The Great Canadian Transit Thread

[milomilo]

Originally Posted by ssiguy

Curious, what's next for Calgary?

I know Tuscany will soon open but are there any more LRT expansions underway or about to start? Also what about the CTrain tunnel?

No new LRT for a long time, bar short extensions. According to this, we'll see Green line LRT before the city hits 1.5m and the 8th Ave subway some time after that. I don't see this happening - the plan is to first build a transit way which won't be ready for another few years, and then build LRT after that, maybe 10 years later? We'll probably be well past 2 mil by then.

It's also madness to be extending the LRT to suburbs 20km away before building the subway, the trains are already close to capacity in the morning peak by the time they get to Anderson.

[1overcosc]

Amazing news from one of Canada's smaller transit systems!

Kingston Transit announced that ridership has increased by 14% (Q1 2014 relative to Q1 2013) since the BRT-lite 'Kingston Express' service was launched last year! Monthly pass sales in particular have increased by 25%, which is a positive sign as it shows that the new riders are dedicated ones.

So the city is moving forward with expanding the Kingston Express, adding two new routes in May 2015. Here's what our "RT" map is going to look like soon! Its going to get more and more BRT-like over time as the city plans to start rolling out transit priority measures at intersections this fall. They also spoke of plans to gradually build up bus lanes in the network as routes get more congested, with medium-term plans for bus lanes on Princess between John Counter & Gardiners, and on Highway 15 between Highway 2 and Gore Road.



I personally talked with Kingston Transit's chief planner, and HOLY CRAP he's amazing! He knows almost everything little detail about the system, right down to miniscule details like what stops have gotten new bus shelters this year, right off the top of his head!

He also really gets the need to improve service. Here's some really cool things he talked about with me:
-Local stops. I don't know about other cities, but both Toronto and Ottawa have problems with buses stopping WAY too frequently. He spoke about the need to consolidate local stops to speed up service. This is something that I've always found really irritating about a lot of municipal transit planners, they always seem to want stops every 10 feet. He even talked about some strategies he's using to consolidate stops sneakily so people don't complain. The city will deliberately add amenities like shelters & benches to only every other stop so ridership on the un-upgraded stops drops enough to remove them from service without complaint. Whenever roads are reconstructed, stops are consolidated too.
-He gets that a connective network is the way to go. He's aggressively expanding frequency while shortening local routes. He gets that as a transit system grows it has to move in this direction. This is something that Ottawa has had a lot of difficulty adopting in its transit planning despite the fact that it desperately needs it.
-He understands that routes need to be made more direct, even if it increases walking distances, in order to allow for higher frequency and faster service. Again, something Ottawa has had trouble with.
-And, this big one: He gets that in order to improve ridership and build a good transit system, you need to suck it up and increase operational funding and allow reduced farebox return rates in the short term while ridership builds. This is something that many of Toronto's suburban transit systems struggle with, particularly York Region Transit.

I want to nominate that man for some sort of award. I don't think I've adequately captured it in my paragraphs above, but this guy is REALLY GOOD. I was blown away talking to him.

[caltrane74]

Wow, for a city the size of Kingston to have Express Buses and BRT(Bus Rapid Transit) that is impressive.

[caltrane74]

http://m.thestar.com/#/article/news/gta/...ht_says_metrolinx_ceo_bruce_mccuaig.html


Electrifying all GO Transit lines within 10 years as the province has requested is going to be tough, says Metrolinx.

[Nouvellecosse]

All GO Lines? I don't know, this plan seems a bit more sensible for the limited transit dollars.

[

[caltrane74]

If it was up to me I would just spend money on electrifying the Lakeshore and Kitchener/UPX line.

[1overcosc]

I for one really like GO electrification. The province's goal of electric, two-way all day GO service at 15 minute frequency would essentially transform the GO Train lines into subways. The GTA would have over 600 kilometres of rapid transit! 15 minute 2-way all day service could happen with diesel, but it would be slow. The benefit of electrification is the faster acceleration, which both reduces travel time and allows for some extra infill stations in places that could really use them.

