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  #5861  
Old Posted Sep 20, 2014, 12:15 AM
alki alki is offline
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Originally Posted by brudy View Post
I'm not sure I have faith in architects to design a park. Look at how awful Spring St is. It's cute and looks great from the air, but the odd grass shape mound is too small for the demand/population/park/multiple uses and has ignited wars among residents, the huge open paved area on the middle is wasted. It's all too overthought and overwrought.
To me, Spring St is a pocket park. You need to keep things simple........trees, benches, chess boards etc. A place for people to hang out on a break or during lunch. I don't understand the need to glamorize.
     
     
  #5862  
Old Posted Sep 20, 2014, 12:19 AM
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Originally Posted by Flavius Josephus View Post
40% of Metropolis Phase I condos reserved, per press release: http://www.virtualpressoffice.com/public...sableHistory=Y&menuName=News&sId=&sInfo=
I was going to mention.......there are major condo projects going up in lots of American cities now. The market seems to be recovering and pre sales seem to be doing really well. At this point it could be Metropolis is exaggerating their sales since its not even out of the ground yet but I bet it does well in the end.
     
     
  #5863  
Old Posted Sep 20, 2014, 12:24 AM
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Originally Posted by The Illusive Man View Post
Isn't CA and LA in a major drought though? It rarely rains here. Is it really wise to have a park that size full of grass and trees? Grass is a major water waster and as soon as you stop watering it gets nasty and dried out. A park in LA will have to have a mixture of concrete and green. It's our reality and it's really not that big of a deal.

You folks need to relax and stop getting emotional over everything.
With trees, it takes them roughly three years for their roots to get down to the ground water table; then they don't need much watering. As for the grasses, there are ones that are decorative that also are drought tolerant. There also are some attractive succulents that you can use to beautify the landscaping. They are drought tolerant as well.

Its an urban square.........doesn't have to have lawns. If you want a lawn, you can go to Grand Park.
     
     
  #5864  
Old Posted Sep 20, 2014, 12:43 AM
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Originally Posted by DistrictDirt View Post
Landscape architects are certainly not exempt from the egomania and overthinking that goes on with traditional architects working on high profile projects. For every hit like the High Line there's a an overwrought, overthought, turkey of a park or plaza that isn't getting used because the architect prioritized edginess over basic functionality. There's pressure to innovate, reinvent the wheel and make a name for yourself just as their is with regular architecture projects. The preliminary renderings and video that Gensler produced are not instilling any confidence.

[/I]
All true...........and then there are those fees.
     
     
  #5865  
Old Posted Sep 20, 2014, 12:54 AM
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Originally Posted by alki View Post
With trees, it takes them roughly three years for their roots to get down to the ground water table; then they don't need much watering. As for the grasses, there are ones that are decorative that also are drought tolerant. There also are some attractive succulents that you can use to beautify the landscaping. They are drought tolerant as well.

Its an urban square.........doesn't have to have lawns. If you want a lawn, you can go to Grand Park.
What do you mean by decorative? Do you mean something like field turf or something similar to it?

It's a pretty big sized park. It would still require water I'm sure. Plus with freeway cap parks, la state historic park, wetlands and the current parks. That's quite a bit of water.
     
     
  #5866  
Old Posted Sep 20, 2014, 1:56 AM
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Originally Posted by The Illusive Man View Post
What do you mean by decorative? Do you mean something like field turf or something similar to it?

It's a pretty big sized park. It would still require water I'm sure. Plus with freeway cap parks, la state historic park, wetlands and the current parks. That's quite a bit of water.
'Drought' tolerant plants once established can survive for months without water. LA has a Mediterranean/semi desert climate. Plants that are native to S. CA have adapted to its climatic conditions......5 months of rain and 7 mos of no rain. Those are the kinds of plants LA might consider planting in public areas. There would be minimal watering requirements.

Here are some landscaping examples:

https://www.google.com/search?q=drought+...dwcVK3qPOK6igKYwYDwAw&sqi=2&ved=0CDUQsAQ
     
     
  #5867  
Old Posted Sep 20, 2014, 10:05 PM
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  #5868  
Old Posted Sep 21, 2014, 4:59 PM
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Originally Posted by LA/OCman View Post
What about Mia Lehrer? She has done some pretty sweet projects, especially Vista Hermosa Park, the Rand Corporation and Natural History Museum garden. She seems to "get it" as far as taste goes….oh and the Annenberg Beach House in Santa Monica.
It's amazing how big the gap is between a terrible park (Grand, Pershing, Spring St) and an excellent park (Vista Hermosa). The former is misguided, unimpressive, ugly, or simply doesn't make sense. Meanwhile VHP is striking and almost gives you a rejuvenating feeling simply being there because of the landscaping. Admittedly, Pershing should resemble more of a city square or open lawn rather than something more wildernessy like VHP, but I still think it's the model park that we have. I would at least hope that all of the future LA River parks follow the basic template that VHP provides. If it weren't so out of the way and in an area that most people wouldn't frequent for any other reason, VHP would be packed constantly.
     
