedrooms are around 500 sq ft and 2 bedrooms start in the 600 sq ft. I never thought I would see 500 sq ft condos in Metrotown , Brentwood & Coquitlam but it's happening.

[Delirium]

Originally Posted by whatnext

There was virtually nobody who opposed increasing density at Main & Broadway. What the neighbourhood asked is that the form be sympathetic to the Lee Building and other heritage apartments in the area. Instead they got a warmed over version of the architectural dreck served up at King Ed & Kingsway and unsurprisingly rubberstamped by Gregor & his developer-funded Vision parrots.

And you're trying to include the Rize project in the Broadway City-Hall station catchment?! It's a kilometre away.

i really don't see how this is 'unsympathetic' to the neighbourhood. but yeah, big bad city hall is at it again.

http://www.vancouversun.com/cms/binary/6213188.jpg

[SFUVancouver]

Originally Posted by whatnext

There was virtually nobody who opposed increasing density at Main & Broadway. What the neighbourhood asked is that the form be sympathetic to the Lee Building and other heritage apartments in the area. Instead they got a warmed over version of the architectural dreck served up at King Ed & Kingsway and unsurprisingly rubberstamped by Gregor & his developer-funded Vision parrots.

And you're trying to include the Rize project in the Broadway City-Hall station catchment?! It's a kilometre away.

I don't consider a kilometre that long of a walk, perhaps 10-12 minutes. I walk that kind of distance all the time and think little of it. I walked at least that daily to and from my bus to school when I lived downtown and I walked just about the same distance to and from SkyTrain when I lived on Commercial Drive. In Toronto, I'd walk a kilometre in a blink of an eye to avoid the wait for a streetcar and I live in Richmond now and I walk a touch more than that, about 1.1 kilometres, from my place to SkyTrain when I head downtown.

The conventional planning radius for a bus stop is 400 metres, and for rapid transit it's usually 800 metres, and often a full kilometre, sometimes even more. So while the walk would be at the upper limit for conventional walking distance, I acknowledge that, it's not as if it's an insurmountable obstacle, a transit iditarod. However, when the Millennium Line is extended west, there will be a station in the immediate vicinity of the Rize, so the low/mid-rise building that was being agitated for on the site just seems like a waste for such a prominent site.

Anyway, let's agree to disagree. I hope that it turns out well and will be the first to acknowledge if it turns out to be a turd as a result of value engineering or poor workmanship.

Edit: nice rendering Delirium. It's going to change that part of the neighbourhood, but hardly ruin it. And a 7 year process is hardly 'rubber stamping'.

[dreambrother808]

[GMasterAres]

Originally Posted by jlousa

We are aware of some projects that have been listes as approved, if we notice it we correct them. There is too much grey area hence the standards of proposed/uc and completed. No arguement from me that a project that is approved is vastly different then one just proposed but approved doesn't mean it's going ahead either, it's just a step along the way. And then what do we have a approved for rezoning? How about approved development permit? How about financing approved? See where we're going, way too much grey. Anyways this is best left to another thread but its' a good discussion

I agree with the mods that approved shouldn't be a thing. There are towers approved in the suburbs (Surrey/Burnaby/etc.) that have been "approved" for years. I can name 2 off the top of my head in Surrey Central alone that have been approved by council for 5 years and have had their DPs renewed multiple times yet construction is nowhere in sight.

Approved is meaningless to me. Same reason why U/C on these forums was clarified to mean first concrete poured not the starting of a giant hole. The classifications as Jlousa points out make perfect sense when you think about them.

Will be good to see this project move forward. I'm a huge anti-heritage advocate, well advocate is probably a stretch, but I think looking back with fawning eyes at the past is more often a waste of time and space. Most old buildings, even those classified as heritage, if proposed today would be laughed at it protested against. Many old houses in Vancouver should be condemmed. And last I checked, we used to ride around on horse-drawn buggies and people died of cholera but I don't see anyone pushing to go back to those days. Why are old buildings held in such high esteem. Humanity isn't hurt by tearing down even a 1000 year old building imho but that's just me.