[caltrane74]

New Concourse underneath the train tracks at Union


Credit: Metrolinx

[vegeta_skyline]

Originally Posted by 1overcosc

I for one really like GO electrification. The province's goal of electric, two-way all day GO service at 15 minute frequency would essentially transform the GO Train lines into subways. The GTA would have over 600 kilometres of rapid transit! 15 minute 2-way all day service could happen with diesel, but it would be slow. The benefit of electrification is the faster acceleration, which both reduces travel time and allows for some extra infill stations in places that could really use them.

Do get me wrong I'm all for electrification of the system and 15 minute service would be great, but saying it would be just like subways is a bit of a misnomer. The typical headway of any subway system(worth a damn at least) is far below 15 minutes, especially during peak periods.

[niwell]

As it is, the 30 minute off-peak headway on the Lakeshore line is pretty amazing considering. IIRC there are some light rail systems that barely match that. 15 minutes would't be subway level, but certainly better than many American systems.

[caltrane74]

15 mins would be pretty close to Washington DC subway frequency levels.

[Doady]

Originally Posted by vegeta_skyline

Do get me wrong I'm all for electrification of the system and 15 minute service would be great, but saying it would be just like subways is a bit of a misnomer. The typical headway of any subway system(worth a damn at least) is far below 15 minutes, especially during peak periods.

It's not about what is typical, it's about the standard, the bare minimum. At 15 minutes, GO Train would meet or come close to the minimum frequency for rapid transit (i.e. subway). It's an important milestone.

Arguably, 10 minutes should be the minimum frequency for any higher order transit whether it is BRT, LRT, or rapid transit, otherwise why did bother building it the first place? If people still have to rely on the schedule there is no point wasting so much money.

But GO is different. The distance between stops is huge, the trains are much faster, so it more than makes up for the slightly longer waiting time. I think 15 minutes all-day will probably be more than enough for people to be able to use GO Train spontaneously, without relying on schedules. I don't think it needs to be 10 minutes or less.

[1overcosc]

Plus it should be noted that trains WILL be running more frequently at rush hour. Exactly how frequent, we don't know yet, it will depend on need. Lakeshore will likely require 5 minute frequencies at peak.

[Innsertnamehere]

They will likely keep the diesel haulers for peak services. the EMUs will probably be used for off peak and baseline peak service with express services using the existing trainsets.

also, Cleveland's "subway" (It actually only has 1 underground station) runs on 15 minute frequencies all day long.

[niwell]

As it is, I find people I know who use the Lakeshore line daily don't worry nearly as much about train times now. If you miss your train it's not too hard to kill 30 minutes, but an hour was a bit much.

15 minute headways from Oshawa to Hamilton would be a HUGE deal though (dunno if they would ever extend that far!). And the Georgetown line could serve as a big relief to transit from the northwest into downtown.

[J.OT13]

I'm very impressed with the work on Union Station. It will stand tall amogst other grand railroad stations of the world.

Also, update for Ottawa's Confederation Line;

Originally Posted by rocketphish

Construction Summary
Week of June 16



Central Segment

Tunnel

West Portal (Jawbreaker)

• The roadheader continues excavating the central pillar in the Lyon Station cavern.
• Cavern reinforcement is ongoing and includes umbrella and mesh installation, and shotcreting.
• Excavation of the ventilation adit[i] begins.

Central Shaft (Chewrocka)

• The roadheader has completed excavation of the bench and a section of the mud slab has been poured.
• Excavation in the transition to Parliament Station cavern continues.

East Portal (Crocodile Rouge)

• Installation of tunnel support, including rockbolts and spiles[ii], is ongoing as excavation advances north under Laurier Street.

East Portal mining advances


For weekly updates on tunnel excavation progress please visit the Roadheader page.

East Segment

Maintenance and Storage Facility (MSF)

Construction activities advance at the MSF as long-term closure of Belfast Road south of Tremblay Road to Trainyards Drive north of Tremblay Road to Coventry Road is ongoing.

• Site utilities, storm sewer work and backfilling continues.
• Excavation continues on the MSF building foundation.
• Preparatory works for the MSF connector continues, including curb removal, stripping of topsoil and utilities locates with the VIA right of way.
• Mobilization of equipment and materials for the MSF connector construction begins, which will be followed by shoring.

MSF site construction activities continue


Civic Works

Highway 417 Roadwork, Widening and Structure Rehabilitation

Roadworks

• Utilities and sewer work is ongoing along the north and south sides of the highway.
• From St. Laurent Boulevard to Vanier Parkway, pouring and panel work progresses for the sound wall along the north and south sides of the highway.

