Stadiums and Arenas of Canada

[osmo]

Originally Posted by JHikka

The issue is that there's no area for growth; people in Quebec already like hockey and already watch the NHL. Would Nordiques 2.0 sell tickets? Yes. Would people buy their merchandise? Yes. But from a TV standpoint (which trumps all) it pales in comparison to the possible coups in Las Vegas/Seattle/etc. Even if they're only possible, the upside would be much larger if it worked. I think this weekend's show in Columbus proves that the NHL is willing to go to an untapped market (Ohio) and do relatively-to-very well. It's my opinion that Seattle would do just as well as Columbus if not better.

As long as the Canadian dollar stays below 90 there's no chance Nords2 happens. Back in the 90s when the dollar was low Calgary, Edmonton, and Ottawa all nearly folded. Had it not been for the NHL (And Bettman, who gets zero credit for this) sticking with these franchises and finding owners they surely would have all relocated.

Ohio was far from untapped. Columbus was the fastest growing city in the state and has a history and tangible infrastructure from Ohio State. The Buckeyes have done good in Hockey in their history and it was never a new of foreign thing for the residents in that metro. The ECHL did well in Columbus also and the team would always sell out games. Very much a good hockey market low key.

NHL is still a gate revenue league also. It isn't the NFL which can turn a profit even if nobody shows up to the games. Teams like Jacksonville which have not sold out games in years still make good money just from TV pay-outs alone. Basketball has entered that territory, the other two sports in Hockey and Baseball still get large percentages of revenues from the gate.

[davidivivid]

Ok, I'll take the bait:

Originally Posted by Oilkountry

Don't freak out on me Quebec. This isn't the way I want things. this is just how I truly feel about the situation. I really don't believe the NHL Nor players want to be in Quebec. Winnipeg is finding this with Evander Kane. Eric lindros killed Quebec in my opinion Shane Doan wouldn't even sign with the yotes without knowing for sure he wasn't gonna end up in QC.

Joe Sakic, Mats Sundin, Peter Forsberg, Peter Stastny, etc. All these great players have said time and time again how much they've enjoyed playing in Quebec City and some of them, like Stastny, even settled here. It seems to me that you have absolutely no clue what is going through the minds of these players and you are sustituting you're own prejudices in place of the players true motives.


Let's continue:

Originally Posted by Oilkountry

The difference is Winnipeg has changed vastly in 20 years and Quebec hasn't as much.

[...]

Winnipeg has defined itself as a city on the rise. Nowhere in Canada has seen an economic growth like Winnipeg outside of Alberta. look at the changes in Winnipeg in like 5 years. The Airport,Convention centre,IGF, the museum ect theirs gonna be cranes in Winnipeg's skyline for the foreseeable future including new skyscrapers.

This statement easily proves that you have no clue what you are talking about. Winnipeg has indeed changed a lot but to claim that Quebec hasn't is a complete fallacy. It also is easily verifiable.

In the last 20 years, Quebec City's economy completely turned around. Its unemployment rate dropped from around 12% in 1995 to around 5% these days, consistently putting Quebec amongst the country's best cities. In the last 5 years, Quebec City's

- average GDP increase
- average weekly earnings increase
- labour force increase
- median family household income increase

were all higher than the national average and higher than Winnipeg's though the Peg is doing very well too.

Quebec's new airport and multi-level parking: built in 2008 and 2014
Quebec's airport new international terminal: construction 2015
Quebec's Beaux-Arts museum new pavilion: in construction
Quebec's new 2nd tallest: built in 2014
Quebec's convention center: $40M expansion built in 2014
Quebec's exhibition center: $40M expansion built in 2011
Quebec's new arena: construction to end in 2015
Quebec's new 2,5km, $100M award winning park: built in 2008
Quebec's new $2B mega-hospital: construction to start in 2017
Etc, etc, etc

Quebec consistently appears on good economic reports and articles, beautiful cities lists, good living standards lists, etc. I live here and very much participate in the cities cultural offerings but perhaps I should take your words for it that there is nothing to do and nothing changes here...

Originally Posted by Oilkountry

On the NHL side it comes down to Television Revenues, cooperate sponsorship and the fact that again like Edmonton,Winnipeg,Calgary and Buffalo the city in itself is cold and it — and theirs nothing there that can make up for that.

You should travel more...

