The Great Canadian Skyline Thread! - Page 31

Calgarian · #**601** Posted **Sep 4, 2014, 3:56 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by MolsonExport

^LOL!! Completely obsessed...with taking Toronto down a peg or two!

I lived in Vancouver for years. Nearby Seattle was very often depicted in photographs with Mount Rainier looming large over the city, but that did not reflect reality. Maybe you are the one obsessed with Calgary, since you automatically concluded I was referring to it.

Yeah you have to be high up in Seattle to even see Raineer with the naked eye, it's really cool when you do see it though.

kool maudit · #**602** Posted **Sep 4, 2014, 3:56 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by flipv

Err what? I'm always taken aback how Belgrade feels even larger than Toronto (nauseating density will do that). It's a city of 2M - why compare to Richmond and Milwaukee?

Comparing Ottawa to Belgrade is like comparing Toronto to St John's.

you might be right. belgrade does feel very large, but it doesn't really cover all that much ground. it's hard to compare cities with such radically different density profiles, i mean, belgrade feels far more intensely urban than ottawa (or any canadian city) but i was chalking that up to density on the peninsula.

maybe ottawa is more like geneva or something, with belgrade being sort of vancouver-sized.

Acajack · #**603** Posted **Sep 4, 2014, 4:18 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by kool maudit

the question is whether the presence of these extended metros allows one to reasonably say things like "ottawa has two million people."

because while ottawa may be the largest city in a conurbation whose combines population approaches two million, ottawa itself doesn't seem like a "city of two million", just as amsterdam doesn't seem like a "city of seven million people."

.

Doing that would be doing what the Americans do. Which makes their populations figures for many of their cities and metros so wonky.

I don't advocate doing that here in Canada.

Acajack · #**604** Posted **Sep 4, 2014, 4:25 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by kool maudit

informally, amsterdam feels like a city of about two million people insofar as adding up amsterdam plus the undeniably amsterdam-dependent parts of the randstad might give you something like that. ottawa feels like a city of about 800,000 people, similar to richmond, milwaukee or maybe belgrade.

800,000 people to me is Winnipeg and Hamilton. Ottawa feels bigger than them for sure.

Ottawa in size feels more like Oslo or Helsinki, although the latter two feel more mature, urbane and sophisticated.

In the North American context, Ottawa feels like New Orleans, Oklahoma City, Buffalo, Milwaukee. Maybe Nashville, Austin and Indianapolis as well. Size-wise only, as all of these cities (except maybe Austin for example) have a very different feel than Ottawa does. Ottawa also feels somewhat similar in size to Portland, Oregon, although according to the official US stats Portland is much larger than Ottawa.

MolsonExport · #**605** Posted **Sep 4, 2014, 4:43 PM**

Feelings of Bigness:

Drummonville>Toronto>Montreal>Vancouver>Calgary>Edmonton/Ottawa>Winnipeg/Quebec City>Hamilton>London/Halifax>KW (yes< I know it is larger than London, but being spread over multiple nodes...)>Victoria/Saskatoon/Regina>St. John's/Moncton

flipv · #**606** Posted **Sep 4, 2014, 4:43 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by kool maudit

you might be right. belgrade does feel very large, but it doesn't really cover all that much ground. it's hard to compare cities with such radically different density profiles, i mean, belgrade feels far more intensely urban than ottawa (or any canadian city) but i was chalking that up to density on the peninsula.

maybe ottawa is more like geneva or something, with belgrade being sort of vancouver-sized.

That's exactly it. The physical size of Belgrade is tiny. I can walk from one end of the urbanized city to the other in about 2-3h.

However, 2M people pack this tiny area.

kwoldtimer · #**607** Posted **Sep 4, 2014, 4:48 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by MolsonExport

Feelings of Bigness:

Drummonville>Toronto>Montreal>Vancouver>Calgary>Edmonton/Ottawa>Winnipeg/Quebec City>Hamilton>London/Halifax>KW (yes< I know it is larger than London, but being spread over multiple nodes...)>Victoria/Saskatoon/Regina>St. John's/Moncton

It's years since I've been to either, but wouldn't you put Victoria and Regina before K-W on a "bigness feel" scale?

MolsonExport · #**608** Posted **Sep 4, 2014, 4:50 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by kwoldtimer

It's years since I've been to either, but wouldn't you put Victoria and Regina before K-W on a "bigness feel" scale?

maybe I would. from memory I would, but KW is growing up quite a bit and I didn't want to get bombarded with population stats.

I work/live in Marseille for a month of the year each year. The density--due to geography, culture and the age of the city--is staggering.

xl.com

logan5 · #**609** Posted **Sep 4, 2014, 4:58 PM**

Re Chicago/Toronto - Chicago has an urban population of 8.3 million over an area of 2122 sq miles. Toronto metro population of 5.6 million over an area of 2751 sq miles.

Wooster · #**610** Posted **Sep 4, 2014, 5:10 PM**

^^ Wow!

mistercorporate · #**611** Posted **Sep 4, 2014, 5:18 PM**

That's the most spectacular aerial of Marseilles I've ever seen, thank you for that.

caltrane74 · #**612** Posted **Sep 4, 2014, 5:35 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by logan5

Re Chicago/Toronto - Chicago has an urban population of 8.3 million over an area of 2122 sq miles. Toronto metro population of 5.6 million over an area of 2751 sq miles.

The City of Toronto is larger than the City of Chicago.