Sound wall construction advances along Highway 417

• Roadway construction continues with excavation, grading, pouring of concrete barrier walls and paving along the north and south sides of Highway 417 from St. Laurent Boulevard to Nicholas Street.

Grading operations eastbound - Lees Avenue to Hurdman Bridge


Signage

• The three message signs have been installed; final construction and electrical works to power the signs continue.

Structures

• Widening, reconstruction and rehabilitation of various bridge structures along the highway continues to progress.

Hurdman Bridge

• Installation of the barrier walls and rebar (reinforcing steel) begins this week.
• Pouring on deck ends takes place.
• Excavation, reinforcing steel and concrete placements continue on the bridge structure.

Hurdman Bridge barrier walls on south side


St. Laurent Overpass

• Widening and rehabilitation on the south side of the structure continues with forming[iii] and pouring of deck end.
• Reconstruction at the northeast and southwest on-ramps continues and includes excavation and grading.

Waterproofing activities at St. Laurent Overpass south side


Vanier Parkway Overpass– work advances in preparation of the rapid bridge replacement scheduled for mid-October 2014.

• Work progresses in the staging area and includes completing construction of the deck ends and placing reinforcing steel.

New deck formwork Vanier Parkway Overpass

• Abutment rehabilitation, concrete curing and stripping occur on the northeast and southeast quadrants of the existing structure.
• Overnight bridge and roadwork continues on the northwest and southeast on-ramps.

Staging area construction - Vanier Parkway Overpass


Belfast Road Underpass – work advances for the conventional demolition of the existing structure and reconstruction of the new bridge, ongoing until fall 2014. Long-term closure of Belfast Road, north of Tremblay Road to Coventry Road continues.

• Double soldier piling and backfilling to support the existing structure is ongoing.
• Sawcutting as well as removals of existing barrier walls, deck and girders continues.
• Installation of reinforcing steel takes place to allow temporary rehabilitation work to continue.

Lees Avenue Underpass – Rapid removal of existing bridge occurs on June 21 and 22.

• Removal of the existing bridge end spans begins this week in preparation for rapid bridge removal during the weekend, and includes saw-cutting and concrete removals.
• Work on the new deck progresses.

Construction of new bridge components continues at Lees Avenue Underpass

• Granular and sewer work occurs on Robinson Road.

Coventry Pedestrian Footbridge

• Steel superstructure installation begins overnight from June 16 to 19 using a 300 tonnes crane.
• Backfilling and stripping are ongoing on the south abutment and footing.
• Formwork and pouring occur on the north ramp footing.

Stay on-track with us and follow our progress by visiting the sections related to each area of construction at the top of this webpage.

[i] Adit refers to a connection between the transition and vent shaft (similar to a gallery – 12m width and 6m height)
[ii] Spiles refer to the protective pipe canopies installed to support the tunnel structure.
[iii] Formwork refers to a mold in which concrete is poured.

[Doady]

Originally Posted by niwell

15 minute headways from Oshawa to Hamilton would be a HUGE deal though (dunno if they would ever extend that far!). And the Georgetown line could serve as a big relief to transit from the northwest into downtown.

Hamilton to Oshawa is a huge distance, over 1 hours to drive, over 2 hours by train, over 100km long. So yeah even 30 minutes is not inconvenient considering the huge distance. And Lakeshore mostly goes through industrial areas too, so 15 minutes probably very ambitious...

I think it depends on the line; not all need 15 minutes. e.g. Barrie Line should be 30 minutes max, any more would be a waste. I think the busiest lines will be Milton and Stouffville. Those two should be the priority for 15 minutes service instead of Lakeshore and Georgetown, imo.

Consider also the TTC has the Spadina Line to relieve Yonge from the west, but nothing from the east, which is why Yonge is so overcrowded). The Stouffville Line could help here (and hopefully the DRL too...).

[Innsertnamehere]

In terms of ridership today, the list runs like this:

1. Lakeshore West
2. Lakeshore East
3. Milton
4. Kitchener
5. Stouffville
6. Barrie
7. Richmond Hill

Stouffville is the fastest growing line outside of the lakeshore lines right now, and is the most over capacity from my understanding. It will probably surpass Kitchener in a few years, provided Metrolinx spends some money upgrading peak services like they are on Kitchener. Milton and the Lakeshore lines are still a long way ahead though.

