Calgary Public Transit II

[DizzyEdge]

Good to know, that photo from from Vancouver's.
I'd also like to see some sort of top bar (maybe segmented metal tubing with vinyl sheathing) extend right across the middle part.

[joe498]

North Central LRT open house information panels now available online:

http://www.calgarytransit.com/pdf/NCLRT_Calgary_Transit_Open_House_Boards-Oct-10.pdf

[*Stardust*]

Originally Posted by joe498

North Central LRT open house information panels now available online:

http://www.calgarytransit.com/pdf/NCLRT_Calgary_Transit_Open_House_Boards-Oct-10.pdf

It's great that Underground is receiving strong community support. That's the way it should be

[speedog]

Having it above ground from 24th to 64th Avenue will be interesting (not much room on Centre Street) - I certainly hope that it doesn't turn into a 36th Street NE scenario or worse, by worse I mean that there'll be less traffic lanes available than there are now and I just don't see the people in those nearby communities utilizing the NCLRT in their daily lives other than commuting downtown. Certainly Edmonton Trail and 4th Street NW will see increased traffic volumes and right now the CoC has reduced 4th Street NW's capacity in sections south of McKnight. It will be interesting to see how traffic patterns change when the NCLRT comes to be.

[fusili]

I think at grade from 24th to 64th is not a bad idea. Underground at McKnight makes sense. But I really don't see Centre Street from 24th to 64th as a major corridor. It really doesn't have that high of a traffic volume. If it saves us several hundred million, it is worth it.

[suburbia]

Originally Posted by *Stardust*

It's great that Underground is receiving strong community support. That's the way it should be

I think it is receiving a lot of support from those who don't understand cost/benefit IE those who would vote in Rob Ford if they had the chance.

[MalcolmTucker]

Originally Posted by fusili

I think at grade from 24th to 64th is not a bad idea. Underground at McKnight makes sense. But I really don't see Centre Street from 24th to 64th as a major corridor. It really doesn't have that high of a traffic volume. If it saves us several hundred million, it is worth it.

And makes an extra station to really drive all day transit use a whole heck of a lot cheaper.

[Socguy]

Took a quick peek at the proposal for Macleod, seems to me like a much needed project. Quite frankly, I don't see how this project would have much of an impact on car traffic at all but it would make a world of difference for everyone else.

Pincott was on CBC radio the other day talking about this project and he made the point that the city is trying to accommodate many more people within the city as opposed to on the outskirts and Macleod trail is one of the areas that the city envisions absorbing those people through extensive redevelopment. Viewed though this lens this project makes a ton of sense.

I think most of the opposition to this plan comes from sticker shock. When the number of $100 million come up, even over 25 years, everyone does a double take.

[lineman]

I like how a 50m deep station comes off as not doable. Hampstead tube station was built over 100 years ago and is 58m deep. Sometimes I think this city lacks vision and likes to take the path of least financial resistance just to have something there.

Being a resident of East Crescent Heights, my fear is that afternoon rush cut through traffic will significantly increase through 1st and 2nd street. There are many young families putting their roots down here and such traffic I'd assume would drive them away. Additionally, I wonder how emergency services feels about this plan. For example, how could they effectively respond to a LRT situation when there are single narrow lanes in each direction clogged with traffic? Then again, tunnel does have its challenges too in an emergency.

[You Need A Thneed]

I can't see centre Street bridge being used for the LRT. It's going to need its own ROW, at least across the river.

[fusili]

Originally Posted by lineman

I like how a 50m deep station comes off as not doable. Hampstead tube station was built over 100 years ago and is 58m deep. Sometimes I think this city lacks vision and likes to take the path of least financial resistance just to have something there.

Being a resident of East Crescent Heights, my fear is that afternoon rush cut through traffic will significantly increase through 1st and 2nd street. There are many young families putting their roots down here and such traffic I'd assume would drive them away. Additionally, I wonder how emergency services feels about this plan. For example, how could they effectively respond to a LRT situation when there are single narrow lanes in each direction clogged with traffic? Then again, tunnel does have its challenges too in an emergency.

They can drive on the LRT tracks. Free and clear of all traffic.

Dedicated transit lanes actually can increase response times, as emergency vehicles can use them.

[lineman]

Thanks for clearing that up. For some reason I was under the impression that the LRT would be barricade separated and on ballast.