     
  #5869  
Old Posted Sep 21, 2014, 5:42 PM
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Originally Posted by StethJeff View Post
It's amazing how big the gap is between a terrible park (Grand, Pershing, Spring St) and an excellent park (Vista Hermosa). The former is misguided, unimpressive, ugly, or simply doesn't make sense. Meanwhile VHP is striking and almost gives you a rejuvenating feeling simply being there because of the landscaping. Admittedly, Pershing should resemble more of a city square or open lawn rather than something more wildernessy like VHP, but I still think it's the model park that we have. I would at least hope that all of the future LA River parks follow the basic template that VHP provides. If it weren't so out of the way and in an area that most people wouldn't frequent for any other reason, VHP would be packed constantly.
I know this is probably speaking heresy but what is wrong with LA looking at cities that do build successful urban parks........of which there are a number of examples...........and just copying them? After all, some things don't have to be cutting edge.
     
     
  #5870  
Old Posted Sep 21, 2014, 6:41 PM
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Originally Posted by alki View Post
I know this is probably speaking heresy but what is wrong with LA looking at cities that do build successful urban parks........of which there are a number of examples...........and just copying them? After all, some things don't have to be cutting edge.
Seriously. It seems like LA is always trying to reinvent the wheel here. Other cities have done things successfully.

I know we've beat this topic before, but I like Grand Park. They made the most of the budget and what they had to work with and around. It's a nice space and works well for smaller scale events. It's only downside is that it's kind of far from most of the residential and they didn't do much with the street crossings (and those parking garage ramps), but I'm up there all the time and enjoy it.

Vista is on a different level for sure, but their situation was a lot different. It's geography and surroundings are also quite different, and it does feel like being outside the city when you're there.
     
     
  #5871  
Old Posted Sep 22, 2014, 2:49 AM
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Seriously. It seems like LA is always trying to reinvent the wheel here. Other cities have done things successfully.

I know we've beat this topic before, but I like Grand Park. They made the most of the budget and what they had to work with and around. It's a nice space and works well for smaller scale events. It's only downside is that it's kind of far from most of the residential and they didn't do much with the street crossings (and those parking garage ramps), but I'm up there all the time and enjoy it.

Vista is on a different level for sure, but their situation was a lot different. It's geography and surroundings are also quite different, and it does feel like being outside the city when you're there.
Grand Park is fine........its the park you go to when you want to lay out and listen to music and just chill. Urban Squares and pocket parks are for when you a have just a few minutes to spare and just want to sit and check out people. I mentioned earlier about liking less hard surfaced parks but when I thought of squares I liked like Bryant Square........really they had mostly hard surfaces but also had lot of shade trees which I think is important in a hot climate like LA and makes up for a lack of greenery.

So I did a search for the best and worst squares/plazas in the world and guess who made the 10 worst list.........yup:

http://www.citylab.com/design/2011/10/best-and-worst-worlds-public-plazas-and-squares/360/#slide1
     
     
  #5872  
Old Posted Sep 22, 2014, 3:02 AM
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Speaking of Grand Park. Weren't some of the typical LA hater doomsayers saying the recent festival there was going to be a disaster or something. It turned out to be quite the success. Let me know how you like your crow.
     
     
  #5873  
Old Posted Sep 22, 2014, 3:42 AM
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So I did a search for the best and worst squares/plazas in the world and guess who made the 10 worst list.........yup:
interesting that some of the plazas or squares judged the best in the world have little to no landscaping....few to no trees....but are beautiful nonetheless.

I think the biggest problem with pershing sq isn't so much just the design of the area itself but the gaps in the surrounding land, esp the hideous large parking lot at the corner of 5th & Olive.

Union sq in SF isn't any softer or greener in design than PS, & it may have even less landscaping than PS, but it's deemed ok or a success mainly cuz the surrounding area still is vibrant & full of ppl who are on the up & up. iow, the drifters or homeless who've been a mainstay of PS for decades never overtook Union Sq the way they did to PS....& dtla in general.

Nice stores, esp big dept stores, have remained a major part of the area around Union sq, while swapmeets & old shuttered dept stores have been a big part of the story of the area just on the other side of Pershing Sq.

But I would like to see PS improved....with the parking ramps in particular made less dominant on the west & east sides. But I think filling in the land across 5th St with major new devlpt....that hopefully will bring thousands more ppl to the hood 24/7....will have a bigger impact on pershing Sq than just redesigning the park itself.

sometimes an overemphasis on good or poor design.....or a park having too much hardscape, even though the plazas judged a success in Europe are mostly stone or terracotta surfaces, instead of enough trees & grass....makes ppl forget that the human element is the ultimate determinant in the success or failure of a park, plaza or proj.

