YVR Airport & Sea Island Developments Discussion - Page 306

Hourglass · #**6101** Posted **Jul 18, 2014, 11:58 AM**

interesting article on Air Canada, including a section about YVR. The market share breakdown on Asian routes for YYZ and YVR is particularly interesting.

Air Canada Moves to Attract More 6th Freedom Traffic

trofirhen · #**6102** Posted **Jul 18, 2014, 12:54 PM**

Thank you, Hourglass. Really interesting. Also worth note is this link taken from the same article.

http://centreforaviation.com/analysis/de...-to-siphon-traffic-from-vancouver-142676

Johnny Aussie · #**6103** Posted **Jul 18, 2014, 11:23 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by trofirhen

Thank you, Hourglass. Really interesting. Also worth note is this link taken from the same article.

http://centreforaviation.com/analysis/de...-to-siphon-traffic-from-vancouver-142676

And yes, this article was posted, linked and discussed ad nauseum back in December 2013.... shall we start that over again?

trofirhen · #**6104** Posted **Jul 18, 2014, 11:33 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Johnny Aussie

And yes, this article was posted, linked and discussed ad nauseum back in December 2013.... shall we start that over again?

Mea Culpa

Johnny Aussie · #**6105** Posted **Jul 18, 2014, 11:38 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by trofirhen

Mea Culpa

It's all good! Just didn't want to have to go and cut and paste the days of discussion on that one again!

Hourglass · #**6106** Posted **Jul 19, 2014, 3:12 AM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Johnny Aussie

It's all good! Just didn't want to have to go and cut and paste the days of discussion on that one again!

But it was such an enjoyable discussion, lol

Jury's still out on the long term effects of DL and SEA, methinks. However, was checking out airfares from HKG to YVR via SEA, and introductory fares aside, the price wasn't that much cheaper than AC or CX.

It seems to me that YVR's core strength is the range of international carriers serving it. Interesting that Air Canada lags in market share for all Asian routes except Narita.

Black Box · #**6107** Posted **Jul 19, 2014, 7:31 AM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hot Rod

No chance of the big ugly in Seattle as SEA isn't designed to land/facilitate A380 unlike YVR which is. Emirates is locked with 777 for the SEA route.

Regarding the potential conspiracy against YVR, how then can you explain the federal govt blocking Qatar from a YVR launch or the original Emirates application to YVR long before they settled with SEA. or the india requests that were shot down. You can't tell me there's not a preference for Ottawa to favour YYZ at the expense of YVR, even for Asia not to mention South America (which would have biz traffic out of YVR) in addition to the route being closer for China. ...

Purely YYZ protectionism by the AC monopoly facilitated by the Federal govt.

A bit ignorant to how things work in Canada. Has Christy Clark or Victoria conducted inquiries in the past or do they have plans in the future to do so in regards to Ottawa's presumed preference to connect the downtown of Canada with the rest of the world via air?

Is Toronto's gain Seattle's gain in some cases? Or is Seattle gaining because it's Seattle?

Do you have links for us to peer into?

It's a curious and interesting time for Sea-Tac. Delta is mounting an offense against Alaska, etc.

Cage · #**6108** Posted **Jul 20, 2014, 4:09 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hot Rod

Regarding the potential conspiracy against YVR, how then can you explain the federal govt blocking Qatar from a YVR launch or the original Emirates application to YVR long before they settled with SEA. or the india requests that were shot down. You can't tell me there's not a preference for Ottawa to favour YYZ at the expense of YVR, even for Asia not to mention South America (which would have biz traffic out of YVR) in addition to the route being closer for China. ...

Purely YYZ protectionism by the AC monopoly facilitated by the Federal govt.

With regard to EK, the final proposal from the UAE govt was all or nothing. Canada would have to accept the following, no capacity restriction, ability for EK to fly from any canadian city, no frequency restriction, 6th freedom rights to USA. The reality was all that EK was interested in utilizing was daily 380 from YYZ. Their partners in crime, EY wanted the same. The remainder of the access rights demands were for future consideration in case EK or EY got into trouble with another country, eg USA or Mexico.

In QR instance, they wanted access rights package for number if cities, no frequency or seat restrictions, etc. QR was also deciding on whether to join star or oneworld. They over played their handh with the star application, as is common for QR and their chief executive. Current example if QR and AAB overplaying their hand, rejection of the A380 delivery. The reality is that QR does not need the A380, but they are committed to delivery.

cyeg66 · #**6109** Posted **Jul 20, 2014, 8:15 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cage

Current example if QR and AAB overplaying their hand, rejection of the A380 delivery. The reality is that QR does not need the A380, but they are committed to delivery.