Anyways, we're talking about skylines.

Beedok · #**613** Posted **Sep 4, 2014, 5:50 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Acajack

800,000 people to me is Winnipeg and Hamilton. Ottawa feels bigger than them for sure.

I wasn't in Winnipeg for very long, but what I saw of it's downtown had a lot more presence than Ottawa's. Meanwhile Hamilton has a small downtown, but the inner city of Hamilton feels about as impressive as Ottawa's.

softee · #**614** Posted **Sep 4, 2014, 5:53 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by logan5

Re Chicago/Toronto - Chicago has an urban population of 8.3 million over an area of 2122 sq miles. Toronto metro population of 5.6 million over an area of 2751 sq miles.

No, that's not the "urban population" and land area of either. If we're talking urbanized areas, then as of earlier this year Chicago had 9,238,000 people in 6,856 Km2, (2,647 sq. mi) and Toronto had 6,345,000 people in 2,287 Km2 (883 sq. mi.). http://www.demographia.com/db-worldua.pdf

These figures don't include all the undeveloped land in the greater Chi/Tor areas, only the continuously built-up, urbanized portion of both as long as it's at or above the threshold of what is considered to be "urban".

Acajack · #**615** Posted **Sep 4, 2014, 6:05 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Beedok

I wasn't in Winnipeg for very long, but what I saw of it's downtown had a lot more presence than Ottawa's..

We'll definitely have to agree to disagree on that one! What measure(s) are you talking about here anyway?

Beedok · #**616** Posted **Sep 4, 2014, 6:16 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Acajack

We'll definitely have to agree to disagree on that one! What measure(s) are you talking about here anyway?

The impression I had riding through the downtown. In Ottawa's downtown there's a fair amount of squat office towers crammed to the street for a few blocks. Riding through Winnipegs there were a few public squares, towers of similar or great height spread around a large area, and various urban buildings in between. I didn't spend very long there, but what I saw felt very big city.

esquire · #**617** Posted **Sep 4, 2014, 6:16 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Acajack

We'll definitely have to agree to disagree on that one! What measure(s) are you talking about here anyway?

To me, Ottawa's downtown is a bit like Edmonton's vis a vis Winnipeg's: slightly larger-feeling and more prosperous, but by a matter of degrees as opposed to a place that exists on an entirely different level like Toronto or Chicago. Ottawa's downtown does a good job of blending seamlessly with surrounding neighbhourhoods, which is Winnipeg's weakness... essentially, two sides of our downtown border on large areas plagued by poverty, crime and social dysfunction on a scale that I have never seen in Ottawa (and the presence of which can be felt in the core of the Winnipeg CBD). That obviously scares investment away from those areas.

As to skyline though, it's a matter of taste. Ottawa's skyline is quite grandiose and impressive with its stately collection of landmark buildings, while I'd argue that Winnipeg has a better straight-up collection of skyscrapers.

Acajack · #**618** Posted **Sep 4, 2014, 6:42 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by esquire

To me, Ottawa's downtown is a bit like Edmonton's vis a vis Winnipeg's: slightly larger-feeling and more prosperous, but by a matter of degrees as opposed to a place that exists on an entirely different level like Toronto or Chicago. Ottawa's downtown does a good job of blending seamlessly with surrounding neighbhourhoods, which is Winnipeg's weakness... essentially, two sides of our downtown border on large areas plagued by poverty, crime and social dysfunction on a scale that I have never seen in Ottawa (and the presence of which can be felt in the core of the Winnipeg CBD). That obviously scares investment away from those areas.

As to skyline though, it's a matter of taste. Ottawa's skyline is quite grandiose and impressive with its stately collection of landmark buildings, while I'd argue that Winnipeg has a better straight-up collection of skyscrapers.

Ottawa is not a great skyscraper city, and skyscrapers are probably the only aspect of downtown where Winnipeg tops Ottawa. There isn't a single skyscraper in Ottawa that's as impressive as the former Canwest building (new name?) on Portage.

Rico Rommheim · #**619** Posted **Sep 4, 2014, 7:03 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Klazu

Beautiful Vancity

Just when you thought downtown couldn't get any more crowded... I remember visiting Vancouver when the 1st wall centre was built. It didn't even stand out, and barely made a mark. Then I remember visiting again in 2012, the Shangri-la's presence changed everything. It changed my perception of a flat, unappealing skyline to a visually stimulating skyline. The pinnacle effect was glorious when seen from second narrows bridge.

I said it before and I'll say it again, downtown vancouver is very nice looking. It's almost sexual really, whenever I see it, I desperately want to be in it. That's weird, right?

HomeInMyShoes · #**620** Posted **Sep 4, 2014, 7:04 PM**

@Acajack: I don't know. Place de Ville is a great building in the International Style, but it doesn't feel skyscraperish because of the height restriction which has created the table-top skyline Ottawa suffers from. Place Export Canada is another very fine skyscraper within Ottawa, but overall these buildings are lost in the still sea of even height.

Winnipeg was the first city I lived in with a big city feel. A feeling of lots of unexplored places. Ottawa was even more so that way. Despite the sleepy government-town vibe at times it felt big. It had no height, but it was brawny. The buildings pushed to the sidewalks and closed you in on the streets downtown.

To me it is a bit disappointing that Ottawa is going to break the height barrier outside of the main core and it will be residential that dominates the height in Ottawa for probably decades to come.