And finally this crown jewel:

Originally Posted by Oilkountry

Yeah okay. Fact is everyone on this forum could sit here and say Quebec is the best province in this entire country and Quebec city is gonna get 5 teams and the new arena is the best in the world and the world should be more like Quebec and that wouldn't be pro Quebec enough for you. Because if you're not talking like you're pro Quebec then you're obviously anti Quebec. Such a classic typical response. I'm not kissing an entire provinces — just because you guys get offended if I don't. Their's 9 other provinces in this beautiful country and believe it or not Quebec doesn't hang over all of them. Yes Winnipeg is moving forward at a rate unseen in Canada of cities not directly affected by Oil. End of story Quebec probably isn't going to see a team unless 1 of today's 30 fail. Sorry I'm not sorry. It's not the way I want it but I do strongly (like basically every other non Quebecer here) believe that's the way it is. Now please stop treating me like I'm part of some Anti Quebec terrorist group because it's getting pretty annoying to have to kiss a provinces @$$ in fear of being bombarded by it's citizens It's pathetic how butthurt you guys get if someone doesn't prop Quebec on a pedestal

How dare you play the victim? You've bashed Quebec City without knowing anything about it and tried to seem reasonable with the 'my family is from there' line. You've posted uninformed opinions and got called for it. Grow up.

Forumers like you are the reason why I do not enjoy posting on this forum as much as I used to.


P.S. I don't even like the new arena that much and actually prefer Edmonton's. I'm also very much aware of the problems Quebec faces in its bid to win an NHL team. A troll, however, I am not.

[harls]

Originally Posted by blueandgoldguy

The MTS Centre will be getting some major upgrades over the summer! This includes:

-278 Premium Loge seats hung below the current first row of the 300 level
-high definition centre hung scoreboard 2.5 times larger than the old one.
-new 360 degree power ring
-new state-of-the-art control room to allow the production of high def images throughout MTS Centre

Details here:

http://jets.nhl.com/v2/ext/files/mtscent...ements.pdf?camefrom=EMCL_508712_22625798

I think that's awesome news, thanks for posting it here.

One thing that irks me about Winnipeg's arena is that during the intermissions you see everybody walking across the ice to go to their dressing rooms... it sort of enforces the fact that it's a small place that doesn't have the same 'grandeur' as the other rinks in the league.. but they sure make up for it in atmosphere.

(actually, there is another rink that has the same setup as Winnipeg where everyone has to walk across the ice during intermission, but I can't remember where it is...)

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by Oilkountry

I remember when I said that Vancouver and Toronto were Canada's more flashy Cities like LA. And Montreal was more of a historical city known for its beauty Like Boston or Philly..... If I would have said Montreal was a Flashy city and wasn't known for its History and Beauty..... I remember someone on this forum warning me about it. I know I'm about to get dumped on by every member of this forum and I honestly couldn't care less.

Oh yes, the infamous episode where Montreal was deemed an un-— city compared to Toronto, Vancouver and even Calgary, and simply a larger version of Edmonton!

And then you kind of tried to save face and said... "guys, guys, guys! I only meant for skylines, skylines, skylines!"

[eemy]

I'm not really seeing how you got dumped on. You asserted that Winnipeg was ascendant and leaving Quebec in the dust and people responded, rather placidly I might add, that you might not be too informed on what's happening in Quebec. For the most part, people just ignored what you said and the general consensus seemed to be in agreement that the NHL won't see a team in Quebec in the near future.

[Bluenote]

Originally Posted by Oilkountry

Figured this would be happening on the off season. I wish this could have added a few more seats. 500 or so but hey what can you do. Love the jumbo tron though. 2.5x bigger when they say will be able to control hd images thoughout the MTS centre i wonder if they mean they same thing that the bell centre has when they light the ice on fire kind of thing?
http://jets.nhl.com/club/news.htm?id=750307&navid=DL|WPG|home

There will be more. The plan is a $40 million Reno by 2020. We have after this phase is done. Eaten half that. So $20 million more in renos to come.

[Boom Shakalaka]

Originally Posted by Oilkountry

I know I'm about to get dumped on by every member of this forum and I honestly couldn't care less.

You make some reasonable points. And you're just giving your opinion. Some people are just too frail and too uptight. The irony is that you will indeed now face a hateful onslought of hipocrisy. Makes you go hmmmmm.

[le calmar]

He did have a few good points and some others were debatable but this is what this forum is for, and most people are more than happy to have an argument with someone. But his way to express his ideas was borderline arrogant. I'm sorry but saying a city — is not just expressing an opinion. And then the moment he encouters resistance to his ideas he starts losing control. People don't like to deal with people like this on here.