Critics complain about new devlpt like the fake tuscan apt bldgs of GH palmer or the stucco junk of TCA, but if such projs are successful with the public....& if more ppl end up living & spending time in dtla due to such projs....that will help offset the badness of the architecture.

btw, the stucco pile that is the jia apt bldg in chinatown has around 30 apts yet to be rented up, so it's coming close to being fully booked. The avant apt bldg on fig in south pk also appears to be filling up at a fairly good rate. The TCA designed stucco & multi color extravaganza that is the ava apt bldg in little tokyo seems to have booked up so quickly that I'm not sure if the owner is purposefully omitting units still available for rent in order to make the proj appear more popular than it really is.

Ppl make the difference....they're the glue that holds everything together....such as what is happening at a grand central mkt that is increasingly reflecting a dtla of today instead of the bad old past.


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^ that's offset by the inability of figaro restaurant on broadway to survive, or a good example of how ppl...or a lack of enough of them...really do make a difference. meanwhile, the swapmeets all around figaro's location somehow manage to stay in business, which is a good example of how the presence of another group of ppl, such as owners of swapmeets, their customers, & slumlords....can also make a difference, but not in a good way.
     
     
  #5874  
Old Posted Sep 22, 2014, 8:15 PM
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Originally Posted by The Illusive Man View Post
Speaking of Grand Park. Weren't some of the typical LA hater doomsayers saying the recent festival there was going to be a disaster or something. It turned out to be quite the success. Let me know how you like your crow.
LOL ! I agree. After the festival was over and the festival paid for the clean up expenses, I like how the park looked unchanged a day or two later and no tress or shrubbery were damaged. After it was proven to be a success and life went on. all you hear on here were *crickets crickets crickets*
     
     
  #5875  
Old Posted Sep 22, 2014, 11:24 PM
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interesting that some of the plazas or squares judged the best in the world have little to no landscaping....few to no trees....but are beautiful nonetheless.

I think the biggest problem with pershing sq isn't so much just the design of the area itself but the gaps in the surrounding land, esp the hideous large parking lot at the corner of 5th & Olive.

Union sq in SF isn't any softer or greener in design than PS, & it may have even less landscaping than PS, but it's deemed ok or a success mainly cuz the surrounding area still is vibrant & full of ppl who are on the up & up. iow, the drifters or homeless who've been a mainstay of PS for decades never overtook Union Sq the way they did to PS....& dtla in general.

Nice stores, esp big dept stores, have remained a major part of the area around Union sq, while swapmeets & old shuttered dept stores have been a big part of the story of the area just on the other side of Pershing Sq.

But I would like to see PS improved....with the parking ramps in particular made less dominant on the west & east sides. But I think filling in the land across 5th St with major new devlpt....that hopefully will bring thousands more ppl to the hood 24/7....will have a bigger impact on pershing Sq than just redesigning the park itself.

sometimes an overemphasis on good or poor design.....or a park having too much hardscape, even though the plazas judged a success in Europe are mostly stone or terracotta surfaces, instead of enough trees & grass....makes ppl forget that the human element is the ultimate determinant in the success or failure of a park, plaza or proj.
I agree........it helps if the surrounding area around a square is vibrant but frankly, I don't think the area around Pershing Square is all that bad anymore. The one bad block is the one with the parking lot and the Jewelry Mart east of the Square. The other three blocks are in decent shape or getting upgraded.

As for a square having trees, I guess that may be a personal preference. I would rather sit under a tree than in the sun.
     
     
  #5876  
Old Posted Sep 23, 2014, 3:06 AM
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Not a new project, but the BoA tower is 89.5% leased: http://www.sec.gov/Archives/edgar/data/1618713/000153949714001113/n368_ts-x1.htm (data on some other DTLA commercial RE in there too).

Also in recent SEC filings, some info on redevelopment plans at Wyvernwood Apartments in Boyle Heights (http://www.sec.gov/Archives/edgar/data/1618150/000153949714001090/n361_fwp-x3.htm).
     
     
  #5877  
Old Posted Sep 23, 2014, 3:21 AM
Flavius Josephus Flavius Josephus is offline
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Meanwhile, 8th+Hope is over 25% leased as of a week ago. http://www.marketwired.com/press-release...ments-over-25-percent-leased-1947265.htm
     
     
  #5878  
Old Posted Sep 23, 2014, 4:04 AM
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Originally Posted by Flavius Josephus View Post
Meanwhile, 8th+Hope is over 25% leased as of a week ago. http://www.marketwired.com/press-release...ments-over-25-percent-leased-1947265.htm

That's a good lease up.........it pays to be first at times.

As for the B of A Plaza...........I didn't see on the prospectus where it said it was 89% leased. If that figure is correct, it is excellent news.
     
     
  #5879  
Old Posted Sep 23, 2014, 4:17 AM
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Pershing Square this afternoon:


And a couple weeks ago:
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  #5880  
Old Posted Sep 23, 2014, 6:30 AM
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Pershing Square this afternoon:


And a couple weeks ago:
Its like someone got everything cleaned up for a party and no one showed.

And once again, your photos are ridiculously focused and stunning. You have a knack for bringing out the best in LA.
     
     
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