[Fuzz]

Man, that sounds horrible. The traffic around centre where the train makes its slow turn is going to be a mess. Have they looked at building another bridge for the LRT? The logic here is baffling.

I also wonder about maintenance issues. They seam to tear up the downtown segment every 10 years to redo it. Without any extra space, will they just close the bridge when they need to do this? What happens when The bridge needs another full overhaul? Shut down the LRT for a year or 2? Have they considered the traffic impacts through Kensington, as this will be an alternate route for many when Centre becomes hell to drive?

I think they are externalizing a LOT of the costs here. Sure, we save a bunch now, but its going to have drastic and expensive impacts later. Typical Calgary planning....

[Full Mountain]

Originally Posted by lineman

Thanks for clearing that up. For some reason I was under the impression that the LRT would be barricade separated and on ballast.

Probably have some sort of barricade, but will look more like a street car (on it's own dedicated lane) than the rest of our LRT system

[Full Mountain]

Originally Posted by Fuzz

Man, that sounds horrible. The traffic around centre where the train makes its slow turn is going to be a mess. Have they looked at building another bridge for the LRT? The logic here is baffling.

I also wonder about maintenance issues. They seam to tear up the downtown segment every 10 years to redo it. Without any extra space, will they just close the bridge when they need to do this? What happens when The bridge needs another full overhaul? Shut down the LRT for a year or 2? Have they considered the traffic impacts through Kensington, as this will be an alternate route for many when Centre becomes hell to drive?

I think they are externalizing a LOT of the costs here. Sure, we save a bunch now, but its going to have drastic and expensive impacts later. Typical Calgary planning....

The LRT on Centre will exponentially increase the capacity of the corridor to move people, remember cars don't equal people.

[H.E.Pennypacker]

Originally Posted by 5seconds

So the NCLRT tunnel under the bow sounds like it is (currently) finished. $700 million more than the centre street bridge option. No station on 2nd street in Eau Claire as well. Of course things can change over the next 20 years...

http://www.calgaryherald.com/news/calgar...rthbound+CTrain+line/10292956/story.html

Edit: the option is apparently not totally off the table when it goes to council later this year

Disappointing .. Adding an underground station with the Eau Claire Market Redevelopment would be huge

[CorporateWhore]

So basically no train station in Eau Claire (one of the most popular areas of downtown), a single lane of car/bus traffic in/out of the busiest corridor from the north, and on a bridge that may or may not be able to handle the load structurally anyway.

Yeah, that sounds like some fantastic long-term planning! Especially 30-40 years from now when we are twice the size and they'll have to rejigger the whole thing and spend double the price to fix it. $700 million is something that an economy like Calgary/Alberta should be able to easily bring together in the 2 decade time-rame that this thing takes to get going.

Just once Calgary, can we try doing it the right way the first time? Please?

[The Chemist]

Skimping out for the sake of saving money in the short term never works out in the long term - just ask residents of Shanghai who live along Line 6 and 8, where they decided to build the platforms too short and the tunnels too narrow, so the lines were over-capacity the day they opened with no easy way to fix them.

[MalcolmTucker]

The project team's job is to present options. I would guess this isn't decided until council pulls the trigger. The easy solution? Ask for each bid to have multiple options for the crossing, and don't constrain the options by saying where we want and don't want stations. Maybe a proponent will pull a rabbit out of their hat.

[mykalberta]

What is the Citys 30-50 year plan for Centre Street?

I assume its to re-develop to 10-12 story type developments all along. And if thats the case the (not enough use to justify) "subway station in Crescent Heights" argument would seem to be extremely short sighted. The only justification I cansee is that people there would walk or bike to downtown but that would seem to forget about the 6 months of the year when both options are extremely difficult.

Also, since when is 600M these days alot of money. From a cost perspective would that result in ending the line at or around Beddington Blvd for a few years? I am wondering what the cost of a station in Crescent Heights would be.

I am very interested to see Nenshi's take on the issue. Im hoping he can use his cache to look at the different tunneling options. I am wondering why a bridge over the Bow wasnt looked at or was dismissed and why it seems a bridge over the bow was the only option looked at. From an asthetics PoV I understand it wouldnt be the prettiest option entering Eau Claire but it would seem better than a tram up Centre Street.