[king10]

Wonder what's going to happen to Winnipegs old scoreboard. And come to think of it the ACC's old scoreboard when they replace it in 2016.

The ACC scoreboard would sure look nice at Copps and could probably be purchased at a large discount. My guess is they'll probably move it to Ricoh though.

[Horus]

Interesting story in the Globe today with references to the Edmonton Oilers, Hamilton Bulldogs, Erie Otters as well as the prospects for both Copps Coliseum and Place Bell.

Read here:
http://www.theglobeandmail.com/sports/ho...ide-of-sports-ownership/article22646466/

Of special interest (to me anyway) was this.

In yet another twist, the Oilers’ ambitions may also have been to keep the (ERIE) Otters away from (Hamilton Bulldog's owner Michael) Andlauer who, ironically, is now in position to be the saviour of the OHL team. He is one of at least two parties negotiating with (Erie Otters owner Sherry)Bassin to buy the Otters, and it’s apparent the Bulldogs will move to Laval no later than 2017. Andlauer’s lease at Copps, since renamed FirstOntario Centre, calls for him to provide a hockey team as a tenant, without specifying it must be an AHL team.

(bolding by me)

Essentially, the article outlines the elaborate scheme to use Copps as leverage in the Oilers arena negotiations, and to use the Erie Otters as a relocation candidate to Hamilton.

[GreaterMontréal]

Originally Posted by Horus

Interesting story in the Globe today with references to the Edmonton Oilers, Hamilton Bulldogs, Erie Otters as well as the prospects for both Copps Coliseum and Place Bell.

Read here:
http://www.theglobeandmail.com/sports/ho...ide-of-sports-ownership/article22646466/

Of special interest (to me anyway) was this.


(bolding by me)

Essentially, the article outlines the elaborate scheme to use Copps as leverage in the Oilers arena negotiations, and to use the Erie Otters as a relocation candidate to Hamilton.

That would be nice, everybody will take the Orange Line and go to Place Bell to see a game. Station Montmorency is extremely well situated.

[king10]

Originally Posted by Horus

Interesting story in the Globe today with references to the Edmonton Oilers, Hamilton Bulldogs, Erie Otters as well as the prospects for both Copps Coliseum and Place Bell.

Read here:
http://www.theglobeandmail.com/sports/ho...ide-of-sports-ownership/article22646466/

Of special interest (to me anyway) was this.


(bolding by me)

Essentially, the article outlines the elaborate scheme to use Copps as leverage in the Oilers arena negotiations, and to use the Erie Otters as a relocation candidate to Hamilton.

Hamiltonian's have known that the MTL farm team will be in MTL by 2017, doesn't come as a surprise. The spec has reported on this numerous times. Andaluar the Bulldogs owner will still retain the rights to the Bulldogs name as well as the lease to Copps. He says he is keeping the Bulldogs hockey team in Hamilton (whether it be an AHL or OHL team we don't know yet).

Sure Copps is 30 years old and not up to date by NHL standards but the new operators Global Spectrum have been putting in decent coin to keep it serviceable. Their connections in the concert industry(live nation) have also brought some big name acts who have sold over 15 000 tickets. Its a viable arena with a rent much cheaper than the ACC which makes it attractive to performers.

The bulldogs have been around for almost 20 years so they've built somewhat of a brand in Hamilton. Makes sense to keep the name.

Also what i got from that article is katz seems like scum.

[Barnes]

Originally Posted by king10

Hamiltonian's have known that the MTL farm team will be in MTL by 2017, doesn't come as a surprise. The spec has reported on this numerous times. Andaluar the Bulldogs owner will still retain the rights to the Bulldogs name as well as the lease to Copps. He says he is keeping the Bulldogs hockey team in Hamilton (whether it be an AHL or OHL team we don't know yet).

Sure Copps is 30 years old and not up to date by NHL standards but the new operators Global Spectrum have been putting in decent coin to keep it serviceable. Their connections in the concert industry(live nation) have also brought some big name acts who have sold over 15 000 tickets. Its a viable arena with a rent much cheaper than the ACC which makes it attractive to performers.

The bulldogs have been around for almost 20 years so they've built somewhat of a brand in Hamilton. Makes sense to keep the name.

Also what i got from that article is katz seems like scum.

From top to bottom, the Oilers are one of the worst professional sports franchises in North America. As a Flames fan it's fun to talk about their no-goodness on the ice but ownership and the management team are a text book case study of business bafoonery.