Richmond Hill is the low ridership baby of the system, the other lines generally have good potential and numbers aren't too far off from each other.

In terms of electrification schedules, Metrolinx seems intent in this order:

1. Lakeshores
2. Kitchener
3. Milton
4. Stouffville
5. Barrie
6. Richmond Hill

Once the Lakeshores are electrified, the Stouffville line will likely be the cheapest due to its short length. (24km) That doesn't mean it will be first however, Kitchener is probably going to be the first one after Lakeshore.

If 15 minute service is in fact implemented, some sections of inner Toronto will likely receive 7.5 minute service. Scarborough and Danforth stations will likely be served by both Lakeshore East as well as Stouffville, and Bloor station will be served by both Milton and Kitchener.


Lakeshore should begin 15 minute service in 2018, with another line opening every year. That means that Kitchener gets it in 2019, Milton 2020, Stouffville 2021, Barrie 2022, Richmond Hill 2023.

The full list of transit improvements from this springs budget in Ontario should include:

GTHA area projects:

DRL phase 1
Hurontario LRT
Yonge subway to Steeles
Hamilton LRT
Waterfront East LRT (streetcar extension)
Queen / Highway 7 BRT
Dundas BRT
Highway 2 / Ellesmere BRT

GO improvements:
Lakeshore Peak services to Niagara and Bowmanville, 15 Minute services from Oshawa to Hamilton
Kitchener 15 minute service to Kitchener
Milton 15 minute service to Lisgar or Milton (not specified)
Barrie 15 Minute service to Green Lane or Bradford (Not specified)
Stouffville 15 minute service to Mount Joy
Richmond Hill 15 minute service to Richmond Hill


Outside GTA improvements:
Phase 2 Kitchener LRT
Phase 2 Ottawa LRT
HSR to London
Possibly London BRT

[1overcosc]

Originally Posted by niwell

As it is, I find people I know who use the Lakeshore line daily don't worry nearly as much about train times now. If you miss your train it's not too hard to kill 30 minutes, but an hour was a bit much.

15 minute headways from Oshawa to Hamilton would be a HUGE deal though (dunno if they would ever extend that far!). And the Georgetown line could serve as a big relief to transit from the northwest into downtown.

The plan is indeed 15 minute headways from Oshawa to Hamilton! The Lakeshore line will also be extended from Oshawa to Bowmanville, and from Hamilton to Niagara, although those segments will likely have lower frequency (still all-day 2 way service though!).

A line from Niagara Falls to Bowmanville would be about 200 kilometres long, making it one of the longest rapid transit lines in the world! (I imagine some lines in Japan or Germany might be longer).

Originally Posted by Doady

Hamilton to Oshawa is a huge distance, over 1 hours to drive, over 2 hours by train, over 100km long. So yeah even 30 minutes is not inconvenient considering the huge distance. And Lakeshore mostly goes through industrial areas too, so 15 minutes probably very ambitious...

I think it depends on the line; not all need 15 minutes. e.g. Barrie Line should be 30 minutes max, any more would be a waste. I think the busiest lines will be Milton and Stouffville. Those two should be the priority for 15 minutes service instead of Lakeshore and Georgetown, imo.

Consider also the TTC has the Spadina Line to relieve Yonge from the west, but nothing from the east, which is why Yonge is so overcrowded). The Stouffville Line could help here (and hopefully the DRL too...).

Milton is also the hardest line to bring 15 minute electric service to. Because it's the CPR main freight line, Metrolinx is going to have built a complete set of parallel tracks to have 2W-AD service.

[milomilo]

Originally Posted by 1overcosc

A line from Niagara Falls to Bowmanville would be about 200 kilometres long, making it one of the longest rapid transit lines in the world! (I imagine some lines in Japan or Germany might be longer).

If we are defining rapid transit as electrified with a few trains per hour then there will be hundreds of longer lines!

The development of these lines in Toronto is great, but let's not pretend they are leading the way worldwide. This is only one city in Canada playing catch up to what most larger cities in Europe have had for decades.