Went to visit Chichen Itza a number of years ago because it is one of the wonders of the modern world (modern lol) and if you've never visited you're in for a real surprise. It's a pile of rock surrounded by hundreds of Mexicans selling you 1 Mayan dollar crap. Nice to visit but I don't think civilization would fall to dust if it vanished one day. And that's Chichen Itza not the "Lee Building" in Vancouver.

I think 21 storeys is modest in Vancouver and the renders look good.

[axestone]

The Rize Alliance Twitter feed is blowing up big time about the big crowds and long lineups waiting to get into their sales centre for today's launch. Looks like the lineup has been stretching way down the block all day.

https://twitter.com/RizeAlliance/media

Oh well. I guess that's just another sign of the coming of the apocalypse and the death of Mount Pleasant those RAMP zealots prophesized.

All pics from the Rize Alliance Twitter feed:











And waddya know? I think there might even be a hipster or two in the crowd!

[Pinion]

How did you get full sized pics from twitter? It won't even let me save the small versions.

I don't know why anyone would want to live there besides that someone at some point decided it was cool. I lived on Main before it was cool and hated it.

[mukmuk64]

Mount Pleasant has been one of the most vibrant and interesting neighbourhoods in Vancouver for a while now so the level of interest for such a major, widely advertised project doesn't surprise me.

I'm kind of a hater of this building and even I spoke against it at the public meeting. I think the design is pretty incoherent with a lot of problems and it really needed a fresh rethink. Oh well.

Don't put me in with that RAMP crowd though!

As an aside I used to think that the empty car lot at Main and Broadway was being reserved for a Skytrain station, but then when I saw the Rize design with the garage entry on Watson in front of what could be a Skytrain station square, which would be really weird. That made me think that maybe the Skytrain would be sited at the Kingsgate mall site instead? Did we ever find out anything about this?

[axestone]

Originally Posted by Pinion

How did you get full sized pics from twitter? It won't even let me save the small versions.

i just dragged them onto my desktop and they were the size that I posted. Didn't even think about it, it just happened like it happened.

[Klazu]

The penthouse is said to cost over 1 million dollars.

[SFUVancouver]

I won't be surprised to hear that they've sold out the building over the weekend. It isn't a huge multi-tower project, so there aren't all that many units and the developer has priced them to be attainable by the broad spectrum of people who are in a position to buy in this city.

[Homeowner]

Originally Posted by SFUVancouver

I won't be surprised to hear that they've sold out the building over the weekend. It isn't a huge multi-tower project, so there aren't all that many units and the developer has priced them to be attainable by the broad spectrum of people who are in a position to buy in this city.

I think they are only doing previews to build up the hype before they begin selling. But I bet the insiders got their hands on the best /cheapest units there before it goes public.

[Liberator]

Rumour is all the 1 bedroom units were sold now. Can anyone confirm this?

[marmo]

Originally Posted by Liberator

Rumour is all the 1 bedroom units were sold now. Can anyone confirm this?

All the Plan C1s, (which, imo, is the best plan for the 1BRs) were taken up early. I think some of the less favourable plans might be up for grabs.

Apparently a lot of the best units were scooped up during the friends/family sale.

[WarrenC12]

Just taking a look at the website..

Plan D, 2BR starting at 626sf?

This is the problem with floorplans and pre-sales. Sure they make the floorplan look reasonable, but it's impossible at that size.

[NewWester]

Originally Posted by WarrenC12

Just taking a look at the website..

Plan D, 2BR starting at 626sf?

This is the problem with floorplans and pre-sales. Sure they make the floorplan look reasonable, but it's impossible at that size.

Welcome to the future!

[logan5]

Is there not even a solid wall between the bedrooms in this plan? Just the backing of the closet to separate the bedrooms. The living room only has room for 2 people on an undersized couch. Lose the dining room table so you can have a chair in the living room area. Not very efficient floorplans for the most part.


It's a little claustrophobic having a bedroom without any windows. This plan is alright as long as you get rid of the closet wall in the bedroom.