[Mrs Sauga]

Originally Posted by jeremy_haak

I'm not really seeing how you got dumped on. You asserted that Winnipeg was ascendant and leaving Quebec in the dust and people responded, rather placidly I might add, that you might not be too informed on what's happening in Quebec. For the most part, people just ignored what you said and the general consensus seemed to be in agreement that the NHL won't see a team in Quebec in the near future.

Exactly. I had to go re read the last few pages because I thought I missed something lol. That was a very weird post.

[JHikka]

Originally Posted by osmo

Ohio was far from untapped. Columbus was the fastest growing city in the state and has a history and tangible infrastructure from Ohio State. The Buckeyes have done good in Hockey in their history and it was never a new of foreign thing for the residents in that metro. The ECHL did well in Columbus also and the team would always sell out games. Very much a good hockey market low key.

When I say untapped I mean untapped on the professional sports level. The ECHL, although great, cannot always be used as a barometer for interest in hockey. The running joke when the Thrashers were in Atlanta was that the Gwinnett Gladiators (up the road by some 50km) would get higher attendances to some games. Since 2003-2004 (their first season) Gwinnett have never had an average-season attendance of less than 5,100.

As well, The Ohio State was the reason the Blue Jackets nearly bit the dust a few seasons ago. Something about The Ohio State owning the arena and charging them an exorbitant fee for usage of Nationwide, or something along those lines. University tried to push them out, effectively.

NHL is still a gate revenue league also. It isn't the NFL which can turn a profit even if nobody shows up to the games. Teams like Jacksonville which have not sold out games in years still make good money just from TV pay-outs alone. Basketball has entered that territory, the other two sports in Hockey and Baseball still get large percentages of revenues from the gate.

But the NHL's push since day 1 with Bettman has been to become a TV-league. That's why the NHL expanded to Florida, Phoenix, San Jose, Dallas, Colorado...they wanted a national TV deal. Although it isn't as lucrative as the other Major 3 it's a hell of a lot better than what they had twenty years ago, and it's exactly why the NHL will expand to Vegas and Seattle in the future. Quebec and other Canadiana expansion aren't of that much importance because the TV deal(s) in Canada are already lucrative and the teams (more or less) sell out all of their games anyway. I'm fairly certain Ottawa is the only team that doesn't sell out consistently and that's mainly due to their arena not being in Ottawa at all.

[eemy]

I think it would be great if Hamilton had an OHL team so that it was in the same league as Kitchener and Guelph and London and so on.

[MacLac]

Originally Posted by Barnes

From top to bottom, the Oilers are one of the worst professional sports franchises in North America. As a Flames fan it's fun to talk about their no-goodness on the ice but ownership and the management team are a text book case study of business bafoonery.

Define "worst." As in "one of the worst records in the NHL currently?" I agree on that 100%. Or "worst franchise in the history of the NHL? based on cups?" Disagree on that one - how many cups has Calgary won again? Refresh my memory. Using the word "worst" shows your immaturity.....maybe Kindergarten let out too early today....

[Barnes]

Originally Posted by MacLac

Define "worst." As in "one of the worst records in the NHL currently?" I agree on that 100%. Or "worst franchise in the history of the NHL? based on cups?" Disagree on that one - how many cups has Calgary won again? Refresh my memory. Using the word "worst" shows your immaturity.....maybe Kindergarten let out too early today....

Ha. Classic Oiler fan. Just remind them about how many cups we one and maybe they'll forget the latest decade of futility.

Don't you have a draft lottery party to plan?

[king10]

Originally Posted by MacLac

Define "worst." As in "one of the worst records in the NHL currently?" I agree on that 100%. Or "worst franchise in the history of the NHL? based on cups?" Disagree on that one - how many cups has Calgary won again? Refresh my memory. Using the word "worst" shows your immaturity.....maybe Kindergarten let out too early today....

Obviously not based on cups. Based on current management and the last 10 years its just been a huge cluterf*ck up there. No need to get defensive. It has nothing to do with who has more cups lol. It has to do with management right now, which does not include the management or owners for that matter who were in place in the 80s.

[JHikka]

Originally Posted by Barnes

Ha. Classic Oiler fan. Just remind them about how many cups we one and maybe they'll forget the latest decade of futility.

Obvious trolling attempt aside the Oilers have just as many Stanley Cup Finals appearances as the Flames do in that last decade.