Well, some regions of the world are sometimes all about showiness and grandeur, keeping up with the Joneses', as it were. Dare I say, the ME is particularly susceptible to this.

trofirhen · #**6110** Posted **Jul 20, 2014, 10:08 PM**

Referring to what you seem to be stating, and how a lot of this is about "prestige," I've come to ralize this "prestige" thing applies to airports, too.
If your airport doesn't have one or more of the ME3, you don't rank up there withe the Big League.
Maybe some YVR followers, myself included, have insidiously fallen prey to this idea. Does YVR NEED the Gulf Destinations? Not if major connected markets, like India are served better. Even now, one can apparently go YVR to DEL with a chane of plane in Beijing, and this works out about 1000 miles shorter than by DBX, to boot. The Iranian market in Vancouver, and other middle east points might be doable out of Munich, (though never-to-happen IST would be all we'd ever need for that. Too bad YYZ has tht route locked down; Turkish is Star_Alliance, and everthing)
What IMO does define an airport as significant, is the number of key destinations it has, related to it's economy and needs.
Size, it appars, isn't everything.

Example cited: Phoenix is a booming sunbelt city we all know with a metro population of around 4m and
an impressive busy airport, Sky Harbour. It handles its % of passengers, has a fantastic US and Mexican network, yet only one route to Europe, LHR.

I think I read that on the YVR homepage, not sure (wish I'd bookmarked the page)... that 2 recommended YVR routes were Lima and São Paolo.
This relates more directly to mining business interest in the Andes, and more financial services in SP, which seems aspiring to be the combined London and New York Of South America.

On the opposite side of the world, in China, it s shorter from HK to SP via EK through DBX. But places in China (and East Asia of course) west of there, are closer to Lima, than by either DBX or YYZ, although sources say EK is planning Lma and Santiago Chile from Dubai, but I doubt it would go for anything north or west than Shanghai. Even HK to Lima it is shorter over the Pacific.

This would apprently warrant the Lima route (itself being a modern gateway airport to South America) and a route to important SP, only a couple of hundred miles longer than by YYZ. We're still in the runnin, is what I'm sayin'

All very much future dreamin' for sure.
Thank you for your time.

SpongeG · #**6111** Posted **Jul 20, 2014, 10:56 PM**

does malaysian airlines fly to vancouver? i am lazy and don't wanna look

Johnny Aussie · #**6112** Posted **Jul 20, 2014, 11:13 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by SpongeG

does malaysian airlines fly to vancouver? i am lazy and don't wanna look

Not since the 20th century.

Hourglass · #**6113** Posted **Jul 21, 2014, 2:36 AM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Johnny Aussie

Not since the 20th century.

Yup. Used to fly 2-3x per week via Taipei

SpongeG · #**6114** Posted **Jul 21, 2014, 6:34 AM**

ah just wondered cause it sounds like they may be over soon and I guess we would lose an airline at the airport but they are lost already

trofirhen · #**6115** Posted **Jul 21, 2014, 4:01 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by SpongeG

ah just wondered cause it sounds like they may be over soon and I guess we would lose an airline at the airport but they are lost already

We already lost Singapore Airlines, and before that, Qantas (which
briefly had a YVR-PPT (tahiti) nonstop on its way to Sydney, but was normally routed,
I believe through SFO and HNL.
Times change.

Cage · #**6116** Posted **Jul 21, 2014, 8:40 PM**

Heard that AC6 (HND-YYZ) had to make a tech stop in YVR for crew issues.

First time 788 arrived in YVR. Did anyone get pics.

madog222 · #**6117** Posted **Jul 21, 2014, 9:34 PM**

^
First Air Canada 788 to land at YVR.

AirCanada_801_C-GHPQ_a by billlmf, on Flickr

AirCanada_801_C-GHPQ_f by billlmf, on Flickr

more here

Hot Rod · #**6118** Posted **Jul 22, 2014, 10:06 AM**

Don't JAL, China Southern, and ANA use 788 into YVR already?

Edit -op, reread and saw 'the first AIR CANADA 788 ....' -

Johnny Aussie · #**6119** Posted **Jul 22, 2014, 10:09 AM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hot Rod

Don't JAL, China Southern, and ANA use 788 into YVR already?

JAL and China Southern yes.
ANA no -763s

But yeah this tech stop seemed to get more coverage. Still happy to see YVR taking a better interest in events and news worthy items.

I suppose because we already know 2 daily AC 788s are confirmed already starting with the winter scheds and more to follow....

trofirhen · #**6120** Posted **Jul 22, 2014, 11:21 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Johnny Aussie

JAL and China Southern yes.
ANA no -763s

But yeah this tech stop seemed to get more coverage. Still happy to see YVR taking a better interest in events and news worthy items.

I suppose because we already know 2 daily AC 788s are confirmed already starting with the winter scheds and more to follow....

AC talked about starting 787 service to Brisbane. Fact, or just smoke and mirrors?